Author Topic: The use of non-Latin Catholic rites outside of their traditional geographic areas  (Read 835 times)

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Offline synLeszka

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Split off from Eastern and Western Catholic Roll Call.

I do not think that it is fortunate to see a Syriac mass in the USA... The Syriac Mass should be said in Syria not in the US.
« Last Edit: December 30, 2010, 10:58:18 AM by Schultz »

Offline WetCatechumen

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I do not think that it is fortunate to see a Syriac mass in the USA... The Syriac Mass should be said in Syria not in the US.

Why? There are many Iraqi refugees in my city, and they go to the Eastern Catholic parish. At some point, we may actually have enough to start a Syriac Catholic mission. They want to hear Mass in their own tongue according to their own rite. There's not reason for us to prevent them just because of locality.
"And because they have nothing better to do, they take cushion and chairs to Rome. And while the Pope is saying liturgy, they go, 'Oh, oh, oh, filioque!' And the Pope say, 'Filioque? That-uh sound nice! I think I divide-uh the Church over it!'" - Comrade Real Presence

Offline ChristusDominus

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I do not think that it is fortunate to see a Syriac mass in the USA... The Syriac Mass should be said in Syria not in the US.
Did they stop celebrating the Syriac Mass over there?
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Offline theistgal

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And I think the Latin Mass should only be said in Latin America. ;)
"Sometimes, you just gotta say, 'OK, I still have nine live, two-headed animals' and move on.'' (owner of Coney Island freak show, upon learning he'd been outbid on a 5-legged puppy)

Offline Papist

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And I think the Latin Mass should only be said in Latin America. ;)
:D
« Last Edit: December 29, 2010, 12:04:52 AM by Papist »
You are right. I apologize for having sacked Constantinople. I really need to stop doing that.

Offline ialmisry

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I do not think that it is fortunate to see a Syriac mass in the USA... The Syriac Mass should be said in Syria not in the US.
Do tell your archdiocese of Chicago. They have all these Polish masses here.
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Offline podkarpatska

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I do not think that it is fortunate to see a Syriac mass in the USA... The Syriac Mass should be said in Syria not in the US.
Do tell your archdiocese of Chicago. They have all these Polish masses here.

I don't want to read too much into synLeszka's comment, but it strikes me of being of the same mindset that Archbishop Ireland and his progeny exhibited in response to the growth of the Slavic Greek Catholic community in the United States in the late 19th century.

Offline elijahmaria

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I do not think that it is fortunate to see a Syriac mass in the USA... The Syriac Mass should be said in Syria not in the US.
Do tell your archdiocese of Chicago. They have all these Polish masses here.

I don't want to read too much into synLeszka's comment, but it strikes me of being of the same mindset that Archbishop Ireland and his progeny exhibited in response to the growth of the Slavic Greek Catholic community in the United States in the late 19th century.

It struck me much the same way.  Though the one-liner is much too cryptic for us to know precisely what he intended.

I do hope he returns to this and explains his response a bit more clearly.  It may confirm what I felt about it initially, or not, but I am interested to know with more certitude.

Mary

Offline synLeszka

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I do not think that it is fortunate to see a Syriac mass in the USA... The Syriac Mass should be said in Syria not in the US.

I find it sad that Syriac Catholics had to immigrate from their homeland. I find it sad that they cannot celebrate their liturgy in peace in Damascus but have to seek asylum in a land which is not their homeland. I think that everyone agrees with me that immigration is a sad experience which in an ideal world would not exist. True, the faith has no national heritage but the religious experience of a nation which the Syriac liturgy is a codification of cannot be transplanted elsewhere without becoming a calque of reality.

Offline ag_vn

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^

Actually, Syriac Catholics don't have problems in Syria, if they emigrate it is not for persecution, but rather for economic reasons, so they can celebrate their Liturgy in peace in Damascus, Aleppo, etc.

Most Syriac Catholics emigrated from their homelands because of the Seyfo; from the Patriarchal diocese in Lebanon during the Lebanese civil war and after the American invasion in Iraq, where they are concentrated in Baghdad and Mosul.

Offline podkarpatska

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I do not think that it is fortunate to see a Syriac mass in the USA... The Syriac Mass should be said in Syria not in the US.

I find it sad that Syriac Catholics had to immigrate from their homeland. I find it sad that they cannot celebrate their liturgy in peace in Damascus but have to seek asylum in a land which is not their homeland. I think that everyone agrees with me that immigration is a sad experience which in an ideal world would not exist. True, the faith has no national heritage but the religious experience of a nation which the Syriac liturgy is a codification of cannot be transplanted elsewhere without becoming a calque of reality.


Are you then critical of Americans of Polish origin who have kept many of the customs and pious traditions of the Old World (many of which those of us who are Ukrainian, Slovak, Rusyn, Lemko or Galician) and do you consider them to be a 'calque of reality?' Seriously, you would not get very far with that argument in say Buffalo, New York, Chicago, Illinois or Milwaukee, Wisconsin just to name a few metropolitan areas with a large Polish American population. (Or Toronto, Ontario if you prefer Canada.)

If that is your point, you have more in common with Archbishop Ireland than your expatriate Poles here and perhaps you have caused some of us to rethink what we have been taught about Archbishop Ireland's motivations. Perhaps he and his colleagues were  motivated not by a misplaced 19th century notion of 'Americanism' but, as I suspect Isa would agree, with a sense of a Papal mandate that would put some hypothetical sense of being a prototypical Roman Catholic over the pious traditions of any nation.

Offline ialmisry

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I do not think that it is fortunate to see a Syriac mass in the USA... The Syriac Mass should be said in Syria not in the US.

I find it sad that Syriac Catholics had to immigrate from their homeland. I find it sad that they cannot celebrate their liturgy in peace in Damascus but have to seek asylum in a land which is not their homeland. I think that everyone agrees with me that immigration is a sad experience which in an ideal world would not exist.

Still pining over the feudalism of the Commonwealth I see.

Quote
True, the faith has no national heritage but the religious experience of a nation which the Syriac liturgy is a codification of cannot be transplanted elsewhere without becoming a calque of reality.
sort of like the Latin mass outside of North Africa.

The English have made quite a convincing calque of Britain in the US and Canada.  The French have made a good calque of France in Quebec, and even vestiges remain in the Mississippi valley (my son, when we were traveling there, asked, how come we have all this French stuff and no one knows about it).
The Poles have made quite a convincing calque here in Chicago in Polonia.
Question a friend, perhaps he did not do it; but if he did anything so that he may do it no more.
A hasty quarrel kindles fire,
and urgent strife sheds blood.
If you blow on a spark, it will glow;
if you spit on it, it will be put out;
                           and both come out of your mouth