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Author Topic: two new publications in Armenian  (Read 1195 times) Average Rating: 0
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Salpy
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« on: July 06, 2010, 08:34:25 PM »

Etchmiadzin is announcing two new publications:

http://www.armenianchurch.org/index.jsp?sid=3&nid=1592&y=2010&m=6&d=1&lng=en



With the blessings of His Holiness Karekin II, Supreme Patriarch and Catholicos of All Armenians, the Publishing Center of the Mother See of Holy Etchmiadzin recently released the work "Commentary on the Gospel of Mathew" by Hovhanes Tsortsoretsi.

The commentary was written by Hovhannes Tsortsoretsi in 1316 as a continuation of the work written by St. Nerses the Graceful, which had stopped at the chapter 5:17. This is thought to be the most extensive and detailed interpretation created during the Middle Ages based on the works of Church Fathers. Ms. Seda Stamboltsian translated the two volume work from classical Armenian.




The Publishing Department also released the works "Collection of Homilies" by St. Yeprem Asori which comprises a selection of homilies from "Appendix of Hymn" by St. Yeprem (N. Akinian, Venice, 1957); "Literary Works of St. Yeprem", volume 4; and "Homilies and Prayer" (Venice, St. Ghazar, 1836). Ms. Marta Arabian translated the works from classical Armenian.

The two works were published through the sponsorship of the Sarkis Gabrellian Endowment Fund.


-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

"St. Yeprem Asori" is St. Ephrem the Syrian.  I think I've heard that there are some works of his that were only preserved, or most anciently preserved, in Classical Armenian.  Perhaps these are some of those works?
« Last Edit: July 06, 2010, 08:35:26 PM by Salpy » Logged

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« Reply #1 on: July 06, 2010, 10:59:10 PM »

This is great Salpy, thanks for the information. I'll be sure to look for them when I'm in Echmiadzin.
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« Reply #2 on: July 06, 2010, 11:09:37 PM »

շնորհակալ եմ
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« Reply #3 on: July 06, 2010, 11:19:14 PM »

շնորհակալ եմ

Are you learning Armenian?
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« Reply #4 on: July 06, 2010, 11:22:08 PM »

շնորհակալ եմ

I'm so impressed!
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« Reply #5 on: July 06, 2010, 11:25:50 PM »

շնորհակալ եմ

Are you learning Armenian?

Unfortunately no Sad  I tried once, but quit for lack of time....I could read the alphabet though at that point.  This is the product of some wikis and google searching  Grin
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« Reply #6 on: July 06, 2010, 11:27:18 PM »

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I'm so impressed!

Well, don't be impressed that I copied/pasted it, but you can be impressed since I picked the Western Armenian dialect over the Eastern Wink
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« Reply #7 on: July 06, 2010, 11:30:46 PM »

շնորհակալ եմ

I'm so impressed!

Well, don't be impressed that I copied/pasted it, but you can be impressed since I picked the Western Armenian dialect over the Eastern Wink

Unfortunately, our beloved Western Armenian will die out within the next generation or two. It's in a similar situation to Assyrian.
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« Reply #8 on: July 07, 2010, 12:00:42 AM »

Don't say that in front of my mom.  She'll tell you that it's the only "real Armenian" and that Eastern Armenian is not even Armenian.  "Ատիկա Հայերէն չէ։"   Cheesy

I think there are strong enough diaspora communities that Western Armenian will survive.  What has pretty much died out are all the little village "sub-dialects" that existed before the Genocide.  My mom's family was from Dikranagert and Kharpert and they settled in a part of the San Joaquin valley where they were with others like them.  The way they spoke Western Armenian was different from the Western Armenian you hear from others who speak it.  It's the Armenian I understand most and I rarely hear it apart from my mom now.  In fact, a few years back I took some dance lessons and I found that I understood the teacher's Armenian absolutely perfectly.  I later found out that his grandmother was from Kharpert.   Smiley  Western Armenian has become pretty standardized now in a way that it was not prior to 1915.  It's kind of sad, actually. 
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« Reply #9 on: July 07, 2010, 02:19:46 AM »

Salpy, is there any chance you could translate the content of these two books into English for us?

If someone wanted to learn some Western Armenian can you recommend any books/programmes?

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« Reply #10 on: July 07, 2010, 02:36:22 AM »

These books would be in Eastern Armenian, which is what they use in the Republic of Armenia.  Also, they would use very scholarly language.  Translating them would be way above my head.

My Armenian is such that I can use it to talk to my mom in the kitchen, or I'll use it with my friends when shopping with them, but if I attended a lecture by some intellectual I would have significant trouble.  And then the dialect difference makes it much harder.

I'm not sure about any good programs for learning Armenian.  Maybe Gisasargavak knows of something.
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« Reply #11 on: July 07, 2010, 03:24:57 AM »

Father Peter:

This looks promising: http://discoverarmenian.com/


Salpy, is there any chance you could translate the content of these two books into English for us?

If someone wanted to learn some Western Armenian can you recommend any books/programmes?

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« Reply #12 on: July 07, 2010, 09:39:08 AM »

շնորհակալ եմ

I'm so impressed!

Well, don't be impressed that I copied/pasted it, but you can be impressed since I picked the Western Armenian dialect over the Eastern Wink

Unfortunately, our beloved Western Armenian will die out within the next generation or two. It's in a similar situation to Assyrian.

Not so sure about that.  When I was in Syria in 1992, it was alive and well in Aleppo.  In Syria, it is against the law to print in any language but Arabic.  The Armenians get a long standing pass, and you can see street signs etc. in Armenian.  The Cilician Catholicate might keep it going.
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« Reply #13 on: July 07, 2010, 12:40:39 PM »

"Beginner's Armenian" by Hagop Andonian is really the only good resource for learning Western Armenian.

http://www.amazon.com/Beginners-Armenian-Hippocrene-Hagop-Andonian/dp/0781807239/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=1278520632&sr=8-1

As for Eastern Armenian, there is a book available called "East Armenian Course" by A.V. Gevorkian, but it is not availble outside of Armenia. There are other resources, but they are either too "scholastic" in the sense of using linguistic structuralism using terms like "fricative vocular unaspirated jussive tense" (!), or they are not deep enough and won't give you a true sense of the language.

That being said, if you learn Western Armenian for a year or two reading newspapers and books and having conversations with native speakers, you will be able to understand most of Eastern Armenian if they do not use Russian slang.
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« Reply #14 on: July 07, 2010, 12:55:19 PM »

What type of Armenian do the Iraqi Armenian community speak?
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« Reply #15 on: July 07, 2010, 01:13:59 PM »

Western Armenian, although the majority of them speak Arabic now. We actually have a few Iraqi-Armenians at our church and they don't know a lick of Armenian.
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« Reply #16 on: July 07, 2010, 01:59:37 PM »

I think that most of the Armenian population in the UK is Iraqi Armenian.

And the Syrian Archbishop is Iraqi as well I think.

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« Reply #17 on: July 07, 2010, 02:10:49 PM »

Western Armenian is spoken by the descendants of those who lived in what is today Eastern Turkey and survived the Genocide.  It's basically spoken in diaspora, which is why some people talk about it eventually dying out.  I think Isa is right, though, that it should survive at least in Syria and Lebanon.  Armenians living in the Middle East (except Iran) speak Western Armenian.

I think what happened was that the two dialects came into existence because of the division of the Armenian homeland between the Ottomans and the Persians.  The Armenians under the Ottomans developed the Western dialect and those under the Persians developed the Eastern dialect.  Around the early 1800's part of the land that was under the Persians came to be taken by the Russians, and that is the Republic of Armenia today.  So Western Armenian was spoken by the Armenians under the Turks, while Eastern Armenian was spoken by those who were with the Persians and Russians.

There are significant differences between the two dialects.  Phonologically, Eastern Armenian preserved the Classical Armenian distinction between aspirated and unaspirated stops and affricates, while Western Armenian dropped the distinction.  What was an unaspirated p in Classical Armenian became a b in Modern Western Armenian.  The b in Classical Armenian became an aspirated p in Western Armenian.  The aspirated p in Classical Armenian remained an aspirated p in Western Armenian.  Eastern Armenian, however, retained all that unchanged.  The same thing happened with t/d, k/g, ch/j, and ts/dz.

You can see this in names from the Bible.  For example, "Peter" in Classical Armenian and Eastern Armenian is "Petros."  In Western Armenian, it is "Bedros."  It results in words from the other dialect just sounding weird to the ear.  

There are also differences in vocabulary.  Even ordinary words can be different.  "Jermag" is "white" in Western Armenian, while in Eastern Armenian it is "speedag."  (Or is it "speetak?")

Probably the most confusing thing, though, is that the grammar is also different.  Verbs are conjugated differently, and nouns are to some extent declined differently.  Western Armenian has six grammatical cases, while Eastern has seven.  (Eastern Armenian has a locative case.  I kind of wish we had that in Western Armenian.  It seems useful.   Smiley  )

Some people can understand both dialects, and even speak both dialects, effortlessly.  Others have a lot of trouble.  I can understand Eastern if the person slows down for me and speaks simply.  My mom doesn't understand Eastern at all, and Armenian was her first language.  She didn't come across Eastern Armenian until the late 1970's when Armenians started coming here from Iran.  It was just too hard for her to adjust to.  
« Last Edit: July 07, 2010, 02:12:04 PM by Salpy » Logged

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« Reply #18 on: July 07, 2010, 02:34:24 PM »

If someone needs a book to learn modern Armenian, I have one in DjVU format and can send to whoever wants it. Just write to me privately.
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« Reply #19 on: July 07, 2010, 02:37:03 PM »

Would it be Eastern or Western?   Smiley
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« Reply #20 on: July 07, 2010, 02:42:21 PM »

Whatever you need.
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« Reply #21 on: July 07, 2010, 02:43:09 PM »

Very cool.  I'm so glad you're back.   Smiley
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« Reply #22 on: July 07, 2010, 02:44:31 PM »

Thank you, Salpy Smiley

You made me do that Smiley
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« Reply #23 on: July 08, 2010, 02:00:26 AM »

"Beginner's Armenian" by Hagop Andonian is really the only good resource for learning Western Armenian.

http://www.amazon.com/Beginners-Armenian-Hippocrene-Hagop-Andonian/dp/0781807239/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=1278520632&sr=8-1


I just realized that I have this book.  It's an excellent book.  It has all the verb conjugations, noun declensions, etc.  It has all those obscure, irregular past tense verbs, which I probably get wrong.  It's great.
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