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Author Topic: Roman Catholic Churches  (Read 29862 times) Average Rating: 0
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synLeszka
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« on: November 01, 2010, 01:34:03 PM »

Please post pictures of Roman Catholic churches here:
I found this beautiful photo at skyscraper city forum.
This is the Piarist church in Chełm,Poland which is also known by its Ukrainian name Kholm.

One of my favorite churches. I used to visit it often but now I seem to have less time. Perhaps I should start praying more. The cathedral and minor basilica in Kielce, Poland.

Cathedral tower
« Last Edit: November 01, 2010, 01:34:36 PM by synLeszka » Logged
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« Reply #1 on: November 01, 2010, 01:39:53 PM »

Now when you say Roman Catholic...you do mean Romanian Orthodox, right? Tongue
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« Reply #2 on: November 01, 2010, 01:46:40 PM »

Here are some pics of the church at St. Vincent College in Latrobe PA (dedicated in 1905, became a basilica in 1955)...



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« Reply #3 on: November 01, 2010, 01:49:54 PM »

St. Michael's New Haven, CT.

http://www.flickr.com/photos/24557771@N02/5128231937/
http://www.flickr.com/photos/24557771@N02/5128837278/

Sacred Heart Phoenixville, PA

http://www.flickr.com/photos/24557771@N02/5128837100/
http://www.flickr.com/photos/24557771@N02/5128837008/

St. Monica's Berwyn, PA

http://www.flickr.com/photos/24557771@N02/5119715598/
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« Reply #4 on: November 01, 2010, 01:53:02 PM »

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« Reply #5 on: November 02, 2010, 11:25:47 AM »

I really wish I could find a picture of my parish's sanctuary (it's really beautiful, not unlike many of the wonderful pictures here), but for now here is a picture of the outside of my Church:

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« Reply #6 on: November 02, 2010, 11:38:10 AM »


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« Reply #7 on: November 02, 2010, 01:57:45 PM »

St. Dominic's Catholic Church in San Francisco California:

http://www.stdominics.org/parish/photos

http://www.flickr.com/photos/subpopstar/2659208138/

http://www.stdominics.org/sacraments/marriage.asp
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« Reply #8 on: November 02, 2010, 03:03:23 PM »

Now when you say Roman Catholic...you do mean Romanian Orthodox, right? Tongue

He ought to: Wołoch in Polish means "Romanian/Vlach," Wołochowie historic "Romania," and Włochy "Italy."  It comes from Germanic Wlaha "foreignors, Romans." The Poles were neighbors to the Romanians, according to the Poles the Dniester forming the boundary set by God between them. The Poles were never anywhere near Rome or Italy.

What does this have to do with the Orthodox, except that the OP shows pictures from Kholm, the historic center of Orthodoxy in Poland, that is before the Union of Brest was forced on it, and after that yoke was lifted? St. Vladimir founded it, and it was part of Kievan Rus', but later annexed by the Piasts who set up a Latin bishoprick.  The Orthodox Cathedral was given by the "The Polish Committee of National Liberation" to the Vatican in 1944.
« Last Edit: November 02, 2010, 03:12:34 PM by ialmisry » Logged

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« Reply #9 on: November 02, 2010, 03:11:49 PM »

Now when you say Roman Catholic...you do mean Romanian Orthodox, right? Tongue

He ought to: Wołoch in Polish means "Romanian/Vlach," Wołochowie historic "Romania," and Włochy "Italy."  It comes from Germanic Wlaha "foreignors, Romans." The Poles were neighbors to the Romanians, according to the Poles the Dniester forming the boundary set by God between them. The Poles were never anywhere near Rome or Italy.


How do you pronounce those? In particular the "ł".
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« Reply #10 on: November 02, 2010, 03:14:42 PM »

Now when you say Roman Catholic...you do mean Romanian Orthodox, right? Tongue

He ought to: Wołoch in Polish means "Romanian/Vlach," Wołochowie historic "Romania," and Włochy "Italy."  It comes from Germanic Wlaha "foreignors, Romans." The Poles were neighbors to the Romanians, according to the Poles the Dniester forming the boundary set by God between them. The Poles were never anywhere near Rome or Italy.


How do you pronounce those? In particular the "ł".
W=v; ł=dark, back l (archaic/stage/regional)/w (usual); ch=kh. o=aw, e=eh
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synLeszka
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« Reply #11 on: November 02, 2010, 04:35:07 PM »

Now when you say Roman Catholic...you do mean Romanian Orthodox, right? Tongue

He ought to: Wołoch in Polish means "Romanian/Vlach," Wołochowie historic "Romania," and Włochy "Italy."  It comes from Germanic Wlaha "foreignors, Romans." The Poles were neighbors to the Romanians, according to the Poles the Dniester forming the boundary set by God between them. The Poles were never anywhere near Rome or Italy.

What does this have to do with the Orthodox, except that the OP shows pictures from Kholm, the historic center of Orthodoxy in Poland, that is before the Union of Brest was forced on it, and after that yoke was lifted? St. Vladimir founded it, and it was part of Kievan Rus', but later annexed by the Piasts who set up a Latin bishoprick.  The Orthodox Cathedral was given by the "The Polish Committee of National Liberation" to the Vatican in 1944.
Wołoch and Włoch in Polish phonetic alphabet are written as Voůoχ and vůoχ. ů being the equivalent of the English "w" and χ being a sound similar to "h" in human.

Wołoch once signified a person who would now be called Romanian. The historic term for Romania in Polish is Wołoszczyzna. The region which is called Transylvannia was in Polish, Siedmiogród.
What are you talking about that caveat about the Dniestr being the Divinely instituted border of Poland? Roll Eyes

The historic centres of Polish Orthodoxy are outside of the modern day borders of Poland. First and foremost, the city of Kyiv/Kiev is the heart of the Polish Orthodoxy, because the majority of Orthodox in Poland are descended from the Kyivan principalities on the Dniepr, who because of political repression emigrated to the West. Another I can mention is Ostróg/Ostroh, Halicz and Włodzimierz Wołyński. The church in question in Jesus's post:

According to the Polish wikipedia here are the owners of the church since its construction in 1756
Wyznanie    
greckokatolickie (1756-1875) Greek Catholic
prawosławie (1875-1919) Orthodox
rzymskokatolickie (1919-1940) Roman Catholic
prawosławie (1940-1944) Orthodox
rzymskokatolickie (od 1940) Roman Catholic

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« Reply #12 on: November 02, 2010, 11:33:49 PM »

Now when you say Roman Catholic...you do mean Romanian Orthodox, right? Tongue

He ought to: Wołoch in Polish means "Romanian/Vlach," Wołochowie historic "Romania," and Włochy "Italy."  It comes from Germanic Wlaha "foreignors, Romans." The Poles were neighbors to the Romanians, according to the Poles the Dniester forming the boundary set by God between them. The Poles were never anywhere near Rome or Italy.

What does this have to do with the Orthodox, except that the OP shows pictures from Kholm, the historic center of Orthodoxy in Poland, that is before the Union of Brest was forced on it, and after that yoke was lifted? St. Vladimir founded it, and it was part of Kievan Rus', but later annexed by the Piasts who set up a Latin bishoprick.  The Orthodox Cathedral was given by the "The Polish Committee of National Liberation" to the Vatican in 1944.
Wołoch and Włoch in Polish phonetic alphabet are written as Voůoχ and vůoχ. ů being the equivalent of the English "w" and χ being a sound similar to "h" in human.

Wołoch once signified a person who would now be called Romanian. The historic term for Romania in Polish is Wołoszczyzna. The region which is called Transylvannia was in Polish, Siedmiogród.
What are you talking about that caveat about the Dniestr being the Divinely instituted border of Poland? Roll Eyes
The Polish delegate Martin Chometowski (1703) "Inter nos et Valachiam ipse Deus flumine Tyras dislimitavit" Between us and the Vlachs/Romanians God Himself delineated the river Dniester.

Quote
The historic centres of Polish Orthodoxy are outside of the modern day borders of Poland. First and foremost, the city of Kyiv/Kiev is the heart of the Polish Orthodoxy,

Kiev isn't in, nor ever has been, in Poland. I know that historically the Polish Crown has had a problem wrapping its head around that fact, signified by splitting the Szczerbiec on Kiev's gate.

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because the majority of Orthodox in Poland are descended from the Kyivan principalities on the Dniepr,


The Dniepr doesn't flow through Galicia (darker green here):


Quote
who because of political repression emigrated to the West. Another I can mention is Ostróg/Ostroh, Halicz and Włodzimierz Wołyński.

Halicz and Volodymyr are the determinative. The sees of Cholm and Peremyshl are the homeland of Polish Orthodoxy.  Besides Krakow of St. Gorazd.

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The church in question in Jesus's post:

According to the Polish wikipedia here are the owners of the church since its construction in 1756
Wyznanie    
greckokatolickie (1756-1875) Greek Catholic
prawosławie (1875-1919) Orthodox
rzymskokatolickie (1919-1940) Roman Catholic
prawosławie (1940-1944) Orthodox
rzymskokatolickie (od 1940) Roman Catholic
The Church was set up by King Daniel of Ruthenia and Halych as an Orthodox See in 1260, which it was until the Polish Sejm forced the Union of Brest on it.
« Last Edit: November 02, 2010, 11:35:17 PM by ialmisry » Logged

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« Reply #13 on: November 02, 2010, 11:58:42 PM »

I'll limit myself to churches I've physically been to.



St. Anthony of Padua parish, New Bedford, Mass.

I consider this perhaps the most beautiful church in New England. This photo doesn't even come close to capturing it. It is covered in sculpture, and in every crevice is a tiny lightbulb---thousands and thousands all over the place. When the lights are lit---stunning! They are not lit often, because it costs $500 an hour in electricity.

The best Stations of the Cross I've ever seen. And hanging over the nave on both sides are lines of enormous sculptures of angels blowing trumpets.

Very nice from the outside too:



And the pastor, Fr. Roger Landry, is one of the great lieutenants of the Catholic restoration.

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« Reply #14 on: November 03, 2010, 12:00:31 AM »

Okay, I'll break my rule this one time. I've never been to the Cathedral of St Louis, Missouri, USA, but it's definitely high on my list:

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« Reply #15 on: November 03, 2010, 12:02:48 AM »

Church of Our Saviour, New York

proof that churches built since the 1950s need not be ugly

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« Reply #16 on: November 03, 2010, 12:18:19 AM »

My favorite, Cathedrale de Notre-Dame-de-Chartres



(artificial shot---it's actually much darker, and what light there is streams from the rich hues of the glorious stained glass, as you can see below)











portal




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« Reply #17 on: November 03, 2010, 12:34:09 AM »

Okay, I'll break my rule this one time. I've never been to the Cathedral of St Louis, Missouri, USA, but it's definitely high on my list:


odd. i've been there but i didn't recognize it in the photo (I think it is the lighting)
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« Reply #18 on: November 03, 2010, 12:36:36 AM »

  angel
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« Reply #19 on: November 03, 2010, 12:58:52 AM »

Okay, I'll break my rule this one time. I've never been to the Cathedral of St Louis, Missouri, USA, but it's definitely high on my list:


odd. i've been there but i didn't recognize it in the photo (I think it is the lighting)
Or perhaps your aversion to all things Latin prevented you from seeing the true beauty of it.
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« Reply #20 on: November 03, 2010, 01:04:07 AM »

Okay, I'll break my rule this one time. I've never been to the Cathedral of St Louis, Missouri, USA, but it's definitely high on my list:



Ooooo, I love that one! Thank you for posting it. I've heard rumors of a beautiful Roman Catholic church with mosaics in St. Louis. If only more were like this. Actually, I'd settle for even a modest reduction in modernism and Baroque. Love Baroque music, but find the architecture and the fat little cherubs very distracting.
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« Reply #21 on: November 03, 2010, 01:06:03 AM »

Okay, I'll break my rule this one time. I've never been to the Cathedral of St Louis, Missouri, USA, but it's definitely high on my list:


odd. i've been there but i didn't recognize it in the photo (I think it is the lighting)
Or perhaps your aversion to all things Latin prevented you from seeing the true beauty of it.

You are on your way to becoming a less witty, more trigger happy version of whom you seek to egg on.
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« Reply #22 on: November 03, 2010, 01:10:54 AM »

Okay, I'll break my rule this one time. I've never been to the Cathedral of St Louis, Missouri, USA, but it's definitely high on my list:


odd. i've been there but i didn't recognize it in the photo (I think it is the lighting)
Or perhaps your aversion to all things Latin prevented you from seeing the true beauty of it.
Hardly. That I have no love for Ultramontanism does not mean I have an aversion to all things Latin.  your prejudice is showing.
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« Reply #23 on: November 03, 2010, 01:34:29 AM »

Hardly. That I have no love for Ultramontanism does not mean I have an aversion to all things Latin.  your prejudice is showing.

Haha, I could have said this. I'm not fond of Ultramontanism either.



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« Reply #24 on: November 03, 2010, 01:43:15 AM »

Durham Cathedral, northern England (11th-12th centuries)

I love this one, and St. Bede the Venerable is buried here.

I wish I could have seen it before the Protestants usurped it and stripped it of its shrines and iconography (interiors of the great Romanesque and Gothic cathedrals were painted). It still has a strong, severe beauty, perfectly fitting its northern England location.





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« Reply #25 on: November 03, 2010, 01:51:16 AM »

Basilique Notre-Dame de Montréal:

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« Reply #26 on: November 03, 2010, 12:10:16 PM »

Lubeltri,
That last one is absolutely stunning.
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« Reply #27 on: November 03, 2010, 12:24:03 PM »

No longer actively a RC Church, but I still like the interior http://www.flickr.com/photos/24557771@N02/4810212337/
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« Reply #28 on: November 03, 2010, 12:27:14 PM »

http://ccincarnation.org/

This Church is under construction, but from what I am told, the interior of this Church (in my diocese) is supposed to be a small replica of St. Paul's in Rome. I will keep you all posted.

Here are several more pictures:

http://ccincarnation.org/new-design-pictures-of-our-new-church/


As you can tell, it's being built cruciform.
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« Reply #29 on: November 03, 2010, 02:23:10 PM »

Response to Jesus' post:
Do you have a problem with the fact that millions of Poles once lived on the Dniestr and Dniepr rivers?
Let us praise that great and holy, defender of the Orthodox faith, Christ's servant, the Thirteenth apostle, the iron man, Iosip Jugashvili, the immortal STALIN who told a Kalmuk and a Kazakh, a Finn and Pole, Tajik and Uzbek, that they have been lied to by the PETTY CAPITALIST and in fact, that they were never Catholic nor Muslim, Lutheran nor Buddhist but GREAT, GREATER, GREATEST GREAT-RUSSIAN nation. The fact that the current Orthodox church of Moscow, does something the Tsars never would of dreamt of, that is that they claim that every citizen of the Russian Federation, is by right of birth, an adherent of Russian Orthodoxy. The Tsar only tried to assimilate Catholics but he did not claim Muslims or Shamanists to be Orthodox.

I view the fact, that the Orthodox branch of our nation was separated from the Catholic branch as a sad event.
This schism in the Commonwealth caused by our great and holy, blessed and apostolic, true believing and insincere, destroyer of all oppression which is the Catholic religion, promoter of Islam and Orthodoxy, Calvinism and Shamanism, His Imperialest Majesty, the Tsar of Holy, Holy, Holy, thrice Holy, thrice thrice thrice Holy social political construct  German occupier of the Eastern Slavs, the Romanov dynasty.
I have even read on one forum, by a self-named Crimean Slav, neither Ukrainian nor Russian who said that nationalities in our region are historical constructions especially the Great Russian nationality. I do not entirely agree with this but in some aspects this might hold true.

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« Reply #30 on: November 03, 2010, 02:49:49 PM »

Response to Jesus' post:
Do you have a problem with the fact that millions of Poles once lived on the Dniestr and Dniepr rivers?

When?
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« Reply #31 on: November 03, 2010, 04:45:52 PM »

St Patrick's Cathedral NY, NY






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« Reply #32 on: November 03, 2010, 05:02:02 PM »

Response to Jesus' post:
You mean me?
Quote
Do you have a problem with the fact that millions of Poles once lived on the Dniestr and Dniepr rivers?
Armed or otherwise? Since they are gone, not particularly, though I doubt it was millions (I have to see figures).
Quote
Let us praise that great and holy, defender of the Orthodox faith, Christ's servant, the Thirteenth apostle, the iron man, Iosip Jugashvili, the immortal STALIN who told a Kalmuk and a Kazakh, a Finn and Pole, Tajik and Uzbek, that they have been lied to by the PETTY CAPITALIST and in fact, that they were never Catholic nor Muslim, Lutheran nor Buddhist but GREAT, GREATER, GREATEST GREAT-RUSSIAN nation.

You seem to place great stock in Soviet propoganda. Are you a Marxist?

I'd ask a Russian, rather than a Georgian, over membership of the Russian nation.

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The fact that the current Orthodox church of Moscow, does something the Tsars never would of dreamt of, that is that they claim that every citizen of the Russian Federation, is by right of birth, an adherent of Russian Orthodoxy.


You can of course quote the Patriarch of Moscow or his spokeman making that claim, no?

Quote
The Tsar only tried to assimilate Catholics but he did not claim Muslims or Shamanists to be Orthodox.

I view the fact, that the Orthodox branch of our nation was separated from the Catholic branch

The Orthodox branch of your nation form a local autocephalous Church of the Catholic Church.

Quote
as a sad event.
This schism in the Commonwealth

"My Kingdon is not of this world"

Quote
caused by our great and holy, blessed and apostolic, true believing and insincere, destroyer of all oppression which is the Catholic religion,

You mean the Orthodox Faith into which the ruling house of Lithuania was first baptized, and the first bishop at Krakow professed?

Quote
promoter of Islam

a true son of Lech and father of the Vatican.
Quote
and Orthodoxy, Calvinism
I recall Calvin being ordained by the Vatican, not the Metropolitan of Moscow.

Quote
and Shamanism,

Quote
His Imperialest Majesty,

Imperialist? How did all those "millions of Poles" end up outside of Poland on the Dniestr and Dniepr?

Quote
the Tsar of Holy, Holy, Holy, thrice Holy, thrice thrice thrice Holy social political construct  German occupier of the Eastern Slavs, the Romanov dynasty.

My, since no dynasty from the loins of Lech has sat on Poland's throne since 1370, one would think you would be more careful.  When the Bolshevks shot the Orthodox confessor Czar St. Nicholas II the blood of Rurik, no matter how diluted, flowed out.

Quote
I have even read on one forum, by a self-named Crimean Slav, neither Ukrainian nor Russian who said that nationalities in our region are historical constructions especially the Great Russian nationality. I do not entirely agree with this but in some aspects this might hold true.

Since I am not in your region, I'll leave you to discuss it. As for construct, I do have a branch of ancestors from the region, in Pomerania, who had a German name and nationality but also spoke Polish, something I don't think common among Germans of the German empire. Should I turn out to be partially a son of Lech, it won't change matters.
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« Reply #33 on: November 03, 2010, 05:06:32 PM »

How did a RCC picture thread become yet another isalmisry vs the Pope takeover?
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« Reply #34 on: November 03, 2010, 05:09:58 PM »

How did a RCC picture thread become yet another isalmisry vs the Pope takeover?

synLeszka (the OP) have been trying to palm off some fantasy theories alongside his pictures.
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« Reply #35 on: November 03, 2010, 05:14:32 PM »

How did a RCC picture thread become yet another isalmisry vs the Pope takeover?

synLeszka (the OP) have been trying to palm off some fantasy theories alongside his pictures.

Looking back on the thread, it appears Isa struck first?
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« Reply #36 on: November 03, 2010, 05:15:24 PM »

How did a RCC picture thread become yet another isalmisry vs the Pope takeover?

Please post pictures of Roman Catholic churches here:
I found this beautiful photo at skyscraper city forum.
This is the Piarist church in Chełm,Poland which is also known by its Ukrainian name Kholm.
Now when you say Roman Catholic...you do mean Romanian Orthodox, right? Tongue

Now when you say Roman Catholic...you do mean Romanian Orthodox, right? Tongue

He ought to: Wołoch in Polish means "Romanian/Vlach," Wołochowie historic "Romania," and Włochy "Italy."  It comes from Germanic Wlaha "foreignors, Romans." The Poles were neighbors to the Romanians, according to the Poles the Dniester forming the boundary set by God between them. The Poles were never anywhere near Rome or Italy.

What does this have to do with the Orthodox, except that the OP shows pictures from Kholm, the historic center of Orthodoxy in Poland, that is before the Union of Brest was forced on it, and after that yoke was lifted? St. Vladimir founded it, and it was part of Kievan Rus', but later annexed by the Piasts who set up a Latin bishoprick.  The Orthodox Cathedral was given by the "The Polish Committee of National Liberation" to the Vatican in 1944.

Wołoch and Włoch in Polish phonetic alphabet are written as Voůoχ and vůoχ. ů being the equivalent of the English "w" and χ being a sound similar to "h" in human.

Wołoch once signified a person who would now be called Romanian. The historic term for Romania in Polish is Wołoszczyzna. The region which is called Transylvannia was in Polish, Siedmiogród.
What are you talking about that caveat about the Dniestr being the Divinely instituted border of Poland? Roll Eyes

The historic centres of Polish Orthodoxy are outside of the modern day borders of Poland. First and foremost, the city of Kyiv/Kiev is the heart of the Polish Orthodoxy, because the majority of Orthodox in Poland are descended from the Kyivan principalities on the Dniepr, who because of political repression emigrated to the West. Another I can mention is Ostróg/Ostroh, Halicz and Włodzimierz Wołyński. The church in question in Jesus's post:

According to the Polish wikipedia here are the owners of the church since its construction in 1756
Wyznanie    
greckokatolickie (1756-1875) Greek Catholic
prawosławie (1875-1919) Orthodox
rzymskokatolickie (1919-1940) Roman Catholic
prawosławie (1940-1944) Orthodox
rzymskokatolickie (od 1940) Roman Catholic

Response to Jesus' post:
Do you have a problem with the fact that millions of Poles once lived on the Dniestr and Dniepr rivers?
Let us praise that great and holy, defender of the Orthodox faith, Christ's servant, the Thirteenth apostle, the iron man, Iosip Jugashvili, the immortal STALIN who told a Kalmuk and a Kazakh, a Finn and Pole, Tajik and Uzbek, that they have been lied to by the PETTY CAPITALIST and in fact, that they were never Catholic nor Muslim, Lutheran nor Buddhist but GREAT, GREATER, GREATEST GREAT-RUSSIAN nation. The fact that the current Orthodox church of Moscow, does something the Tsars never would of dreamt of, that is that they claim that every citizen of the Russian Federation, is by right of birth, an adherent of Russian Orthodoxy. The Tsar only tried to assimilate Catholics but he did not claim Muslims or Shamanists to be Orthodox.

I view the fact, that the Orthodox branch of our nation was separated from the Catholic branch as a sad event.
This schism in the Commonwealth caused by our great and holy, blessed and apostolic, true believing and insincere, destroyer of all oppression which is the Catholic religion, promoter of Islam and Orthodoxy, Calvinism and Shamanism, His Imperialest Majesty, the Tsar of Holy, Holy, Holy, thrice Holy, thrice thrice thrice Holy social political construct  German occupier of the Eastern Slavs, the Romanov dynasty.
I have even read on one forum, by a self-named Crimean Slav, neither Ukrainian nor Russian who said that nationalities in our region are historical constructions especially the Great Russian nationality. I do not entirely agree with this but in some aspects this might hold true.
Okay, I'll break my rule this one time. I've never been to the Cathedral of St Louis, Missouri, USA, but it's definitely high on my list:


odd. i've been there but i didn't recognize it in the photo (I think it is the lighting)
Or perhaps your aversion to all things Latin prevented you from seeing the true beauty of it.
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« Reply #37 on: November 03, 2010, 05:23:52 PM »





I see one..ONE..more post that is not either a picture of a Roman Catholic Church or a direct commentary about such a picture and a) this thread gets shut down and b) the offending poster, be they ORthodox, Catholic, Hindu, whatever, gets slapped with an official warning to the next level.

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« Reply #38 on: November 03, 2010, 05:32:02 PM »

Okay, I'll break my rule this one time. I've never been to the Cathedral of St Louis, Missouri, USA, but it's definitely high on my list:

Church of Our Saviour, New York

This reminds me of Fr. Seraphim Rose's theory that Byzantine iconography is not strictly Eastern but Universal tradition of the Church. I bow my head to sheer beauty. We might have the most correct theology but RCs have the most beautiful churches. The present pope of Old Rome has mourned the lost of and lack of concept of sacred art in the Latin church. Fortunately it seems that His Holiness was a little wrong. Smiley

Here and here is couple of panoramas from Turku Cathedral in Finland which used to be Catholic cathedral before reformation. The present RC bishop of Finland was consecrated here.
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« Reply #39 on: November 03, 2010, 05:50:22 PM »




Here is a church from my hometown, Immaculate Conception in Jacksonville, Fl.
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« Reply #40 on: November 03, 2010, 06:12:36 PM »

The Cathedral/Basillica from my diocese (Santa Fe):

http://www.cbsfa.org/home0.aspx

http://www.virtualsantafe.com/VirtualSF/StFrancis/


the Altar:

http://www.travelpod.com/travel-photo/mikvs/2/1002625820/st-francis-cathedral-interior.jpg/tpod.html

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« Reply #41 on: November 03, 2010, 06:19:17 PM »

Notre Dame of Africa, Algeria






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« Reply #42 on: November 03, 2010, 06:20:22 PM »


Notre Dame of Africa, Algeria






WOW!
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« Reply #43 on: November 03, 2010, 06:29:19 PM »

St. Paul Cathedral
St. Paul, Minnesota

I got to see this breathtaking place this spring sometime. There was a service going on, so I couldn't be quite as nosey as I would have liked.









These other four are copyrighted but I encourage you to click on the links to see them:

http://www.flickr.com/photos/hqbach/2585450652/lightbox/

http://www.flickr.com/photos/hqbach/2585413052/lightbox/

http://www.flickr.com/photos/hqbach/2584271442/lightbox/

http://www.flickr.com/photos/hqbach/2583434007/lightbox/

Sts. Peter and Paul, pray to God for us!
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« Reply #44 on: November 03, 2010, 06:33:12 PM »

The Cathedral in Denver is absolutely stunning. I had the opportunity to pray there for a dear priest/friend who had passed away.

http://www.denvercathedral.org/
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« Reply #45 on: November 03, 2010, 06:39:32 PM »

I love this little church.  http://www.flickr.com/photos/biblarte/3208793311/
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« Reply #46 on: November 03, 2010, 06:43:48 PM »

Here are some pics of the church at St. Vincent College in Latrobe PA (dedicated in 1905, became a basilica in 1955)...





Yuck you can sure tell the Vatican II iconoclasts had their way with this place. Pre 1969 or so there would have been a beautiful high altar in the sanctuary there where now stands only a table.
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« Reply #47 on: November 03, 2010, 06:56:33 PM »

Looking at this thread is helping me to realize that with the beauty of your temples, there is still hope that they might invoke a return to proper liturgy in some areas where there is abuse.
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« Reply #48 on: November 03, 2010, 06:57:49 PM »

Looking at this thread is helping me to realize that with the beauty of your temples, there is still hope that they might invoke a return to proper liturgy in some areas where there is abuse.
Keep us in your prayers. We have alot of work to do.
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« Reply #49 on: November 03, 2010, 07:22:12 PM »

Cathederal of Monreale, Sicily, Italy









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« Reply #50 on: November 03, 2010, 07:27:36 PM »

^ Love the chairs!
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« Reply #51 on: November 03, 2010, 08:31:16 PM »

Surely the Cathederal of Monreale, Sicily, Italy, along with others in Ravenna and elsewhere in that region, give to us some reflection of the transcendent glory that was Hagia Sophia before the conquest.
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« Reply #52 on: November 03, 2010, 08:34:13 PM »

Would it be safe to say that Orthodox churches today tend to be smaller, even cathedrals?

When I visited Hagia Sophia, I got the feeling that the vastness of the architecture would have dwarfed the action around the altar. I get the same feeling looking at the grander RC cathedrals- as awesome and beautiful as they are, I wonder if there should be more of a sense of intimacy in the proportions. 
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« Reply #53 on: November 03, 2010, 09:06:17 PM »




Here is a church from my hometown, Immaculate Conception in Jacksonville, Fl.
I was there for a wedding two weekends ago. Very beautiful church.

In Christ,
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« Reply #54 on: November 03, 2010, 09:22:28 PM »

The former St. Francis de Sales Church in Oakland, CA which was left structurally unsound by the Loma Prieta earthquake and later demolished

http://www.flickr.com/photos/24557771@N02/5144627716/
http://www.flickr.com/photos/24557771@N02/5144627758/
http://www.flickr.com/photos/24557771@N02/5144627792/
http://www.flickr.com/photos/24557771@N02/5144627834/
http://www.flickr.com/photos/24557771@N02/5144023303/
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« Reply #55 on: November 03, 2010, 09:26:49 PM »

The former St. Francis de Sales Church in Oakland, CA which was left structurally unsound by the Loma Prieta earthquake and later demolished

...http://www.flickr.com/photos/24557771@N02/5144627792/...

Eww.
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« Reply #56 on: November 03, 2010, 09:28:20 PM »

Basilica di San Marco in Venice, Italy




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« Reply #57 on: November 03, 2010, 09:44:40 PM »

The former St. Francis de Sales Church in Oakland, CA which was left structurally unsound by the Loma Prieta earthquake and later demolished

...http://www.flickr.com/photos/24557771@N02/5144627792/...

Eww.

I realize that's the common reflexive viewpoint on the era.  I happen to like that image very much personally.
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« Reply #58 on: November 03, 2010, 09:47:05 PM »

Basilica di San Marco in Venice, Italy






That is stunning!
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« Reply #59 on: November 03, 2010, 09:50:02 PM »

The former St. Francis de Sales Church in Oakland, CA which was left structurally unsound by the Loma Prieta earthquake and later demolished

...http://www.flickr.com/photos/24557771@N02/5144627792/...

Eww.

Double eww. What a barren Church. I could never worship in a place so barren. A lot of the reason I converted to OC was because of places like that. That and the beautiful liturgy as opposed to the Modern Catholic man centered Mass.
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« Reply #60 on: November 03, 2010, 09:50:54 PM »

Looking at this thread is helping me to realize that with the beauty of your temples, there is still hope that they might invoke a return to proper liturgy in some areas where there is abuse.

http://www.newliturgicalmovement.org/

There are those that are trying. I went to a high Latin Requiem Mass for All Souls Day last night. It hasn't all disappeared.
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« Reply #61 on: November 03, 2010, 09:55:03 PM »

Church of Our Saviour, New York

proof that churches built since the 1950s need not be ugly



Yeah but tell that to the modernists. Thats a beautiful Church. Isnt their a show on EWTN that has a Priest teaching in that Church. I am thinking I may have seen it back in my RC days.
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« Reply #62 on: November 03, 2010, 10:00:23 PM »

Cathederal of Monreale, Sicily, Italy











Nice. Why do all these Catholic Cathedrals in Italy look so Byzantine?
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« Reply #63 on: November 03, 2010, 10:31:50 PM »

Nice. Why do all these Catholic Cathedrals in Italy look so Byzantine?

Certain parts of modern Italy. There's a great reason for it, and someone with more time should be able to give you the answer in detail.
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« Reply #64 on: November 03, 2010, 11:42:47 PM »

cathedral of Las Lajas, Colombia



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« Reply #65 on: November 03, 2010, 11:44:48 PM »

Yeah but tell that to the modernists. Thats a beautiful Church. Isnt their a show on EWTN that has a Priest teaching in that Church. I am thinking I may have seen it back in my RC days.

Yes, the pastor of this church is Fr. George Rutler. He hosts the EWTN program Christ in the City.

Great, great, great priest.
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« Reply #66 on: November 04, 2010, 12:13:09 AM »

Sagrada Familia, Barcelona. Pope Benedict is going to consecrate this cathedral next week!



-

Cathedral of Notre-Dame-de-Reims





-

Cathedral of Orvieto, Italy





-

Kings College Chapel, Cambridge, England


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« Reply #67 on: November 04, 2010, 12:18:06 AM »

Duomo, Milano, Italy. This one is ENORMOUS, and it is awesome up close because the facade is covered with thousands of statues, most of them perched precariously on needle-like spires. The interior is wonderful, but I wasn't able to find a photo which could adequately capture it.



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« Reply #68 on: November 04, 2010, 12:29:55 AM »

La Sainte-Chapelle, Paris.

Incredible floor-to-ceiling, wall-to-wall, 13th-century stained glass. Was built as a glittering reliquary to house the Crown of Thorns.





-

Our Lady of Lichen, Poland. One of world's largest churches. Built in 2004

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« Reply #69 on: November 04, 2010, 12:33:02 AM »

Needs no introduction, but it's worth mentioning the Duomo in Florence, Italy. I was just there last month and was astonished at how much bigger it was than it looks in pictures. The dome is as large as St. Peter's. It just dominates the modern city of Florence. See that sizeable church in the foreground? It looks like a Turkish minaret in comparison.

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« Reply #70 on: November 04, 2010, 12:35:02 AM »

Santa Maria Maggiore Tuscania, Italy







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« Reply #71 on: November 04, 2010, 12:37:19 AM »

Salisbury Cathedral, England. That spire is 700 years old and is well over 400 feet high. Such a graceful and harmonious building because it was completed in a relatively short period of time.

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« Reply #72 on: November 04, 2010, 12:44:06 AM »

Thanks to all those who started and participated in this thread! Looking at all these churches gets me so excited. I'll take a break now :-)
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« Reply #73 on: November 04, 2010, 12:52:42 AM »

Santa Maria in Trastevere (Rome, Italy)



Santa Maria delle Grotte (Fossa, Italy)








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« Reply #74 on: November 04, 2010, 12:55:46 AM »

Thanks to all those who started and participated in this thread! Looking at all these churches gets me so excited. I'll take a break now :-)
Me too! This was interesting. Smiley
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« Reply #75 on: November 04, 2010, 03:35:52 AM »

Nice. Why do all these Catholic Cathedrals in Italy look so Byzantine?

Because they are former Orthodox churches? Wink
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« Reply #76 on: November 04, 2010, 09:15:42 AM »

Nice. Why do all these Catholic Cathedrals in Italy look so Byzantine?

Because they are former Orthodox churches? Wink

Some of them are, some of them are just made up stuff stolen from Orthodox churches  Wink
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« Reply #77 on: November 04, 2010, 09:45:18 AM »

Nice. Why do all these Catholic Cathedrals in Italy look so Byzantine?

Because they are former Orthodox churches? Wink

Some of them are, some of them are just made up stuff stolen from Orthodox churches  Wink

They stole the walls. You should have seen it!
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« Reply #78 on: November 04, 2010, 10:07:12 AM »

F.e. the marble columns from the demolished St. Alexander Church in Warsaw are now in the RC Wawel Cathedral in Kraków. AFAIK it's not the only one case.

edit:

I also recall the rubble from the demolished Resurrection Church in Białystok used in fence of the RC St. Roch Church in Białystok.
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« Reply #79 on: November 04, 2010, 10:49:06 AM »

Ukrainian and Romanian Byzantine Catholics can provide plenty of examples of the reverse.  I'm going to have to echo the sentiments of podkarpatska in another thread and say the historical recriminations don't do us much good.
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« Reply #80 on: November 04, 2010, 10:58:11 AM »

Nice. Why do all these Catholic Cathedrals in Italy look so Byzantine?

Because they are former Orthodox churches? Wink

Some of them are, some of them are just made up stuff stolen from Orthodox churches  Wink

They stole the walls. You should have seen it!

This is a long and complicated history with many sources for further information

Actually, much of southern Italy and Sicily was past of the Byzantine Empire through the 12th century or so. As the power of the Byzantines diminished, its influence there waned. Also, the Venetians maintained a 'complicated' relationship with the Byzantines after 1054 continuing through the period of the conquest . Venetian merchants and churchmen often imported the greatest artists of Constantinople to adorn the Churches of the Venetians.

We Orthodox should be thankful to our Roman brothers who, for the most part,  did not act like the Muslims in obliterating iconography but for preserving its majesty for the eyes of modern peoples!
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« Reply #81 on: November 04, 2010, 11:01:12 AM »

F.e. the marble columns from the demolished St. Alexander Church in Warsaw are now in the RC Wawel Cathedral in Kraków. AFAIK it's not the only one case.

edit:

I also recall the rubble from the demolished Resurrection Church in Białystok used in fence of the RC St. Roch Church in Białystok.
Read what Schultz wrote!

Anyways, the Gorazd mentioned in many of Isa's posts did not come to Kraków but to Wiślica, which was the capital of the region.
Here is the minor basilica of Wiślica.







Also, a temporary Byzantine exarchate existed in the city of Sandomierz for a couple decades in the 10th century.
Here are the churches of modern Sandomierz.
The Dominican convent of Sandomierz, founded by one of the Apostles of St.Dominic, St.Jacek(yA-tsek) who is called st.Hyacinth in English,French and other languages.

Church of the conversion of St.Paul, Sandomierz
Below is the cathedral of Sandomierz


If someone wants to gaze at Baroque and Roccoco please view these four galeries : http://www.katedra.sandomierz.org/galeria/index1.html

The Catholic Church of St.Nicholas, Kyiv, Ukraine

The church of st.John the Baptist in Bila Tserkva, Ukraine
Zhytomyr:
The church of st. John from Dukla built in 1828-41
The cathedral of Zhytomyr, Ukraine st.Sophia built in 1737
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« Reply #82 on: November 04, 2010, 11:15:10 AM »

May someone help me with resizing the photos above. The Royal Cathedral of the Royal City of Kraków, (CRACOVIA) dedicated to St.Stanisław and Wacław (Stanislaus and Vaclav/Weneceslaus)
The Sarcophagus of St.Stanisław (Stanislaus)




The main altar of the Lady Church of Kraków, Kościół Mariacki
The Apse and Rood of the Lady Church of Kraków
The exterior of the Lady Church of Kraków

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« Reply #83 on: November 04, 2010, 12:05:36 PM »

May someone help me with resizing the photos above.

type width=500, or whatever size you want, in the [img] e.g.. [img width=500]
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« Reply #84 on: November 04, 2010, 12:08:54 PM »

Santa Maria in Trastevere (Rome, Italy)

Is this the one which is supposed to have gold on its ceiling brought back by Columbus from the New World?
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« Reply #85 on: November 04, 2010, 01:22:45 PM »

Isa, I think that every church in Spain has gold from the New World. The fact that they used gold from the New World is not a shocking fact. I do not think that Europe has or had much gold, though. Although I hear Romania has significant gold mines.
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« Reply #86 on: November 04, 2010, 02:47:59 PM »

Isa, I think that every church in Spain has gold from the New World. The fact that they used gold from the New World is not a shocking fact. I do not think that Europe has or had much gold, though. Although I hear Romania has significant gold mines.
He ignorance is showing. This church is Italian. The Spanish Crown was the one that discovered America. I hope the moderator sees his posts. We just can't be at peace anywhere us Catholics have something to post without having him attacking anything that resembles Roman Catholic. I was under the assumption that this thread is for posting pics and not for polemics. I sincerely hope the moderator helps us keep that way, and I am aware he has already given a warning.
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« Reply #87 on: November 04, 2010, 02:59:44 PM »

I'm probably being Captain Obvious here, but this one is pretty stunning:



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« Reply #88 on: November 04, 2010, 03:16:20 PM »



Didn't they take out the "ironing board" recently and start performing the liturgy with the original altar? Or am I just remembering high hopes?
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« Reply #89 on: November 04, 2010, 03:19:50 PM »

Isa, I think that every church in Spain has gold from the New World. The fact that they used gold from the New World is not a shocking fact. I do not think that Europe has or had much gold, though. Although I hear Romania has significant gold mines.
He ignorance is showing. This church is Italian. The Spanish Crown was the one that discovered America. I hope the moderator sees his posts. We just can't be at peace anywhere us Catholics have something to post without having him attacking anything that resembles Roman Catholic. I was under the assumption that this thread is for posting pics and not for polemics. I sincerely hope the moderator helps us keep that way, and I am aware he has already given a warning.


That's funny, because it's your prejudice against Ialmisry that is showing.  He asked a rather neutral question based on information I myself have heard elsewhere.  Instead of being the clairvoyant that you are purporting to be and telling us ialmisry's intentions, answering his question would have sufficed instead of being a hypocrite and pointing out the supposed speck in his eye when you have a plank in yours: you are engaging in commentary that stands on the edge of violating my diktat.

In short, KNOCK. IT. OFF.  IF YOU HAVE A PROBLEM, USE THE REPORT TO MODERATOR FUNCTION.

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« Reply #90 on: November 04, 2010, 04:25:42 PM »

Isa, I think that every church in Spain has gold from the New World. The fact that they used gold from the New World is not a shocking fact. I do not think that Europe has or had much gold, though. Although I hear Romania has significant gold mines.
He ignorance is showing. This church is Italian. The Spanish Crown was the one that discovered America. I hope the moderator sees his posts. We just can't be at peace anywhere us Catholics have something to post without having him attacking anything that resembles Roman Catholic. I was under the assumption that this thread is for posting pics and not for polemics. I sincerely hope the moderator helps us keep that way, and I am aware he has already given a warning.


That's funny, because it's your prejudice against Ialmisry that is showing.  He asked a rather neutral question based on information I myself have heard elsewhere.  Instead of being the clairvoyant that you are purporting to be and telling us ialmisry's intentions, answering his question would have sufficed instead of being a hypocrite and pointing out the supposed speck in his eye when you have a plank in yours: you are engaging in commentary that stands on the edge of violating my diktat.

In short, KNOCK. IT. OFF.  IF YOU HAVE A PROBLEM, USE THE REPORT TO MODERATOR FUNCTION.

-Schultz.
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So Santa Maria in Trastevere is the church?  I remember a guide pointing that out on one of the churches, but can't remember which (it is like sorting coals in Newcastle after a while).

I hope sickness didn't completely robe you of your time with your lovely wife. Get well!
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« Reply #91 on: November 04, 2010, 04:32:31 PM »

Isa, I think that every church in Spain has gold from the New World. The fact that they used gold from the New World is not a shocking fact. I do not think that Europe has or had much gold, though. Although I hear Romania has significant gold mines.
He ignorance is showing. This church is Italian. The Spanish Crown was the one that discovered America. I hope the moderator sees his posts. We just can't be at peace anywhere us Catholics have something to post without having him attacking anything that resembles Roman Catholic. I was under the assumption that this thread is for posting pics and not for polemics. I sincerely hope the moderator helps us keep that way, and I am aware he has already given a warning.


That's funny, because it's your prejudice against Ialmisry that is showing.  He asked a rather neutral question based on information I myself have heard elsewhere.  Instead of being the clairvoyant that you are purporting to be and telling us ialmisry's intentions, answering his question would have sufficed instead of being a hypocrite and pointing out the supposed speck in his eye when you have a plank in yours: you are engaging in commentary that stands on the edge of violating my diktat.

In short, KNOCK. IT. OFF.  IF YOU HAVE A PROBLEM, USE THE REPORT TO MODERATOR FUNCTION.

-Schultz.
ORthodox-Catholic Discussion moderator.
So Santa Maria in Trastevere is the church?  I remember a guide pointing that out on one of the churches, but can't remember which (it is like sorting coals in Newcastle after a while).

I hope sickness didn't completely robe you of your time with your lovely wife. Get well!

I'm not sure, either, but it sounds familiar.  We both may, of course, be totally wrong.  Like you said, all the information about all the various churches in Rome run together after a while. 

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« Reply #92 on: November 04, 2010, 04:42:39 PM »

Very well then, I was very eager to post more pics but will cease doing so for fear of causing more provocations, I will just leave this thread.
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« Reply #93 on: November 04, 2010, 05:11:57 PM »

Very well then, I was very eager to post more pics but will cease doing so for fear of causing more provocations, I will just leave this thread.

What if I provoke you anyways.  Grin


Just keep going. Besides, ever notice that OCnet isn't the same when islmisry isn't around to poke at people. He keeps you thinking.
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« Reply #94 on: November 04, 2010, 09:55:22 PM »

Very well then, I was very eager to post more pics but will cease doing so for fear of causing more provocations, I will just leave this thread.

What if I provoke you anyways.  Grin


Just keep going. Besides, ever notice that OCnet isn't the same when islmisry isn't around to poke at people. He keeps you thinking.
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Santa Maria del Popolo (Rome, Italy)





San Luigi dei Francesi (Rome, Italy)



Naples Cathedral (Italy)




Basilica di Sant'Eustorgio (Milan, Italy)

[imghttp://farm1.static.flickr.com/46/163043301_1090665b5f_b.jpg]http://[/img]

Sant'Apollinare Nuovo (Ravenna, Italy)

[imghttp://i43.tinypic.com/2qwpt93.jpg]http://[/img]


Orvieto Cathedral (Orvieto, Italy)


[imghttp://farm3.static.flickr.com/2137/2446625151_96dfaa4ac4_b.jpg]http://[/img]

Santa Cecilia in Trastevere (Rome, Italy)
[imghttp://farm1.static.flickr.com/56/207803871_0e9dab997f_b.jpg]http://[/img]







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« Reply #95 on: November 04, 2010, 10:37:53 PM »

Basilica di San Clemente (Rome, Italy)




San Pietro in Vincoli (Rome, Italy)




Chiesa del Gesù (Rome, Italy)




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« Reply #96 on: November 04, 2010, 10:59:03 PM »

This is where I used to attend Latin Mass, in Mission Hills, inside of Los Angeles. San Fernando Rey de España ( St. Ferdinand, King of Spain). One of the many missions of Father Junipero Serra in California. Built in 1797.
















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« Reply #97 on: November 04, 2010, 11:56:45 PM »

Stunning
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« Reply #98 on: November 05, 2010, 01:08:56 AM »

These pictures are all quite beautiful, but is it true that all of these magnificent Catholic Churches were built before Vatican II?
What can be said about some of the monstrosities, er, excuse me I meant to say Catholic Churches built after Vatican II?
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« Reply #99 on: November 05, 2010, 02:02:27 AM »

Some of the churches I have been to in the D.C. area.

The National Shrine of the Immaculate Conception:



Franciscan Monastery




The Chapel at Mount Saint Mary's (I remember attending the "Mount 2000...and Beyond" event held at the seminary and hosted by the Franciscan Friars of the Renewal and waking up early one morning and walking from the gym (where we slept) to this chapel with a seminarian to pray the rosary and talk a little bit about our faith)


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« Reply #100 on: November 05, 2010, 02:32:22 AM »

This thread is replete with extraordinary images of Catholic temples and like any other such thread (were there to be parallel ones filled with photographs of Eastern or Oriental Orthodox or Eastern Catholic temples), the incredible beauty, majesty, and workmanship portrayed awes the viewer.

There is, however, a concern that should be noted. As I recently pointed out on my home forum, when photos are posted using the image function ([img:]), instead of merely linking to the URL of the photo, as was done here, the images draw on the bandwidth of the site from which they originate - effectively 'stealing' that site's bandwidth. It's considered bad form on the net and is also the reason that some such pics disappear w/in a day or so, to be replaced by red 'x's in a small box. (Because, most photo-based sites, most commercial sites, and other sites that are on top of things, use software that breaks the bandwidth connection once it is discovered - and most such perform periodic - as often as weekly, in some cases - scans to detect these intrusive acts).

A sufficient draw on the bandwidth of a site can effectively cause it to shut down, can result in it being shut down by the domain owner for exceeding the bandwidth allocated to it for a given period, or can result in monetary charges being levied against it by the domain owner for exceeding its allowed bandwidth usage in a given period (usually a calendar month). These are serious issues, particularly for small sites operating on shoestring budgets.

Additionally, posting image links versus URL links raises copyright issues for the site to which the images are posted.

I realize that words, when accompanied by an image available for immediate, simultaneous, viewing trump even Confucious' famous saying regarding the value of pictures over words ... but, there is a need to be a good internet neighbor (and for forums to protect themselves legally)


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« Reply #101 on: November 05, 2010, 02:51:27 AM »

There is, however, a concern that should be noted.



Howe realistic is this concern?

Take the last photograph above.  It is 107kb.

Let's assume the site which it is on has a provider which allows a download capacity of 20Gb monthly (and that is really a very small download amount.)

The photo would need to be downloaded 186,915 times in a month before it exceeds the 20Gb.

(Have I done my sums right?)
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« Reply #102 on: November 05, 2010, 03:19:14 AM »

Bless, Father,

It isn't so much the download at issue; rather, it's the fact that the image continues to draw on the image's home site bandwidth for the entire period that it is hosted at the site to which it was downloaded.

Here's an explanation that, altho created to sell a product, explains the issue rather well. It includes reference to something about which I failed to warn - the switch response, in which a site employs a means of replacing the hotlinked image w/ another - sometimes an image that points out the bandwidth theft, sometimes a porn or more innocuous, but likewise offensive, image.

Many years,

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« Reply #103 on: November 05, 2010, 11:17:43 AM »

I was going to say that I have been on other forums that have picture threads and it was never an issue on there, but then I remembered that most of the photos in those threads were posted from either Image Shack or Photobucket, so it wasn't a problem in those cases. Maybe people could copy these images to Photobucket before uploading them? Of course that wouldn't deal with the copyright issue, but in my opinion if the author was concerned about copyrights he would make sure to have his pictures locked to where they cannot be copied and pasted (which can be done).
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« Reply #104 on: November 05, 2010, 11:21:41 AM »

Some of the churches I have been to in the D.C. area.

The National Shrine of the Immaculate Conception:



I used to serve Mass here about a decade ago and the sanctuary has never looked this pretty.  Methinks the photographer played with the light both before and after taking the picture. Wink

It's usually a dull gray color all the time.
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« Reply #105 on: November 05, 2010, 11:27:09 AM »

I used to serve Mass here about a decade ago and the sanctuary has never looked this pretty.  Methinks the photographer played with the light both before and after taking the picture. Wink

It's usually a dull gray color all the time.
Perhaps Photoshop even?
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« Reply #106 on: November 05, 2010, 11:28:41 AM »

It appears to be HDR to me.
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« Reply #107 on: November 05, 2010, 12:03:18 PM »

It appears to be HDR to me.

Yes, it's definitely HDR.  I've also been there and it didn't look like that Wink
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« Reply #108 on: November 05, 2010, 03:18:27 PM »

This is where I went for the high Latin Requiem Mass last Tuesday.


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« Reply #109 on: November 05, 2010, 04:30:24 PM »

Sainte Marie de la Tourette Monastery



St. Pancras Church in Oberkirch:



Monastery in Mainz:



St. John and Paul Church in Katowice:



St. Christopher Church in Emmerich:



Cathedral in Brasilia:



Liverpool Metropolitain Cathedral:
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« Reply #110 on: November 05, 2010, 04:35:01 PM »

St. John and Paul Church in Katowice:


They have a KFC in their Church? Sweet!
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« Reply #111 on: November 05, 2010, 04:37:40 PM »

Yeah, any idea what that's all about?
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« Reply #112 on: November 05, 2010, 04:42:50 PM »

St. John and Paul Church in Katowice:


They have a KFC in their Church? Sweet!

Om nom nom nom!
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« Reply #113 on: November 05, 2010, 05:12:50 PM »

Sainte Marie de la Tourette Monastery


Is it some kind of Stalinist prison?
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« Reply #114 on: November 05, 2010, 05:18:50 PM »

Yeah, any idea what that's all about?

They were organising some kind of Christmass Carrol concert in there and KFC was one of the sponsors, so they rolled up it's banner.
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Holy Trinity Church of Gergeti, Georgia


« Reply #115 on: November 05, 2010, 05:21:22 PM »

Yeah, any idea what that's all about?

They were organising some kind of Christmass Carrol concert in there and KFC was one of the sponsors, so they rolled up it's banner.

And this is how we know that Poland has thoroughly embraced capitalism.
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« Reply #116 on: November 05, 2010, 05:30:40 PM »

Sainte Marie de la Tourette Monastery



St. Pancras Church in Oberkirch:



Monastery in Mainz:



St. John and Paul Church in Katowice:



St. Christopher Church in Emmerich:



Cathedral in Brasilia:



Liverpool Metropolitain Cathedral:

Do you like these images?
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« Reply #117 on: November 05, 2010, 05:36:43 PM »

Do you like these images?

"Like" is such a... strong... word.  Wink
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« Reply #118 on: November 05, 2010, 05:50:42 PM »

Do you like these images?

I can't find a reason why would anyone like these "churches". Finnish Lutherans have had same kind of weird tendency to build just plain ugly "churches" in recent decades. Nobody even among Lutherans themselves seems to like them but they are still built. Huh
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« Reply #119 on: November 05, 2010, 06:48:46 PM »

Do you like these images?

I can't find a reason why would anyone like these "churches". Finnish Lutherans have had same kind of weird tendency to build just plain ugly "churches" in recent decades. Nobody even among Lutherans themselves seems to like them but they are still built. Huh


Let's be careful fellow Orthodox...The West doesn't have a monopoly on modern 'art' church design. There are plenty of 'ugly' modernistic Orthodox Churches built in the US in the late 20th century! Let's NOT start a photo thread of those as beauty is in the eye of the beholder and we probably would offend members of  the same!
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« Reply #120 on: November 05, 2010, 07:59:47 PM »

Collegiata di Castiglione Olona, Italy




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« Reply #121 on: November 05, 2010, 08:04:30 PM »

Santa Caterina ( St. Catherine in Palermo, Italy)



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« Reply #122 on: November 05, 2010, 08:16:07 PM »

^ Love the chairs!
Aren't they great? Smiley

You can tell that some of these churches, at one point in time, had no pews.
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« Reply #123 on: November 05, 2010, 08:23:08 PM »

Sant' Agostino ( St. Augustine in rome, Italy)



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« Reply #124 on: November 05, 2010, 08:31:34 PM »

Duomo di Sant'Emidio- Cathederal of ST. Emidio (Ascoli Piceno, Italy)




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« Reply #125 on: November 05, 2010, 08:39:51 PM »

Please Show Us Some Pictures of Our Eastern Orthodox Religious Items and Holy orthodox Relics  Looted By The Crusaders, that are on display in your Catholic Churches...... This should be interesting... Grin
Stashko, you are hereby given a 30-day warning for attempting to derail this thread a second time with blatant polemical commentary that is not only completely out of line but also in direct violation of my previous diktat in this thread.  If you think this is unfair, please PM Fr. George or Fr. Chris, but you already knew that.  -Schultz.  
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« Reply #126 on: November 05, 2010, 08:51:18 PM »

.
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« Reply #127 on: November 05, 2010, 08:56:53 PM »

Santa Maria della Vittoria (St. Mary of Victory, Rome, Italy)





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« Reply #128 on: November 05, 2010, 09:00:29 PM »

They are all so beautiful. How do you find them all?

Tell you the truth. I believe the iconoclasm that is current in the Catholic Churches should be intentionally erased and replaced by numerous beautiful paintings/icons like these.  Those paintings can only help to teach the Word to the barely catechized, not to mention present a fuller worship for the faithful.
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« Reply #129 on: November 05, 2010, 09:20:13 PM »

They are all so beautiful. How do you find them all?

Tell you the truth. I believe the iconoclasm that is current in the Catholic Churches should be intentionally erased and replaced by numerous beautiful paintings/icons like these.  Those paintings can only help to teach the Word to the barely catechized, not to mention present a fuller worship for the faithful.
I am in agreement with you.
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« Reply #130 on: November 05, 2010, 10:03:59 PM »

San Bernardino (L'Aquila, Italy)



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« Reply #131 on: November 05, 2010, 10:17:40 PM »

Cathedral of Mexico City- the largest and oldest Cathedral in the Americas.



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« Reply #132 on: November 06, 2010, 07:39:28 AM »

Do you like these images?

No. Why should I?

Let's be careful fellow Orthodox...The West doesn't have a monopoly on modern 'art' church design. There are plenty of 'ugly' modernistic Orthodox Churches built in the US in the late 20th century! Let's NOT start a photo thread of those as beauty is in the eye of the beholder and we probably would offend members of  the same!

http://www.orthodoxchristianity.net/forum/index.php/topic,24233.0.html

I have already did. It is closed now because of the reason you mentioned.
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« Reply #133 on: November 06, 2010, 08:21:21 AM »

Do you like these images?

I can't find a reason why would anyone like these "churches". Finnish Lutherans have had same kind of weird tendency to build just plain ugly "churches" in recent decades. Nobody even among Lutherans themselves seems to like them but they are still built. Huh


Let's be careful fellow Orthodox...The West doesn't have a monopoly on modern 'art' church design.

Of course not. I'm not being triumphalistic since I could call these modern churches as "churches" regardless of denomination. Even if the "church" in case happened to be EO. However I wouldn't do that if I thought that it offends someone. And every Catholic in here seems to be a sort of conservative so I think that they won't be offended even though I don't like their modern churches since they either doesn't seem to like them. And same applies to Finnish Lutherans. Even themselves doesn't seem to like them.
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« Reply #134 on: November 06, 2010, 11:35:17 AM »

They are all so beautiful. How do you find them all?

Tell you the truth. I believe the iconoclasm that is current in the Catholic Churches should be intentionally erased and replaced by numerous beautiful paintings/icons like these.  Those paintings can only help to teach the Word to the barely catechized, not to mention present a fuller worship for the faithful.
I am in agreement with you.

I think that, to some extent,this is happening. I was at our local Catholic hospital this week visiting a family member and I came across a number of icons of post-schism Catholic Saints in the traditional Eastern fashion. There was a particularly beautiful icon of St. Vincent de Paul, the patron of the order who run the hospital.  To some of our fellow posters in particular,I can not say enough about the quality of care and compassionate assistance that this facility has rendered to my family over the the years and our community in general. There is most definitely a 'charism' present in the works at this hospital and of the lay and religious believers who work there.
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« Reply #135 on: November 06, 2010, 02:10:16 PM »

Do you like these images?

No. Why should I?
So then why would you post them? . I am sure there are very nice churches in your country. I don't understand your motive.
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« Reply #136 on: November 07, 2010, 03:48:00 PM »

The OP didn't ask to post pictures of Churches one likes. I find them interesting so I posted them. That's all.
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« Reply #137 on: November 07, 2010, 05:30:09 PM »

Just it's funny that someone cuts and pastes from Kronika Novus Ordo, the Polish Novus Ordo Watch.

This is a Roman Catholic Church in Michał Kalina's hometown built between 1991 and 1996.




Churches at the border of Christendom
The cathedral in Kamieniec Podolski, Kamyanets Podolshkyy Ukraine




Please, remember that the church was built by Martians who lived in Ukraine for hundreds of years.

Czortków, Podole now Chortkiv, Ukraine

In the thread former Roman Catholic churches, stolen by Orthodox

On Polish web sites, it is called the Jesuit church while on Ukrainian sites it is called a monastery of the Orthodox church.

One of the hundreds of Roman Catholic monasteries "canceled" (kasowane) by the Tsars.
The monastery of st,Catherine of Alexandria


Edit: fixed img tags, nothing more -Schultz.
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« Reply #138 on: November 07, 2010, 05:52:52 PM »

I took some pictures yesterday of the Catholic Basilica in my city. The Basilica of St. Adalbert in Grand Rapids was built in 1907 and my great-grandparents helped build it along with many other poor Polish families. They recently redid the domes of the church which have been green for ages and will soon turn that way again so I wanted to take some pictures as a remembrance that I got to see it the same way my great-grandparents did. It is a very beautiful church.

















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« Reply #139 on: November 07, 2010, 06:04:47 PM »

Just it's funny that someone cuts and pastes from Kronika Novus Ordo, the Polish Novus Ordo Watch.

This is a Roman Catholic Church in Michał Kalina's hometown built between 1991 and 1996.

Churches at the border of Christendom
The cathedral in Kamieniec Podolski, Kamyanets Podolshkyy Ukraine


Please, remember that the church was built by Martians who lived in Ukraine for hundreds of years.

Czortków, Podole now Chortkiv, Ukraine

In the thread former Roman Catholic churches, stolen by Orthodox

On Polish web sites, it is called the Jesuit church while on Ukrainian sites it is called a monastery of the Orthodox church.

One of the hundreds of Roman Catholic monasteries "canceled" (kasowane) by the Tsars.
The monastery of st,Catherine of Alexandria
http://www.orthodoxchristianity.net/forum/index.php/topic,31115.msg490934/topicseen.html#msg490934
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« Reply #140 on: November 09, 2010, 01:18:34 AM »

Yes,a very humble and simple church in appearance. I wonder what it dates back to?
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« Reply #141 on: November 10, 2010, 09:11:05 AM »


The Lady Church in Kraków one of my most favorite churches..
Note, the box at the side with the sign, is for petitions to St.Jude Thaddeus. Somethings are universal in the Catholic world.
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« Reply #142 on: November 12, 2010, 11:29:47 AM »

Hi everyone, and God bless.

This is my first post in here so I thought I'd share an image of the largest RC church in my city:

http://www.dxn.ro/millenium_church_QT.html

(it's one of those 3d things, you need Apple QuickTime I think)
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« Reply #143 on: November 16, 2010, 11:08:42 PM »

One I took this weekend

http://www.flickr.com/photos/24557771@N02/5178974879/

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« Reply #144 on: November 17, 2010, 01:09:22 AM »

I took some pictures yesterday of the Catholic Basilica in my city. The Basilica of St. Adalbert in Grand Rapids was built in 1907 and my great-grandparents helped build it along with many other poor Polish families. They recently redid the domes of the church which have been green for ages and will soon turn that way again so I wanted to take some pictures as a remembrance that I got to see it the same way my great-grandparents did. It is a very beautiful church.
















Very nice.
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« Reply #145 on: November 17, 2010, 11:41:55 PM »

The Basilica of Our Lady of Perpetual Help, Boston, Massachusetts









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« Reply #146 on: November 18, 2010, 01:33:33 AM »

The Basilica of Our Lady of Perpetual Help, Boston, Massachusetts










Bello, bello (beautiful)
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« Reply #147 on: April 03, 2011, 01:58:06 PM »



I'm not crazy about the steeples/cupola, but I think everything below the (upper) roof is beautiful...
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« Reply #148 on: April 04, 2011, 04:18:01 AM »

I visited this parish yesterday... the pic doesn't do it justice though...

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« Reply #149 on: April 04, 2011, 11:58:08 AM »

I visited this parish yesterday... the pic doesn't do it justice though...


How was the inside of the Church?
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« Reply #150 on: April 04, 2011, 12:19:03 PM »

How was the inside of the Church?

Some observations about the interior that I remember...

- The lights hanging from the ceiling were in the shape of + style crosses (maybe 3' x 3'), but they were hidden and the lights were pointed upward, so you didn't actually see the bulbs, only cross-like things. There was plenty of light though.

- There is a giant circular window behind the altar, similar to the one that can be seen in the picture

- On the dais was a chair for the priest to sit on on the right, a rather minimalistic altar in the middle, and a podium for doing readings/singing on the left.

- For holy water there was a continuously running/recirculating fountain at the back of the nave

- There were lots of pews, and some chairs, most running in the normal manner, but with some pews up front running from the front wall towards the direction of the main group of pews. The spaces between the pews were a bit close, but not uncomfortably so.

- There were windows along the sides of the Church, but not stained glass. The roof was slanted leading towards the windows, with the space opening for the windows being in a wedge or pie like shape, which was architecturally interesting

- There were things (I don't recall what) in between the windows on the sides, so that the Church did not seem as bare

- There was a crucifix behind the altar, below the window

- They had a bell choir at the beginning and towards the end doing some music

- While I like the domes of Orthodox Churches, the roof was fine looking

- Built in 1999, the parish was quite clean and modern looking (I've seen parishes much more minimalistic, and also more ornate)

- The vestibule was rather large, though didn't have a place to put my coat (argh!)  Maybe they had a cloakroom somewhere, though other people in the church also had jackets on

Overall a nice parish, I think Smiley
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« Reply #151 on: May 04, 2011, 02:52:26 AM »

St. Stephen's, Cleveland, Ohio











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« Reply #152 on: May 04, 2011, 05:12:17 AM »

St.Vitus cathedral in Praha, Ceska Republika (Prague Czech Republic) under Czech government occupation


Czech Nepomuk- statue of the death of St.John Nepomucene by St.Vit's cathedral in Praha

Altar of St.John Nepomucene in Prague cathedral

Nepomucene statue in Wrocław, on the Ostrów Tumski

Nepomucen in Kielce,Poland

Nepomucen in Piotrków, Poland

Nepomucen in Bodzentyn, Poland

Nepomucene in Olomouc, Czechia

St.John Nepomucene is the patron saint of good confession, protector against floods, and protector of honor and virginity.
St.John Nepomucen died defending the seal of confession. His devotion was popular in Central Europe, although now few people upkeep devotion to him.
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« Reply #153 on: May 04, 2011, 10:32:34 AM »

St. Stephen's, Cleveland, Ohio




Wow. What was the ethnicity of the builders of this Church?
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« Reply #154 on: May 04, 2011, 10:40:54 AM »

St. Stephen's, Cleveland, Ohio




Wow. What was the ethnicity of the builders of this Church?


Quote
Early history:

St. Stephen Parish arose from a division necessitated by the increases at St. Mary Parish, formerly located on W. 30th St. St. Mary’s Parish is no longer in existence. In April of 1869, Rt. Rev. Amadeus Rappe, first bishop of Cleveland, commissioned Father Stephen Falk to establish a two-story building which would service both church and school for German-speaking Catholics living west of W. 44th St. The newly ordained Father Casimir Reichlin was appointed the first pasture and celebrated the first mass in the new building on May 1, 1870. At that time to Parish consists of about 200 families. The Parish prospered, and so the larger church was needed. In 1873 the present structure was begun by the architectural firm Cudell and Richardson. Parishioners mortgage their own properties in order to raise the needed funds. On November 20, 1881, Rt. Rev. Richard Gilmour: second bishop of Cleveland, dedicated St. Stephen church; the interior had been completed just one week previously. On the day of its dedication, St. Stephen church stood as one of the most elegant and substantial church edifices in the city. Built entirely of stone, mainly of the best Amherst, the church is 165 ft. long and 74 ft. wide, the side walls are 40 ft. high. The style is Gothic, in the shape of the Cross. The church's interior is massive and sound the interior lentils give it a bright and airy feeling. Interior height from the floor to ceiling is 75 ft. On each side of the main aisle are six great tree-like pillars that branch out into numerous columns. The oak pews harmonize with wood carvings which dominate the high altar, siding alters, and pulpit. As the years passed, a Mexican onyx and brass communion rail were installed. Basket-weave marble tiles were installed in the sanctuary floor and aisles. The church building his many artistic treasures, some of them are described below:
source
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« Reply #155 on: May 04, 2011, 10:54:58 AM »

Cathedral of the Immaculate Conception, Kansas City, MO.

Pre-Vatican II Iconoclasm:



What is there today:



After lengthy renovations completed in 2003, here we have the new cathedral, where the altar is placed in the center of the nave with pews facing from each direction. I was going to go and visit this cathedral this week until I saw pictures of the interior. It seems so wrong!
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« Reply #156 on: May 04, 2011, 11:07:13 AM »

Cathedral of the Immaculate Conception, Kansas City, MO.

Pre-Vatican II Iconoclasm:



What there is today:



After lengthy renovations completed in 2003, here we have the new cathedral, where the altar is placed in the center of the nave with pews facing from each direction. I was going to go and visit this cathedral this week until I saw pictures of the interior. It seems so wrong!

I suspect that many of the faithful were not expressing a whole lot of love to their Bishop about this abomination. I hope that he isn't assigned to Chartres.
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« Reply #157 on: May 04, 2011, 11:12:24 AM »

What is there today:



That might be the best looking inside of a Church I've seen on the thread yet...  angel
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« Reply #158 on: May 04, 2011, 11:13:43 AM »

http://www.diocese-kcsj.org/content/diocese/bishop_emeritus/

Apparently this "Bishop Emeritus" is responsible. Can Roman Catholic bishops retire?

Also from the cathedral site:


"THE ALTAR
Like a dining room or kitchen table for a family, the altar should be more or less centrally located (to symbolize a welcome gathering around the table). For the first few centuries of the church's existence it was a simple free-standing table. In later centuries when the liturgy became a performance by the clergy, it moved physically away from the people to the rear wall. It was no longer a family table but a kind of stage. In those "middle times" the altar was oblong to allow the priest to proclaim two readings from Scripture from opposite ends and separate from the Eucharistic action in the center.

The Second Vatican Council led us back to the earlier practice of the church.

Our tables today are a variety of shapes. So altars may be. Since the sacred food (communion) is distributed as part of the action taking place the tabernacle (reservation) is removed and given another place of honor.

The altar should be beautiful and noble as befits the mystery being celebrated there. But it should be of a simplicity that can be seen as welcoming even to the most humble who might approach it."
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« Reply #159 on: May 04, 2011, 11:15:04 AM »

http://www.diocese-kcsj.org/content/diocese/bishop_emeritus/

Apparently this "Bishop Emeritus" is responsible. Can Roman Catholic bishops retire?

They can get fired as happened this past week in Australia, and as happened to a Byzantine Catholic Bishop in the 1960's. (although he reappeared after a period of re-education in Rome in the person
of a Latin Rite auxiliary Bishop.)
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« Reply #160 on: May 05, 2011, 01:43:02 AM »

St. Stephen's, Cleveland, Ohio




Wow. What was the ethnicity of the builders of this Church?

It's a magnificent German church. All that wood carving was done in a Munich workshop and shipped over. The stained glass was also done in Germany, at great cost. God bless those wonderful, sacrificing German immigrants who pinched pennies to pay for such a glorious house of God!

My favorite American Gothic churches tend to be the German ones and the ones built for French-speaking congregations (both from Quebec and France).
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« Reply #161 on: May 05, 2011, 01:49:19 AM »

Cathedral of the Immaculate Conception, Kansas City, MO.

Pre-Vatican II Iconoclasm:



What is there today:



After lengthy renovations completed in 2003, here we have the new cathedral, where the altar is placed in the center of the nave with pews facing from each direction. I was going to go and visit this cathedral this week until I saw pictures of the interior. It seems so wrong!

Christ is Risen!

Before I converted I served in this Cathedral many times it's a beautiful church. and Alveus  it may have been intended for people to sit on either side when it was built but people rarely sit is the back that seating is mainly used when their are large liturgies with large numbers of con-celebrating priests 
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« Reply #162 on: May 05, 2011, 01:53:33 AM »

http://www.diocese-kcsj.org/content/diocese/bishop_emeritus/

Apparently this "Bishop Emeritus" is responsible. Can Roman Catholic bishops retire?

Also from the cathedral site:


"THE ALTAR
Like a dining room or kitchen table for a family, the altar should be more or less centrally located (to symbolize a welcome gathering around the table). For the first few centuries of the church's existence it was a simple free-standing table. In later centuries when the liturgy became a performance by the clergy, it moved physically away from the people to the rear wall. It was no longer a family table but a kind of stage. In those "middle times" the altar was oblong to allow the priest to proclaim two readings from Scripture from opposite ends and separate from the Eucharistic action in the center.

The Second Vatican Council led us back to the earlier practice of the church.

Our tables today are a variety of shapes. So altars may be. Since the sacred food (communion) is distributed as part of the action taking place the tabernacle (reservation) is removed and given another place of honor.

The altar should be beautiful and noble as befits the mystery being celebrated there. But it should be of a simplicity that can be seen as welcoming even to the most humble who might approach it."

Wow, that is horrible what he did to that cathedral. The ironic thing is that his successor, Bishop Robert Finn, is awesome, very much pro-tradition and rock-solid.
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« Reply #163 on: May 05, 2011, 11:14:49 AM »

http://www.diocese-kcsj.org/content/diocese/bishop_emeritus/

Apparently this "Bishop Emeritus" is responsible. Can Roman Catholic bishops retire?

Also from the cathedral site:


"THE ALTAR
Like a dining room or kitchen table for a family, the altar should be more or less centrally located (to symbolize a welcome gathering around the table). For the first few centuries of the church's existence it was a simple free-standing table. In later centuries when the liturgy became a performance by the clergy, it moved physically away from the people to the rear wall. It was no longer a family table but a kind of stage. In those "middle times" the altar was oblong to allow the priest to proclaim two readings from Scripture from opposite ends and separate from the Eucharistic action in the center.

The Second Vatican Council led us back to the earlier practice of the church.

Our tables today are a variety of shapes. So altars may be. Since the sacred food (communion) is distributed as part of the action taking place the tabernacle (reservation) is removed and given another place of honor.

The altar should be beautiful and noble as befits the mystery being celebrated there. But it should be of a simplicity that can be seen as welcoming even to the most humble who might approach it."

Wow, that is horrible what he did to that cathedral. The ironic thing is that his successor, Bishop Robert Finn, is awesome, very much pro-tradition and rock-solid.

The description you quoted is awful, the author sounds like a low-Church Protestant wannabe.
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« Reply #164 on: May 05, 2011, 02:05:59 PM »

http://www.diocese-kcsj.org/content/diocese/bishop_emeritus/

Apparently this "Bishop Emeritus" is responsible. Can Roman Catholic bishops retire?

Also from the cathedral site:


"THE ALTAR
Like a dining room or kitchen table for a family, the altar should be more or less centrally located (to symbolize a welcome gathering around the table). For the first few centuries of the church's existence it was a simple free-standing table. In later centuries when the liturgy became a performance by the clergy, it moved physically away from the people to the rear wall. It was no longer a family table but a kind of stage. In those "middle times" the altar was oblong to allow the priest to proclaim two readings from Scripture from opposite ends and separate from the Eucharistic action in the center.

The Second Vatican Council led us back to the earlier practice of the church.

Our tables today are a variety of shapes. So altars may be. Since the sacred food (communion) is distributed as part of the action taking place the tabernacle (reservation) is removed and given another place of honor.

The altar should be beautiful and noble as befits the mystery being celebrated there. But it should be of a simplicity that can be seen as welcoming even to the most humble who might approach it."

Wow, that is horrible what he did to that cathedral. The ironic thing is that his successor, Bishop Robert Finn, is awesome, very much pro-tradition and rock-solid.

The description you quoted is awful, the author sounds like a low-Church Protestant wannabe.

And of course it justifies the rape of that cathedral by an appeal to the Second Vatican Council, which is a whopper of damnable proportions.


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« Reply #165 on: May 05, 2011, 02:20:22 PM »

http://www.diocese-kcsj.org/content/diocese/bishop_emeritus/

Apparently this "Bishop Emeritus" is responsible. Can Roman Catholic bishops retire?

Also from the cathedral site:


"THE ALTAR
Like a dining room or kitchen table for a family, the altar should be more or less centrally located (to symbolize a welcome gathering around the table). For the first few centuries of the church's existence it was a simple free-standing table. In later centuries when the liturgy became a performance by the clergy, it moved physically away from the people to the rear wall. It was no longer a family table but a kind of stage. In those "middle times" the altar was oblong to allow the priest to proclaim two readings from Scripture from opposite ends and separate from the Eucharistic action in the center.

The Second Vatican Council led us back to the earlier practice of the church.

Our tables today are a variety of shapes. So altars may be. Since the sacred food (communion) is distributed as part of the action taking place the tabernacle (reservation) is removed and given another place of honor.

The altar should be beautiful and noble as befits the mystery being celebrated there. But it should be of a simplicity that can be seen as welcoming even to the most humble who might approach it."

Wow, that is horrible what he did to that cathedral. The ironic thing is that his successor, Bishop Robert Finn, is awesome, very much pro-tradition and rock-solid.

The description you quoted is awful, the author sounds like a low-Church Protestant wannabe.

And of course it justifies the rape of that cathedral by an appeal to the Second Vatican Council, which is a whopper of damnable proportions.




Just goes to show that some Catholics can be as woefully ignorant about the complexities of their faith's teachings as are some Orthodox!  Wink Wink Wink
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« Reply #166 on: May 05, 2011, 02:26:21 PM »

You guys are crazy. The church looks much better in the second picture.
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« Reply #167 on: May 05, 2011, 03:28:54 PM »

The newly renovated Roman Catholic Church in my neighborhood:



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« Reply #168 on: May 05, 2011, 09:11:50 PM »

Just goes to show that some professional Catholics can be as woewilfully ignorant about the complexities of their faith's teachings as are some Orthodox!  Wink Wink Wink
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« Reply #169 on: May 09, 2011, 02:09:53 AM »

And of course it justifies the rape of that cathedral by an appeal to the Second Vatican Council, which is a whopper of damnable proportions.
I don't understand this. Who has been raping Catholic cathedrals and why are they doing so?
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« Reply #170 on: May 09, 2011, 12:23:49 PM »

And of course it justifies the rape of that cathedral by an appeal to the Second Vatican Council, which is a whopper of damnable proportions.
I don't understand this. Who has been raping Catholic cathedrals and why are they doing so?

Some bishops or "liturgists" have, and they are iconoclasts. They have a faulty understanding of liturgy and want to impose this on churches by "wreckovating" old churches and building monstrous new ones. They've had their heyday (1970s and 1980s) but they still occasionally do some serious damage.

One of the more notorious recent examples was Archbishop Rembert Weakland's $12 million destruction of the cathedral in Milwaukee in 2001. Incidentally, Weakland's horrified flock appealed to Rome to stop this, and the Holy See told Weakland to desist. He disobeyed.



May God have mercy on these church rapists' souls, because I wouldn't.
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« Reply #171 on: May 09, 2011, 07:54:50 PM »

And of course it justifies the rape of that cathedral by an appeal to the Second Vatican Council, which is a whopper of damnable proportions.
I don't understand this. Who has been raping Catholic cathedrals and why are they doing so?

You mess with the bull, you get the horns Wink
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« Reply #172 on: May 12, 2011, 05:21:46 AM »

The newly renovated Roman Catholic Church in my neighborhood:


The lighting on the crucifix is unbelievable - I can't think of any other way to describe it  Shocked

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« Reply #173 on: May 12, 2011, 08:23:08 AM »

The newly renovated Roman Catholic Church in my neighborhood:


The lighting on the crucifix is unbelievable - I can't think of any other way to describe it  Shocked



The crucifix made me think a bit as it says a great deal about the differences in the spiritual approach to Christ between the East and West - we of the East (Orthodox or Eastern Catholic alike)  would place a Pantocrator, a Panaghia or even an Icon of the Resurrected Christ in a place of predominance within our churches - but never such a graphic rendering of Christ's suffering and passion.

It calls to mind the generally negative Orthodox reaction to works such as the Passion of the Christ.

This is not to claim that either the Roman Church downplays the Resurrection or that the Orthodox downplay the passion - but stylistically and prayerfully there is a difference.

Sorry for going off-topic a bit but they say that a picture can be worth a thousand words.

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« Reply #174 on: May 12, 2011, 10:39:13 AM »

The newly renovated Roman Catholic Church in my neighborhood:


The lighting on the crucifix is unbelievable - I can't think of any other way to describe it  Shocked



The crucifix made me think a bit as it says a great deal about the differences in the spiritual approach to Christ between the East and West - we of the East (Orthodox or Eastern Catholic alike)  would place a Pantocrator, a Panaghia or even an Icon of the Resurrected Christ in a place of predominance within our churches - but never such a graphic rendering of Christ's suffering and passion.

It calls to mind the generally negative Orthodox reaction to works such as the Passion of the Christ.

This is not to claim that either the Roman Church downplays the Resurrection or that the Orthodox downplay the passion - but stylistically and prayerfully there is a difference.

Sorry for going off-topic a bit but they say that a picture can be worth a thousand words.



Well I'm a big Crucifix guy but I hate that one too.
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« Reply #175 on: May 12, 2011, 12:47:46 PM »


Well I'm a big Crucifix guy but I hate that one too.

I find it significant that in the photo the corpus is obliterated by the lighting.  I wonder if that is the case in real life.  What would be the message in that I wonder...intended and unintended.  I can see it might be the intention to view the cruciform in light of the resurrection but I don't think that is what happens in reality, nor is it the purpose of the cruciform in the first place.

The cruciform in Weakland's Wobbly is just an abomination...I don't mind the corpus as drawn by John of the Cross and reproduced in three dimensional cruciform, or even the elongated figures in paintings in the Spanish style but there must be limits on the place for abstraction in representative art that claims to present the body of Christ.
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« Reply #176 on: May 12, 2011, 12:52:31 PM »


Well I'm a big Crucifix guy but I hate that one too.

I find it significant that in the photo the corpus is obliterated by the lighting.  I wonder if that is the case in real life.  What would be the message in that I wonder...intended and unintended.  I can see it might be the intention to view the cruciform in light of the resurrection but I don't think that is what happens in reality, nor is it the purpose of the cruciform in the first place.

The cruciform in Weakland's Wobbly is just an abomination...I don't mind the corpus as drawn by John of the Cross and reproduced in three dimensional cruciform, or even the elongated figures in paintings in the Spanish style but there must be limits on the place for abstraction in representative art that claims to present the body of Christ.

I agree with you about John of the Cross, I did mean to imply that the crucifix is inappropriate within Orthodoxy - just the type of emphasis on the physical suffering as depicted in the Weakland picture.

For example, here is an example of a crucifix with a corpus within one of the holiest and most sacred Orthodox Churches of Russia, Holy Trinity Cathedral of St. Daniel Monastery. Check out the 35 second mark of the video against the wall of the church:  Holy Trinity Cathedral of St. Daniel Monastery  Both our parish cemetery and a cross dedicated to the soldiers of the First World War have an almost identical depiction of the crucified Saviour as do many churches and cemeteries of that era. http://www.youtube.com/user/russianchurch#p/u/124/4a03uniwp4Y

(Whenever I see these videos from the Patriarchate, I wonder at who has the vestment concession there!  Wink )
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« Reply #177 on: May 12, 2011, 03:40:34 PM »

I wear a crucifix because it reminds me to have gratitude for what Jesus suffered for us. That's the reason they display large crucifixes in the RCC. I can appreciate a King of Glory cross as well, but I don't find a 'graphic rendering' of the Passion to be inappropriate. I was never called out for wearing one by my Orthodox friends when I was younger.
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« Reply #178 on: May 13, 2011, 04:22:24 PM »

Behold! The future of Catholic churches in America...



(No, that's not a Catholic church. Yet. Wink )
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« Reply #179 on: May 13, 2011, 05:06:08 PM »

Behold! The future of Catholic churches in America...



(No, that's not a Catholic church. Yet. Wink )

Kind of looks like the Imperial Senate Chamber in Star Wars!
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« Reply #180 on: May 19, 2011, 08:43:41 PM »

Hardly. That I have no love for Ultramontanism does not mean I have an aversion to all things Latin.  your prejudice is showing.

Haha, I could have said this. I'm not fond of Ultramontanism either.


Anyone who seethes over Jansenism as much as I do doesn't even like the word Ultramontanism. I fall short of calling it a heresy. Although it probably is. I know not. Depending on who's speaking of it the definition of Ultramontanism seems to change like the wind.

Thank you for the photographs, gentlemen.

+
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« Reply #181 on: May 19, 2011, 08:47:33 PM »

Hardly. That I have no love for Ultramontanism does not mean I have an aversion to all things Latin.  your prejudice is showing.

Haha, I could have said this. I'm not fond of Ultramontanism either.


Anyone who seethes over Jansenism as much as I do doesn't even like the word Ultramontanism. I fall short of calling it a heresy. Although it probably is. I know not. Depending on who's speaking of it the definition of Ultramontanism seems to change like the wind.

Thank you for the photographs, gentlemen.

+

The definition here seems to be "anyone who is in communion with the pope" and is so quite willingly.
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« Reply #182 on: May 19, 2011, 08:53:36 PM »

Depending on who's speaking of it the definition of Ultramontanism seems to change like the wind.

True.
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« Reply #183 on: May 19, 2011, 09:08:37 PM »

Quote from: James Joseph
Depending on who's speaking of it the definition of Ultramontanism seems to change like the wind.

You noticed?  laugh
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« Reply #184 on: May 21, 2011, 03:15:13 PM »

Ultramontanism is a term taken from the Enlightenment era Austria and Germany, in which there were two fractions, the Ultramontanists and the Josephinists/Febrionists. The Josephinists called from state control of the Church, vernacular liturgy, and delegalisation of monastic orders. The Ultramontanists called the Papal control of the Church, Latin liturgy, and supported the rights of the Church to run schools, hospitals, and monasteries. The Ultramontanists were the minority of the nobility, the majority of the commonfolk. The Josephinists were the majority of nobility and biurocracy, non-existent among the commonfolk. From another angle, Josephinists viewed the Church only as a biurocratic instrument of the State and its goals negating the spiritual and mystical, sacramental life of Christianity. Josephinism is also associated with the values of middle class biurocracy and capitalism. Ultramontanism was viewed as the religion of the underpriveliged rural "rabble".
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« Reply #185 on: May 21, 2011, 03:34:04 PM »

Ultramontanism is a term taken from the Enlightenment era Austria and Germany, in which there were two fractions, the Ultramontanists and the Josephinists/Febrionists. The Josephinists called from state control of the Church, vernacular liturgy, and delegalisation of monastic orders. The Ultramontanists called the Papal control of the Church, Latin liturgy, and supported the rights of the Church to run schools, hospitals, and monasteries. The Ultramontanists were the minority of the nobility, the majority of the commonfolk. The Josephinists were the majority of nobility and biurocracy, non-existent among the commonfolk. From another angle, Josephinists viewed the Church only as a biurocratic instrument of the State and its goals negating the spiritual and mystical, sacramental life of Christianity. Josephinism is also associated with the values of middle class biurocracy and capitalism. Ultramontanism was viewed as the religion of the underpriveliged rural "rabble".


I am so grateful to you for doing this.  It is particularly useful as you make the distinction that allows us to see two, at least primary, perspectives among the nobility.  This difference one finds among the noble or aristocratic houses follows through all the way into the beginning of the 20th century and the Fall of Eagles.

M.
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« Reply #186 on: May 22, 2011, 11:27:31 PM »

Ultramontanism is a term taken from the Enlightenment era Austria and Germany, in which there were two fractions, the Ultramontanists and the Josephinists/Febrionists. The Josephinists called from state control of the Church, vernacular liturgy, and delegalisation of monastic orders. The Ultramontanists called the Papal control of the Church, Latin liturgy, and supported the rights of the Church to run schools, hospitals, and monasteries. The Ultramontanists were the minority of the nobility, the majority of the commonfolk. The Josephinists were the majority of nobility and biurocracy, non-existent among the commonfolk. From another angle, Josephinists viewed the Church only as a biurocratic instrument of the State and its goals negating the spiritual and mystical, sacramental life of Christianity. Josephinism is also associated with the values of middle class biurocracy and capitalism. Ultramontanism was viewed as the religion of the underpriveliged rural "rabble".

Thank you.

Reading this has sort the other thoughts I have read on this. I do know that throughout Europe the state has generally controlled the Church in various ways. Except in one book written by Fr. Avery Cardinal Dulles I have only read of Ultramontanists in the very negative. With a background in Modern French History, I must admit most of the books I have read have been written by damnable heretics.

I must also admit that I seem to have an inability to shake Montanism from Ultramontanism in a false cognitive association. I remind myself ultramontane is an awkward if not pejorative way of saying 'Beyond the Mountains'. In this way, while I reside in North America, I must be an Ultramare; that is, beyond the seas.

+
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« Reply #187 on: May 23, 2011, 08:30:54 AM »

I must also admit that I seem to have an inability to shake Montanism from Ultramontanism in a false cognitive association. I remind myself ultramontane is an awkward if not pejorative way of saying 'Beyond the Mountains'. In this way, while I reside in North America, I must be an Ultramare; that is, beyond the seas.

+

I wonder if "ultramontane" has caused a lot of confusion, inasmuch as to an ultramontanist the non-ultramontanist are "ultramontane". (Similarly, if I were to "cross the tiber", that would mean leaving the Catholic Church.)
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« Reply #188 on: May 23, 2011, 08:40:54 AM »

I must also admit that I seem to have an inability to shake Montanism from Ultramontanism in a false cognitive association. I remind myself ultramontane is an awkward if not pejorative way of saying 'Beyond the Mountains'. In this way, while I reside in North America, I must be an Ultramare; that is, beyond the seas.

+

I wonder if "ultramontane" has caused a lot of confusion, inasmuch as to an ultramontanist the non-ultramontanist are "ultramontane". (Similarly, if I were to "cross the tiber", that would mean leaving the Catholic Church.)

Anybody have a spare compass?
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« Reply #189 on: July 25, 2013, 08:47:49 PM »

Sorry I couldn't find a better picture, but just to bump the thread... the church I was baptized in...

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« Reply #190 on: July 25, 2013, 10:17:19 PM »

Please, remember that the church was built by Martians who lived in Ukraine for hundreds of years.

I never knew Martians lived in Ukraine, much less built churches there.
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« Reply #191 on: July 26, 2013, 12:24:04 AM »

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« Reply #192 on: July 26, 2013, 02:40:15 AM »

St. Emmeram's, Regensburg.
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« Reply #193 on: July 26, 2013, 02:48:08 AM »

St. Sebastian, Ramsau.
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« Reply #194 on: July 26, 2013, 02:49:41 AM »

Maria Gern, Berchtesgaden.
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« Reply #195 on: July 26, 2013, 03:17:35 AM »

^Some very picturesque scenes Smiley
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« Reply #196 on: July 26, 2013, 04:10:27 AM »

Behold! The future of Catholic churches in America...



(No, that's not a Catholic church. Yet. Wink )

That is horrible.  So cold.
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« Reply #197 on: July 26, 2013, 04:11:21 AM »

Basilique Notre-Dame de Montréal:



Beautiful!
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« Reply #198 on: August 04, 2013, 02:20:42 PM »

St. Dominic's in San Francisco

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« Reply #199 on: August 04, 2013, 02:22:29 PM »

St. Francis Cathedral in Santa Fe, New Mexico



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« Reply #200 on: August 04, 2013, 02:37:05 PM »

What kind of icons those are? Byzantine? Coptic? Romanesque?
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« Reply #201 on: August 04, 2013, 02:45:44 PM »

What kind of icons those are? Byzantine? Coptic? Romanesque?
Interesting you should ask. They are not Icons in the sense you are thinking but, rather, they are Retablos, a traditional New Mexican form of religious art which dates back to the Spanish Colonial period. I have always thought they resembled icons too.



Here is a close up of a traditional retablo from New Mexico


And here:
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« Reply #202 on: August 04, 2013, 02:50:50 PM »

Note: You have to be careful when looking for a good traditional New Mexican Retablo. Unfortunately, the artsy/hippie type know to dwell in Santa Fe has adopted the style, and as a consequence, there are some very ugly/gaudy pieces out there that are masquerading as Retablos.
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« Reply #203 on: August 04, 2013, 02:52:33 PM »

Very icon-ish indeed. I might venerate one if it depicted an Orthodox Saint and didn't contain anything goofy like those "icons" painted by Robert Lenz.
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« Reply #204 on: August 04, 2013, 02:56:19 PM »

I saw some of those elsewhere online recently, and the ones I saw in particular reminded me of Slavic folk icons I've seen.
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« Reply #205 on: August 04, 2013, 02:59:24 PM »

Very icon-ish indeed. I might venerate one if it depicted an Orthodox Saint and didn't contain anything goofy like those "icons" painted by Robert Lenz.
I had a Franciscan priest, friend named Fr. Robert, who made a relief of St. Seraphim of Serov. The relief was somewhere between Icon and Retablo. I have a print of it sitting around somewhere. If I can find it and upload it, I will share it here online.
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« Reply #206 on: August 04, 2013, 03:04:29 PM »

This Church, for the most part has Retablos, instead of Statues.


It feels very New Mexican.
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« Reply #207 on: August 04, 2013, 03:23:40 PM »

The newly renovated Roman Catholic Church in my neighborhood:

The lighting on the crucifix is unbelievable - I can't think of any other way to describe it  Shocked
Actually, that is not a normal crucifix; instead, it is a holographic image of the risen Christ.

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« Reply #208 on: August 11, 2013, 12:27:22 PM »

Beautiful! What Church is that?

This Church, for the most part has Retablos, instead of Statues.


It feels very New Mexican.
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« Reply #209 on: August 11, 2013, 12:31:59 PM »

The black and white photo is beautiful.
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« Reply #210 on: August 11, 2013, 03:20:59 PM »

This Church, for the most part has Retablos, instead of Statues.


It feels very New Mexican.
I think it may be Santa Ana in Questa, NM. Though I'm not 100% sure.
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« Reply #211 on: August 11, 2013, 03:23:53 PM »

If you check this link: http://www.lorettochapel.com/history.html You will find images of Loretto Chapel in Santa Fe, NM. The stair case in the chapel was supposedly built by St. Joseph, and was made without nails.
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« Reply #212 on: August 11, 2013, 03:33:06 PM »

This is the Santuario De Chimayo in Chimayo, New Mexico.



Every year on Good Friday, thousands of New Mexicans make make a pilgrimage to the Santuario, in honor of our Lord's passion. Some even go seeking miraculous healings.
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« Reply #213 on: August 11, 2013, 03:37:14 PM »

Here is the altar from the Santuario:



And here is the "Holy Dirt" that Pilgrims take from the Santuario:

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« Reply #214 on: August 11, 2013, 03:39:47 PM »

Here is the Catholic Cathedral in Denver, CO:



Here is the exterior:

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« Reply #215 on: August 11, 2013, 03:48:37 PM »

Here is the Catholic Cathedral in Denver, CO:



Did the parish ran out of paint? police
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« Reply #216 on: August 11, 2013, 03:50:33 PM »

Here is the Catholic Cathedral in Denver, CO:



Did the parish ran out of paint? police

I have actually been there. There is a beautiful charm to the plain statuary. Smiley
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