Western rite statistics for the USA

[SubdeaconDavid]

Likewise it would be useful to know WR statistics by jurisdiction.  I am especially interested in those jurisdictions outside of the big two of the US WR scene - AWRV and ROCOR. Again clergy numbers including deacon/subdeacon/readers, laity numbers, monastic presence etc. 

[SubdeaconDavid]

I am surprised at the lack of comment re WR in the US.  There is one new stat, if Reader Benjamin is correct from a posting on Facebook about a new Western-rite monastery in New Mexico under the St. Petroc Paruchia of Fr. Michael (Mansbridge-Wood).  Reader Benjamin is to become a monastic in this new venture. May the Lord grant him and his Petrochian brethren at St. George's Monastery many years and bless this monastic house. See:

An APPEAL on FB for Donations
> To Assist in Building Saint George's Hermitage
> _________________________________________
>
> I am going this year to a monastery in New Mexico. St. George
Hermitage
> is a new monastery in ROCOR under the direcion of St. Petroc
Monastery.
> We will be both Western and Eastern Rite. 48 acres of land in the high
> desert outside of Belen, NM was donated to the monastery. We will be
> moving there as soon as buildings can be constructed. We are planning
to
> build a Spanish Mission style church using adobe block construction.
> This will be very long-lasting and efficient construction.
>
> We are in need of support in any way it can be offered. Tax-deductible
> donations can be made to:
>
> Holy cross/Saint George Hermitage
> P.O. Box 778
> Belen, NM 87002
>
> We can be contacted at 918.346.5381 or by e-mail at
> saint.george.hermitage @ gmail.com
>
> SEE
>
<http://www.facebook.com/notes/benjamin-slayton/help-support-future-monk
> s/10150125145874002
>
> -
> -

[Irish Hermit]

More good news!

Subdeacon Peter Noel Guilianotti is to be ordained a priest for the Western Rite on Palm Sunday.

Father Peter will be a member of the Fraternity of Saint Gregory under Fr Anthony (Bondi.)  This takes to 16 the number of WR priests in the Fraternity.


Fr Peter will be starting a WR parish in the area of San Mateos California (Carlsbad.)

[SubdeaconDavid]

More good news!

Subdeacon Peter Noel Guilianotti is to be ordained a priest for the Western Rite on Palm Sunday.

Father Peter will be a member of the Fraternity of Saint Gregory under Fr Anthony (Bondi.)  This takes to 16 the number of WR priests in the Fraternity.


Fr Peter will be starting a WR parish in the area of San Mateos California (Carlsbad.)

May the Lord bless Subdeacon Peter.  Will the Fraternity of St. Gregory be the primary parochial vehicle of the ROCOR WR?  With more priests than the rest of ROCOR's WR combined, with the exception of  monasteries under different disciplines such as the Benedictines of Christ the Saviour and the Petrochian monastic houses such as St. Petroc, South Hobart and St. George in New Mexico, a case could be made for  non-monastic WR to come under the St. Gregory Fraternity. Such standardisation may well be a welcome focus for unity.

[Irish Hermit]

.....monasteries under different disciplines such as the Benedictines of Christ the Saviour and the Petrochian monastic houses such as St. Petroc, South Hobart and St. George in New Mexico

Pleased to announce further good news, namely that Fr Michael has decided that monks in his paruchia will be not Benedictines but Columbans following the Rule of Saint Columba.  It was revealed today on a Western Rite e-list that Fr Joshua of Saint George in New Mexico will follow the Columban Rule.

I am delighted to hear it - a (presumably) Arab monk adopting an Irish Rule gladdens my Irish heart.

And we would hope that these Columban  monks will adopt not only the Columban Rule but also the type of Irish Liturgy used in Columba's monasteries throughout what came to be called the "Columban Paruchia"  - the Lorrha Missal.   This will bring all their spiritual practices into a wholistic unity.

[Sleeper]

That is interesting! Do you, Irish Hermit, dislike the Rule of St. Benedict, or do you just have a preference for that of St. Columba?

Also, is there a good online source for reading the Lorrha Missal?

[Irish Hermit]

That is interesting! Do you, Irish Hermit, dislike the Rule of St. Benedict, or do you just have a preference for that of St. Columba?

There were various monastic Rules in pre-schism Ireland but really they were much of a muchness.  You can puchase quite a few books on them.  The early Irish Riles were very severe, nuch more so than the Benedictine.  In time they were supplanted in Ireland by the Benedicitne Rule, and later the Augustinian, etc.

So there's no question of liking or disliking.   There is simply a variety of Rules and each has its worth.

[Irish Hermit]

Also, is there a good online source for reading the Lorrha Missal?

Do you want the orginal in Latin or some modern English translations?

[Irish Hermit]

Also, is there a good online source for reading the Lorrha Missal?

The Lorrha (Stowe) Missal is now preserved in the Royal Irish Academy

They have kindly digitised it and it may be read, page by page at

http://www.isos.dias.ie/libraries/RIA/RIA_MS_D_ii_3/english/index.html

It's in uncial Latin so it takes some perseverance to read.



-oOo-

The publishing firm of Boydell and Brewer is once again offering copies of the Lorrha, as part of their print on demand publishing.

Stowe Missal [POD PB]

Copies can be ordered through their  web site or from your local bookshop.

http://www.boydell.co.uk/70252594.HTM

Boydell & Brewer Ltd
Whitwell House, St Audry's Park Road
Melton, Woodbridge, Suffolk IP12 1SY
Tel: +44 (0)1394 610600. Fax: +44 (0)1394 610316

[Irish Hermit]

Also, is there a good online source for reading the Lorrha Missal?

Text of the Stowe-Lorrha Missal in English

Part 1: http://www.illusions.com/rowanhold/stowe.htm
Part 2: http://www.illusions.com/rowanhold/stowe2.htm

These links no longer work.

Please try here

Part 1
http://web.archive.org/web/20021219230809/http://www.illusions.com/rowanhold/stowe.htm

Part 2
http://web.archive.org/web/20030214220709/http://www.illusions.com/rowanhold/stowe2.htm

This 8th century Celtic Liturgy is used (almost never really) in the Russian Orthodox Church Abroad in the Diocese of Australia and New Zealand, with the blessing of His Grace Archbishop Hilarion.

[Sleeper]

Thank you so much for these fascinating links. I did not know this service was offered in the Russian Church Abroad (is this different than ROCOR?), does it have any relationship with what ROCOR calls The English Liturgy?

[Irish Hermit]

Thank you so much for these fascinating links. I did not know this service was offered in the Russian Church Abroad (is this different than ROCOR?), does it have any relationship with what ROCOR calls The English Liturgy?

Funny you should ask that.  I have had a copy of the Saint Colman Prayer Book sitting on my desk for the past week but have been too busy to examine it..

[Sleeper]

Be sure to share your thoughts when you do!

Ancient Irish/Celtic/British/Scottish Christianity has become a bit of an obsession of mine recently, mostly due to the fact that in digging into my familial roots I have discovered that the tree goes back to these places. I'd be greatly interested in any websites or books you'd recommend to explore this further!

[SubdeaconDavid]

Thank you so much for these fascinating links. I did not know this service was offered in the Russian Church Abroad (is this different than ROCOR?), does it have any relationship with what ROCOR calls The English Liturgy?

Funny you should ask that.  I have had a copy of the Saint Colman Prayer Book sitting on my desk for the past week but have been too busy to examine it..

I would welcome Father your analysis of the Saint Colman Prayer Book.  Are you referring to the SSCPB - Shorter St. Colman Prayer Book or the harder to find (longer) St. Colman Prayer book?  I am especially interested in your thoughts on the offices contained therein as well as the various mass ('divine liturgy') rites especially the uniquely named 'Usus Cascadae'.

[Irish Hermit]

That is interesting! Do you, Irish Hermit, dislike the Rule of St. Benedict, or do you just have a preference for that of St. Columba?

There were various monastic Rules in pre-schism Ireland but really they were much of a muchness.  You can puchase quite a few books on them.  The early Irish Riles were very severe, nuch more so than the Benedictine.  In time they were supplanted in Ireland by the Benedicitne Rule, and later the Augustinian, etc.

So there's no question of liking or disliking.   There is simply a variety of Rules and each has its worth.

It seems very appropriate that it will be Columban monks, following some
form of an Irish rule, who will refound the British Orthodox Church.  Fr
Michael and his Columban monastics will resurrect and continue the astounding
work of the Orthodox Irish monks in evangelising and re-evangelising Europe.

This is an outstanding resurgence of Celtic monasticism.  If Father Michael
maintains their Celtic liturgical integrity and eschews Anglo-Saxon forms
such as Sarum, they have the opportunity to revalourise such as the Lorrha
Missal (more than a Missal, it is also a "trebnik" as Slavs understand it.)
The Lorrha's pre-schism antecedents are impeccable,  possibily emerging in
the 6th century and continuing for many centuries, almost up to the time of
the Anglo-Norman invasion of Ireland and the blanket imposition of the Sarum
by the invaders from England facilitated by the removal of all Irish bishops
and the imposition of purely Norman bishops.

My prayers are with Fr Michael's mission, that God will bless their
missionary efforts as he blessed those of the Irish monks so richly.  The
ancient Irish monks' (and this new Paruchia of Saint Columba)  approach to
the work was entirely evangelical - without a change of clothing, with only
one pair of shoes, with no money in their pockets, they brought much of
Europe to Christ.

Hierom. Ambrose

[Shlomlokh]

Also, is there a good online source for reading the Lorrha Missal?

Text of the Stowe-Lorrha Missal in English

Part 1: http://www.illusions.com/rowanhold/stowe.htm
Part 2: http://www.illusions.com/rowanhold/stowe2.htm

These links no longer work.

Please try here

Part 1
http://web.archive.org/web/20021219230809/http://www.illusions.com/rowanhold/stowe.htm

Part 2
http://web.archive.org/web/20030214220709/http://www.illusions.com/rowanhold/stowe2.htm

This 8th century Celtic Liturgy is used (almost never really) in the Russian Orthodox Church Abroad in the Diocese of Australia and New Zealand, with the blessing of His Grace Archbishop Hilarion.

Father, do you happen to have any more information about Celtic Christianity, such as the layouts of their temples, vestments, and other rites? I find it rather fascinating.

In Christ,
Andrew

[Irish Hermit]

Father, do you happen to have any more information about Celtic Christianity, such as the layouts of their temples, vestments, and other rites? I find it rather fascinating.

See if you can get hold of one other of these books, both are rather small.

"The Egyptian Desert in the Irish Bogs: The Byzantine Character of Early Celtic Monasticism "
Father Gregory Telepneff

"The Liturgy and Ritual of the Celtic Church"
by Warren

My guess is that they are out of print but you could locate copies on www.bookfinder.com

[Shlomlokh]

Father, do you happen to have any more information about Celtic Christianity, such as the layouts of their temples, vestments, and other rites? I find it rather fascinating.

See if you can get hold of one other of these books, both are rather small.

"The Egyptian Desert in the Irish Bogs: The Byzantine Character of Early Celtic Monasticism "
Father Gregory Telepneff

"The Liturgy and Ritual of the Celtic Church"
by Warren

My guess is that they are out of print but you could locate copies on www.bookfinder.com

I found an online copy of the second book: http://www.archive.org/details/liturgyceltuc00warruoft

In Christ,
Andrew

[Michał]

Fr Peter will be starting a WR parish in the area of San Mateos California (Carlsbad.)

Here is the website of the parish: http://johnthewonderworker.org (IMHO, a little bit too Byzantine-ish design and content).

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