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Author Topic: Difference between Russian Orthodox and Orthodox Church of America  (Read 3994 times) Average Rating: 0
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Shiloah
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« on: April 23, 2004, 09:46:47 PM »

Christ is risen, indeed He is risen!

Before I invest hours to search through all the forums here, can anybody tell me whether this topic has been discussed already and point me to the link, or if it hasn't, can someone please enlighten me a little about any potential differences between the Russian Orthodox Church/Creed and the Orthodox Church of America one?  I see from various discussions that the Byzantine Catholic Orthodox Church is actually more Catholic than Byzentine, therefore I'd prefer one or the other of the above two mentioned, but I need some clarity as to there dogmatic differences.
Thank you kindly, and may the Holy Spirit guide you in your answer,
Shoshana
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« Reply #1 on: April 23, 2004, 10:55:36 PM »

 [can someone please enlighten me a little about any potential differences between the Russian Orthodox Church/Creed and the Orthodox Church of America one? ]

There are no differences between the the ROC/Creed and the OCA/Creed.  All Orthodox believe in the same Nicean Creed IN ITS ORIGINAL FORM without the Filioque.

The Orthodox Church In America is the daughter of the Russian Orthodox Church.  Its was given its self governing independence from its mother in 1970.

[I see from various discussions that the Byzantine Catholic Orthodox Church is actually more Catholic than Byzentine, therefore I'd prefer one or the other of the above two mentioned, but I need some clarity as to there dogmatic differences.]

Can you be more specific?  Your question is confusing to us.  If you are talking about the Byzantine Catholic Church then it is part of the Church of Rome.  The very fact that it is 'In Communion' with Rome puts it under Romes ultimate authority.  And, as pointed out here recently, required to accept the dogma of the Church it proclaims allegiance to.  Though many of them will deny this.

Orthodoc



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« Reply #2 on: April 24, 2004, 08:53:08 AM »

Thanks, Orthodoc. I am pleased to hear that there are no differences in belief between the ROC and the OCA.  In regard to the other part of my question, I had the impression from visiting a Byzantine Catholic church for a while that not only are they subject to the pope but many RC people attend and they have a different approach to Mary than the Eastern Church. They are into rosary praying etc. and it seems not to be the original veneration but a forced kind which I cannot distinguish clearly because I don't have the background knowledge.  With the Byzantine Church I feel like they have somewhat compromised their roots.

But I am considering joining the OCA because I believe that they represent the true faith and are the closest thing I can find to the original church of Antioch. Or is there such an original church left?

All answers are welcome. I will not be offended and there is no offense meant here.

Have a blessed day,
Shoshana


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« Reply #3 on: April 24, 2004, 09:50:48 AM »


[But I am considering joining the OCA because I believe that they represent the true faith and are the closest thing I can find to the original church of Antioch. Or is there such an original church left?]

All the various Orthodox Churches share the same faith which are expressed in the dogmas and doctrines they adhere to, abide by, and protect.  And it is that which unites them to that original Church of Antioch you mention.

Unfortunately in this country we are  divided by ethnic and political differences, but not the faith we share as one.  I am a life long member of the OCA but have worshipped and been welcomed in all the other Orthodox jurisdictions I have visited.

If you are interested in how todays Orthodox faith ties into the original ancient christian faith I suggest you read the book 'Becoming Orthodox' I recommended to another person in one of my most recent posts.  Also, most books stores carry a paperback copy of 'The Orthodox Church' by Timothy Ware who is a convert and a Bishop in the Greek Orthodox Church.

Orthodoc  

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« Reply #4 on: April 24, 2004, 09:58:58 AM »

... With the Byzantine Church I feel like they have somewhat compromised their roots.

With the "Byzantine Catholics", you certainly have that correct, shoshana! They are a different church now.

Quote
But I am considering joining the OCA because I believe that they represent the true faith and are the closest thing I can find to the original church of Antioch. Or is there such an original church left?

"Original church left? "Yes, the church is called the Orthodox Church! Matters not which jurisdiction you pick other than your finding a parish where you can grow in the Faith. Welcome!
Ask away!

Demetri
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« Reply #5 on: April 24, 2004, 10:35:46 AM »

Quote
But I am considering joining the OCA because I believe that they represent the true faith and are the closest thing I can find to the original church of Antioch. Or is there such an original church left?

As has already been said all the Orthodox churches believe in the same thing, there some slight difference in traditions like melodies in music (but the words are the same).

You mention the orginal church of Antioch, I think someone should mention to you that the direct decedents can be found in the Antiochian Orthodox Archdiocese of North America.

Part of the confusion of the original question is our fault. The question of is Russian Orthodox the same as Greek Orthodox will always be asked until we have a adiministrative unitiy here in America.
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Shiloah
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« Reply #6 on: April 24, 2004, 11:26:41 AM »

Thank y'all for your kind replies. I just checked out the web with your info and come to find out there is an Antiochian Orthodox church about 30 miles from where I live. I will attend tomorrow and will let you know how I like it. Smiley

Shoshana, looking forward to tomorrow
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« Reply #7 on: April 24, 2004, 11:29:23 AM »


You mention the orginal church of Antioch, I think someone should mention to you that the direct decedents can be found in the Antiochian Orthodox Archdiocese of North America.


I considered pointing that out as well, arimethea. It does get confusing yet further when one sees that the mother church of the Antiochian Orthodox Archdiocese of North America is the Greek Orthodox Church of Antioch... Smiley
You are right on about American administrative unity.
For the AO Archdiocese, shoshana:

http://www.antiochian.org/

Demetri
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« Reply #8 on: April 24, 2004, 11:31:08 AM »

About where in VA are you, shoshana?
I only ask because the Antiochians have at least one mission parish in SE Va that may not be serviced by a priest at this time. I suggest you call ahead to where you intend visiting.
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Shiloah
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« Reply #9 on: April 24, 2004, 06:55:36 PM »

Ari, I'm in the area of 37.13 latitude and  76.62  longitude - give or take-  Wink
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"God, who commanded the light to shine out of darkness, hath shined in our hearts, to give the light of the knowledge of the glory of God in the face of Jesus Christ" 2.Cor.4:6

"One thing is education: that we learn how to love God. "
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« Reply #10 on: April 24, 2004, 07:19:15 PM »

The question of is Russian Orthodox the same as Greek Orthodox will always be asked until we have a adiministrative unitiy here in America.
I disagree.  Usually when I hear this question it is from someone who doesn't have a clue about "adminstrative unity" or disunity.  Most people ask the question simply because the name and the country is different.  If we in North America were all "under" the OCA, inquirers would ask "What's the difference between the Russian Orthodox, Greek Orthodox, and American Orthodox?"  Besides, administrative unity wouldn't seem to be much good without spiritual unity.  Does anyone imagine the Metropolitan Philip's aversion to monasticism in America can be "unified" with the Russian and Greek monastic zeal in America?  Any "vision" of the future of Orthodoxy in America that does not include monasticism is not going to bring unity, and can hardly be a "vision" in the right direction.
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« Reply #11 on: April 24, 2004, 08:08:40 PM »

The Metropolitan Philip is opposed to monasticism?
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« Reply #12 on: April 24, 2004, 11:08:41 PM »

The Metropolitan Philip is opposed to monasticism?  

Well, either that or he's just opposed to having monastics and monasteries within his jurisdiction.  Wink
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« Reply #13 on: April 25, 2004, 06:00:25 AM »

Ari, I'm in the area of 37.13 latitude and  76.62  longitude - give or take-  Wink


Good answer. Cheesy
I'm at 40.92864 N
79.18470 W

With the coordinates you supply, I would definitely call ahead to the Antiochian mission before I made the drive. There is a welcoming OCA parish in the area. Of the 3-4 Greek parishes in the area, only one uses mainly or mostly English (and is mainly converts) and I think there is still an active ROCOR mission nearby as well.
PM me if you need.

Demetri, amateur astronomer and Newtonian optics fabricator.
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Shiloah
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« Reply #14 on: April 25, 2004, 04:00:18 PM »

[/font]
To Ari and all,
today I visited the Antiochian Orthodox church I found out about in my area. They have a webpage at http://www.stbasilthegreatorthodoxchurch.org/ . I really liked their liturgy and everything.

Can anybody tell me about how the liturgy developed out eventually out of Acts 2:46-47, or didn't it?  Huh


Shoshana in Antioch territory  Grin
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« Reply #15 on: April 25, 2004, 05:44:31 PM »

[Can anybody tell me about how the liturgy developed out eventually out of Acts 2:46-47, or didn't it?  

Shoshana in Antioch territory]


Try -

Studies in the Faith - Orthodox Liturgical Worship  - Orthodox Liturgical Worship. Return to The Orthodox Faith & Tradition. ...

http://www.goholycross.org/studies/studies_liturgical.html

http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/tg/detail/-/0881411000/104-7959741-6371938?v=glance

-------

Orthodox


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Oh Lord, Save thy people and bless thine inheritance.
Grant victory to the Orthodox Christians over their adversaries.
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Shiloah
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« Reply #16 on: April 26, 2004, 10:46:36 AM »

Thanks to Orthodoc and Nicholas for the references. Greatly appreciated! Will need some time to read all and money ($120) for the Windows XP version of the Orthodox New Testament.  Donations welcome (if 120 people on this forum send me a dollar each, it would work out   Smiley

Shoshana, blessed
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« Reply #17 on: April 26, 2004, 11:52:46 AM »

Well, either that or he's just opposed to having monastics and monasteries within his jurisdiction.  Wink

Yes it is odd in comparison with other jurisdictions active in North America.  Don't really understand very much about what the basis for this approach has been.  I suspect, however, that it works well for the many protestant converts in the AA, given that at least some of these will have some aversion to monasticism in general.

Brendan
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