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« on: December 15, 2010, 12:51:01 PM »

Would it be against canon law to have a Muslim group temporarily use a basement or community center associated with an Orthodox parish?

"MANCHESTER (Connecticut)
While local Muslims work to open a new mosque in a Cottage Street house, they have been worshipping in space provided by a local church..

Local Muslims working to open a mosque in a Cottage Street house have been worshipping in space provided by St. Mary's Episcopal Church.

The Association of Muslim Community recently received a variance from the zoning board of appeals to establish a place of worship at 46 Cottage St. Association Treasurer Tarek Ambia said Friday that the association still needs a special permit from the town to open the mosque.

The group of 35 to 40 residents, first- or second-generation immigrants from Bangladesh, Pakistan and India, has been worshiping since January at St. Mary's on Park Street. The Muslim worshipers pay a nominal fee to use the church's basement, the Rev. Paul Briggs of St. Mary's said.

"I inquired of the leadership to see if there were any objections, and no one had any objections," Briggs said. "We were glad to welcome them.""
« Last Edit: December 15, 2010, 12:51:31 PM by Jetavan » Logged

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« Reply #1 on: December 25, 2010, 12:01:43 PM »

Allah akbar! GOD is great!
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« Reply #2 on: December 25, 2010, 12:48:53 PM »

Would it be against canon law to have a Muslim group temporarily use a basement or community center associated with an Orthodox parish?

That happened in Damascus, in the Cathedral of St. John the Baptist.  It's now the Umayyad Mosque.

There is a litttle mosque next to the Church of the Resurrection. The Caliph Umar prayed there, lest the Muslims seize the CoR.

Quote
"MANCHESTER (Connecticut)
While local Muslims work to open a new mosque in a Cottage Street house, they have been worshipping in space provided by a local church..

Local Muslims working to open a mosque in a Cottage Street house have been worshipping in space provided by St. Mary's Episcopal Church.

The Association of Muslim Community recently received a variance from the zoning board of appeals to establish a place of worship at 46 Cottage St. Association Treasurer Tarek Ambia said Friday that the association still needs a special permit from the town to open the mosque.

The group of 35 to 40 residents, first- or second-generation immigrants from Bangladesh, Pakistan and India, has been worshiping since January at St. Mary's on Park Street. The Muslim worshipers pay a nominal fee to use the church's basement, the Rev. Paul Briggs of St. Mary's said.

"I inquired of the leadership to see if there were any objections, and no one had any objections," Briggs said. "We were glad to welcome them.""


Knowing about how things have gotten in the Episcoplian community, I'm suprised the Muslims weren't allowed to use the church.  They might have, and the Muslims objected.

As to letting them use Orthodox facilities, outside the Church, there shouldn't be a problem on our side, but not if they ask to take the icons down while they are there (there is a tradition of that in Albania).  In the Middle East, Muslims come to Christian shrines all the time-you have to go where the blessing is.  They actually have a right to pray at the tomb of the Theotokos.
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« Reply #3 on: December 25, 2010, 12:49:21 PM »

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Christ is born! Glorify Him!
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« Reply #4 on: December 25, 2010, 01:07:18 PM »

Absolutely not. The moment Muslims allow a Christian to worship in a mosque, I might start to consider it--maybe. The moment you can take a Bible into Saudi Arabia without being arrested--maybe. The moment a Muslim's life isn't in danger because he has converted to Christianity--maybe.

No.
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« Reply #5 on: December 25, 2010, 01:18:31 PM »


As to letting them use Orthodox facilities, outside the Church, there shouldn't be a problem on our side, but not if they ask to take the icons down while they are there (there is a tradition of that in Albania).  In the Middle East, Muslims come to Christian shrines all the time-you have to go where the blessing is.  They actually have a right to pray at the tomb of the Theotokos.

Seriously?  No problem?

I understand in helping our neighbor...and I would feed and cloth a muslim, however, I would NOT allow them to worship their false deity under the roof of God's house.

...as long as they don't ask to take the icons down?   What about entering the Altar?   Is someone going to stand there and make sure they don't?  Or is that also permissible since they are men?

Are we going to allow Wiccan in, as well?

Where is the limit?





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« Reply #6 on: December 25, 2010, 01:32:10 PM »

You got to realize that in Muslim countries where Christians are the minority, the Christians may not have a choice.  Also, the Muslims do respect the Mother of God and sometimes venerate her.

I have a friend from Baghdad who said that there is a church near the university there, and during exam week you could see Muslim students in there praying to the Mother of God for success on their exams.
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« Reply #7 on: December 25, 2010, 01:41:38 PM »

You got to realize that in Muslim countries where Christians are the minority, the Christians may not have a choice.  Also, the Muslims do respect the Mother of God and sometimes venerate her.

I have a friend from Baghdad who said that there is a church near the university there, and during exam week you could see Muslim students in there praying to the Mother of God for success on their exams.

I am not living in a "muslim" country, just yet.   Here, I would find it sacrilegious to allow them to worship their false god under our sanctuary's roof.

Worshiping the Mother of God?  They don't believe that Christ was God...therefore, why are they worshiping the Theotokos? 

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« Reply #8 on: December 25, 2010, 01:43:59 PM »

You got to realize that in Muslim countries where Christians are the minority, the Christians may not have a choice.  Also, the Muslims do respect the Mother of God and sometimes venerate her.

I have a friend from Baghdad who said that there is a church near the university there, and during exam week you could see Muslim students in there praying to the Mother of God for success on their exams.
And do they call her Theotokos? Mother of God?
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« Reply #9 on: December 25, 2010, 01:50:16 PM »

I think they just refer to her as the Virgin Mary or the Mother of Jesus.  They don't believe that she is Mother of God.  Many Muslims do venerate her, though.  As Isa mentioned, Muslims will visit Christian shrines set up for her. 
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« Reply #10 on: December 25, 2010, 01:52:31 PM »

I think they just refer to her as the Virgin Mary or the Mother of Jesus.  They don't believe that she is Mother of God.  Many Muslims do venerate her, though.  As Isa mentioned, Muslims will visit Christian shrines set up for her.  

All Muslims venerate her as the mother of a past Islamic prophet named Isa, not as the mother of Jesus the Savior.

There is also a scandalous Hadith that describes the Virgin as a Houri married to Muhammad in heaven.  Angry

Read these articles:
http://www.answering-islam.org/Shamoun/mary.htm

http://www.answering-islam.org/authors/masihiyyen/imran_father1.html
« Last Edit: December 25, 2010, 01:54:59 PM by Theophilos78 » Logged

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« Reply #11 on: December 25, 2010, 01:56:30 PM »


As to letting them use Orthodox facilities, outside the Church, there shouldn't be a problem on our side, but not if they ask to take the icons down while they are there (there is a tradition of that in Albania).  In the Middle East, Muslims come to Christian shrines all the time-you have to go where the blessing is.  They actually have a right to pray at the tomb of the Theotokos.

Seriously?  No problem?

I understand in helping our neighbor...and I would feed and cloth a muslim, however, I would NOT allow them to worship their false deity under the roof of God's house.

...as long as they don't ask to take the icons down?   What about entering the Altar?   Is someone going to stand there and make sure they don't?  Or is that also permissible since they are men?

Are we going to allow Wiccan in, as well?

Where is the limit?
"Outside the Church"

I don't care if they use the Church hall. But most Church Halls I know have icons in them. They don't get removed.  The Kaaba in the days of Muhammad, according to the Muslims, had an icon of Christ and the Theotokos in it. According to them, Muhammad covered it with his body and told his followers to destroy everything else in the Kaaba.
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« Reply #12 on: January 06, 2011, 02:08:55 AM »

As one raised in islam, I wonder if our Orthodox leaders know basic islamic doctrine?  St. Gregory Palamas revealed 700 years ago: "Mohammad came with war, knives, pillaging, forced enslavements, murders & acts that are not from the Good God, but instigated by the chief manslayer, the devil." And in 1547 a.d., on his way to be burned alive by faithful muslims, Orthodox Christian Martyr St. Michael from Thessaloníki said: "Mohammad is a liar & deceiver, NOT a prophet of Allah.I believe in The LORD Jesus Christ who is True God, my Creator & Maker. I am ready if necessary to suffer tortures for his love. Whatever money I have, take it to buy wood for the fire you threaten me with, causee I don't want muslim paid wood to send me to meet my LORD." And workers of the evil one proceeded to burn a holy man of God alive as they had done so many times since the time of mohammad.

Muslims teach that Christ is NOT the Son of God, but to call him the Son of God is equal to blasphemy. In islam, we are taught that Jesus did not die on the cross and he was no man's savior. Since our trusted Orthodox Church fathers were led by The Holy Spirit to guide the Church in our Ecumenical councils to openly dethrone Bishops who taught the evil of Arianism, and not allow Arians to lead worship in our Holy Orthodox Church and our Orthodox Buildings, how could anyone ever think it right to have a mosque inside of a Church? When muslims had us under a sword and forced us to do this, it still ended up becoming a mosque. Has anyone seen Hagia Sophia with mohammad and Allah openly honored, our Icons dishonored and even a recent request to worship inside of Hagia Sophia by Orthodox members was denied by islamic government? Do Orthodox know that islamic theology has always taught that all Christians are kafir/najes infidels worthy of death and to be tolerated only for a season if they agree to financially provide as slaves of islam, for the propagation of islam? Has anyone seen how many Orthodox Saints have been martyred by faithful muslims for the last 1388 years?

Here is a couple of links that might be a good beginning to understand the nature of mohammad's teaching in the qur'an and how Orthodox understand the experience:

http://patriotstatesman.com/2011/01/our-military-arsenal-used-by-moderate-muslim-allies-to-stop-church-services/
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=omSgUPydzdc&feature=related Fr. Zakaria

LORD Jesus Christ Son of God have mercy on us.
If you would like to know more, can friend me on fb at http://www.facebook.com/ServantCEO where I provide regular updates on islam and our responses.

humbly in Christ,
Anthony
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« Reply #13 on: January 06, 2011, 02:20:09 AM »

Would it be against canon law to have a Muslim group temporarily use a basement or community center associated with an Orthodox parish?
Hmm.  Define "associated with".  If it's a basement of a church, the answer would hopefully be "NO".  If it's a community center owned and used by Orthodox Christians, it more than likely has icons adorning the walls.  They absolutely must stay up and may not be covered.  That being the case, I cannot imagine (just thinking back on my own Islamic past) that any Muslim would want to pray there. 

Local Muslims working to open a mosque in a Cottage Street house have been worshipping in space provided by St. Mary's Episcopal Church.
An Episcopal church allowing Muslims to worship their false deity?  Surprise, surprise, surprise.  Roll Eyes

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« Reply #14 on: January 27, 2011, 07:54:37 PM »

An Episcopal church allowing Muslims to worship their false deity?  Surprise, surprise, surprise.  Roll Eyes
You no like New England Episcopalians? Grin Here are some Tennessee evangelicals who welcomed Muslims:


"Having no qualms about Muslims using the same space we use for worship has everything to do with our understanding of the nature of the church. As we all know, the church is a people, not a building. There is nowhere in the teaching of Jesus or the rest of the New Testament witness that refers to the church as a place. The church is the faithful who spend life with Jesus together, according to his teachings and under the guidance of the Holy Spirit.
....
The space we use for worship is also used for sports banquets, dinner theater, scout ceremonies, rock concerts, and zumba. If you believe a certain space is holy in itself, say a space named the sanctuary of a church, what happens to its holiness when that building becomes a restaurant or a bar or a bed and breakfast? Is it still a holy space? Where did the holiness go?
....
One of the most troubling components in the current dialogue about relationships between Jesus followers and Muslims is the charge that Muslims do not worship the one true God, indeed that they are idolaters. I wonder if people who say that would make the same charge against Jews who also do not accept Jesus as the Messiah. The Muslims with whom I share relationships of love and trust tell me they worship the same God I do and the Jews do. According to my faith, they cannot do it to the fullest because Jesus is the full revelation of God—God in flesh and blood. But who am I to say that they do not worship the one true God according to their understanding? Jesus reserved his sternest warnings for those who would dare take the place of God and pass judgment on the heart of another. Heartsong and I do not dare do this. Be careful, sisters and brothers, that you also do not."
« Last Edit: January 27, 2011, 07:56:37 PM by Jetavan » Logged

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« Reply #15 on: January 27, 2011, 08:16:24 PM »

Quote
The space we use for worship is also used for sports banquets, dinner theater, scout ceremonies, rock concerts, and zumba. If you believe a certain space is holy in itself, say a space named the sanctuary of a church, what happens to its holiness when that building becomes a restaurant or a bar or a bed and breakfast? Is it still a holy space? Where did the holiness go?

Orthodox churches are consecrated, and this consecration includes the embedding of a saint's relic within the altar/holy table. This is but one factor in the holiness of an Orthodox church building. Should, for whatever reason, the church building need to be vacated, there is a procedure of deconsecration, which includes locating and removing the holy relic from the altar.

The "worship spaces" of post-reformation, non-sacramental churches/sects are simply rooms, not holy places.
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« Reply #16 on: January 28, 2011, 05:22:09 AM »

That's not totally out of the ordinary.

The Episcopal Cathedral here in the Diocese of Massachusetts has Wednesday night "hip-hop worship" and Friday afternoon Muslim prayers.

Also recently at the cathedral, two local Episcopal priestesses got "married" in a ceremony celebrated by the bishop.



Rank in terms of unsuitability, I would put the Muslim prayers at #2.

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« Reply #17 on: February 04, 2011, 06:06:21 PM »

An Episcopal church allowing Muslims to worship their false deity?  Surprise, surprise, surprise.  Roll Eyes


They had a show about that in Canada.
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« Reply #18 on: October 08, 2011, 07:04:52 AM »

Orthodox Christian Martyr St. Michael from Thessaloníki said: "Mohammad is a liar & deceiver, NOT a prophet of Allah.I believe in The LORD Jesus Christ who is True God, my Creator & Maker. I am ready if necessary to suffer tortures for his love. Whatever money I have, take it to buy wood for the fire you threaten me with, causee I don't want muslim paid wood to send me to meet my LORD."

Sorry for the thread bump, but this caused me a good twenty minutes of laughter and tears and riffing chatting with some folks.

The has got to be my favorite quote from a Saint. Ever.

If Kentucky goes Orthodox, this will be their patron Saint.

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« Reply #19 on: October 08, 2011, 01:01:55 PM »

So what is the big deal?  Muslims have been worshipping in Christian churches fro centuries, as long as they can convert them to mosques!!!!!
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« Reply #20 on: October 08, 2011, 01:13:43 PM »

If you go to any Christian pilgrimage site in the Middle East, you'll find Muslims going there to pray. That said, they don't usually perform the required ritual prayers (salat) in such places, but rather petitionary prayer (du'a)....
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« Reply #21 on: October 09, 2011, 02:42:09 PM »

That's not totally out of the ordinary.

The Episcopal Cathedral here in the Diocese of Massachusetts has Wednesday night "hip-hop worship" and Friday afternoon Muslim prayers.

Also recently at the cathedral, two local Episcopal priestesses got "married" in a ceremony celebrated by the bishop.



Rank in terms of unsuitability, I would put the Muslim prayers at #2.



Surely you can't be serious...  This is happening?

The bishop looks fabulous, btw.
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« Reply #22 on: October 09, 2011, 03:18:27 PM »

My Coptic friends have told me that sometimes Muslims will come in secret to the monasteries in Egypt to deal with problems that would not be acceptable to address openly in their own Islamic communities (exorcism and whatnot). This jibes with what I have read, too (e.g., "Journey back to Eden" by Fr. Mark Gruber OSB, which also mentions house blessing/cleansing performed for a Muslim family after the father died), though I have to be honest and say that this idea makes me pretty uncomfortable (not because I don't want to help Muslims be free of the devil, but because inviting Islam into our holy places invites that same demonic force). So the idea of Muslims worshiping in a church...I don't know about the canons, but I do know it is not acceptable to me or any of the Orthodox people I have known (including several priests). Salpy is right that there are many situations in which there is no choice, but when there is a choice I hope it is isn't controversial to say that it should be a clear and consistent no. Let the worshipers of the false "god" of the false prophet Muhammad worship their blasphemy in their own places, as they have long forced us to worship the true God wherever we can find out of their sight. Christians of any kind have no stake in the continuation of Islam in any way, shape, or form. May Islam (not Muslims) die a terrible, terrible death befitting its terrible, terrible life.

Would that all Christians could be as strong as the Axumites who tore down the attempts at a mosque in their holy city, and responded to the interference of Islamic leaders in the matter by saying "sure, you can have a mosque in this city when we can have a church in Mecca." That got the point across!
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« Reply #23 on: October 09, 2011, 06:05:36 PM »

Also, the Muslims do respect the Mother of God and sometimes venerate her.

Something interesting to go with this. I once heard about a church somewhere in Syria where Sufi Muslims come on the feast of the Dormition and light candles before her icon. Just as many of them show up as Christians do.

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« Reply #24 on: October 11, 2011, 11:47:09 AM »

I think they just refer to her as the Virgin Mary or the Mother of Jesus.  They don't believe that she is Mother of God.  Many Muslims do venerate her, though.  As Isa mentioned, Muslims will visit Christian shrines set up for her. 

Yes they see Jesus as a prophet rather than God, so hence Mary would not be the "Mother of God".
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« Reply #25 on: October 11, 2011, 11:59:46 AM »

How do you think Christ would handle the situation?  If he were walking the earth day and a Muslim asked him if they could use his Church building for worship since they had no where else, what would he say?

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« Reply #26 on: October 11, 2011, 02:20:14 PM »

How do you think Christ would handle the situation?  If he were walking the earth day and a Muslim asked him if they could use his Church building for worship since they had no where else, what would he say?


Since the Church is the Body of Christ, I would think the Muslims would want to simply be in Christ's presence, rather than 'worship' in a building.
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« Reply #27 on: October 13, 2011, 07:32:01 PM »

I was going to say "do the Muslims venerate her as Christotokos?" when I realized that would be recognizing Christ as the messiah. "Isousotokos", perhaps?   Tongue
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« Reply #28 on: October 13, 2011, 07:59:10 PM »

I was going to say "do the Muslims venerate her as Christotokos?" when I realized that would be recognizing Christ as the messiah. "Isousotokos", perhaps?   Tongue

The Koran calls Jesus Al-Masih, the Christ. Muhammad just didn't understand what that meant.
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« Reply #29 on: October 13, 2011, 08:04:51 PM »

How do you think Christ would handle the situation?  If he were walking the earth day and a Muslim asked him if they could use his Church building for worship since they had no where else, what would he say?


Christ told the Samaritan woman that the Father desires worship in spirit and truth more than worship in a particular holy spot, so I can't really see Him approving Islamic worship since it lacks both. Especially not in a holy place.
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« Reply #30 on: October 13, 2011, 08:09:38 PM »

I was going to say "do the Muslims venerate her as Christotokos?" when I realized that would be recognizing Christ as the messiah. "Isousotokos", perhaps?   Tongue

The Koran calls Jesus Al-Masih, the Christ. Muhammad just didn't understand what that meant.
Interesting... very interesting. Thank you.  Smiley
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« Reply #31 on: October 13, 2011, 08:21:23 PM »

I was going to say "do the Muslims venerate her as Christotokos?" when I realized that would be recognizing Christ as the messiah. "Isousotokos", perhaps?   Tongue

The Koran calls Jesus Al-Masih, the Christ. Muhammad just didn't understand what that meant.

They do not understand what that means, that's for sure. I once asked a Muslim what Islam meant by "al-Masih" (a title we also call Him in Arabic, after all), and he said that it apparently comes from a root meaning "rub, wipe" (which is true, insofar as m-s-H does cover that concept), referring to the miracle of healing the blind man by rubbing mud on his eyes. I dunno...I found that to be really shallow, but that's Islam for ya.
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« Reply #32 on: October 13, 2011, 08:31:00 PM »

Would it matter? It ain't like Christ is a unique title for Jesus Christ. Even pagans were God's anointed.
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« Reply #33 on: October 13, 2011, 08:48:45 PM »

I was going to say "do the Muslims venerate her as Christotokos?" when I realized that would be recognizing Christ as the messiah. "Isousotokos", perhaps?   Tongue

The Koran calls Jesus Al-Masih, the Christ. Muhammad just didn't understand what that meant.

I think he did. That is, in the way Rabbinical Jews do. Not as a divine being.
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« Reply #34 on: October 13, 2011, 08:52:58 PM »

I don't know the correct answer, but isn't this a way of sharing the Christian faith with Muslims? Not actively proseltysing, but showing love and concern for them - giving them shelter for their needs?

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« Reply #35 on: October 13, 2011, 08:54:44 PM »

I was going to say "do the Muslims venerate her as Christotokos?" when I realized that would be recognizing Christ as the messiah. "Isousotokos", perhaps?   Tongue

The Koran calls Jesus Al-Masih, the Christ. Muhammad just didn't understand what that meant.

I think he did. That is, in the way Rabbinical Jews do. Not as a divine being.

Except Rabbinical Jews don't see Him as a Christ. That is why the Muslims are actually closer to us than nearly any stripe of Jews. We actually have more in common theologically.

Virgin Birth.
Perpetual Virginity.
Major Prophet.
Virgin Mary worthy of veneration.
Jesus Christ will come to judge the living and the dead at the end of this age.
No ridiculous slander about the Theotokos or Christ in their writings.

All of these are point of agreement we can enter into with our heterodox Muslims, but not so with Rabbinical Jews.
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« Reply #36 on: October 13, 2011, 08:55:15 PM »

I was going to say "do the Muslims venerate her as Christotokos?" when I realized that would be recognizing Christ as the messiah. "Isousotokos", perhaps?   Tongue
The Koran calls Jesus Al-Masih, the Christ. Muhammad just didn't understand what that meant.
I think he did. That is, in the way Rabbinical Jews do. Not as a divine being.

Biblically speaking, the word "Christ" has nothing to do with divinity. It doesn't mean being a prophet either. I don't mean this as a denial of Christ's divinity, only that the word is used in the OT to refer to the high priest and the king.
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« Reply #37 on: October 13, 2011, 08:55:34 PM »

I don't know the correct answer, but isn't this a way of sharing the Christian faith with Muslims? Not actively proseltysing, but showing love and concern for them - giving them shelter for their needs?



I highly recommend the film Of Gods and Men.
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« Reply #38 on: October 13, 2011, 08:57:41 PM »

I was going to say "do the Muslims venerate her as Christotokos?" when I realized that would be recognizing Christ as the messiah. "Isousotokos", perhaps?   Tongue

The Koran calls Jesus Al-Masih, the Christ. Muhammad just didn't understand what that meant.

I think he did. That is, in the way Rabbinical Jews do. Not as a divine being.

Not even in that way. The Koran reduces the "Christ" to the second best prophet. Rabbinical Jews at least see the Christ as a savior and king.
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« Reply #39 on: October 13, 2011, 08:59:18 PM »

I was going to say "do the Muslims venerate her as Christotokos?" when I realized that would be recognizing Christ as the messiah. "Isousotokos", perhaps?   Tongue

The Koran calls Jesus Al-Masih, the Christ. Muhammad just didn't understand what that meant.

I think he did. That is, in the way Rabbinical Jews do. Not as a divine being.

Except Rabbinical Jews don't see Him as a Christ. That is why the Muslims are actually closer to us than nearly any stripe of Jews. We actually have more in common theologically.

Virgin Birth.
Perpetual Virginity.
Major Prophet.
Virgin Mary worthy of veneration.
Jesus Christ will come to judge the living and the dead at the end of this age.
No ridiculous slander about the Theotokos or Christ in their writings.

All of these are point of agreement we can enter into with our heterodox Muslims, but not so with Rabbinical Jews.


Yes, but Muhammad understood Messiah as just a man anointed by God (as the word means) just as the Jews do.

Quote
Not even in that way. The Koran reduces the "Christ" to the second best prophet. Rabbinical Jews at least see the Christ as a savior and king.

Edit: Yes, William you are right about that
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« Reply #40 on: October 13, 2011, 09:00:53 PM »

I was going to say "do the Muslims venerate her as Christotokos?" when I realized that would be recognizing Christ as the messiah. "Isousotokos", perhaps?   Tongue

The Koran calls Jesus Al-Masih, the Christ. Muhammad just didn't understand what that meant.

I think he did. That is, in the way Rabbinical Jews do. Not as a divine being.

Not even in that way. The Koran reduces the "Christ" to the second best prophet. Rabbinical Jews at least see the Christ as a savior and king.

Which Christ?
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« Reply #41 on: October 13, 2011, 09:05:08 PM »

I was going to say "do the Muslims venerate her as Christotokos?" when I realized that would be recognizing Christ as the messiah. "Isousotokos", perhaps?   Tongue

The Koran calls Jesus Al-Masih, the Christ. Muhammad just didn't understand what that meant.

I think he did. That is, in the way Rabbinical Jews do. Not as a divine being.

Not even in that way. The Koran reduces the "Christ" to the second best prophet. Rabbinical Jews at least see the Christ as a savior and king.

Which Christ?

The one mentioned in the twelfth of Maimonides' Jewish principles of faith.
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« Reply #42 on: October 13, 2011, 09:11:13 PM »

I don't know the correct answer, but isn't this a way of sharing the Christian faith with Muslims? Not actively proseltysing, but showing love and concern for them - giving them shelter for their needs?



I highly recommend the film Of Gods and Men.

Am I wayward?  laugh Some hint as to how this film would help, please. Smiley
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« Reply #43 on: October 13, 2011, 09:23:58 PM »

I don't know the correct answer, but isn't this a way of sharing the Christian faith with Muslims? Not actively proseltysing, but showing love and concern for them - giving them shelter for their needs?



I highly recommend the film Of Gods and Men.


Am I wayward?  laugh Some hint as to how this film would help, please. Smiley

No!

It is a lovely film about the struggle of Catholic monks who have lived within a Muslim community attending to their health and well-being in a state of mutual respect who must come to decision to leave the community once "radicals" begin to encroach with violence.

Based on a "true" story.

Lovely. A wonderful French actor just speaks volumes with so few words.

It is a nice and non-sentimental story of the difficulties and joys of Christians and Muslims living side by side.

A beautiful work.

That is all. It is just tangentially hit here, but I think that which approaches art says much more than polemics can.

See the film and tell me what you think. I am easily drawn in by sentimentality.  
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« Reply #44 on: October 13, 2011, 09:32:12 PM »

I don't know the correct answer, but isn't this a way of sharing the Christian faith with Muslims? Not actively proseltysing, but showing love and concern for them - giving them shelter for their needs?



I highly recommend the film Of Gods and Men.


Am I wayward?  laugh Some hint as to how this film would help, please. Smiley

No!

It is a lovely film about the struggle of Catholic monks who have lived within a Muslim community attending to their health and well-being in a state of mutual respect who must come to decision to leave the community once "radicals" begin to encroach with violence.

Based on a "true" story.

Lovely. A wonderful French actor just speaks volumes with so few words.

It is a nice and non-sentimental story of the difficulties and joys of Christians and Muslims living side by side.

A beautiful work.

That is all. It is just tangentially hit here, but I think that which approaches art says much more than polemics can.

See the film and tell me what you think. I am easily drawn in by sentimentality.  

Ok, thanks. Smiley

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