OrthodoxChristianity.net
September 30, 2014, 12:23:14 PM *
Welcome, Guest. Please login or register.

Login with username, password and session length
News: Reminder: No political discussions in the public fora.  If you do not have access to the private Politics Forum, please send a PM to Fr. George.
 
   Home   Help Calendar Contact Treasury Tags Login Register  
Pages: « 1 2  All   Go Down
  Print  
Author Topic: A prayer that I'm having difficulty with...  (Read 3678 times) Average Rating: 0
0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.
Alveus Lacuna
Warned
Taxiarches
**********
Offline Offline

Posts: 6,891



« Reply #45 on: January 27, 2011, 03:59:49 PM »

So how long did it take for you to overcome issues you had with the MoG? How is such a devotion cultivated and strengthened?

Maybe a year or so. Once I figured out she was bothering me I started reciting an akathist to her every night. That did the trick after a couple of months.
Logged
Ortho_cat
Protokentarchos
*********
Offline Offline

Faith: Orthodox
Jurisdiction: AOCA-DWMA
Posts: 5,392



« Reply #46 on: January 27, 2011, 09:58:38 PM »

So how long did it take for you to overcome issues you had with the MoG? How is such a devotion cultivated and strengthened?

Maybe a year or so. Once I figured out she was bothering me I started reciting an akathist to her every night. That did the trick after a couple of months.

What other types of devotional tools are there besides the akathist hymn?

I found this website:

http://aggreen.net/theotokos/devotions/queen_of_all_creation.html
« Last Edit: January 27, 2011, 10:02:35 PM by Ortho_cat » Logged
LBK
Merarches
***********
Offline Offline

Faith: Orthodox
Posts: 10,871


Holy Father Patrick, pray for us!


« Reply #47 on: January 27, 2011, 10:11:50 PM »

Quote
What other types of devotional tools are there besides the akathist hymn?

Prayers. Supplicatory canons, including to many of the icons of the Mother of God.
Logged
Alveus Lacuna
Warned
Taxiarches
**********
Offline Offline

Posts: 6,891



« Reply #48 on: January 28, 2011, 01:20:56 AM »

What other types of devotional tools are there besides the akathist hymn?

Is that an insufficient recommendation, or did you just not particularly like it? If you want more to do I assure you that praying the same akathist every night for a while, I would recommend 40 days as a great period, will be sufficient in terms of devotional action. By the way, don't allow yourself to be selective in what you pray. Pray everything that is written there, every night. I found illumination come through praying the prayers rather than externally analyzing them. Also, if you have an icon of the Theotokos then I recommend burning a vigil lamp before her during this entire 40 day period. Tending to the wick throughout the day as well as keeping the oil filled will keep you focused on your spiritual task.

Don't expect this to work like a magic formula. It might have no effect. All I know is that it was a revelation for me on the heart level.
Logged
Ortho_cat
Protokentarchos
*********
Offline Offline

Faith: Orthodox
Jurisdiction: AOCA-DWMA
Posts: 5,392



« Reply #49 on: January 28, 2011, 01:25:53 AM »

What other types of devotional tools are there besides the akathist hymn?

Is that an insufficient recommendation, or did you just not particularly like it? If you want more to do I assure you that praying the same akathist every night for a while, I would recommend 40 days as a great period, will be sufficient in terms of devotional action. By the way, don't allow yourself to be selective in what you pray. Pray everything that is written there, every night. I found illumination come through praying the prayers rather than externally analyzing them. Also, if you have an icon of the Theotokos then I recommend burning a vigil lamp before her during this entire 40 day period. Tending to the wick throughout the day as well as keeping the oil filled will keep you focused on your spiritual task.

Don't expect this to work like a magic formula. It might have no effect. All I know is that it was a revelation for me on the heart level.

No that is all good and well, I was just asking out of curiosity. Thanks for the recommendation.

Is this a good translation? It was the first I pulled up on google:

http://www.fatheralexander.org/booklets/english/m_akathist_e.htm
« Last Edit: January 28, 2011, 01:26:58 AM by Ortho_cat » Logged
Alveus Lacuna
Warned
Taxiarches
**********
Offline Offline

Posts: 6,891



« Reply #50 on: January 28, 2011, 01:33:14 AM »

Seems like the translation I have. If finances are an issue, then sure just print it offline, but the whole thing is available along with tons of other prayers in the Jordanville Prayerbook. Using the prayerbook always just seems more personal to me, as you stay connected to it over time much like well-worn Bible of the past. So I would also recommend getting a Jordanville Prayerbook and praying the akathist from that. Watch the pages change color over the years from all of your praying. Or not. Either way, the akathist is a true blessing.
Logged
Rdunbar123
Sr. Member
****
Offline Offline

Faith: Orthodox
Jurisdiction: Antiochian
Posts: 161


« Reply #51 on: January 28, 2011, 05:36:03 PM »


I am taking instruction in the Orthodox church. I am a cradle Roman Catholic and if I am not wrong one of the strenghts of Orthodoxy is that the "have to believes" are issues defined by the Councils or agreed to by the whole church. This way no one other than the whole body of Christ is infallible, even a saint or Church Father. I have just begun my inquiry so please tell me if I am off base.
A couple of days before reading the prayer on this thread I read a quote from St Gregory Palamas that stated, "No one can approach God, but only through the intercessions of the Most Holy Theotokos, through the One who gave birth to the Savior, our Lord Jesus Christ." Perhaps the quote is slightly inaccurate or not, I do not know; it is on a saints calender that our parish priest gave me & it is a good calendar & i never considered any of its info to be wrong. I routinely sing the refrains "Most Holy Theotokos save us" in choir & share in the veneration there. I have been to many akathists & strongly believe that some of Romanus' hymnography is influenced by the descriptions given to the martyred mother in 4th Maccabees (2 maccabees 7). I have understtod since catechesis that the saints prayers are for us to be found worthy of grace & prayed for the departed before becoming Orthodox.

I did find the prayer & the quote I listed above to be deeply confusing (& still do). My use of the term "ignorable baggage" is too subjective & I would better mean to say that some things can perhaps be bypassed and not let one's overall faith suffer on what may not be a big deal.
Logged
JLatimer
OC.net guru
*******
Offline Offline

Faith: Orthodox
Jurisdiction: ROCOR
Posts: 1,202



« Reply #52 on: January 28, 2011, 06:29:24 PM »


I am taking instruction in the Orthodox church. I am a cradle Roman Catholic and if I am not wrong one of the strenghts of Orthodoxy is that the "have to believes" are issues defined by the Councils or agreed to by the whole church. This way no one other than the whole body of Christ is infallible, even a saint or Church Father. I have just begun my inquiry so please tell me if I am off base.
A couple of days before reading the prayer on this thread I read a quote from St Gregory Palamas that stated, "No one can approach God, but only through the intercessions of the Most Holy Theotokos, through the One who gave birth to the Savior, our Lord Jesus Christ." Perhaps the quote is slightly inaccurate or not, I do not know; it is on a saints calender that our parish priest gave me & it is a good calendar & i never considered any of its info to be wrong. I routinely sing the refrains "Most Holy Theotokos save us" in choir & share in the veneration there. I have been to many akathists & strongly believe that some of Romanus' hymnography is influenced by the descriptions given to the martyred mother in 4th Maccabees (2 maccabees 7). I have understtod since catechesis that the saints prayers are for us to be found worthy of grace & prayed for the departed before becoming Orthodox.

I did find the prayer & the quote I listed above to be deeply confusing (& still do). My use of the term "ignorable baggage" is too subjective & I would better mean to say that some things can perhaps be bypassed and not let one's overall faith suffer on what may not be a big deal.

Yes, I think it would be correct to say that in Orthodoxy the Church as a whole, as Christ's Body, is infallible, rather than any particular saint or ecclesiarch.
Logged

1 Samuel 25:22 (KJV)
So and more also do God unto the enemies of David, if I leave of all that pertain to him by the morning light any that pisseth against the wall.
augustin717
Warned
Taxiarches
**********
Online Online

Faith: The other ROC
Posts: 5,634



« Reply #53 on: January 28, 2011, 11:37:13 PM »


I am taking instruction in the Orthodox church. I am a cradle Roman Catholic and if I am not wrong one of the strenghts of Orthodoxy is that the "have to believes" are issues defined by the Councils or agreed to by the whole church. This way no one other than the whole body of Christ is infallible, even a saint or Church Father. I have just begun my inquiry so please tell me if I am off base.
A couple of days before reading the prayer on this thread I read a quote from St Gregory Palamas that stated, "No one can approach God, but only through the intercessions of the Most Holy Theotokos, through the One who gave birth to the Savior, our Lord Jesus Christ." Perhaps the quote is slightly inaccurate or not, I do not know; it is on a saints calender that our parish priest gave me & it is a good calendar & i never considered any of its info to be wrong. I routinely sing the refrains "Most Holy Theotokos save us" in choir & share in the veneration there. I have been to many akathists & strongly believe that some of Romanus' hymnography is influenced by the descriptions given to the martyred mother in 4th Maccabees (2 maccabees 7). I have understtod since catechesis that the saints prayers are for us to be found worthy of grace & prayed for the departed before becoming Orthodox.

I did find the prayer & the quote I listed above to be deeply confusing (& still do). My use of the term "ignorable baggage" is too subjective & I would better mean to say that some things can perhaps be bypassed and not let one's overall faith suffer on what may not be a big deal.

Yes, I think it would be correct to say that in Orthodoxy the Church as a whole, as Christ's Body, is infallible, rather than any particular saint or ecclesiarch.
Ecclesiarch is a rank within a cathedral, kind of the boss of the clergy there.
Logged
JLatimer
OC.net guru
*******
Offline Offline

Faith: Orthodox
Jurisdiction: ROCOR
Posts: 1,202



« Reply #54 on: January 29, 2011, 02:41:43 PM »


I am taking instruction in the Orthodox church. I am a cradle Roman Catholic and if I am not wrong one of the strenghts of Orthodoxy is that the "have to believes" are issues defined by the Councils or agreed to by the whole church. This way no one other than the whole body of Christ is infallible, even a saint or Church Father. I have just begun my inquiry so please tell me if I am off base.
A couple of days before reading the prayer on this thread I read a quote from St Gregory Palamas that stated, "No one can approach God, but only through the intercessions of the Most Holy Theotokos, through the One who gave birth to the Savior, our Lord Jesus Christ." Perhaps the quote is slightly inaccurate or not, I do not know; it is on a saints calender that our parish priest gave me & it is a good calendar & i never considered any of its info to be wrong. I routinely sing the refrains "Most Holy Theotokos save us" in choir & share in the veneration there. I have been to many akathists & strongly believe that some of Romanus' hymnography is influenced by the descriptions given to the martyred mother in 4th Maccabees (2 maccabees 7). I have understtod since catechesis that the saints prayers are for us to be found worthy of grace & prayed for the departed before becoming Orthodox.

I did find the prayer & the quote I listed above to be deeply confusing (& still do). My use of the term "ignorable baggage" is too subjective & I would better mean to say that some things can perhaps be bypassed and not let one's overall faith suffer on what may not be a big deal.

Yes, I think it would be correct to say that in Orthodoxy the Church as a whole, as Christ's Body, is infallible, rather than any particular saint or ecclesiarch.
Ecclesiarch is a rank within a cathedral, kind of the boss of the clergy there.

Clearly, I am not using the word in that sense.
Logged

1 Samuel 25:22 (KJV)
So and more also do God unto the enemies of David, if I leave of all that pertain to him by the morning light any that pisseth against the wall.
Ortho_cat
Protokentarchos
*********
Offline Offline

Faith: Orthodox
Jurisdiction: AOCA-DWMA
Posts: 5,392



« Reply #55 on: February 03, 2011, 10:59:09 AM »

A thought just came to me, regarding my OP, which I thought I would share.

Take the analogy where I meet the mother of my hypothetical wife-to-be and she gives me the blessing to marry her daughter.

This can be be similar to how the Theotokos considers us worthy to partake of her Son in the eucharist.

Of course, my wife-to-be is more than competent to decide for herself whom she wants to marry, but it is comforting and reassuring nevertheless to have the blessing from her mother; to know that she considers you 'worthy' of her daughter, so to speak  Smiley

« Last Edit: February 03, 2011, 11:01:22 AM by Ortho_cat » Logged
Father H
Archon
********
Offline Offline

Faith: Orthodox Christian--God's One Holy Catholic and Apostolic Church
Jurisdiction: UOCofUSA-Ecumenical Patriarchate
Posts: 2,611



« Reply #56 on: February 03, 2011, 05:42:28 PM »

Back to the op.  Scripture tells us that we are fellow laborers with God.  Fellow laborers with what?  With the salvation of mankind.  If that is true of those of us who are still running, how much moreso those who have finished the race, above all the Theotokos. 
Logged
Rufus
OC.net guru
*******
Offline Offline

Faith: Orthodox Christian
Jurisdiction: GOA
Posts: leet


Nafpliotis with sunglasses and a cigar.


« Reply #57 on: February 03, 2011, 09:32:15 PM »

Although cradle Orthodox, I was brought up by my Protestant mother (not a believer, but ardently pro-Protestant), and I basically grew up with a lot of Protestant theological ideas without knowing it. (Side note: the old edition of the OSB ironically fueled this.) As a result, I complained in middle school that Catholics pray to saints. (Our church did everything in Greek, so I didn't understand anything.) I have thus always been uncomfortable with prayers to saints, especially when I began to read the "real" Orthodox prayers out of books.

I've prayed the post-Communion canon in the OP, I beg the Mother of God to "save us/me," and I "place all my hope" in her. I also feel deeply offended when anybody says the slightest irreverent thing about her. How do I understand these prayers?

I think the theological ways that people try to explain away these verses by claiming that they don't mean what they say are off-base. On the one hand, all Eastern hymns, prayers, and even stories about saints are bursting with hyperbole. The Apostles' sound did not go forth into all the earth, nor did their words reach the end of the world. It's a truth told in hyperbole. At the same time, it's still profoundly true. Same thing with the prayers to the Mother of God: hyperbole, yet profoundly true in a way we should never downplay.
Logged
Tags:
Pages: « 1 2  All   Go Up
  Print  
 
Jump to:  

Powered by MySQL Powered by PHP Powered by SMF 1.1.18 | SMF © 2013, Simple Machines Valid XHTML 1.0! Valid CSS!
Page created in 0.07 seconds with 39 queries.