Author Topic: The Church Fathers on New Advent  (Read 1225 times)

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Offline Papist

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The Church Fathers on New Advent
« on: November 16, 2010, 04:02:20 PM »
How good are the translations of the Church Fathers' works provided by New Advent?
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Offline Wyatt

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Re: The Church Fathers on New Advent
« Reply #1 on: November 16, 2010, 04:07:45 PM »
I'm sure you're going to get a whole slew of responses that say "horrible."

Offline ialmisry

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Re: The Church Fathers on New Advent
« Reply #2 on: November 16, 2010, 04:41:39 PM »
How good are the translations of the Church Fathers' works provided by New Advent?
Not terribly great, but not awful either. Just very dated.

Btw, it has nothing to do with the Vatican-they are just the translations of Schaff's Ante- and Post-Nicea series, minus the notes.
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Offline Schultz

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Re: The Church Fathers on New Advent
« Reply #3 on: November 16, 2010, 04:45:06 PM »
How good are the translations of the Church Fathers' works provided by New Advent?
Not terribly great, but not awful either. Just very dated.

Btw, it has nothing to do with the Vatican-they are just the translations of Schaff's Ante- and Post-Nicea series, minus the notes.

You forgot to mention they're "horrible".  ;)
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Offline Wyatt

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Re: The Church Fathers on New Advent
« Reply #4 on: November 16, 2010, 04:48:22 PM »
How good are the translations of the Church Fathers' works provided by New Advent?
Not terribly great, but not awful either. Just very dated.

Btw, it has nothing to do with the Vatican-they are just the translations of Schaff's Ante- and Post-Nicea series, minus the notes.

You forgot to mention they're "horrible".  ;)
He is only not using that wording because I mentioned it. If I wouldn't have I'm sure the words "horrible," "Vatican," and "Ultramontanist" would have been used. Oh look, he even used the word Vatican in his post above. Can't resist dropping the V word at every turn.

Offline Iconodule

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Re: The Church Fathers on New Advent
« Reply #5 on: November 16, 2010, 04:55:46 PM »
How good are the translations of the Church Fathers' works provided by New Advent?
Not terribly great, but not awful either. Just very dated.

Btw, it has nothing to do with the Vatican-they are just the translations of Schaff's Ante- and Post-Nicea series, minus the notes.

You forgot to mention they're "horrible".  ;)
He is only not using that wording because I mentioned it. If I wouldn't have I'm sure the words "horrible," "Vatican," and "Ultramontanist" would have been used. Oh look, he even used the word Vatican in his post above. Can't resist dropping the V word at every turn.

Yet, as he pointed out, it's from the Protestant Schaff's collection...

Is this going to turn into another Catholic "Help, help, I'm being repressed!" thread?

Offline Schultz

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Re: The Church Fathers on New Advent
« Reply #6 on: November 16, 2010, 04:57:26 PM »
How good are the translations of the Church Fathers' works provided by New Advent?
Not terribly great, but not awful either. Just very dated.

Btw, it has nothing to do with the Vatican-they are just the translations of Schaff's Ante- and Post-Nicea series, minus the notes.

You forgot to mention they're "horrible".  ;)
He is only not using that wording because I mentioned it. If I wouldn't have I'm sure the words "horrible," "Vatican," and "Ultramontanist" would have been used. Oh look, he even used the word Vatican in his post above. Can't resist dropping the V word at every turn.

Yet, as he pointed out, it's from the Protestant Schaff's collection...



Bingo!

Quote
Is this going to turn into another Catholic "Help, help, I'm being repressed!" thread?

No, because if he tries it again, this is getting locked and he's getting an increase in warning status
« Last Edit: November 16, 2010, 04:58:04 PM by Schultz »
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Offline Papist

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Re: The Church Fathers on New Advent
« Reply #7 on: November 16, 2010, 04:59:09 PM »
How good are the translations of the Church Fathers' works provided by New Advent?
Not terribly great, but not awful either. Just very dated.

Btw, it has nothing to do with the Vatican-they are just the translations of Schaff's Ante- and Post-Nicea series, minus the notes.
So would you say that they contain alot of mistranslations?
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Offline Iconodule

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Re: The Church Fathers on New Advent
« Reply #8 on: November 16, 2010, 05:00:32 PM »
I think Schaff's work remains valuable for Anglophones, if only because it has no rival in terms of breadth.

Offline Wyatt

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Re: The Church Fathers on New Advent
« Reply #9 on: November 16, 2010, 05:59:40 PM »
No, because if he tries it again, this is getting locked and he's getting an increase in warning status
So ialmisry saying that we offer the Holy Eucharist in the name of the Pope is totally fine, but we aren't allowed to point out stuff that is actually true? Nice.
Wyatt, You know full well when and how to discuss moderation decisions that are encoded in green on threads.  For knowingly and flagrantly violating this rule, you are now put on post moderation status for 45 days.  As for your comment regarding ialmisry's posts in another thread, your co-religionists seem to be doing a good job in debunking his claims for all to see; I also point out that NO ONE HAS REPORTED ANY POSTS IN THAT THREAD.  Once again, my only job is to enforce the rules.  Continued flagrant violation and whining about how you are being treated on a voluntary forum when none of those rules are broken will be met with further increase in warning status (muting).  I suggest you take this time to reflect on why you are participating here and put your martyr complex in check.  If you find this in error, please PM Fr. George or FrChris.  -Schultz.
« Last Edit: November 16, 2010, 06:07:38 PM by Schultz »

Offline Fr. George

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Re: The Church Fathers on New Advent
« Reply #10 on: November 16, 2010, 06:04:18 PM »
So ialmisry saying that we offer the Holy Eucharist in the name of the Pope is totally fine, but we aren't allowed to point out stuff that is actually true? Nice.

That's a non sequitur to this discussion.  Offer the correction of what Isa said in that thread where he said it - don't use it as a whine here to complain about a mod repeating a clear directive he gave at the end of a previous thread.

I mean, goodness gracious, in the thread you're talking about, no one has directed you to stop your attempt to get him to back off of his position; you (and Papist) have both engaged Isa to provide evidence for his position, and have not been told by the mods (or anyone else) that you cannot.  So your complaint here is little more than "sour grapes."  You should quit your attempts at portraying yourself as some sort of e-martyr around here; it's not "martyrdom" if you thrust yourself on the sword, it's forum suicide, and if you continue to violate forum rules about complaining about moderation, that's what it will be clearly seen as by all.
« Last Edit: November 16, 2010, 06:09:38 PM by Fr. George »
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Offline ialmisry

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Re: The Church Fathers on New Advent
« Reply #11 on: November 16, 2010, 06:55:52 PM »
How good are the translations of the Church Fathers' works provided by New Advent?
Not terribly great, but not awful either. Just very dated.

Btw, it has nothing to do with the Vatican-they are just the translations of Schaff's Ante- and Post-Nicea series, minus the notes.
So would you say that they contain alot of mistranslations?
Not so much, though there are points where they do. Most of Schaff's Protestant bias is contained in the notes, excusi, etc.
Question a friend, perhaps he did not do it; but if he did anything so that he may do it no more.
A hasty quarrel kindles fire,
and urgent strife sheds blood.
If you blow on a spark, it will glow;
if you spit on it, it will be put out;
                           and both come out of your mouth

Offline Wyatt

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Re: The Church Fathers on New Advent
« Reply #12 on: November 17, 2010, 01:55:24 PM »
How good are the translations of the Church Fathers' works provided by New Advent?
Not terribly great, but not awful either. Just very dated.

Btw, it has nothing to do with the Vatican-they are just the translations of Schaff's Ante- and Post-Nicea series, minus the notes.
So would you say that they contain alot of mistranslations?
Not so much, though there are points where they do. Most of Schaff's Protestant bias is contained in the notes, excusi, etc.
Can you provide specific examples of mistranslation in the New Advent text?

Offline Justin Kissel

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Re: The Church Fathers on New Advent
« Reply #13 on: November 19, 2010, 04:39:39 AM »
Can you provide specific examples of mistranslation in the New Advent text?

Not sure if it's a mistranslation of the original or what, but I've always been curious about a passage in St. Gregory the Theologian which speaks of people being "semi-Orthodox":

"In this way, then, we shall hold our own against the semi-orthodox—among whom I may not count you." - Oration 31, 24 (New Advent and CCEL both use the term)

Contrast this with Gregory also using the term (at least in translation) "ultra-Orthodox":

"For, amid the three infirmities in regard to theology, atheism, Judaism, and polytheism, one of which is patronised by Sabellius the Libyan, another by Arius of Alexandria, and the third by some of the ultra-orthodox among us, what is my position, can I avoid whatever in these three is noxious, and remain within the limits of piety; neither being led astray by the new analysis and synthesis into the atheism of Sabellius" - Oration 2, 37

I've wondered what exactly is going on here? I've also done searches through Gregory's works (using computer files) and found a score or more references to "true faith" and "a genuine Christian" and so forth. Sometimes I wish I was already at the point when I could read Greek for myself.  :police: