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Author Topic: should I keep this friend?  (Read 8531 times) Average Rating: 0
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Tikhon.of.Colorado
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« on: July 02, 2010, 02:49:57 AM »

I have a friend at school, who understands me.  I (clearly) am a very religous person, and so is he.  we talk about religion alot, have theological disgussions, etc.  the only problem is, he's a Jehovah's Witness.  he has lately been pushing a bible study, he even gave me a "New World Translation of the Holy Scriptures".  he has also given me magazines and handouts galore, published by the Watchtower. 

I don't know if I should continue associating with him, knowing he might be trying to lead me into his cult.  or, should I stop associating with him?
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« Reply #1 on: July 02, 2010, 02:58:30 AM »

I have a friend at school, who understands me.  I (clearly) am a very religous person, and so is he.  we talk about religion alot, have theological disgussions, etc.  the only problem is, he's a Jehovah's Witness.  he has lately been pushing a bible study, he even gave me a "New World Translation of the Holy Scriptures".  he has also given me magazines and handouts galore, published by the Watchtower. 

I don't know if I should continue associating with him, knowing he might be trying to lead me into his cult.  or, should I stop associating with him?
I don't know.  From what you say, it looks as if he may already be trying to lead you into his cult.  Do you feel strong enough in your newly found Orthodox faith to resist his temptations?
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« Reply #2 on: July 02, 2010, 03:05:09 AM »

I have a friend at school, who understands me.  I (clearly) am a very religous person, and so is he.  we talk about religion alot, have theological disgussions, etc.  the only problem is, he's a Jehovah's Witness.  he has lately been pushing a bible study, he even gave me a "New World Translation of the Holy Scriptures".  he has also given me magazines and handouts galore, published by the Watchtower. 

I don't know if I should continue associating with him, knowing he might be trying to lead me into his cult.  or, should I stop associating with him?
I don't know.  From what you say, it looks as if he may already be trying to lead you into his cult.  Do you feel strong enough in your newly found Orthodox faith to resist his temptations?
you know, I do.  he invited me to his Kingdom Hall (but he won't come to Liturgy) and I went.  they had so many facts based in their nutty "Bible" that proved Orthodoxy wrong, scripturally, along with ALL other denominations.  I took this to my priest, and he explained to me that their "bible" was molded from the original bible, to fit their theology.  and that the stuff they tell to visitors is just the popyckck they feed to try to get you to join their cult.  I'm lucky that I also have an ex-Jehovah's Witness at Church.  I spoke to her about this. 

I think I'll TRY to get him to come to liturgy with me.  of course, the prayers of all who read this would help ALOT! Grin
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« Reply #3 on: July 02, 2010, 03:32:47 AM »

Sure. Be Friends. Be Positive. Spread the Gospel. If there's some differences that come up, you can look into it and explain what they are. You can tell him what the Original New Testament says. Ultimately it is his choice if he wants to learn.


I will tell you a funny story. Some Jehovah's Witness missionaries came to the OCF priest in Pittsburgh. They asked if they can share their Bible with him. He could speak Greek (the original language) and said "Sure, You can show me yours if I can show you mine. They said no and that was it." You don't have to know Greek to find out what a Greek word means though.





And always remember: "Say No to Drugs and Stay in School."
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« Reply #4 on: July 02, 2010, 03:36:09 AM »

Sure. Be Friends. Be Positive. Spread the Gospel. If there's some differences that come up, you can look into it and explain what they are. You can tell him what the Original New Testament says. Ultimately it is his choice if he wants to learn.


I will tell you a funny story. Some Jehovah's Witness missionaries came to the OCF priest in Pittsburgh. They asked if they can share their Bible with him. He could speak Greek (the original language) and said "sure, You can show me yours if I can show you mine. They said no and that was it." You don't have to know Greek to find out what a Greek word means though.





And always remember: "Say No to Drugs and Stay in School."


that is a funny story!  I heard someone say, when Jehovah's Witnesses come to your door, you should say "my bible told me to expect you"  and when they say where, you point to the part where scripture says to expect false prophets!  sadly, I don't recall who on OC.net said this. 
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« Reply #5 on: July 02, 2010, 03:44:37 AM »

When you are surrounded by people who think a certain way there is a strong environment you may not realize.

Key to keep from getting brainwashed is that you need to spend a special effort thinking of rebuttals in your mind as they tell you things. if they make a good point you can't rebut, try hard to remember it so you can find out the answer later.



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« Reply #6 on: July 02, 2010, 03:52:26 AM »


 sadly, I don't recall who on OC.net said this. 

http://www.orthodoxchristianity.net/forum/index.php/topic,26892.msg422933.html#msg422933
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« Reply #7 on: July 02, 2010, 09:38:30 AM »

My $0.02, if he's not willing to visit your church after you visited his, then he's not being much of a friend. after all DL is as important to you as kingdom Hall is to him. I wonder if he's using friendship as a way to convert you.

I don't have much trouble with JW's, the mezzuzah keeps them away!
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« Reply #8 on: July 02, 2010, 11:58:15 AM »

Trevor, stay away from the Kingdom Hall.  Return his New World Translation of the Holy Scriptures, and, very kindly, say to your friend, "Thank you, but I know I have the Truth".  Jehovah's Witnesses, for the most part, are good, sincere people, but their cult is spiritually dangerous.  Be kind to him.

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« Reply #9 on: July 02, 2010, 12:57:13 PM »

Never be the first to break with a friend.  But don't be surprised if this one breaks with you.  It is obvious that his church's teachings are important to him.  That he won't reciprocate by attending Liturgy with you tells you how important.  Returning the literature may be taken as a personal rejection, so exercise caution if you want to remain friends.  It may be better to read it, tell him you've read it, but to remain Orthodox.  That the literature fails to persuade you may cause him to reconsider his own position.

I don't have much trouble with JW's, the mezzuzah keeps them away!

I find that a goblin head on a pike is also effective.
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« Reply #10 on: July 02, 2010, 02:56:50 PM »

Continue to be his friend. Love him unconditionally. But let him know that you will never compromise Orthodox truth. If he insists on his prosyletizing, let him know that although you will always remain his friend you will never allow him to divert you from Orthodoxy. Suggest to him that you all may need to avoid religious conversations in order to keep your friendship amicable. But also tell him that you will gladly discuss and debate things with him as long as he is able to do so without allowing it to effect his friendship with you.  Remember that sometimes the best defense is a good offense. So maybe you can start prosyletizing him. Wink But remain his friend always.


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« Reply #11 on: July 02, 2010, 02:56:50 PM »

I will pray for you and your friend.
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« Reply #12 on: July 02, 2010, 04:29:21 PM »

Quote from: tuesdayschild
Never be the first to break with a friend.
Quote from: Gebre
But remain his friend always.
I agree with these two.  I'd let him know that your faith is too important to let him affect it, but that his friendship is important enough for you to be candid and honest with him in these matters.
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« Reply #13 on: July 02, 2010, 06:33:22 PM »

So long as there is truly not danger of you endorsing his religion as if it is the truth, and as long as it is clear to him that you will not do so, and if he does not continue to push his religion on you to a degree that bothers you, I don't see why you couldn't remain friends.
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« Reply #14 on: July 02, 2010, 07:49:22 PM »

I agree with others who said that there is no reason to be the one who breaks the friendship. However, - never, NEVER, but NEVER go with him to Kingdom Hall. There is an Apostolic Canon LXIV, which very explicitly forbids not only praying together with heretics, but even entering the house where they are praying. Jehovah's Witnesses are Arians, so they most definitely are heretics. And maybe limit talks with your JW friend about the Bible. I am not sure they will be productive. I may be wrong though.
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« Reply #15 on: July 02, 2010, 10:10:03 PM »

Funny, I read some Watchtower Society literature today. The most thing that stood out to me the most was that in a few instances they actually rewrote history to "prove" that Justin Martyr and St. Clement (and Tatian? I think.) were apostate philosophers whose work laid the groundwork for the great apostasy. It. Was. Laughable.

But what isn't going to be laughable from a group that literally rewrote the Bible in an attempt to bolster their goofy doctrinal deviations. (Jesus was impaled, not crucified? Seriously? Seriously?)

Trevor, avoid the Kingdom Hall; keep sharing the gospel with your friend; and use the New World Translation to prop up the wobbly leg on your kitchen table.
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« Reply #16 on: July 05, 2010, 11:26:45 AM »

I agree with others who said that there is no reason to be the one who breaks the friendship. However, - never, NEVER, but NEVER go with him to Kingdom Hall. There is an Apostolic Canon LXIV, which very explicitly forbids not only praying together with heretics, but even entering the house where they are praying. Jehovah's Witnesses are Arians, so they most definitely are heretics. And maybe limit talks with your JW friend about the Bible. I am not sure they will be productive. I may be wrong though.

gosh, I had no idea they were Arians!  I knew some of their teachings were Arian.  I had no idea that there's a canon against going to their "Kingdom Hall" either.  thanks so much for the soul saving info!  Grin

AAAAA!  his family and I went out for pizza afterward, and we (I felt I had to join them, out of respect) prayed to "Jehovah God".  is this something I should bring up in confession?
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« Reply #17 on: July 05, 2010, 11:32:56 AM »

Funny, I read some Watchtower Society literature today. The most thing that stood out to me the most was that in a few instances they actually rewrote history to "prove" that Justin Martyr and St. Clement (and Tatian? I think.) were apostate philosophers whose work laid the groundwork for the great apostasy. It. Was. Laughable.

But what isn't going to be laughable from a group that literally rewrote the Bible in an attempt to bolster their goofy doctrinal deviations. (Jesus was impaled, not crucified? Seriously? Seriously?)

Trevor, avoid the Kingdom Hall; keep sharing the gospel with your friend; and use the New World Translation to prop up the wobbly leg on your kitchen table.
to tell you the truth, I got rather "into" reading the JW website and the NWT bible for a while.  this, I felt, was damaging my soul.  so (God forgive me if this was the wrong thing to do) I took the watchtower magazines and their "bible" down to the recycle bin outside of the Catholic Church that's in biking distance from my home.  I figured it was the right thing to do, an I didn't have the heart to throw away a Bible, no matter how corrupt.  it was usually locked, but someone left the recycle bin wide open (my guardian angel, perhapse?)
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« Reply #18 on: July 05, 2010, 11:41:21 AM »

Hello, all.  I would like to thank all who have answered my post and apologize for my belated responce.  I didn't think this post was still active, so I stopped checking it.  Now that I know there's people on here who respond, I'll try to do the same. 

one thing I wanted to tell y'all about, I picked up a pamphlet at Church called: "Cultist at my door: An Orthodox Examination of the Mormons and the Jehovah's Witnesses" by Fr. John W. Morris.  published by conciliar press.

here it is online:  http://www.trueorthodoxy.org/heretics_others_cultist_at_my_door.shtml 

I think that people with problems with cultists who read this post will find it very useful and informative.
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« Reply #19 on: July 05, 2010, 12:12:11 PM »

I agree with others who said that there is no reason to be the one who breaks the friendship. However, - never, NEVER, but NEVER go with him to Kingdom Hall. There is an Apostolic Canon LXIV, which very explicitly forbids not only praying together with heretics, but even entering the house where they are praying. Jehovah's Witnesses are Arians, so they most definitely are heretics. And maybe limit talks with your JW friend about the Bible. I am not sure they will be productive. I may be wrong though.

gosh, I had no idea they were Arians!  I knew some of their teachings were Arian.  I had no idea that there's a canon against going to their "Kingdom Hall" either.  thanks so much for the soul saving info!  Grin

AAAAA!  his family and I went out for pizza afterward, and we (I felt I had to join them, out of respect) prayed to "Jehovah God".  is this something I should bring up in confession?

I looked up the canon:  "Edit: I just looked up the canon: "Canon LXIV.

If any clergyman or layman shall enter into a synagogue of Jews or heretics to pray, let the former be deposed and let the latter be excommunicated."

Now, will something happen to my membership in the Church?
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« Reply #20 on: July 05, 2010, 02:36:47 PM »

AAAAA!  his family and I went out for pizza afterward, and we (I felt I had to join them, out of respect) prayed to "Jehovah God".  is this something I should bring up in confession?

Probably.

I looked up the canon:  "Edit: I just looked up the canon: "Canon LXIV.

If any clergyman or layman shall enter into a synagogue of Jews or heretics to pray, let the former be deposed and let the latter be excommunicated."

Now, will something happen to my membership in the Church?

Probably not. 

This should all be cleared up during confession.
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« Reply #21 on: July 05, 2010, 02:45:33 PM »

I agree with others who said that there is no reason to be the one who breaks the friendship. However, - never, NEVER, but NEVER go with him to Kingdom Hall. There is an Apostolic Canon LXIV, which very explicitly forbids not only praying together with heretics, but even entering the house where they are praying. Jehovah's Witnesses are Arians, so they most definitely are heretics. And maybe limit talks with your JW friend about the Bible. I am not sure they will be productive. I may be wrong though.

gosh, I had no idea they were Arians!  I knew some of their teachings were Arian.  I had no idea that there's a canon against going to their "Kingdom Hall" either.  thanks so much for the soul saving info!  Grin

AAAAA!  his family and I went out for pizza afterward, and we (I felt I had to join them, out of respect) prayed to "Jehovah God".  is this something I should bring up in confession?

I looked up the canon:  "Edit: I just looked up the canon: "Canon LXIV.

If any clergyman or layman shall enter into a synagogue of Jews or heretics to pray, let the former be deposed and let the latter be excommunicated."

Now, will something happen to my membership in the Church?

That's something for your priest to decide after he hears your confession.
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« Reply #22 on: July 05, 2010, 03:25:48 PM »

I'm a bit nervous Sad 

I'm just a new convert, and I wasn't informed of the cannon.  I hope it will all be alright.
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« Reply #23 on: July 05, 2010, 03:59:34 PM »

now I have a question about this cannon.  what if my little sister was to get married in a non-denominational Christian Church.  could I attend her wedding?  could I attend a non-Orthodox funeral?
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« Reply #24 on: July 05, 2010, 04:06:30 PM »

I'm a bit nervous Sad 

I'm just a new convert, and I wasn't informed of the cannon.  I hope it will all be alright.

no worries, everyone!  I just remembered, I attended a kingdom hall before my chrismation! I wasn't even Orthodox!  I'm sure my membership is safe (but now I know!)
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« Reply #25 on: July 05, 2010, 04:49:20 PM »

now I have a question about this cannon.  what if my little sister was to get married in a non-denominational Christian Church.  could I attend her wedding?  could I attend a non-Orthodox funeral?

It is alright to attend things like that where it would do more harm than good not to attend.  I've attended two Catholic Masses in the past 1 1/2 year.  One was my friend's father's funeral and the other was my nephew's first communion.  I didn't partake in the responses, nor did I kneel; just sat and stood when everyone else did.  To tell my 8 year old nephew, whom I'm very close to, "I'm not going to your first communion because I'm not Catholic anymore" would be sinful.  

I know what you mean though.  I was only Chrismated in October and still have questions that come up here and there on the "do's and don'ts" so to speak.   Smiley
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« Reply #26 on: July 05, 2010, 05:25:15 PM »

now I have a question about this cannon.  what if my little sister was to get married in a non-denominational Christian Church.  could I attend her wedding?  could I attend a non-Orthodox funeral?

It is alright to attend things like that where it would do more harm than good not to attend.  I've attended two Catholic Masses in the past 1 1/2 year.  One was my friend's father's funeral and the other was my nephew's first communion.  I didn't partake in the responses, nor did I kneel; just sat and stood when everyone else did.  To tell my 8 year old nephew, whom I'm very close to, "I'm not going to your first communion because I'm not Catholic anymore" would be sinful.  

I know what you mean though.  I was only Chrismated in October and still have questions that come up here and there on the "do's and don'ts" so to speak.   Smiley

thanks, I appreciate this. Wink
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« Reply #27 on: July 05, 2010, 05:26:19 PM »

now I have a question about this cannon.  what if my little sister was to get married in a non-denominational Christian Church.  could I attend her wedding?  could I attend a non-Orthodox funeral?
This question comes up for discussion quite often on OC.net.  Rather than rehash the question again here, I will encourage you to follow a couple of these earlier discussions on the subject.

Attending Non-Orthodox Services

Is It OK For Orthodox to Attend Protestant Churches?
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« Reply #28 on: July 05, 2010, 06:12:31 PM »

I agree with others who said that there is no reason to be the one who breaks the friendship. However, - never, NEVER, but NEVER go with him to Kingdom Hall. There is an Apostolic Canon LXIV, which very explicitly forbids not only praying together with heretics, but even entering the house where they are praying. Jehovah's Witnesses are Arians, so they most definitely are heretics. And maybe limit talks with your JW friend about the Bible. I am not sure they will be productive. I may be wrong though.

gosh, I had no idea they were Arians!  I knew some of their teachings were Arian.  I had no idea that there's a canon against going to their "Kingdom Hall" either.  thanks so much for the soul saving info!  Grin

AAAAA!  his family and I went out for pizza afterward, and we (I felt I had to join them, out of respect) prayed to "Jehovah God".  is this something I should bring up in confession?

I wouldn't worry about an ultra-strict reading of the "Canons of the Apostles" cited here against praying with nonOrthodox. Orthodox leaders and clergy occasionally pray with other traditional Christians. The particular canon has been criticized regarding authenticity, and also some other parts of it, like its baptism rules, contradict other Orthodox teachings. Peter the Aleut linked to some good discussions.

HOWEVER, I recommend avoiding praying things that go against basic Christian teachings, keeping in mind the Arian problems of JW.

Regarding the JW mis-Translation of the Bible, it is worth pointing out that Rev. Bernstein became non-Arian Christian from reading it. However, if you have a choice between a "good faith" effort at accurate translation and a translation with a very strong JW bent to it, I recommend using the traditional one.

I like the King James Version after learning about some of the technicalities in the wording. The KJV actually introduced new Latin words into the English language, so in some ways, its concepts are more accurate and closer in meaning than "modern language" editions.

Russian-language Orthodox Synodal version and the Jewish Publication Society(Old Testament) translations have some small inaccuracies that could become big ones if their interpretation turns out wrong, but otherwise seem ok. That is, the Synodal version seems to predict the resurrection more clearly than the traditional versions, while the JPS sometimes tries to direct the reader away from them (eg. saying the Servant  is afflicted "by disease").
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« Reply #29 on: July 05, 2010, 09:11:45 PM »

AAAAA!  his family and I went out for pizza afterward, and we (I felt I had to join them, out of respect) prayed to "Jehovah God".  is this something I should bring up in confession?

It is "missing the mark", but it seems like you did not do it with the clear knowledge that you were not supposed to, so it's not really an intentional moral evil.
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« Reply #30 on: July 05, 2010, 09:24:29 PM »

Jehovah = Yahweh (transliterated). Prayer to the God Yahweh is correct. Perhaps thou wast praying correctly if thou prayed with right idea of God.
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« Reply #31 on: July 05, 2010, 09:27:59 PM »

Jehovah = Yahweh (transliterated). Prayer to the God Yahweh is correct. Perhaps thou werest praying correctly.

That's a little but too much hair splitting for my taste.

We know that the JW's meant by it.

They were praying to a non-Trinitarian God.

To join in prayer with those who are praying to a non-Trinitarian God is either apostasy (if praying to their non-Trinitarian God) or inconsistency (if praying to the real God).
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« Reply #32 on: July 05, 2010, 09:36:53 PM »

That's a little but too much hair splitting for my taste.

We know that the JW's meant by it.

They were praying to a non-Trinitarian God.

To join in prayer with those who are praying to a non-Trinitarian God is either apostasy (if praying to their non-Trinitarian God) or inconsistency (if praying to the real God).

C'mon, deusveritasest, cut trevor72694 some slack. The lad's not quite sixteen (IIRC), and was received into the Orthodox Church only months ago.  police Angry
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« Reply #33 on: July 05, 2010, 09:43:03 PM »

In his case, I believe he was being inconsistent. I doubt that he was trying to pray to the same version of deity as the JWs.

The apostles went to synagogues and prayed after the Ascension. The official idea of God from the synagogues was The father minus the Son and the Spirit. Yet they found praying there acceptable. They were being inconsistent with the synagogue's view of God.

Nonetheless, I would avoid regular attendance at JW halls, and feel hesitant about engage in their prayer services, whatever the hairsplitting justifications, because of the danger of getting sidetracked into the heresies of this unusual, tight-knit group.

Maybe it is my bias, but synagogues and Catholic churches do not seem to present a big danger of getting into such a small, tight-knit group with such a strong psychology. Assuming that non-Chalcedonian churches have an incorrect understanding of the basic nature of Christ, something seems much more acceptable about praying in Oriental churches than JW ones.

That being the case, one could participate in a Judaic, Catholic, JW, Protestant, or nonChalcedonian prayer, while maintaining Orthodox understanding of God.

For example, when they say the Nicene Creed, pay attention to avoid the filioque.
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« Reply #34 on: July 05, 2010, 10:17:58 PM »

That's a little but too much hair splitting for my taste.

We know that the JW's meant by it.

They were praying to a non-Trinitarian God.

To join in prayer with those who are praying to a non-Trinitarian God is either apostasy (if praying to their non-Trinitarian God) or inconsistency (if praying to the real God).

C'mon, deusveritasest, cut trevor72694 some slack. The lad's not quite sixteen (IIRC), and was received into the Orthodox Church only months ago.  police Angry

Isn't that essentially what I was doing in this post?:

AAAAA!  his family and I went out for pizza afterward, and we (I felt I had to join them, out of respect) prayed to "Jehovah God".  is this something I should bring up in confession?

It is "missing the mark", but it seems like you did not do it with the clear knowledge that you were not supposed to, so it's not really an intentional moral evil.
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« Reply #35 on: July 06, 2010, 12:13:24 PM »

When JWs come to the door, with their literature, I say, "That's so sweet of you to give me this. Let me give you something in return." I then offer them an icon card or a pamphlet on Orthodoxy.
This causes them to try to run away so fast that they almost fall down the steps backwards.
Perhaps you should reciprocate your friend's gifts with a couple of Orthodox books?
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« Reply #36 on: July 06, 2010, 05:35:22 PM »

When JWs come to the door, with their literature, I say, "That's so sweet of you to give me this. Let me give you something in return." I then offer them an icon card or a pamphlet on Orthodoxy.
This causes them to try to run away so fast that they almost fall down the steps backwards.
Perhaps you should reciprocate your friend's gifts with a couple of Orthodox books?
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Yes. I like this approach too. Don't allow them to put us on the defensive. Be proactive with spreading Orthodoxy. Fight demonic fire with holy fire!



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« Reply #37 on: July 13, 2010, 10:32:12 AM »

When JWs come to the door, with their literature, I say, "That's so sweet of you to give me this. Let me give you something in return." I then offer them an icon card or a pamphlet on Orthodoxy.
This causes them to try to run away so fast that they almost fall down the steps backwards.
Perhaps you should reciprocate your friend's gifts with a couple of Orthodox books?
 angel

actually, I had that idea!  I gave him a "want to know more" that all of the Churches in the Diocese of the West have published, with directions to their particular perish. 

I don't want people to think, though, that I'll participate in any non-Orthodox worship service.  I would never "cheat" on Christ.  at the event's center in my town, there is a HUGE meeting of JW's from all over Colorado.  he invited me, even offered to get me baptized.  I said firmly "NO, I have my faith.  you come with me and I'll baptize you into Christ's Church, then we'll see what you have to say about that."
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« Reply #38 on: July 13, 2010, 10:35:53 AM »

interestingly enough, the OCA has this article published in their latest issue of their magazine:

"The mission field
at your front door
Instead of slamming the door on
Jehovah’s Witnesses, share your
faith with them!

Knowing that the Apostles traveled thousands of miles
to spread the Gospel, we could easily become overwhelmed
by Christ’s command to “make disciples of all nations”
[Matthew 28:19]. This is precisely how I felt when two KJehovah’s Witnesses appeared at my door a few summers
ago. After letting the door bell ring a few times, I decided to
step outside my comfort zone, sensing that God had sent them
not to convert me, but so that I could proclaim the fullness of
the Gospel to them. While it seemed like a daunting task, I
believe that a seed was planted in their hearts which only God
can nurture over time.
In my experience, Jehovah’s Witnesses are genuinely kind
people who have adopted false beliefs about Jesus Christ.
While they visit with conversion in mind, they are interested in
engaging in conversation about faith. Used to having people
ignore or close their doors on them, they are appreciative – if
somewhat caught off guard – by those who engage them in a
respectful manner.
Fundamentally, the Jehovah’s Witnesses follow the same
heresy that led to the convocation of the First Ecumenical
Council – Arianism. While they believe that Jesus Christ is the
Messiah, they hold that He is inferior to God, thereby rejecting
the doctrine of the Holy Trinity.
It is my hope that the following passages will help encourage
others to open their doors and become “evangelizing disciples” –
without leaving home or traveling thousands of miles!

taken from:  http://www.oca.org/PDF/DOC-PUB/TOC/2010/toc-spring-summer.pdf
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« Reply #39 on: July 13, 2010, 02:33:25 PM »

Trevor,

I heard that one of the hardest things for Mormons and JWs to leave their groups is because they are so connected to it. When the kids sometimes run away from home (apparently there are some Mormon groups with compounds that have an aversion to sons because they want more women to marry with), they don't know anyone in the outside world!!

What I mean is that you probably should keep this friend.

Hal
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« Reply #40 on: July 13, 2010, 06:13:28 PM »

The neighbor's we had for years were Jehovaha's witnesses, the Lord  couldn't  of Blessed us with any greater neighbors than them, salt of the earth... Grin

I went to the kingdom Hall Many times with them ,they would come over on our Jan 7 Christmas celebration and Pacha,,they would indulge in a few beers and hard liquor....Wonderful  ,fine People .... Grin
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« Reply #41 on: July 13, 2010, 06:21:23 PM »

they would come over on our Jan 7 Christmas celebration and Pacha,,they would indulge in a few beers and hard liquor....Wonderful  ,fine People .... Grin

Um, I don't think their rules allow them to do some of this.
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« Reply #42 on: July 13, 2010, 06:26:24 PM »

they would come over on our Jan 7 Christmas celebration and Pacha,,they would indulge in a few beers and hard liquor....Wonderful  ,fine People .... Grin

Um, I don't think their rules allow them to do some of this.

The Parent's were in there age and they mellowed, and weren't as hard on themself's ,so they came over and did indulge and celibrate with us... Grin
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« Reply #43 on: July 14, 2010, 01:06:49 AM »

I'm a bit nervous Sad 

I'm just a new convert, and I wasn't informed of the cannon.  I hope it will all be alright.

no worries, everyone!  I just remembered, I attended a kingdom hall before my chrismation! I wasn't even Orthodox!  I'm sure my membership is safe (but now I know!)

I think you're being overly legalistic. You should definitely never go to a JW meeting again, but particularly since you didn't even know it was wrong I don't see the big deal. Just confess it and receive God's forgiveness which covers all our offenses, voluntary and involuntary, known and unknown. The canons are there for our benefit; it's not a "gotcha, you violated canon 5 title 6 subsection a-1 type thing.

I agree with those who said you should be kind to him and be his friend, but be resolute and firm in your Orthodox faith.

Personally, I would probably return the bible and explain politely why you will not read it.

The Fathers also recommend against discussing the Scriptures with heretics.
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« Reply #44 on: July 14, 2010, 01:08:36 AM »

The Fathers also recommend against discussing the Scriptures with heretics.

ALL the fathers? How else to spread Orthodoxy without discussing scriptural basis for it?
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