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Author Topic: Orthodox Christianity's Impact on Modern Russian Culture  (Read 2102 times) Average Rating: 0
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Irish Hermit
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« on: May 12, 2010, 01:50:19 AM »

[
I would never Guilt God, take that stupidity out of your head. I say that somethig is quite wrong in orthodox eclesiology that it simply was unable to work like Romans did under hard circunstances, underground. And they expected to be priced by sultans and be respected and taken into consideration as when they where by the emperor. That is cesaropapism.


Yet Christianity survived in Greece, Serbia, Bulgaria, etc under the Turkish rule.  Eventually they managed to throw off the Turkish Yoke.

Christianity also survived in the Soviet Union despite the most horrific persecution.

Under persecution in Northern Africa the great Church of Africa under the Pope simply disappeared and never re-emerged.

Caeseropapism..... what were the Papal States?   How many young Italians did Pope Pius IX kill in his wars with Italy?  What is Vatican City State?  A strange combination of a secular monarch and an ecclesiarch in one person. 
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Irish Hermit
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« Reply #1 on: May 12, 2010, 02:01:19 AM »


I say that somethig is quite wrong in orthodox eclesiology that it simply was unable to work like Romans did under hard circunstances, underground.
.

You are playing with very dangerous logic.

Modern Orthodoxy has emerged from the scourge of Communism in many countries and it is strong and resurgent.  Russia has opened 33,000 churches since 1991 (but Catholic Europe is selling theirs to the Muslims!!) Orthodoxy makes a moral impact on society.  In both Bulgaria and Russia, for example, tougher abortion laws have been brought in, partly as a result of Church lobbying.

But look at Catholicism.... In modern Catholicism, secular humanism is winning the day throughout Western Europe.

If we had to judge the preference of God with regard to each Church by your standard, we would have to say that these days God is in favour of the Orthodox Church more than the Catholic.

Well, that's the result of your logic..........................
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Irish Hermit
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« Reply #2 on: May 12, 2010, 02:11:29 AM »

Christ is Risen!

Don't worry, Alonso.  God may be sending the Orthodox to Europe to shore up your dying Christianity.  You can look forward to what this article calls "the Orthodox century" in Western Europe.

Why be afraid of it?  Remember when at the beginning of his pontificate Pope John Paul  II hoped that he could yoke the vitality and piety of Orthodoxy and rejuvenate the jaded Christianity of Western Europe.  But he soon came to abandon that project when he realised that the Orthodox no more want to be yoked to the Vatican than they did to the Ottomans.

Have a read - it reveals your future...

"The EU: The Orthodox Are Coming"

http://www.orthodoxchristianity.net/forum/index.php/topic,5709.msg72805.html#msg72805
« Last Edit: May 12, 2010, 02:12:46 AM by Irish Hermit » Logged
stanley123
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« Reply #3 on: May 12, 2010, 03:29:12 AM »

In both Bulgaria and Russia, for example, tougher abortion laws have been brought in, partly as a result of Church lobbying.
With reference to abortion rates, I think that Russia has one of the highest abortion rates in the world, something like 100 abortions per 1000 women of childbearing age. Compare that to Catholic Italy, for example, where the rate is something like 10 abortions per 1000 women. That is a big difference.
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Alveus Lacuna
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« Reply #4 on: May 12, 2010, 03:30:12 AM »

With reference to abortion rates, I think that Russia has one of the highest abortion rates in the world, something like 100 abortions per 1000 women of childbearing age. Compare that to Catholic Italy, for example, where the rate is something like 10 abortions per 1000 women. That is a big difference.

Can't we just blame it on communism and move on?
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stanley123
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« Reply #5 on: May 12, 2010, 03:40:41 AM »

With reference to abortion rates, I think that Russia has one of the highest abortion rates in the world, something like 100 abortions per 1000 women of childbearing age. Compare that to Catholic Italy, for example, where the rate is something like 10 abortions per 1000 women. That is a big difference.

Can't we just blame it on communism and move on?
Perhaps you are right. 
Let's pray that the rates will decrease in both Orthodox and Catholic countries.
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« Reply #6 on: May 12, 2010, 03:48:16 AM »

In both Bulgaria and Russia, for example, tougher abortion laws have been brought in, partly as a result of Church lobbying.

I don't know about Russia, but I haven't heard about any lobbying of the Bulgarian Patriarchate on this matter.

Bulgaria has one of the highest abortion rates in Europe. In Eastern Europe, only Russia and Ukraine have higher abortion rates than Bulgaria. Unfortunately, Bulgaria has the highest abortion rate among schoolgirls in the EU.

Annually, there about 75 000 births and 37 000 abortions in Bulgaria, about 1/3 of all pregnancies end in abortion.
« Last Edit: May 12, 2010, 03:50:14 AM by ag_vn » Logged
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« Reply #7 on: May 12, 2010, 09:48:54 AM »


I say that somethig is quite wrong in orthodox eclesiology that it simply was unable to work like Romans did under hard circunstances, underground.
.

You are playing with very dangerous logic.

Modern Orthodoxy has emerged from the scourge of Communism in many countries and it is strong and resurgent.  Russia has opened 33,000 churches since 1991 (but Catholic Europe is selling theirs to the Muslims!!) Orthodoxy makes a moral impact on society.  In both Bulgaria and Russia, for example, tougher abortion laws have been brought in, partly as a result of Church lobbying.

But look at Catholicism.... In modern Catholicism, secular humanism is winning the day throughout Western Europe.

If we had to judge the preference of God with regard to each Church by your standard, we would have to say that these days God is in favour of the Orthodox Church more than the Catholic.

Well, that's the result of your logic..........................
And seccular humanism has already won in EO Russia.
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« Reply #8 on: May 12, 2010, 10:35:51 AM »

And seccular humanism has already won in EO Russia.

Maybe He favours the secular humanists?  laugh  We're a pretty decent group after all.  Tongue
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« Reply #9 on: May 12, 2010, 10:37:21 AM »

[
And seccular humanism has already won in EO Russia.


Has it?   The extraordinary event in Moscow on Easter day, when soccer fans in the stadium began to chant "Christ is Risen!"  Truly He is Risen!"  back and forth across the stadium

A brother priest made this commentary and I thought it worthwhile to mention it.

"The important point here, though, is the steady and gradual process of Orthodox symbols vis-a-vis language continuing to infiltrate the mass Russian consciousness. We know that only a small percentage of Russians go to church regularly, even on Pascha, regardless of location, emigration or generation. However, the phenomenon of Orthodox acculturation, as seen by the soccer (real football) video, the observance of maslenitsa, the change of menus in many restaurants to offer more Lenten meals during the Great Fast, and the revival of festivals around the feast day of saints (such as St. Tatiana), are all signs that the life of the Church continues to grow in its role in the greater Russian consciousness. This offers much potential and hope in the future vis-a-vis the churching of Russian culture and society."

Two videos from the exchange...

Absolutely wonderful!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WotZUI2hurM

The second video here is longer with more exchanges:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wZmJjPC1dUc

"In Moscow, at a match at Lokomotiv Stadium on Sunday night, football fans gave each other the Easter greeting. Our Interfax correspondent reported that at the beginning of the second half, thousands of FK Dynamo fans started a chorus, chanting, “Christ is Risen!” Thousands of FK Lokomotiv supporters seated on the other side of the stadium responded to them. They also began to chant in unison, “He is risen, indeed!” The crowd repeated this dialogue several times. Our Interfax correspondent, with nearly 50 years of experience as a fan, says that this is the first such case in the history of football in the motherland. During the match, Lokomotiv fans hung a huge banner on their side of the pitch, “Christ is Risen!” ?
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elijahmaria
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« Reply #10 on: May 13, 2010, 12:18:15 AM »

Christ is Risen!

Don't worry, Alonso.  God may be sending the Orthodox to Europe to shore up your dying Christianity.  You can look forward to what this article calls "the Orthodox century" in Western Europe.

Why be afraid of it?  Remember when at the beginning of his pontificate Pope John Paul  II hoped that he could yoke the vitality and piety of Orthodoxy and rejuvenate the jaded Christianity of Western Europe.  But he soon came to abandon that project when he realised that the Orthodox no more want to be yoked to the Vatican than they did to the Ottomans.

Have a read - it reveals your future...

"The EU: The Orthodox Are Coming"

http://www.orthodoxchristianity.net/forum/index.php/topic,5709.msg72805.html#msg72805

Father,

I for one hope to send ALL of the contracepting, multiple-marriage, shack-up Catholics to Orthodoxy, along with those who would rather talk about all those clever non-fasting food substitutes...eh? than to actually fast to the point of discomfort!!...ALL of the ones who think purgation is for the birds....Text removed...ALL of the habitual sinners who want to be healed painlessly...

I look forward to the day when Orthodox parishes have 8000 families rather than 800 members.

I will shout from the Mountain Top!!  When Orthodoxy has ALL of the burdens of the Catholic Church on her shoulders and the people are in charge and the hierarchy are there in ceremonial capacity only!!

Then perhaps the faithful Catholic remnant can get on about the business of salvation, while y'all are busy running an Orthodox Religious Organization.

Mary



Post modified to make it compliant with Moratorium on Discussing Homosexual Conduct  -PtA
« Last Edit: May 15, 2010, 05:56:41 PM by PeterTheAleut » Logged

ialmisry
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« Reply #11 on: May 13, 2010, 12:31:01 AM »

Christ is Risen!

Don't worry, Alonso.  God may be sending the Orthodox to Europe to shore up your dying Christianity.  You can look forward to what this article calls "the Orthodox century" in Western Europe.

Why be afraid of it?  Remember when at the beginning of his pontificate Pope John Paul  II hoped that he could yoke the vitality and piety of Orthodoxy and rejuvenate the jaded Christianity of Western Europe.  But he soon came to abandon that project when he realised that the Orthodox no more want to be yoked to the Vatican than they did to the Ottomans.

Have a read - it reveals your future...

"The EU: The Orthodox Are Coming"

http://www.orthodoxchristianity.net/forum/index.php/topic,5709.msg72805.html#msg72805

Father,

I for one hope to send ALL of the contracepting, multiple-marriage, shack-up Catholics to Orthodoxy,

Why?  Your Corban factory a/k/a the marriage tribunal produces them in abundance.




Quote
along with those who would rather talk about all those clever non-fasting food substitutes...eh? than to actually fast to the point of discomfort!!...ALL of the ones who think purgation is for the birds....

Fasting isn't to prove something.  A difference between the Orthodox and Vatican practice.  Hence why it is never seperated (in Orthodoxy) from almsgiving.


Quote
ALL of the homosexuals looking for a quiet Island get-away...

given the aftermath of recent scandals, odd that you bring this up.


Quote
ALL of the habitual sinners who want to be healed painlessly...

Yeah, that masachistic streak in the Vatican has always puzzled me.  I remember reflectin on it looking at a Crucifix in Poland, where the wooden image had blood spirting out three feet.

Quote
I look forward to the day when Orthodox parishes have 8000 families rather than 800 members.

Don't hold your breath: even in countries where everyone is Orthodox, the parishes are on the small size.  More like a family. We'll leave the megachurches to you and your protestant siblings.

Quote
I will shout from the Mountain Top!!  When Orthodoxy has ALL of the burdens of the Catholic Church on her shoulders and the people are in charge and the hierarchy are there in ceremonial capacity only!!

Still smarting that the Orthodox bishops do not have the right to sell the Orthodox Faithful out?

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stanley123
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« Reply #12 on: May 18, 2010, 03:15:54 AM »

And seccular humanism has already won in EO Russia.
Immediately after the fall of communism, the Orthodox Church was quite strong and warmly embraced by the people of Eastern Europe. It would be great if this strong commitment to the Orthodox Church would continue. However, I am afraid that secular humanism is making inroads in both Western and Eastern Europe. Also Islam becomes stronger and stronger in many parts of Western Europe.
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