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Author Topic: RC Sedevacantism vs. Western Orthodoxy: Heretical Popes and Ecclesiology  (Read 1196 times) Average Rating: 0
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« on: July 23, 2010, 10:21:53 AM »

Sedevacantism's ecclesiology may be mysterious (and so it is), but its critiques of heretical papacy seem to ring true every time.

For those who do not know, the Sedevacantist thesis is, in a nutshell, that the Postwar Popes have all been heretics and that as such, they cannot actually be Popes at all. Thus is the Seat or "Sede" of Peter is said to be "vacant."

Most of the Orthodox here already know that the Patriarchate of Antioch is also a Petrine See, and obviously the older one of the two. So it makes some sense to us, from a "pastoral perspective," given this assertive fetishism in the western contingent, for the Antiochian See to be a propagator of the Western Rite...

(St. Cyprian said something about Petrine Succession and Papal Primacy in Rome once... Hmm. How did it go again... ?)


Whether or not Catholics will ackowledge the damage done by Vatican II, or the blatant heresy and real promotion heresy of JP II, it is clear that Western Rite Orthodoxy is a destination for many who are searching for a Latin Rite experience that feels right again, clean, holy.

It seems to me, that the only thing that would keep a Sedevacantist immersed in ecclesiological chaos against his will is his fetish for Papal Primacy.

So, if we set aside the historical question of Papal Primacy, do Western Rite jurisdictions just make more sense than, say, the CMRI?

And is not true that any bona fide Orthodox Bishop of any rank is the Successor of Peter (cf. St. Cyprian)?
« Last Edit: July 23, 2010, 10:22:50 AM by visitor » Logged
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« Reply #1 on: July 23, 2010, 10:32:03 AM »

Sedevacantism's ecclesiology may be mysterious (and so it is), but its critiques of heretical papacy seem to ring true every time.

For those who do not know, the Sedevacantist thesis is, in a nutshell, that the Postwar Popes have all been heretics and that as such, they cannot actually be Popes at all. Thus is the Seat or "Sede" of Peter is said to be "vacant."

Most of the Orthodox here already know that the Patriarchate of Antioch is also a Petrine See, and obviously the older one of the two. So it makes some sense to us, from a "pastoral perspective," given this assertive fetishism in the western contingent, for the Antiochian See to be a propagator of the Western Rite...

(St. Cyprian said something about Petrine Succession and Papal Primacy in Rome once... Hmm. How did it go again... ?)


Whether or not Catholics will ackowledge the damage done by Vatican II, or the blatant heresy and real promotion heresy of JP II, it is clear that Western Rite Orthodoxy is a destination for many who are searching for a Latin Rite experience that feels right again, clean, holy.

It seems to me, that the only thing that would keep a Sedevacantist immersed in ecclesiological chaos against his will is his fetish for Papal Primacy.

So, if we set aside the historical question of Papal Primacy, do Western Rite jurisdictions just make more sense than, say, the CMRI?

And is not true that any bona fide Orthodox Bishop of any rank is the Successor of Peter (cf. St. Cyprian)?
Ummmm... Are you and ex-Catholic?
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« Reply #2 on: July 23, 2010, 10:58:17 AM »

Most of the Orthodox here already know that the Patriarchate of Antioch is also a Petrine See, and obviously the older one of the two. So it makes some sense to us, from a "pastoral perspective," given this assertive fetishism in the western contingent, for the Antiochian See to be a propagator of the Western Rite...

But there was no "Western rite" (or eastern rite) in St. Peter's time...

Another thing is, the argument for Rome as a special "Petrine see" comes not only from his founding of it, but from his martyrdom there.
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« Reply #3 on: July 23, 2010, 11:09:19 AM »

Sedevacantism's ecclesiology may be mysterious (and so it is), but its critiques of heretical papacy seem to ring true every time.

For those who do not know, the Sedevacantist thesis is, in a nutshell, that the Postwar Popes have all been heretics and that as such, they cannot actually be Popes at all. Thus is the Seat or "Sede" of Peter is said to be "vacant."

Most of the Orthodox here already know that the Patriarchate of Antioch is also a Petrine See, and obviously the older one of the two. So it makes some sense to us, from a "pastoral perspective," given this assertive fetishism in the western contingent, for the Antiochian See to be a propagator of the Western Rite...

(St. Cyprian said something about Petrine Succession and Papal Primacy in Rome once... Hmm. How did it go again... ?)


Whether or not Catholics will ackowledge the damage done by Vatican II, or the blatant heresy and real promotion heresy of JP II, it is clear that Western Rite Orthodoxy is a destination for many who are searching for a Latin Rite experience that feels right again, clean, holy.

It seems to me, that the only thing that would keep a Sedevacantist immersed in ecclesiological chaos against his will is his fetish for Papal Primacy.

So, if we set aside the historical question of Papal Primacy, do Western Rite jurisdictions just make more sense than, say, the CMRI?

And is not true that any bona fide Orthodox Bishop of any rank is the Successor of Peter (cf. St. Cyprian)?
Ummmm... Are you and ex-Catholic?


That's kind of an incoherent question, friend. You ask if I have done the impossible. According to RC dogma, I'm a Catholic right now!!!!
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« Reply #4 on: July 23, 2010, 11:11:14 AM »

Most of the Orthodox here already know that the Patriarchate of Antioch is also a Petrine See, and obviously the older one of the two. So it makes some sense to us, from a "pastoral perspective," given this assertive fetishism in the western contingent, for the Antiochian See to be a propagator of the Western Rite...

But there was no "Western rite" (or eastern rite) in St. Peter's time...

Another thing is, the argument for Rome as a special "Petrine see" comes not only from his founding of it, but from his martyrdom there.

I know that. I'm saying that the AP's Petrine succession is good PR today in terms of Western Rite interest.
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« Reply #5 on: July 23, 2010, 11:26:23 AM »

That's kind of an incoherent question, friend. You ask if I have done the impossible. According to RC dogma, I'm a Catholic right now!!!!

Nobody likes an angry convert.
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« Reply #6 on: July 23, 2010, 11:35:52 AM »

That's kind of an incoherent question, friend. You ask if I have done the impossible. According to RC dogma, I'm a Catholic right now!!!!

Nobody likes an angry convert.

What? I'm not a... The Balamand agreem... Oh, I give up.

You might want to read what the thread is about, catechumen.
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« Reply #7 on: July 23, 2010, 11:49:24 AM »

You might want to read what the thread is about, catechumen.

Catechize me, oh wise one.
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« Reply #8 on: July 23, 2010, 02:50:55 PM »

You might want to read what the thread is about, catechumen.

Catechize me, oh wise one.

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« Reply #9 on: July 27, 2010, 10:25:00 PM »

You might want to read what the thread is about, catechumen.

Catechize me, oh wise one.

Papal heresy isn't part of the Orthodox Catechism. But I expect you know that already.

Thanks for your substantive contribution to a real topic that is melting the RCC down even as we speak! Souls are really hurting because of it and Orthodoxy can restore faith, order, and the eucharist to their existence.

Between Vatican II and its backlash, along with some of the most serious bureaucratic crimes in modern memory, the RCC is practically made of people who know how to fully desire Christ but cannot reach Him.

Where's "New Grancinia" anyway? Did I spell that right? I have always wanted to see a map with all of the diasporic dioceses on it together.
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« Reply #10 on: July 27, 2010, 10:50:51 PM »

Where's "New Grancinia" anyway? Did I spell that right? I have always wanted to see a map with all of the diasporic dioceses on it together.

It's in Chicagoland, and overlooks the Serbians in the regions of the midwestern hill-folk.
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« Reply #11 on: July 28, 2010, 09:31:51 AM »

Where's "New Grancinia" anyway? Did I spell that right? I have always wanted to see a map with all of the diasporic dioceses on it together.

It's in Chicagoland, and overlooks the Serbians in the regions of the midwestern hill-folk.

St. Cyprian said that Rome had erred in taking the office of every Bishop and making it exclusive to one Bishop in one city. <We'll go aheand and skip the middle term here, jumping ahead to the conclusion.> In other words, for all intents and purposes in your spiritual life, your Bishop is your Pope. Neat huh.

Do you ever think about the Catholicism of the Croats? It seems like that would matter to you.
« Last Edit: July 28, 2010, 09:33:39 AM by visitor » Logged
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