OrthodoxChristianity.net
November 28, 2014, 03:35:38 PM *
Welcome, Guest. Please login or register.

Login with username, password and session length
News: Reminder: No political discussions in the public fora.  If you do not have access to the private Politics Forum, please send a PM to Fr. George.
 
   Home   Help Calendar Contact Treasury Tags Login Register  
Pages: 1 2 »  All   Go Down
  Print  
Author Topic: Four in 10 Americans Believe in Strict Creationism  (Read 3040 times) Average Rating: 0
0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.
Jetavan
Argumentum ad australopithecum
Taxiarches
**********
Offline Offline

Faith: Science to the Fourth Power
Jurisdiction: Ohayo Gozaimasu
Posts: 6,580


Barlaam and Josaphat


WWW
« on: December 20, 2010, 12:58:05 PM »

What's interesting is that while the theistic evolution position has remained constant, slight changes occurred in the percentages of strict creationism and non-theistic evolution, almost as if those who gave up strict creationism would later accept evolution as not being guided by God.

PRINCETON, NJ -- Four in 10 Americans, slightly fewer today than in years past, believe God created humans in their present form about 10,000 years ago. Thirty-eight percent believe God guided a process by which humans developed over millions of years from less advanced life forms, while 16%, up slightly from years past, believe humans developed over millions of years, without God's involvement.



These views have been generally stable over the last 28 years. Acceptance of the creationist viewpoint has decreased slightly over time, with a concomitant rise in acceptance of a secular evolution perspective. But these shifts have not been large, and the basic structure of beliefs about human beings' origins is generally the same as it was in the early 1980s.

« Last Edit: December 20, 2010, 01:03:13 PM by Jetavan » Logged

If you will, you can become all flame.
Extra caritatem nulla salus.
In order to become whole, take the "I" out of "holiness".
सर्वभूतहित
Ἄνω σχῶμεν τὰς καρδίας
"Those who say religion has nothing to do with politics do not know what religion is." -- Mohandas Gandhi
Y dduw bo'r diolch.
Iconodule
Uranopolitan
Warned
Taxiarches
**********
Offline Offline

Faith: Orthodox Christian
Jurisdiction: OCA (Diocese of Eastern Pennsylvania)
Posts: 7,092


"My god is greater."


« Reply #1 on: December 20, 2010, 03:39:49 PM »

What's interesting is that while the theistic evolution position has remained constant, slight changes occurred in the percentages of strict creationism and non-theistic evolution, almost as if those who gave up strict creationism would later accept evolution as not being guided by God.

"Theistic evolution" is already a concession to atheism, and a very awkward one, so why not skip it and go all the way?
Logged

"A riddle or the cricket's cry
Is to doubt a fit reply." - William Blake
minasoliman
Mr., Sir, Dude, Guy, Male, tr. Minas in Greek, Menes in white people Egyptologists :-P
Moderator
Toumarches
*****
Offline Offline

Faith: Oriental Orthodox
Jurisdiction: Coptic Orthodox Archdiocese of North America
Posts: 12,734


Strengthen O Lord the work of Your hands(Is 19:25)


« Reply #2 on: December 20, 2010, 03:47:34 PM »

What's interesting is that while the theistic evolution position has remained constant, slight changes occurred in the percentages of strict creationism and non-theistic evolution, almost as if those who gave up strict creationism would later accept evolution as not being guided by God.

"Theistic evolution" is already a concession to atheism, and a very awkward one, so why not skip it and go all the way?

This comment is a very stupid one, probably the stupidest post ever and most useless.
« Last Edit: December 20, 2010, 03:47:57 PM by minasoliman » Logged

Vain existence can never exist, for "unless the LORD builds the house, the builders labor in vain." (Psalm 127)

If the faith is unchanged and rock solid, then the gates of Hades never prevailed in the end.
Tzimis
Site Supporter
Archon
*****
Offline Offline

Faith: Greek Orthodox
Jurisdiction: GOA
Posts: 2,375



« Reply #3 on: December 20, 2010, 04:05:41 PM »

I don't know if I would trust that graph. It is projecting out past 2010.  The year isn't even over yet. Roll Eyes
Logged

Excellence of character, then, is a state concerned with choice, lying in a mean relative to us, this being determined by reason and in the way in which the man of practical wisdom would determine it. Now it is a mean between two vices, that which depends on excess and that which depends on defect.
minasoliman
Mr., Sir, Dude, Guy, Male, tr. Minas in Greek, Menes in white people Egyptologists :-P
Moderator
Toumarches
*****
Offline Offline

Faith: Oriental Orthodox
Jurisdiction: Coptic Orthodox Archdiocese of North America
Posts: 12,734


Strengthen O Lord the work of Your hands(Is 19:25)


« Reply #4 on: December 20, 2010, 04:09:13 PM »

I don't know if I would trust that graph. It is projecting out past 2010.  The year isn't even over yet. Roll Eyes

ummmmm....really?

it's the gallop poll taken at the "end of 2010."  Take a closer look at the graph.  It's an approximation of when in each year gallup polls were taken.

For example, the second time a gallup poll seems to have been taken (after 1982), seems to look like it was taken in 1993, perhaps even the middle of 1993 if we were to assume it's all scaled correctly.
« Last Edit: December 20, 2010, 04:11:27 PM by minasoliman » Logged

Vain existence can never exist, for "unless the LORD builds the house, the builders labor in vain." (Psalm 127)

If the faith is unchanged and rock solid, then the gates of Hades never prevailed in the end.
Tzimis
Site Supporter
Archon
*****
Offline Offline

Faith: Greek Orthodox
Jurisdiction: GOA
Posts: 2,375



« Reply #5 on: December 20, 2010, 04:16:58 PM »

I don't know if I would trust that graph. It is projecting out past 2010.  The year isn't even over yet. Roll Eyes

ummmmm....really?

it's the gallop poll taken at the "end of 2010."  Take a closer look at the graph.  It's an approximation of when in each year gallup polls were taken.

For example, the second time a gallup poll seems to have been taken (after 1982), seems to look like it was taken in 1993, perhaps even the middle of 1993 if we were to assume it's all scaled correctly.

If that were true than in 1982 it would state 0. How could you start a graph with data if it didn't already occur? Wink
Logged

Excellence of character, then, is a state concerned with choice, lying in a mean relative to us, this being determined by reason and in the way in which the man of practical wisdom would determine it. Now it is a mean between two vices, that which depends on excess and that which depends on defect.
minasoliman
Mr., Sir, Dude, Guy, Male, tr. Minas in Greek, Menes in white people Egyptologists :-P
Moderator
Toumarches
*****
Offline Offline

Faith: Oriental Orthodox
Jurisdiction: Coptic Orthodox Archdiocese of North America
Posts: 12,734


Strengthen O Lord the work of Your hands(Is 19:25)


« Reply #6 on: December 20, 2010, 04:39:42 PM »

I don't know if I would trust that graph. It is projecting out past 2010.  The year isn't even over yet. Roll Eyes

ummmmm....really?

it's the gallop poll taken at the "end of 2010."  Take a closer look at the graph.  It's an approximation of when in each year gallup polls were taken.

For example, the second time a gallup poll seems to have been taken (after 1982), seems to look like it was taken in 1993, perhaps even the middle of 1993 if we were to assume it's all scaled correctly.

If that were true than in 1982 it would state 0. How could you start a graph with data if it didn't already occur? Wink

what?
Logged

Vain existence can never exist, for "unless the LORD builds the house, the builders labor in vain." (Psalm 127)

If the faith is unchanged and rock solid, then the gates of Hades never prevailed in the end.
HandmaidenofGod
Archon
********
Offline Offline

Faith: Eastern Orthodox
Jurisdiction: Ukrainian Orthodox Church of the USA (Ecumenical Patriarch)
Posts: 3,397


O Holy St. Demetrius pray to God for us!


« Reply #7 on: December 20, 2010, 04:40:38 PM »

1 in 5 Americans believe the President is a Muslim.

Just because people believe something doesn't make it true.
Logged

"For I know the thoughts that I think toward you, says the LORD, thoughts of peace and not of evil, to give you a future and a hope." Jer 29:11
GiC
Resident Atheist
Site Supporter
Merarches
*****
Offline Offline

Faith: Mathematician
Posts: 9,490



« Reply #8 on: December 20, 2010, 05:07:27 PM »

I don't know if I would trust that graph. It is projecting out past 2010.  The year isn't even over yet. Roll Eyes

ummmmm....really?

it's the gallop poll taken at the "end of 2010."  Take a closer look at the graph.  It's an approximation of when in each year gallup polls were taken.

For example, the second time a gallup poll seems to have been taken (after 1982), seems to look like it was taken in 1993, perhaps even the middle of 1993 if we were to assume it's all scaled correctly.

If that were true than in 1982 it would state 0. How could you start a graph with data if it didn't already occur? Wink

Looks like someone needs to go back to primary school and learn to read graphs again. Wink

But with that said, there is a real problem with this graph, it's based on a survey which means there's a certain amount of uncertainty (a margin of error). The omission of error bars is a real problem. I don't know what the sample sizes were, but I do question if a 2% change is even significant.
Logged

"The liberties of people never were, nor ever will be, secure, when the transactions of their rulers may be concealed from them." -- Patrick Henry
Tzimis
Site Supporter
Archon
*****
Offline Offline

Faith: Greek Orthodox
Jurisdiction: GOA
Posts: 2,375



« Reply #9 on: December 20, 2010, 05:24:24 PM »

I don't know if I would trust that graph. It is projecting out past 2010.  The year isn't even over yet. Roll Eyes

ummmmm....really?

it's the gallop poll taken at the "end of 2010."  Take a closer look at the graph.  It's an approximation of when in each year gallup polls were taken.

For example, the second time a gallup poll seems to have been taken (after 1982), seems to look like it was taken in 1993, perhaps even the middle of 1993 if we were to assume it's all scaled correctly.

If that were true than in 1982 it would state 0. How could you start a graph with data if it didn't already occur? Wink

Looks like someone needs to go back to primary school and learn to read graphs again. Wink


Minas stated that there needs to be a time line and the graph states approximately the 11 eleventh month. I stated that 1982 has a figure without a time line and that it should have started with 0 to make the graph accurate since there is no time line before 1982.

Logged

Excellence of character, then, is a state concerned with choice, lying in a mean relative to us, this being determined by reason and in the way in which the man of practical wisdom would determine it. Now it is a mean between two vices, that which depends on excess and that which depends on defect.
Jetavan
Argumentum ad australopithecum
Taxiarches
**********
Offline Offline

Faith: Science to the Fourth Power
Jurisdiction: Ohayo Gozaimasu
Posts: 6,580


Barlaam and Josaphat


WWW
« Reply #10 on: December 20, 2010, 05:27:50 PM »

Results are based on telephone interviews conducted December 10-12, 2010 with a random sample of –1,019— adults, aged 18+, living in the continental U.S., selected using random-digit dial sampling.

For results based on the total sample of national adults, one can say with 95% confidence that the margin of error is ±4 percentage points.

For results based on the sample of – 840—Internet users, one can say, the maximum margin of sampling error is ±4 percentage points.
« Last Edit: December 20, 2010, 05:30:35 PM by Jetavan » Logged

If you will, you can become all flame.
Extra caritatem nulla salus.
In order to become whole, take the "I" out of "holiness".
सर्वभूतहित
Ἄνω σχῶμεν τὰς καρδίας
"Those who say religion has nothing to do with politics do not know what religion is." -- Mohandas Gandhi
Y dduw bo'r diolch.
Fr. George
formerly "Cleveland"
Administrator
Stratopedarches
*******
Offline Offline

Faith: Orthodox (Catholic) Christian
Jurisdiction: GOA - Metropolis of Pittsburgh
Posts: 20,110


May the Lord bless you and keep you always!


« Reply #11 on: December 20, 2010, 05:57:51 PM »

I don't know if I would trust that graph. It is projecting out past 2010.  The year isn't even over yet. Roll Eyes

ummmmm....really?

it's the gallop poll taken at the "end of 2010."  Take a closer look at the graph.  It's an approximation of when in each year gallup polls were taken.

For example, the second time a gallup poll seems to have been taken (after 1982), seems to look like it was taken in 1993, perhaps even the middle of 1993 if we were to assume it's all scaled correctly.

If that were true than in 1982 it would state 0. How could you start a graph with data if it didn't already occur? Wink

Looks like someone needs to go back to primary school and learn to read graphs again. Wink


Minas stated that there needs to be a time line and the graph states approximately the 11 eleventh month. I stated that 1982 has a figure without a time line and that it should have started with 0 to make the graph accurate since there is no time line before 1982.

They can't put "0" on a graph of a survey unless they got a response of "0," so they can't put "0" for a time when no data exists because that would imply data indicating "0."
Logged

"The man who doesn't read good books has no advantage over the one who can't read them." Mark Twain
---------------------
Ordained on 17 & 18-Oct 2009. Please forgive me if earlier posts are poorly worded or incorrect in any way.
GabrieltheCelt
Hillbilly Extraordinaire
Taxiarches
**********
Offline Offline

Faith: Eastern Orthodox Christian
Jurisdiction: OCA
Posts: 6,990


Chasin' down a Hoodoo...


« Reply #12 on: December 20, 2010, 06:12:49 PM »

4) Who cares?
Logged

"The Scots-Irish; Brewed in Scotland, bottled in Ireland, uncorked in America."  ~Scots-Irish saying
Tzimis
Site Supporter
Archon
*****
Offline Offline

Faith: Greek Orthodox
Jurisdiction: GOA
Posts: 2,375



« Reply #13 on: December 20, 2010, 06:28:57 PM »

I don't know if I would trust that graph. It is projecting out past 2010.  The year isn't even over yet. Roll Eyes

ummmmm....really?

it's the gallop poll taken at the "end of 2010."  Take a closer look at the graph.  It's an approximation of when in each year gallup polls were taken.

For example, the second time a gallup poll seems to have been taken (after 1982), seems to look like it was taken in 1993, perhaps even the middle of 1993 if we were to assume it's all scaled correctly.

If that were true than in 1982 it would state 0. How could you start a graph with data if it didn't already occur? Wink

Looks like someone needs to go back to primary school and learn to read graphs again. Wink


Minas stated that there needs to be a time line and the graph states approximately the 11 eleventh month. I stated that 1982 has a figure without a time line and that it should have started with 0 to make the graph accurate since there is no time line before 1982.

They can't put "0" on a graph of a survey unless they got a response of "0," so they can't put "0" for a time when no data exists because that would imply data indicating "0."

I understand your logic father. It's all a matter of perspective I would guess. If there is an 0 in January and a 44 in Dec. than it would indicate that there is a time line associated with the chart. So the 2010 reaches beyond the 2010 projecting to the 11th month. Wouldn't it be natural for the same to occur in 1982?
Logged

Excellence of character, then, is a state concerned with choice, lying in a mean relative to us, this being determined by reason and in the way in which the man of practical wisdom would determine it. Now it is a mean between two vices, that which depends on excess and that which depends on defect.
ialmisry
There's nothing John of Damascus can't answer
Warned
Hypatos
*****************
Offline Offline

Faith: جامعي Arab confesssing the Orthodox Faith of the One, Holy, Catholic and Apostolic Church
Jurisdiction: Antioch (for now), but my heart belongs to Alexandria
Posts: 37,963



« Reply #14 on: December 20, 2010, 06:39:18 PM »

1 in 5 Americans believe the President is a Muslim.

Just because people believe something doesn't make it true.
I'm curious, what percentage of Muslims are convinced that Obama is Muslim.
Logged

Question a friend, perhaps he did not do it; but if he did anything so that he may do it no more.
A hasty quarrel kindles fire,
and urgent strife sheds blood.
If you blow on a spark, it will glow;
if you spit on it, it will be put out;
                           and both come out of your mouth
Ortho_cat
Protokentarchos
*********
Offline Offline

Faith: Orthodox
Jurisdiction: AOCA-DWMA
Posts: 5,392



« Reply #15 on: December 20, 2010, 06:40:52 PM »

I heard once that the U.S. has the highest percentage of evolution deniers among the developed countries. Can anyone confirm this?
Logged
Jetavan
Argumentum ad australopithecum
Taxiarches
**********
Offline Offline

Faith: Science to the Fourth Power
Jurisdiction: Ohayo Gozaimasu
Posts: 6,580


Barlaam and Josaphat


WWW
« Reply #16 on: December 20, 2010, 08:56:23 PM »

I heard once that the U.S. has the highest percentage of evolution deniers among the developed countries. Can anyone confirm this?
From NatGeo:

This chart depicts the public acceptance of evolution theory in 34 countries in 2005. Adults were asked to respond to the statement: "Human beings, as we know them, developed from earlier species of animals." The percentage of respondents who believed this to be true is marked in blue; those who believed it to be false, in red; and those who were not sure, in yellow.

A study of several such surveys taken since 1985 has found that the United States ranks next to last in acceptance of evolution theory among nations polled. Researchers point out that the number of Americans who are uncertain about the theory's validity has increased over the past 20 years.

« Last Edit: December 20, 2010, 09:00:30 PM by Jetavan » Logged

If you will, you can become all flame.
Extra caritatem nulla salus.
In order to become whole, take the "I" out of "holiness".
सर्वभूतहित
Ἄνω σχῶμεν τὰς καρδίας
"Those who say religion has nothing to do with politics do not know what religion is." -- Mohandas Gandhi
Y dduw bo'r diolch.
CRCulver
OC.net guru
*******
Offline Offline

Faith: Eastern Orthodox
Jurisdiction: Church of Finland and Romanian Orthodox Church
Posts: 1,159


St Stephen of Perm, missionary to speakers of Komi


WWW
« Reply #17 on: December 20, 2010, 10:29:43 PM »

I'm curious, what percentage of Muslims are convinced that Obama is Muslim.

Having travelled in a few Muslim countries since he was elected, I was surprised to find many think that he is a Jew (and that a whole half of Americans are Jews).
Logged
David 2007
Sr. Member
****
Offline Offline

Posts: 197



« Reply #18 on: December 21, 2010, 04:46:08 AM »

I heard once that the U.S. has the highest percentage of evolution deniers among the developed countries. Can anyone confirm this?
From NatGeo:

This chart depicts the public acceptance of evolution theory in 34 countries in 2005. Adults were asked to respond to the statement: "Human beings, as we know them, developed from earlier species of animals." The percentage of respondents who believed this to be true is marked in blue; those who believed it to be false, in red; and those who were not sure, in yellow.

A study of several such surveys taken since 1985 has found that the United States ranks next to last in acceptance of evolution theory among nations polled. Researchers point out that the number of Americans who are uncertain about the theory's validity has increased over the past 20 years.




That graph is offensive and should be disregarded. Where is Australia??

Pfft. Totally irrelevant if Australia is not on it!  Tongue

(Actually that is quite rude of them to exclude the best Western Country on Earth!)
Logged
David 2007
Sr. Member
****
Offline Offline

Posts: 197



« Reply #19 on: December 21, 2010, 04:47:43 AM »

Malta has a population of 400,000???

But they exclude Australia???


DUMB!
Logged
Jetavan
Argumentum ad australopithecum
Taxiarches
**********
Offline Offline

Faith: Science to the Fourth Power
Jurisdiction: Ohayo Gozaimasu
Posts: 6,580


Barlaam and Josaphat


WWW
« Reply #20 on: December 21, 2010, 12:43:46 PM »

Malta has a population of 400,000???

But they exclude Australia???


DUMB!
Don't you guys have a whole town named "Darwin"? What more do you wantHuh
Logged

If you will, you can become all flame.
Extra caritatem nulla salus.
In order to become whole, take the "I" out of "holiness".
सर्वभूतहित
Ἄνω σχῶμεν τὰς καρδίας
"Those who say religion has nothing to do with politics do not know what religion is." -- Mohandas Gandhi
Y dduw bo'r diolch.
jckstraw72
OC.net guru
*******
Offline Offline

Faith: Orthodox
Jurisdiction: OCA
Posts: 1,174



« Reply #21 on: December 21, 2010, 12:53:09 PM »

I heard once that the U.S. has the highest percentage of evolution deniers among the developed countries. Can anyone confirm this?
From NatGeo:

This chart depicts the public acceptance of evolution theory in 34 countries in 2005. Adults were asked to respond to the statement: "Human beings, as we know them, developed from earlier species of animals." The percentage of respondents who believed this to be true is marked in blue; those who believed it to be false, in red; and those who were not sure, in yellow.

A study of several such surveys taken since 1985 has found that the United States ranks next to last in acceptance of evolution theory among nations polled. Researchers point out that the number of Americans who are uncertain about the theory's validity has increased over the past 20 years.



sweet. looks like America is right at home with a bunch of Orthodox countries!
Logged
jckstraw72
OC.net guru
*******
Offline Offline

Faith: Orthodox
Jurisdiction: OCA
Posts: 1,174



« Reply #22 on: December 21, 2010, 12:53:50 PM »

What's interesting is that while the theistic evolution position has remained constant, slight changes occurred in the percentages of strict creationism and non-theistic evolution, almost as if those who gave up strict creationism would later accept evolution as not being guided by God.

"Theistic evolution" is already a concession to atheism, and a very awkward one, so why not skip it and go all the way?

aaah the succint truth! tastes so yummy.
Logged
minasoliman
Mr., Sir, Dude, Guy, Male, tr. Minas in Greek, Menes in white people Egyptologists :-P
Moderator
Toumarches
*****
Offline Offline

Faith: Oriental Orthodox
Jurisdiction: Coptic Orthodox Archdiocese of North America
Posts: 12,734


Strengthen O Lord the work of Your hands(Is 19:25)


« Reply #23 on: December 21, 2010, 01:19:04 PM »

I heard once that the U.S. has the highest percentage of evolution deniers among the developed countries. Can anyone confirm this?
From NatGeo:

This chart depicts the public acceptance of evolution theory in 34 countries in 2005. Adults were asked to respond to the statement: "Human beings, as we know them, developed from earlier species of animals." The percentage of respondents who believed this to be true is marked in blue; those who believed it to be false, in red; and those who were not sure, in yellow.

A study of several such surveys taken since 1985 has found that the United States ranks next to last in acceptance of evolution theory among nations polled. Researchers point out that the number of Americans who are uncertain about the theory's validity has increased over the past 20 years.



sweet. looks like America is right at home with a bunch of Orthodox countries!

And the Muslim countries.  They've only shown one, but I bet you a dime a dozen the Islamic countries are right in there as well.  It's interesting you're proud of Orthodox being in association with Muslim and Protestant beliefs.
« Last Edit: December 21, 2010, 01:19:58 PM by minasoliman » Logged

Vain existence can never exist, for "unless the LORD builds the house, the builders labor in vain." (Psalm 127)

If the faith is unchanged and rock solid, then the gates of Hades never prevailed in the end.
jckstraw72
OC.net guru
*******
Offline Offline

Faith: Orthodox
Jurisdiction: OCA
Posts: 1,174



« Reply #24 on: December 21, 2010, 02:00:18 PM »

I heard once that the U.S. has the highest percentage of evolution deniers among the developed countries. Can anyone confirm this?
From NatGeo:

This chart depicts the public acceptance of evolution theory in 34 countries in 2005. Adults were asked to respond to the statement: "Human beings, as we know them, developed from earlier species of animals." The percentage of respondents who believed this to be true is marked in blue; those who believed it to be false, in red; and those who were not sure, in yellow.

A study of several such surveys taken since 1985 has found that the United States ranks next to last in acceptance of evolution theory among nations polled. Researchers point out that the number of Americans who are uncertain about the theory's validity has increased over the past 20 years.



sweet. looks like America is right at home with a bunch of Orthodox countries!

And the Muslim countries.  They've only shown one, but I bet you a dime a dozen the Islamic countries are right in there as well.  It's interesting you're proud of Orthodox being in association with Muslim and Protestant beliefs.

as i demonstrated in the other thread, its actually the Protestants and the Muslims who are in association with Orthodox beliefs (and you recognized this in the other thread - you said that the Fathers are wrong because of their literal interpretation of Genesis). so yes, i'm glad that the heterodox have retained some seeds of the truth.
Logged
Entscheidungsproblem
Formerly Friul & Nebelpfade
Protokentarchos
*********
Offline Offline

Faith: Machine God
Posts: 4,495



WWW
« Reply #25 on: December 21, 2010, 03:35:40 PM »

4) Who cares?
Those of us concerned with scientific education. 

Hardly surprised though.  A sizable percentage of people have lost their grip on reality and believe in astrology, might as well believe in creationism while you are at it...
Logged

As a result of a thousand million years of evolution, the universe is becoming conscious of itself, able to understand something of its past history and its possible future.
-- Sir Julian Sorell Huxley FRS
minasoliman
Mr., Sir, Dude, Guy, Male, tr. Minas in Greek, Menes in white people Egyptologists :-P
Moderator
Toumarches
*****
Offline Offline

Faith: Oriental Orthodox
Jurisdiction: Coptic Orthodox Archdiocese of North America
Posts: 12,734


Strengthen O Lord the work of Your hands(Is 19:25)


« Reply #26 on: December 21, 2010, 03:44:49 PM »

I heard once that the U.S. has the highest percentage of evolution deniers among the developed countries. Can anyone confirm this?
From NatGeo:

This chart depicts the public acceptance of evolution theory in 34 countries in 2005. Adults were asked to respond to the statement: "Human beings, as we know them, developed from earlier species of animals." The percentage of respondents who believed this to be true is marked in blue; those who believed it to be false, in red; and those who were not sure, in yellow.

A study of several such surveys taken since 1985 has found that the United States ranks next to last in acceptance of evolution theory among nations polled. Researchers point out that the number of Americans who are uncertain about the theory's validity has increased over the past 20 years.



sweet. looks like America is right at home with a bunch of Orthodox countries!

And the Muslim countries.  They've only shown one, but I bet you a dime a dozen the Islamic countries are right in there as well.  It's interesting you're proud of Orthodox being in association with Muslim and Protestant beliefs.

as i demonstrated in the other thread, its actually the Protestants and the Muslims who are in association with Orthodox beliefs (and you recognized this in the other thread - you said that the Fathers are wrong because of their literal interpretation of Genesis). so yes, i'm glad that the heterodox have retained some seeds of the truth.

Well, I'm sorry you feel that way about me, that I partake of some sort of seeds of falsehood.  Keep me in your prayers then.
Logged

Vain existence can never exist, for "unless the LORD builds the house, the builders labor in vain." (Psalm 127)

If the faith is unchanged and rock solid, then the gates of Hades never prevailed in the end.
ialmisry
There's nothing John of Damascus can't answer
Warned
Hypatos
*****************
Offline Offline

Faith: جامعي Arab confesssing the Orthodox Faith of the One, Holy, Catholic and Apostolic Church
Jurisdiction: Antioch (for now), but my heart belongs to Alexandria
Posts: 37,963



« Reply #27 on: December 21, 2010, 04:02:29 PM »

4) Who cares?
Those of us concerned with scientific education.


You're right on those Climategate emails then, aren't you?  Following up on those wikileaks on Al Gore the savior and his entourage, no?

Quote
Hardly surprised though.  A sizable percentage of people have lost their grip on reality and believe in astrology, might as well believe in creationism while you are at it...

No, astrology leads to idolatry.
Logged

Question a friend, perhaps he did not do it; but if he did anything so that he may do it no more.
A hasty quarrel kindles fire,
and urgent strife sheds blood.
If you blow on a spark, it will glow;
if you spit on it, it will be put out;
                           and both come out of your mouth
Iconodule
Uranopolitan
Warned
Taxiarches
**********
Offline Offline

Faith: Orthodox Christian
Jurisdiction: OCA (Diocese of Eastern Pennsylvania)
Posts: 7,092


"My god is greater."


« Reply #28 on: December 21, 2010, 04:14:46 PM »

No, astrology leads to idolatry.

Not necessarily. Some astrology has a place in Christianity, for instance, in our calendar. And don't forget- "Those who worshipped the stars were taught by a star to worship Thee."
Logged

"A riddle or the cricket's cry
Is to doubt a fit reply." - William Blake
ialmisry
There's nothing John of Damascus can't answer
Warned
Hypatos
*****************
Offline Offline

Faith: جامعي Arab confesssing the Orthodox Faith of the One, Holy, Catholic and Apostolic Church
Jurisdiction: Antioch (for now), but my heart belongs to Alexandria
Posts: 37,963



« Reply #29 on: December 21, 2010, 04:24:58 PM »

No, astrology leads to idolatry.

Not necessarily. Some astrology has a place in Christianity, for instance, in our calendar.
That's astronmy.

Quote
And don't forget- "Those who worshipped the stars were taught by a star to worship Thee."
I had that in the back of my mind.  In the front was the determinism of astrology that St. John denounced.
Logged

Question a friend, perhaps he did not do it; but if he did anything so that he may do it no more.
A hasty quarrel kindles fire,
and urgent strife sheds blood.
If you blow on a spark, it will glow;
if you spit on it, it will be put out;
                           and both come out of your mouth
PeterTheAleut
The Right Blowhard Peter the Furtive of Yetts O'Muckhart
Section Moderator
Protospatharios
*****
Offline Offline

Faith: Orthodox Christian
Jurisdiction: OCA
Posts: 32,968


Lord, have mercy on the Christians in Mosul!


« Reply #30 on: December 21, 2010, 04:33:44 PM »

as i demonstrated in the other thread, its actually the Protestants and the Muslims who are in association with Orthodox beliefs (and you recognized this in the other thread - you said that the Fathers are wrong because of their literal interpretation of Genesis). so yes, i'm glad that the heterodox have retained some seeds of the truth.
Unfortunately, the only thing you've demonstrated with any definitive authority on the other thread is that you just can't walk away from an argument. Roll Eyes
« Last Edit: December 21, 2010, 04:43:39 PM by PeterTheAleut » Logged
Iconodule
Uranopolitan
Warned
Taxiarches
**********
Offline Offline

Faith: Orthodox Christian
Jurisdiction: OCA (Diocese of Eastern Pennsylvania)
Posts: 7,092


"My god is greater."


« Reply #31 on: December 21, 2010, 04:37:18 PM »

No, astrology leads to idolatry.

Not necessarily. Some astrology has a place in Christianity, for instance, in our calendar.
That's astronmy.

Such a distinction, like "chemistry" vs. "alchemy", was meaningless before modernity and the triumph of materialism as the only real science (in the minds of its promoters). Astrology is astronomy.

Quote
I had that in the back of my mind.  In the front was the determinism of astrology that St. John denounced.

Of course, determinism was rejected, but at the same time St. John accepted that celestial bodies can influence events on earth. Like other aspects of pagan thought, astrology had good and bad elements.
Logged

"A riddle or the cricket's cry
Is to doubt a fit reply." - William Blake
Ortho_cat
Protokentarchos
*********
Offline Offline

Faith: Orthodox
Jurisdiction: AOCA-DWMA
Posts: 5,392



« Reply #32 on: December 21, 2010, 04:39:07 PM »


 Astrology is astronomy.


 Shocked
Logged
Iconodule
Uranopolitan
Warned
Taxiarches
**********
Offline Offline

Faith: Orthodox Christian
Jurisdiction: OCA (Diocese of Eastern Pennsylvania)
Posts: 7,092


"My god is greater."


« Reply #33 on: December 21, 2010, 04:57:02 PM »


http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Astrology_and_astronomy
Logged

"A riddle or the cricket's cry
Is to doubt a fit reply." - William Blake
jckstraw72
OC.net guru
*******
Offline Offline

Faith: Orthodox
Jurisdiction: OCA
Posts: 1,174



« Reply #34 on: December 21, 2010, 05:08:29 PM »

as i demonstrated in the other thread, its actually the Protestants and the Muslims who are in association with Orthodox beliefs (and you recognized this in the other thread - you said that the Fathers are wrong because of their literal interpretation of Genesis). so yes, i'm glad that the heterodox have retained some seeds of the truth.
Unfortunately, the only thing you've demonstrated with any definitive authority on the other thread is that you just can't walk away from an argument. Roll Eyes

oh thank you, but actually i was responding to Minasoliman, who in the other thread acknowledged that the Fathers have consistently interpreted Genesis literally, which prompted him to say that the Fathers are wrong. your input sure is swell though!
Logged
minasoliman
Mr., Sir, Dude, Guy, Male, tr. Minas in Greek, Menes in white people Egyptologists :-P
Moderator
Toumarches
*****
Offline Offline

Faith: Oriental Orthodox
Jurisdiction: Coptic Orthodox Archdiocese of North America
Posts: 12,734


Strengthen O Lord the work of Your hands(Is 19:25)


« Reply #35 on: December 21, 2010, 05:21:09 PM »

as i demonstrated in the other thread, its actually the Protestants and the Muslims who are in association with Orthodox beliefs (and you recognized this in the other thread - you said that the Fathers are wrong because of their literal interpretation of Genesis). so yes, i'm glad that the heterodox have retained some seeds of the truth.
Unfortunately, the only thing you've demonstrated with any definitive authority on the other thread is that you just can't walk away from an argument. Roll Eyes

oh thank you, but actually i was responding to Minasoliman, who in the other thread acknowledged that the Fathers have consistently interpreted Genesis literally, which prompted him to say that the Fathers are wrong. your input sure is swell though!

No, I said their science is wrong.  Another stupid post.
Logged

Vain existence can never exist, for "unless the LORD builds the house, the builders labor in vain." (Psalm 127)

If the faith is unchanged and rock solid, then the gates of Hades never prevailed in the end.
mtgdude
Newbie
*
Offline Offline

Posts: 19



« Reply #36 on: December 21, 2010, 06:29:07 PM »

Whats the official ruling of Orthodox Christianity on evolution?
Logged
Jetavan
Argumentum ad australopithecum
Taxiarches
**********
Offline Offline

Faith: Science to the Fourth Power
Jurisdiction: Ohayo Gozaimasu
Posts: 6,580


Barlaam and Josaphat


WWW
« Reply #37 on: December 21, 2010, 06:42:30 PM »

Whats the official ruling of Orthodox Christianity on evolution?

"Orthodoxy absolutely affirms that God is the Creator and Author of all things, that He is actively engaged with His creation, and that He desires to restore His creation to full communion with Himself through the saving death and resurrection of Our Lord Jesus Christ. This, unlike Darwinism, is not a matter of ideology but, rather, a matter of theology.

Orthodoxy has no problem with evolution as a scientific theory, only with evolution -- as some people may view it -- eliminating the need for God as Creator of All."
« Last Edit: December 21, 2010, 06:42:57 PM by Jetavan » Logged

If you will, you can become all flame.
Extra caritatem nulla salus.
In order to become whole, take the "I" out of "holiness".
सर्वभूतहित
Ἄνω σχῶμεν τὰς καρδίας
"Those who say religion has nothing to do with politics do not know what religion is." -- Mohandas Gandhi
Y dduw bo'r diolch.
David 2007
Sr. Member
****
Offline Offline

Posts: 197



« Reply #38 on: December 21, 2010, 10:42:34 PM »

Whats the official ruling of Orthodox Christianity on evolution?
Orthodoxy has no problem with evolution as a scientific theory, only with evolution -- as some people may view it -- eliminating the need for God as Creator of All."

I thinks this sets Orthodoxy part and above those Christian denominations that insist on ramming Literal interpretations down our throats.

The above view that I've quoted has always been my belief.
Logged
GiC
Resident Atheist
Site Supporter
Merarches
*****
Offline Offline

Faith: Mathematician
Posts: 9,490



« Reply #39 on: December 21, 2010, 10:49:55 PM »

4) Who cares?
Those of us concerned with scientific education.


You're right on those Climategate emails then, aren't you?  Following up on those wikileaks on Al Gore the savior and his entourage, no?

You do know we've covered that in another thread, right? I'm not sure why you keep bringing it up, but everyone pretty much agrees that the lack of rigor in their methodology is intolerable, that conclusions based on bad science should be dismissed, and that funding should be directed to those using proper scientific methodologies.

Was there anyone here that said otherwise?
Logged

"The liberties of people never were, nor ever will be, secure, when the transactions of their rulers may be concealed from them." -- Patrick Henry
GiC
Resident Atheist
Site Supporter
Merarches
*****
Offline Offline

Faith: Mathematician
Posts: 9,490



« Reply #40 on: December 21, 2010, 10:53:01 PM »


Which says the two fields are, and I quote, 'completely separate disciplines.'
Logged

"The liberties of people never were, nor ever will be, secure, when the transactions of their rulers may be concealed from them." -- Patrick Henry
Iconodule
Uranopolitan
Warned
Taxiarches
**********
Offline Offline

Faith: Orthodox Christian
Jurisdiction: OCA (Diocese of Eastern Pennsylvania)
Posts: 7,092


"My god is greater."


« Reply #41 on: December 21, 2010, 10:57:11 PM »


Only "in Western 17th century philosophy." Before that, and aside from that, they are "one and the same discipline." I posted the link simply to introduce this history to those who were unaware of it.
Logged

"A riddle or the cricket's cry
Is to doubt a fit reply." - William Blake
ialmisry
There's nothing John of Damascus can't answer
Warned
Hypatos
*****************
Offline Offline

Faith: جامعي Arab confesssing the Orthodox Faith of the One, Holy, Catholic and Apostolic Church
Jurisdiction: Antioch (for now), but my heart belongs to Alexandria
Posts: 37,963



« Reply #42 on: December 21, 2010, 11:29:25 PM »

4) Who cares?
Those of us concerned with scientific education.


You're right on those Climategate emails then, aren't you?  Following up on those wikileaks on Al Gore the savior and his entourage, no?

You do know we've covered that in another thread, right?

What haven't we covered in another thread. Your point?

I'm not sure why you keep bringing it up,
The same reason you'd like it forgotten.

but everyone pretty much agrees that the lack of rigor in their methodology is intolerable, that conclusions based on bad science should be dismissed, and that funding should be directed to those using proper scientific methodologies.

Was there anyone here that said otherwise?
Many act as if it never happened.
Logged

Question a friend, perhaps he did not do it; but if he did anything so that he may do it no more.
A hasty quarrel kindles fire,
and urgent strife sheds blood.
If you blow on a spark, it will glow;
if you spit on it, it will be put out;
                           and both come out of your mouth
jckstraw72
OC.net guru
*******
Offline Offline

Faith: Orthodox
Jurisdiction: OCA
Posts: 1,174



« Reply #43 on: December 21, 2010, 11:51:01 PM »

as i demonstrated in the other thread, its actually the Protestants and the Muslims who are in association with Orthodox beliefs (and you recognized this in the other thread - you said that the Fathers are wrong because of their literal interpretation of Genesis). so yes, i'm glad that the heterodox have retained some seeds of the truth.
Unfortunately, the only thing you've demonstrated with any definitive authority on the other thread is that you just can't walk away from an argument. Roll Eyes

oh thank you, but actually i was responding to Minasoliman, who in the other thread acknowledged that the Fathers have consistently interpreted Genesis literally, which prompted him to say that the Fathers are wrong. your input sure is swell though!

No, I said their science is wrong.  Another stupid post.

right -- you think their "science" is wrong because their interpretation of Genesis is clearly incompatible with evolution. in post 2642 you said:

Quote
I'm going to be very clear with you.  The saints are wrong.  Period!

There was death.  Leaving evolution out of the picture, the evidence clearly shows death existed long before apes even existed.  The fossil records are consistent about this and don't lie.  I don't care if you don't agree with evolution.  But surely you are also rejecting other sciences when doing this.

the Saints dont believe there was death before sin, but because of evolution you do. so i haven't misrepresented what you said. i don't know what the point is of trying to deny what you said then.

and really dude, your bad mood isn't very becoming.
« Last Edit: December 21, 2010, 11:52:21 PM by jckstraw72 » Logged
Sleeper
OC.net guru
*******
Offline Offline

Posts: 1,267

On hiatus for the foreseeable future.


« Reply #44 on: December 22, 2010, 12:20:59 AM »

Has anyone read The Genesis Enigma?  I found it to be fascinating.

http://www.amazon.com/Genesis-Enigma-First-Scientifically-Accurate/dp/0452296552/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=1292991495&sr=8-1


Logged
Tags:
Pages: 1 2 »  All   Go Up
  Print  
 
Jump to:  

Powered by MySQL Powered by PHP Powered by SMF 1.1.18 | SMF © 2013, Simple Machines Valid XHTML 1.0! Valid CSS!
Page created in 0.162 seconds with 73 queries.