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Author Topic: Saying bishops 'scared,' panelists urge laity to take lead  (Read 622 times) Average Rating: 0
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« on: January 06, 2011, 01:12:59 PM »

How would increased lay-involvement impact Catholic-Orthodox hopes for re-union?

From NCRonline:

Panelists at a recent Woodstock forum in Philadelphia urged lay Catholics to grab the reins and set the course for the church’s future.

“We are becoming a do-it-yourself church” for the laity, said Jesuit Fr. Thomas J. Reese, one of three senior fellows of the Woodstock Theological Center in Washington who spoke at “The Future of the Church: A Woodstock Forum on Sources of Hope,” held at St. Joseph’s University in Philadelphia Dec. 5.
....
He said that for him the most depressing finding of the Pew study was that 71 percent of former Catholics said the reason they left the church was “that my spiritual needs were not met by the church -- in other words, our fundamental product failed.”
....
Reese said that for church leaders to blame the exodus of Catholics from the church on sinfulness, dissent, lack of commitment, or other factors among those who leave is ignoring a major issue. “If this was a retail outlet, we’d say we’re blaming the customers -- and that’s not a way to make your bottom line,” he said.
....
“When was the last time you entered a Catholic church and actually were welcomed?” he asked. “Our churches and our liturgies are boring. That, I think, more than theology, is what is driving our people away from our church.

“What you need is good music, good preaching, programs for kids and a welcoming community,” he said. “If you have that, you will have a full church.”

He called the Catholic church today “a lazy monopoly” around which evangelical churches “are running circles.”
....
“At 65, I’m considered a young priest,” he said, adding that the Catholic priesthood may be the only profession in the country today where someone who dies of old age is still considered “young.” Because of the church’s sacramental theology linked to ordination, lack of priests means lack of access to the Eucharist and other sacraments, weakening the entire institutional structure, he said.
....
On the church’s immediate prospects for the future, “maybe God knows what she’s doing,” he said. “If you don’t have clergy, maybe the job’s yours.”
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« Reply #1 on: January 06, 2011, 01:18:17 PM »

Quote
On the church’s immediate prospects for the future, “maybe God knows what she’s doing,” he said. “If you don’t have clergy, maybe the job’s yours.”

Sure. The problem is that the priests are old and the mass is boring.

No apparent problem exists with statements like this by the clergy!
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« Reply #2 on: January 06, 2011, 01:38:25 PM »

Isn't most of the problem because of a shortage of priests, consolidation of parishes (although necessary, can create over-crowding), and (rightly or wrongly as to perception) the clergy abuse scandals? Is this indicative of a loss of personal connection rather than so-called "boredom"?
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« Reply #3 on: January 06, 2011, 05:16:01 PM »

Quote
On the church’s immediate prospects for the future, “maybe God knows what she’s doing,” he said. “If you don’t have clergy, maybe the job’s yours.”

Sure. The problem is that the priests are old and the mass is boring.

No apparent problem exists with statements like this by the clergy!

It has been said that we could do quite well with a smaller, more faith filled and obedient flock.   I agree with that assessment.  So these Do-It-Yourself priests and the people they serve could easily be accommodated in any protestant sect or Orthodoxy.  In fact I encourage that wherever I can out here in the real world.

Mary
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« Reply #4 on: January 06, 2011, 11:16:25 PM »

"The spirit of Vatican II" gutted the Church, morally, spiritually, and liturgically. We need a new council.
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« Reply #5 on: January 06, 2011, 11:24:44 PM »

Quote
On the church’s immediate prospects for the future, “maybe God knows what she’s doing,” he said. “If you don’t have clergy, maybe the job’s yours.”

Sure. The problem is that the priests are old and the mass is boring.

No apparent problem exists with statements like this by the clergy!

It has been said that we could do quite well with a smaller, more faith filled and obedient flock.   I agree with that assessment.  So these Do-It-Yourself priests and the people they serve could easily be accommodated in any protestant sect or Orthodoxy.  In fact I encourage that wherever I can out here in the real world.

Mary

But, Mary, didn't you know: their job is to make sure that the faith accommodates them.  Nothing less will do.

And, no Orthodoxy wouldn't take 'em.  I could name a few Protestants sects that would off the top of my head, but even then those guys have enough problems of their own without more carpetbaggers moving in.
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« Reply #6 on: January 07, 2011, 03:13:34 PM »

Quote
On the church’s immediate prospects for the future, “maybe God knows what she’s doing,” he said. “If you don’t have clergy, maybe the job’s yours.”

Sure. The problem is that the priests are old and the mass is boring.

No apparent problem exists with statements like this by the clergy!

It has been said that we could do quite well with a smaller, more faith filled and obedient flock.   I agree with that assessment.  So these Do-It-Yourself priests and the people they serve could easily be accommodated in any protestant sect or Orthodoxy.  In fact I encourage that wherever I can out here in the real world.

Mary

But, Mary, didn't you know: their job is to make sure that the faith accommodates them.  Nothing less will do.

And, no Orthodoxy wouldn't take 'em.  I could name a few Protestants sects that would off the top of my head, but even then those guys have enough problems of their own without more carpetbaggers moving in.

You already have a bunch of 'em!!  And proud of them you are...oh yes.  I could name them.

You have no way of knowing, one at a time, what you've really got coming in and there's enough congregationalism going around in Orthodoxy in this country that they feel right at home and in charge of their parish and spiritual lives...with nobody to answer to but a kind parish priest who will put them in hospital before he puts them in jail.  They are right at home, and they see girls and women reading and so they think that slowly but surely the rest will come...peace, out!!

You think I am joking...but frankly it isn't funny to me.

M.
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