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Author Topic: Catholicism, from a happy catholic.  (Read 33784 times) Average Rating: 0
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Irish Hermit
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« Reply #315 on: May 16, 2010, 09:58:27 AM »

[
Don't keep taking the bait Alonso.

It is absolutely meaningless.

Truly, what is being said here against you has no meaning.

Let them go.  The rubber band will always snap back.

It is hateful in its content dear boy; and it will not prevail.


Dear Alonso,

I am sure you do not know this, but within Orthodoxy there is a deep-seated fear of Roman Catholicism.  It has been conditioned by long centuries of aggression - the Crusades, the 60 year occupation of Constantinople, the bloodbath in Jerusalem, the attempt to fragment and destroy Orthodoxy by the creation of parallel look-alike Churches in many Orthodox countries (always accompanied by violence), the Croatian policy in WWII of "kill 1/3 of the Orthodox, convert 1/3, and marry 1/3."   

Things such as this have become an integral part of Orthodoxy's innermost psyche when they think of Roman Catholics.  Brushing it aside as polemics damages the bilateral dialogue because it does not acknowledge a deep-rooted problem in our relationship which cries out for attention. 

Pope John Paul II spoke often of the "healing of memory."  The Orthodox attitude could be summed up in the well-known words of Patriarch Pavle of Serbia when he dedicated the monument at the Jasenovac concentration camp in Croatia - "Forgive we must, forget we dare not."  Oprostiti moramo, zaboraviti ne smemo.

Don't shoot me for saying this.  I am just the messenger.  But what I am reporting is how the average Orthodox Christian sees things.
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elijahmaria
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« Reply #316 on: May 16, 2010, 10:37:21 AM »

[
Don't keep taking the bait Alonso.

It is absolutely meaningless.

Truly, what is being said here against you has no meaning.

Let them go.  The rubber band will always snap back.

It is hateful in its content dear boy; and it will not prevail.


Dear Alonso,

I am sure you do not know this, but within Orthodoxy there is a deep-seated fear of Roman Catholicism.  It has been conditioned by long centuries of aggression - the Crusades, the 60 year occupation of Constantinople, the bloodbath in Jerusalem, the attempt to fragment and destroy Orthodoxy by the creation of parallel look-alike Churches in many Orthodox countries (always accompanied by violence), the Croatian policy in WWII of "kill 1/3 of the Orthodox, convert 1/3, and marry 1/3."   

Things such as this have become an integral part of Orthodoxy's innermost psyche when they think of Roman Catholics.  Brushing it aside as polemics damages the bilateral dialogue because it does not acknowledge a deep-rooted problem in our relationship which cries out for attention. 

Pope John Paul II spoke often of the "healing of memory."  The Orthodox attitude could be summed up in the well-known words of Patriarch Pavle of Serbia when he dedicated the monument at the Jasenovac concentration camp in Croatia - "Forgive we must, forget we dare not."  Oprostiti moramo, zaboraviti ne smemo.

Don't shoot me for saying this.  I am just the messenger.  But what I am reporting is how the average Orthodox Christian sees things.

It is a double edged sword Alonso.  Do not pick it up.  It cries out for healing but the scab-pickers continue to pick and claim they are all-innocent.   Do not engage the scab-pickers!!  Pray for healing in silence, in the quiet of your own room.

M.
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stashko
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« Reply #317 on: May 16, 2010, 10:45:12 AM »

Fr.Bless,
 was it you that mentioned ,that the crusaders threw the Orthodox Jerusalem Patriarch out of the Holy Church Of The Resurrection ,and setup a latin Patriarch There ..It was a muslim Leader that ended up restoring the Greek one back to its rightful place,after they reconqued jerusalem from the crusaders... Grin

« Last Edit: May 16, 2010, 10:54:50 AM by stashko » Logged

ГОСПОДЕ ГОСПОДЕ ,ПОГЛЕДАЈ СА НЕБА ,ДОЂИ И ПОСЕТИ ТВОЈ ВИНОГРАД ТВОЈА ДЕСНИЦА ПОСАДИЛА АМИН АМИН.
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« Reply #318 on: May 16, 2010, 10:47:14 AM »


It is a double edged sword Alonso.  Do not pick it up.  It cries out for healing but the scab-pickers continue to pick and claim they are all-innocent.   Do not engage the scab-pickers!!  Pray for healing in silence, in the quiet of your own room.

We are not stupid.  We have heads on our shoulders and brains in our heads.   We cannot forget the hundreds of years of persecution and suffering which the Roman Catholic Church has inflicted on Orthodox Christians.

We look at the new attitude which is developing in Roman Catholicism over the last 40 years - but 40 years is a piffling time span compared to our mutual history of interaction.  Will your new irenic period last?  Will the leopard return to its old spots?

Let us wait and see.  Caution is a virtue and the empirical evidence shows that we ought to be cautious in our contacts with Roman Catholics.
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elijahmaria
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« Reply #319 on: May 16, 2010, 10:57:39 AM »


It is a double edged sword Alonso.  Do not pick it up.  It cries out for healing but the scab-pickers continue to pick and claim they are all-innocent.   Do not engage the scab-pickers!!  Pray for healing in silence, in the quiet of your own room.

We are not stupid.  We have heads on our shoulders and brains in our heads.   We cannot forget the hundreds of years of persecution and suffering which the Roman Catholic Church has inflicted on Orthodox Christians.

We look at the new attitude which is developing in Roman Catholicism over the last 40 years - but 40 years is a piffling time span compared to our mutual history of interaction.  Will your new irenic period last?  Will the leopard return to its old spots?

Let us wait and see.  Caution is a virtue and the empirical evidence shows that we ought to be cautious in our contacts with Roman Catholics.

This assertion is entirely dependent upon the fact that when a civil government in a predominantly Catholic country does harm to Orthodox Christians, it is the fault of the Catholic Church.

But when the State Church that is Orthodox, finds its national government killing Catholics, then the State Church that is Orthodox throws up her hands and pleads no contest!!

Now if you take away the fail-safe escape easement from Orthodoxy, the Catholic Church does not look nearly as blood thirsty.

And frankly I am weary of you criticizing the Catholic Church for bringing in Orthodox faithful to save them from certain death if they remained confessing Orthodoxy.  The idea was to save not to kill and everything was falling apart then and terror reigned and I am deeply sorry we did not leave Orthodox faithful to fend for themselves.

You remind me of the beggars in Port Authority who throw your handful of change back at you because it was not a wad of bills.  I had that happen once to me when I emptied my pockets to give to a legless man while waiting for a bus.  I will NEVER make that mistake again.

Mary
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stashko
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« Reply #320 on: May 16, 2010, 11:05:10 AM »


St. Alexander Nevsky made the same decision as Stashko.  This is the result:



[/quote]

Actually St. Alexander Nevsky is our Holy Patron Saint [krsna Slava] that we celebrate honor every year...
« Last Edit: May 16, 2010, 11:07:16 AM by stashko » Logged

ГОСПОДЕ ГОСПОДЕ ,ПОГЛЕДАЈ СА НЕБА ,ДОЂИ И ПОСЕТИ ТВОЈ ВИНОГРАД ТВОЈА ДЕСНИЦА ПОСАДИЛА АМИН АМИН.
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« Reply #321 on: May 16, 2010, 11:19:13 AM »

And frankly I am weary of you criticizing the Catholic Church for bringing in Orthodox faithful to save them from certain death if they remained confessing Orthodoxy.  The idea was to save not to kill and everything was falling apart then and terror reigned and I am deeply sorry we did not leave Orthodox faithful to fend for themselves.


I really do not know if you are deceiving people or genuinely have no knowledge of what took place in Yugoslavia, in my lifetime for I was a toddler then, not sure if you were born..

I have lived in Yugoslavia and witnessed the sad results of the work of the Ustashe and Franciscan friars during WWII - a mound near the monastery in Kraljevo where 5,000 students (!) were buried after their brutal killing by knife and axe (not even the mercy of a quick bullet.)   It was a Franciscan friar who started the bloodshed.  He went into a classroom in Kraljevo with his band of vile characters.  He selected a little girl and sat her on his knee at the front of the class.  He said, "Now I am going to show you how we must baptize the Orthodox" and he took his knife and slit the girl's throat.

And so began the slaughter of the students of Kraljevo....

If you know nothing of what transpired in WWII make an attempt to read material on the Net.  Even the Nazis in Yugoslavia expressed their distaste at the savagery with which the Catholic Croatians slaughtered the Orthodox.

These things do colour one's perception of another religious system, I do not deny it.  

« Last Edit: May 16, 2010, 11:21:09 AM by Irish Hermit » Logged
elijahmaria
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« Reply #322 on: May 16, 2010, 11:25:10 AM »

And frankly I am weary of you criticizing the Catholic Church for bringing in Orthodox faithful to save them from certain death if they remained confessing Orthodoxy.  The idea was to save not to kill and everything was falling apart then and terror reigned and I am deeply sorry we did not leave Orthodox faithful to fend for themselves.


I really do not know if you are deceiving people or genuinely have no knowledge of what took place in Yugoslavia, in my lifetime for I was a toddler then, not sure if you were born..

I have lived in Yugoslavia and witnessed the sad results of the work of the Ustashe and Franciscan friars during WWII - a mound near the monastery in Kraljevo where 5,000 students (!) were buried after their brutal killing by knife and axe (not even the mercy of a quick bullet.)   It was a Franciscan friar who started the bloodshed.  He went into a classroom in Kraljevo with his band of vile characters.  He selected a little girl and sat her on his knee at the front of the class.  He said, "Now I am going to show you how we must baptize the Orthodox" and he took his knife and slit the girl's throat.

And so began the slaughter of the students of Kraljevo....

If you know nothing of what transpired in WWII make an attempt to read material on the Net.  Even the Nazis in Yugoslavia expressed their distaste at the savagery with which the Catholic Croatians slaughtered the Orthodox.

These things do colour one's perception of another religious system, I do not deny it.  



I am not going to offer a tit-for-tat but they are out there with individual Orthodox killing Catholics.

The difference as I said is that in the re-telling you blame the entire Catholic Church for the actions of individuals and you excuse Orthodoxy because, after all, the killing was only the work of individuals.

I've watched you work your Internet magic for a long time.

I know how you think and I know how you keep an enraptured following and I know that there are many besides myself who also see what you do and deplore it and they are Orthodox.

Mary
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Irish Hermit
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« Reply #323 on: May 16, 2010, 11:43:55 AM »

And frankly I am weary of you criticizing the Catholic Church for bringing in Orthodox faithful to save them from certain death if they remained confessing Orthodoxy.  The idea was to save not to kill and everything was falling apart then and terror reigned and I am deeply sorry we did not leave Orthodox faithful to fend for themselves.


I really do not know if you are deceiving people or genuinely have no knowledge of what took place in Yugoslavia, in my lifetime for I was a toddler then, not sure if you were born..

I have lived in Yugoslavia and witnessed the sad results of the work of the Ustashe and Franciscan friars during WWII - a mound near the monastery in Kraljevo where 5,000 students (!) were buried after their brutal killing by knife and axe (not even the mercy of a quick bullet.)   It was a Franciscan friar who started the bloodshed.  He went into a classroom in Kraljevo with his band of vile characters.  He selected a little girl and sat her on his knee at the front of the class.  He said, "Now I am going to show you how we must baptize the Orthodox" and he took his knife and slit the girl's throat.

And so began the slaughter of the students of Kraljevo....

If you know nothing of what transpired in WWII make an attempt to read material on the Net.  Even the Nazis in Yugoslavia expressed their distaste at the savagery with which the Catholic Croatians slaughtered the Orthodox.

These things do colour one's perception of another religious system, I do not deny it. 



I am not going to offer a tit-for-tat but they are out there with individual Orthodox killing Catholics.

The difference as I said is that in the re-telling you blame the entire Catholic Church for the actions of individuals and you excuse Orthodoxy because, after all, the killing was only the work of individuals.

I've watched you work your Internet magic for a long time.

I know how you think and I know how you keep an enraptured following and I know that there are many besides myself who also see what you do and deplore it and they are Orthodox.

Mary

I have an immense empathy for the suffering Serbian people.  For many many years the truth was not fully known because the Vatican has an efficient media machine and the Serbs were suppressed for decades under Tito's regime.  The books that were published and found a market in the West were viewed with skepticism. People tended to see the authors as exaggerating.  Now we know they were speaking the truth.  The Serbian tragedy must not be concealed, no more than the great tragedy of the Armenians.
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elijahmaria
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« Reply #324 on: May 16, 2010, 12:00:16 PM »

And frankly I am weary of you criticizing the Catholic Church for bringing in Orthodox faithful to save them from certain death if they remained confessing Orthodoxy.  The idea was to save not to kill and everything was falling apart then and terror reigned and I am deeply sorry we did not leave Orthodox faithful to fend for themselves.


I really do not know if you are deceiving people or genuinely have no knowledge of what took place in Yugoslavia, in my lifetime for I was a toddler then, not sure if you were born..

I have lived in Yugoslavia and witnessed the sad results of the work of the Ustashe and Franciscan friars during WWII - a mound near the monastery in Kraljevo where 5,000 students (!) were buried after their brutal killing by knife and axe (not even the mercy of a quick bullet.)   It was a Franciscan friar who started the bloodshed.  He went into a classroom in Kraljevo with his band of vile characters.  He selected a little girl and sat her on his knee at the front of the class.  He said, "Now I am going to show you how we must baptize the Orthodox" and he took his knife and slit the girl's throat.

And so began the slaughter of the students of Kraljevo....

If you know nothing of what transpired in WWII make an attempt to read material on the Net.  Even the Nazis in Yugoslavia expressed their distaste at the savagery with which the Catholic Croatians slaughtered the Orthodox.

These things do colour one's perception of another religious system, I do not deny it. 



I am not going to offer a tit-for-tat but they are out there with individual Orthodox killing Catholics.

The difference as I said is that in the re-telling you blame the entire Catholic Church for the actions of individuals and you excuse Orthodoxy because, after all, the killing was only the work of individuals.

I've watched you work your Internet magic for a long time.

I know how you think and I know how you keep an enraptured following and I know that there are many besides myself who also see what you do and deplore it and they are Orthodox.

Mary

I have an immense empathy for the suffering Serbian people.  For many many years the truth was not fully known because the Vatican has an efficient media machine and the Serbs were suppressed for decades under Tito's regime.  The books that were published and found a market in the West were viewed with skepticism. People tended to see the authors as exaggerating.  Now we know they were speaking the truth.  The Serbian tragedy must not be concealed, no more than the great tragedy of the Armenians.

This in no way detracts from the fact that you excuse one and accuse the other.

You do no one any good in that regard.

M.
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Irish Hermit
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« Reply #325 on: May 16, 2010, 12:10:49 PM »

And frankly I am weary of you criticizing the Catholic Church for bringing in Orthodox faithful to save them from certain death if they remained confessing Orthodoxy.  The idea was to save not to kill and everything was falling apart then and terror reigned and I am deeply sorry we did not leave Orthodox faithful to fend for themselves.


I really do not know if you are deceiving people or genuinely have no knowledge of what took place in Yugoslavia, in my lifetime for I was a toddler then, not sure if you were born..

I have lived in Yugoslavia and witnessed the sad results of the work of the Ustashe and Franciscan friars during WWII - a mound near the monastery in Kraljevo where 5,000 students (!) were buried after their brutal killing by knife and axe (not even the mercy of a quick bullet.)   It was a Franciscan friar who started the bloodshed.  He went into a classroom in Kraljevo with his band of vile characters.  He selected a little girl and sat her on his knee at the front of the class.  He said, "Now I am going to show you how we must baptize the Orthodox" and he took his knife and slit the girl's throat.

And so began the slaughter of the students of Kraljevo....

If you know nothing of what transpired in WWII make an attempt to read material on the Net.  Even the Nazis in Yugoslavia expressed their distaste at the savagery with which the Catholic Croatians slaughtered the Orthodox.

These things do colour one's perception of another religious system, I do not deny it. 



I am not going to offer a tit-for-tat but they are out there with individual Orthodox killing Catholics.

The difference as I said is that in the re-telling you blame the entire Catholic Church for the actions of individuals and you excuse Orthodoxy because, after all, the killing was only the work of individuals.

I've watched you work your Internet magic for a long time.

I know how you think and I know how you keep an enraptured following and I know that there are many besides myself who also see what you do and deplore it and they are Orthodox.

Mary

I have an immense empathy for the suffering Serbian people.  For many many years the truth was not fully known because the Vatican has an efficient media machine and the Serbs were suppressed for decades under Tito's regime.  The books that were published and found a market in the West were viewed with skepticism. People tended to see the authors as exaggerating.  Now we know they were speaking the truth.  The Serbian tragedy must not be concealed, no more than the great tragedy of the Armenians.

This in no way detracts from the fact that you excuse one and accuse the other.

You do no one any good in that regard.

M.

I am not going to play footsie with the Devil and that is who, in my opinion, was running most of the Catholic hierarchy and the Franciscans during the war years.  If you do not believe it then look for the dissident voices of a few Catholic bishops and Catholic professors who tried to protest what was being done to the Orthodox.
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elijahmaria
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« Reply #326 on: May 16, 2010, 12:24:25 PM »

And frankly I am weary of you criticizing the Catholic Church for bringing in Orthodox faithful to save them from certain death if they remained confessing Orthodoxy.  The idea was to save not to kill and everything was falling apart then and terror reigned and I am deeply sorry we did not leave Orthodox faithful to fend for themselves.


I really do not know if you are deceiving people or genuinely have no knowledge of what took place in Yugoslavia, in my lifetime for I was a toddler then, not sure if you were born..

I have lived in Yugoslavia and witnessed the sad results of the work of the Ustashe and Franciscan friars during WWII - a mound near the monastery in Kraljevo where 5,000 students (!) were buried after their brutal killing by knife and axe (not even the mercy of a quick bullet.)   It was a Franciscan friar who started the bloodshed.  He went into a classroom in Kraljevo with his band of vile characters.  He selected a little girl and sat her on his knee at the front of the class.  He said, "Now I am going to show you how we must baptize the Orthodox" and he took his knife and slit the girl's throat.

And so began the slaughter of the students of Kraljevo....

If you know nothing of what transpired in WWII make an attempt to read material on the Net.  Even the Nazis in Yugoslavia expressed their distaste at the savagery with which the Catholic Croatians slaughtered the Orthodox.

These things do colour one's perception of another religious system, I do not deny it. 



I am not going to offer a tit-for-tat but they are out there with individual Orthodox killing Catholics.

The difference as I said is that in the re-telling you blame the entire Catholic Church for the actions of individuals and you excuse Orthodoxy because, after all, the killing was only the work of individuals.

I've watched you work your Internet magic for a long time.

I know how you think and I know how you keep an enraptured following and I know that there are many besides myself who also see what you do and deplore it and they are Orthodox.

Mary

I have an immense empathy for the suffering Serbian people.  For many many years the truth was not fully known because the Vatican has an efficient media machine and the Serbs were suppressed for decades under Tito's regime.  The books that were published and found a market in the West were viewed with skepticism. People tended to see the authors as exaggerating.  Now we know they were speaking the truth.  The Serbian tragedy must not be concealed, no more than the great tragedy of the Armenians.

This in no way detracts from the fact that you excuse one and accuse the other.

You do no one any good in that regard.

M.

I am not going to play footsie with the Devil and that is who, in my opinion, was running most of the Catholic hierarchy and the Franciscans during the war years.  If you do not believe it then look for the dissident voices of a few Catholic bishops and Catholic professors who tried to protest what was being done to the Orthodox.

Excusing Orthodox excess is the same Devil.

M.
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Alonso_castillo
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« Reply #327 on: May 16, 2010, 01:59:27 PM »

Islam actually protected Holy Orthodoxy, Intentionally or Unintentionally ,From the  Latin west ..Rome If they couldn't absorb Holy Orthodoxy into non existence, they would of destroyed us DUE TO ROME'S GREED FOR POWER AND AUTHORITY..God put Islam in the right place at times as a buffer to protect us from the Latin west.... Ottoman Turks could of wiped out Holy Orthodoxy in the 500 so year they ruled the balkans ,if the wanted too but they didn't ....
 THIS SAYING IS FROM THE BALKAN'S ,  BETTER THE SULTAN'S TURBAN THAN THE TIERA OF ROME,.... I HAVE A TEE SHIRT THAT I WEAR PROUDLY WITH THIS SAYING  WRITTEN IN SERBIAN CIRILICA...

Your argument totally lacks of piety, ¿Is that orthodoxy?, ¿Is orthodoxy more alike to let apostasy from Jesus to grow among those who were saved, making them to deny Christ?, ¿are you aware of the Blasfemy you just said making God the performer of the denying of His Most Loved Son by Islam as a protector of orhodoxy?

I just can't believe how far your blasfemous schismatic anticatholicism can reach.

No...no...Alonso.

They are right!!

It is much better for them to wear the Sultan's turban!!

Don't you see it?

Thank you sister. God Bless you
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Nisi Dominus aedificaverit Domum
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Nisi Dominus custodierit civitatem
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Alonso_castillo
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« Reply #328 on: May 16, 2010, 02:01:12 PM »

Islam actually protected Holy Orthodoxy, Intentionally or Unintentionally ,From the  Latin west ..Rome If they couldn't absorb Holy Orthodoxy into non existence, they would of destroyed us DUE TO ROME'S GREED FOR POWER AND AUTHORITY..God put Islam in the right place at times as a buffer to protect us from the Latin west.... Ottoman Turks could of wiped out Holy Orthodoxy in the 500 so year they ruled the balkans ,if the wanted too but they didn't ....
 THIS SAYING IS FROM THE BALKAN'S ,  BETTER THE SULTAN'S TURBAN THAN THE TIERA OF ROME,.... I HAVE A TEE SHIRT THAT I WEAR PROUDLY WITH THIS SAYING  WRITTEN IN SERBIAN CIRILICA...

Your argument totally lacks of piety, ¿Is that orthodoxy?, ¿Is orthodoxy more alike to let apostasy from Jesus to grow among those who were saved, making them to deny Christ?, ¿are you aware of the Blasfemy you just said making God the performer of the denying of His Most Loved Son by Islam as a protector of orhodoxy?

St. Alexander Nevsky made the same decision as Stashko.  This is the result:



Quote
I just can't believe how far your blasfemous schismatic anticatholicism can reach.
Just a point of order, here, as in heaven, we are the Catholic Church, and you are in schism.

I just can't believe how far your blasfemous schismatic anticatholicism can reach.

Like I said, here, as in heaven, you are the one committing blasfemy.

Don't keep taking the bait Alonso.

It is absolutely meaningless.

Truly, what is being said here against you has no meaning.

Let them go.  The rubber band will always snap back.

It is hateful in its content dear boy; and it will not prevail.

M.

God Bless you sister, thanks
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Nisi Dominus aedificaverit Domum
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Nisi Dominus custodierit civitatem
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Alonso_castillo
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« Reply #329 on: May 16, 2010, 02:08:28 PM »

[
Don't keep taking the bait Alonso.

It is absolutely meaningless.

Truly, what is being said here against you has no meaning.

Let them go.  The rubber band will always snap back.

It is hateful in its content dear boy; and it will not prevail.


Dear Alonso,

I am sure you do not know this, but within Orthodoxy there is a deep-seated fear of Roman Catholicism.  It has been conditioned by long centuries of aggression - the Crusades, the 60 year occupation of Constantinople, the bloodbath in Jerusalem, the attempt to fragment and destroy Orthodoxy by the creation of parallel look-alike Churches in many Orthodox countries (always accompanied by violence), the Croatian policy in WWII of "kill 1/3 of the Orthodox, convert 1/3, and marry 1/3."   

Things such as this have become an integral part of Orthodoxy's innermost psyche when they think of Roman Catholics.  Brushing it aside as polemics damages the bilateral dialogue because it does not acknowledge a deep-rooted problem in our relationship which cries out for attention. 

Pope John Paul II spoke often of the "healing of memory."  The Orthodox attitude could be summed up in the well-known words of Patriarch Pavle of Serbia when he dedicated the monument at the Jasenovac concentration camp in Croatia - "Forgive we must, forget we dare not."  Oprostiti moramo, zaboraviti ne smemo.

Don't shoot me for saying this.  I am just the messenger.  But what I am reporting is how the average Orthodox Christian sees things.

We Catholics are not taught about the massacre of latins in constantinople, in fact we are more aware of the terrible  consecuences of 4th crusade than of the terrible massacre of catholics by fanatic orthodoxs.

So we can forget, but justice has to be done in both sides, Ukrainian GreeK Catholic Churches have not yet come back from Russian Orthodoxy, which recieved them from soviet desition to destroy catholicism in Ukraine. They very well knew whom to fear. Catholicism, the One true faith that brought freedom to russian orthodoxy. By one single man governing the smallest country in the world and without an army, the largest Country of the world with the second most powerful army was changed from totalitarism to Democracy. So remembre that such liberty is a gift from Catholicism to Russian orthodoxy.

And not just remember the bad things
« Last Edit: May 16, 2010, 02:18:50 PM by Alonso_castillo » Logged

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« Reply #330 on: May 16, 2010, 02:20:56 PM »


St. Alexander Nevsky made the same decision as Stashko.  This is the result:




Actually St. Alexander Nevsky is our Holy Patron Saint [krsna Slava] that we celebrate honor every year...
[/quote]

If that so said """Saint""" sugested that Islam is a God gift protection against Catholicism, Be Anathema.
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« Reply #331 on: May 16, 2010, 02:21:33 PM »

Ukrainian GreeK Catholic Churches have not yet come back from Russian Orthodoxy, which recieved them from soviet desition to destroy catholicism in Ukraine.

False. http://www.ugcc.org.ua/index.php?L=2 We wait for them to come back once again.

Quote
By one single man governing the smallest country in the world and without an army. So remember that such is a gift from Catholicism to Russian orthodoxy.

In 1596 the situation was a bit different:

Quote
During the Renaissance, the papal territory expanded greatly, notably under Popes Alexander VI and Julius II. The Pope became one of Italy's most important secular rulers as well as the head of the Church, signing treaties with other sovereigns and fighting wars. In practice, though, most of the Papal States was still only nominally controlled by the Pope, and much of the territory was ruled by minor princes. Control was always contested; indeed it took until the 16th century for the Pope to have any genuine control over all his territories.
source.
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« Reply #332 on: May 16, 2010, 03:00:17 PM »

Aren't you bored yet?

I am Joyful of Being Catholic.

I know folks who are very happy to be Buddhist, Christian Science, Jewish . I even know some happy Calvinists. 

Your personal good feelings are a fine thing. What we are more interested in is discovering the Authentic and Historic Church founded by Christ and given to his disciples as the One Holy Catholic and Apostolic Church. The one that Hades can not prevail against.

Each time I have seen that issue debated in a serious manner, the Orthodox appear to have the stronger position. That is why I am Orthodox and not Roman Catholic.

If you would like to try your hand and discuss that, feel free. We will listen to whatever case you can make with an open mind. You should also be prepared to hear our case as well with an open mind.

Thanks for the pretty pictures.   
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« Reply #333 on: May 16, 2010, 04:40:40 PM »

the pictures are pretty, alonso. thanx 4 postin. ^_^
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« Reply #334 on: May 16, 2010, 06:16:43 PM »

And frankly I am weary of you criticizing the Catholic Church for bringing in Orthodox faithful to save them from certain death if they remained confessing Orthodoxy.  The idea was to save not to kill and everything was falling apart then and terror reigned and I am deeply sorry we did not leave Orthodox faithful to fend for themselves.


I really do not know if you are deceiving people or genuinely have no knowledge of what took place in Yugoslavia, in my lifetime for I was a toddler then, not sure if you were born..

I have lived in Yugoslavia and witnessed the sad results of the work of the Ustashe and Franciscan friars during WWII - a mound near the monastery in Kraljevo where 5,000 students (!) were buried after their brutal killing by knife and axe (not even the mercy of a quick bullet.)   It was a Franciscan friar who started the bloodshed.  He went into a classroom in Kraljevo with his band of vile characters.  He selected a little girl and sat her on his knee at the front of the class.  He said, "Now I am going to show you how we must baptize the Orthodox" and he took his knife and slit the girl's throat.

And so began the slaughter of the students of Kraljevo....

If you know nothing of what transpired in WWII make an attempt to read material on the Net.  Even the Nazis in Yugoslavia expressed their distaste at the savagery with which the Catholic Croatians slaughtered the Orthodox.

These things do colour one's perception of another religious system, I do not deny it.  



I am not going to offer a tit-for-tat but they are out there with individual Orthodox killing Catholics.

The difference as I said is that in the re-telling you blame the entire Catholic Church for the actions of individuals and you excuse Orthodoxy because, after all, the killing was only the work of individuals.

I've watched you work your Internet magic for a long time.

I know how you think and I know how you keep an enraptured following and I know that there are many besides myself who also see what you do and deplore it and they are Orthodox.

Mary

Your supreme pontiff's bull "Unam Sanctum" pretty much moots any distinction you want to make between individuals and secular powers from the Vatican.  They were only doing the latter's bidding.
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« Reply #335 on: May 16, 2010, 06:18:14 PM »


St. Alexander Nevsky made the same decision as Stashko.  This is the result:



Actually St. Alexander Nevsky is our Holy Patron Saint [krsna Slava] that we celebrate honor every year...

If that so said """Saint""" sugested that Islam is a God gift protection against Catholicism, Be Anathema.
No, it was protection of the Catholic Church against the Vatican. Anathema to the Teutonic Knights and the synagogue of Satan who sent them.
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« Reply #336 on: May 16, 2010, 06:31:28 PM »


St. Alexander Nevsky made the same decision as Stashko.  This is the result:



Actually St. Alexander Nevsky is our Holy Patron Saint [krsna Slava] that we celebrate honor every year...

If that so said """Saint""" sugested that Islam is a God gift protection against Catholicism, Be Anathema.
No, it was protection of the Catholic Church against the Vatican. Anathema to the Teutonic Knights and the synagogue of Satan who sent them.

Once more if anyone says that God Created Islam for the salvation of Men directly through or as a protector for. Be Anathema. For it can only be sugested by those who oppose to Jesus. Islam is not a new revelation of God, but an extension of Arianism, denying Jesus divinity. so Anyone who see that antichristian doctrine as a God making, BE ANATHEMA. NO SAINT.
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« Reply #337 on: May 16, 2010, 06:38:02 PM »


St. Alexander Nevsky made the same decision as Stashko.  This is the result:



Actually St. Alexander Nevsky is our Holy Patron Saint [krsna Slava] that we celebrate honor every year...

If that so said """Saint""" sugested that Islam is a God gift protection against Catholicism, Be Anathema.
No, it was protection of the Catholic Church against the Vatican. Anathema to the Teutonic Knights and the synagogue of Satan who sent them.

Once more if anyone says that God Created Islam for the salvation of Men directly through or as a protector for. Be Anathema.
No one said that. What we have said that living under the infidelity of Islam protected the Catholic Church from the Vatican's heresies.
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« Reply #338 on: May 16, 2010, 06:38:31 PM »

the pictures are pretty, alonso. thanx 4 postin. ^_^

I am Glad you like them. God Bless You.
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« Reply #339 on: May 16, 2010, 06:42:09 PM »

And frankly I am weary of you criticizing the Catholic Church for bringing in Orthodox faithful to save them from certain death if they remained confessing Orthodoxy.  The idea was to save not to kill and everything was falling apart then and terror reigned and I am deeply sorry we did not leave Orthodox faithful to fend for themselves.


I really do not know if you are deceiving people or genuinely have no knowledge of what took place in Yugoslavia, in my lifetime for I was a toddler then, not sure if you were born..

I have lived in Yugoslavia and witnessed the sad results of the work of the Ustashe and Franciscan friars during WWII - a mound near the monastery in Kraljevo where 5,000 students (!) were buried after their brutal killing by knife and axe (not even the mercy of a quick bullet.)   It was a Franciscan friar who started the bloodshed.  He went into a classroom in Kraljevo with his band of vile characters.  He selected a little girl and sat her on his knee at the front of the class.  He said, "Now I am going to show you how we must baptize the Orthodox" and he took his knife and slit the girl's throat.

And so began the slaughter of the students of Kraljevo....

If you know nothing of what transpired in WWII make an attempt to read material on the Net.  Even the Nazis in Yugoslavia expressed their distaste at the savagery with which the Catholic Croatians slaughtered the Orthodox.

These things do colour one's perception of another religious system, I do not deny it.  



I am not going to offer a tit-for-tat but they are out there with individual Orthodox killing Catholics.

The difference as I said is that in the re-telling you blame the entire Catholic Church for the actions of individuals and you excuse Orthodoxy because, after all, the killing was only the work of individuals.

I've watched you work your Internet magic for a long time.

I know how you think and I know how you keep an enraptured following and I know that there are many besides myself who also see what you do and deplore it and they are Orthodox.

Mary

Your supreme pontiff's bull "Unam Sanctum" pretty much moots any distinction you want to make between individuals and secular powers from the Vatican.  They were only doing the latter's bidding.

This is the kind of inflammatory rhetoric that sets off every religious war in history.

The Decree that you reference was a very specific response to a very specific threat from the secular world against the Vatican.  It cannot be carried forward to say what you have said here.

Anyone who follows you is deluded and will begin wars where there is not need.

This is in my opinion an objectively evil and purposefully inflammatory declaration of half truth and fiction.

It is false witness.

Mary
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« Reply #340 on: May 16, 2010, 06:46:21 PM »


St. Alexander Nevsky made the same decision as Stashko.  This is the result:



Actually St. Alexander Nevsky is our Holy Patron Saint [krsna Slava] that we celebrate honor every year...

If that so said """Saint""" sugested that Islam is a God gift protection against Catholicism, Be Anathema.
No, it was protection of the Catholic Church against the Vatican. Anathema to the Teutonic Knights and the synagogue of Satan who sent them.

Once more if anyone says that God Created Islam for the salvation of Men directly through or as a protector for. Be Anathema.
No one said that. What we have said that living under the infidelity of Islam protected the Catholic Church from the Vatican's heresies.

¿Are you saying that is a God Blessing losing millions of souls into Hell for their apostasy from Jesus? just to protect few souls from Catholicism, very blasphemous are your thoughts..
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« Reply #341 on: May 16, 2010, 06:57:34 PM »

Just to be more clear

This Was Colonial Africa, Ruled mostly by masonic France and heretical England and Germany, little of Portuguese and practicaly nothing of Spain.



Then In the 60's and 70's they got their independence.



And After their independence they convert to the True faith left by Jesus to await his second coming.

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« Reply #342 on: May 16, 2010, 06:59:02 PM »


St. Alexander Nevsky made the same decision as Stashko.  This is the result:



Actually St. Alexander Nevsky is our Holy Patron Saint [krsna Slava] that we celebrate honor every year...

If that so said """Saint""" sugested that Islam is a God gift protection against Catholicism, Be Anathema.
No, it was protection of the Catholic Church against the Vatican. Anathema to the Teutonic Knights and the synagogue of Satan who sent them.

Once more if anyone says that God Created Islam for the salvation of Men directly through or as a protector for. Be Anathema.
No one said that. What we have said that living under the infidelity of Islam protected the Catholic Church from the Vatican's heresies.

When I talk to other Orthodox bishops and clergy about what I encounter on the Internet, I am told to stay away from people who speak as you speak and they refer to people who speak as you speak as the "lunatic fringe"...meaning that your positions are not a significant part of universal Orthodoxy.

Frankly I am not as inclined to dismiss people like you out of hand and it is bit annoying that my concerns are dismissed so cavalierly.  I think people who speak as you speak are very dangerous and the attitude you project has made Catholic martyrs over time.

I would hope that the Catholic Church is wise enough, in the future,  to allow some Orthodox faithful to choose their preferred headgear.

Mary
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« Reply #343 on: May 16, 2010, 07:09:51 PM »

Irish Hermit, Ialmisry, and Stashko,

What good do you three (and any more of us Orthodox who have joined you in what you're doing on this thread) hope to accomplish by continuing to feed Alonso?  Can you not leave him alone and just let this thread die the death it deserves?  He's clearly not here to dialogue with you and doesn't really care to know your opinions.
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« Reply #344 on: May 16, 2010, 07:10:50 PM »

The Decree that you reference was a very specific response to a very specific threat from the secular world against the Vatican.  It cannot be carried forward to say what you have said here.

Anyone who follows you is deluded and will begin wars where there is not need.

This is in my opinion an objectively evil and purposefully inflammatory declaration of half truth and fiction.

It is false witness.

Mary

This is the incipit of "Unam Sanctam"

Unam sanctam ecclesiam catholicam et ipsam apostolicam urgente fide credere cogimur et tenere, nosque hanc firmiter credimus et simpliciter confitemur, extra quam nec salus est, nec remissio peccatorum...

"In one holy catholic and apostolic church, we are, urged by our faith, compelled to believe, and we do firmly believe and simply confess that outside of it there is neither salvation nor remission of sins..."

Seems clear enough, and then the Pope goes on to repeat the same teaching a few times more.  It's really hard to believe that these words are coming from the mouth of Peter. 

The Pope takes a moment to preach damnation for the Orthodox:  "Therefore, if the Greeks or others should say that they are not confided to Peter and to his successors, they must confess not being the sheep of Christ..."

But Peter is all for equal opportunity damnation and the Pope concludes by damning every single soul that is not subject to him:  "Furthermore, we declare, we proclaim, we define that it is absolutely necessary for salvation that every human creature be subject to the Roman Pontiff."

Roma locuta est, damnatio omnibus hominibus

http://www.fordham.edu/halsall/source/b8-unam.html
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« Reply #345 on: May 16, 2010, 07:15:07 PM »

Irish Hermit, Ialmisry, and Stashko,

What good do you three (and any more of us Orthodox who have joined you in what you're doing on this thread) hope to accomplish by continuing to feed Alonso?  Can you not leave him alone and just let this thread die the death it deserves?  He's clearly not here to dialogue with you and doesn't really care to know your opinions.


I vote to continue it's a hot topic.... Grin
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« Reply #346 on: May 16, 2010, 07:15:33 PM »

Irish Hermit, Ialmisry, and Stashko,

What good do you three (and any more of us Orthodox who have joined you in what you're doing on this thread) hope to accomplish by continuing to feed Alonso?  Can you not leave him alone and just let this thread die the death it deserves?  He's clearly not here to dialogue with you and doesn't really care to know your opinions.

I like his pictures but I also feel that I would like to engage the topic even if Alonso himself won't dialogue. Mary seems to have picked up the dialogue for him.   I would probably do the same if a Mormon were posting stacks of photos showing the glory of Mormonism.
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« Reply #347 on: May 16, 2010, 07:15:54 PM »

This happened in Kansas, So USA also can work for salvation of souls  moving this young catholic lads to speak of Jesus to those who don't know him in his true churchm, The Catholic Church.

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« Reply #348 on: May 16, 2010, 07:23:37 PM »

It Is Believed that St Thomas Apostle is here in India.

To Be Catholic is to say as Thomas did, ""My Lord and My God"". to Jesus:

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« Reply #349 on: May 16, 2010, 07:24:28 PM »

In Asia, in Vietnam they also are converting to Catholicism.

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« Reply #350 on: May 16, 2010, 07:24:34 PM »

The continent to be evangelized in the Third Millenium is Asia













We need a lot the help of Phillipines who also were evangelized by Spain, and they enjoy catholicism as we in Mexico do.




Blue and white flags are to signify the presence of Mary.
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« Reply #351 on: May 16, 2010, 07:30:58 PM »

It Is Believed that St Thomas Apostle is here in India.

To Be Catholic is to say as Thomas did, ""My Lord and My God"". to Jesus:


 


Alonso.. Grin
When the pope was in chicago for a visit ,i was on my way to work people, were everywhere media was taking pictures ,possably i was included as one of the faithful as well as others, who weren't interested in the pope or his visit ......
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« Reply #352 on: May 16, 2010, 07:33:20 PM »

It Is Believed that St Thomas Apostle is here in India.

To Be Catholic is to say as Thomas did, ""My Lord and My God"". to Jesus:


 


Alonso.. Grin
When the pope was in chicago for a visit ,i was on my way to work people, were everywhere media was taking pictures ,possably i was included as one of the faithful as well as others, who weren't interested in the pope or his visit ......

Ok , poop happens, is that what you are saying?



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« Reply #353 on: May 16, 2010, 07:34:07 PM »

To be Catholic is to look for unity of Brothers, in obedience to Our Lord's desire.


And for those who don't submit... well nothing makes someone submit like a boot to the throat, eh?


This looks to me like it is vicious anti-Catholic slander. I don;t think that these soldiers or police have anything at all to do with the Catholic religion.

I wasn't talking about Catholicism, I was commenting on how the Orthodox say, on the one hand, that they are committed to "unity" and "love," yet have no problem treating their own Orthodox brothers like dirt, persecuting them through the means of secular authorities. I should have been more clear about that in the original post. The picture in question came from the Orthodox Esphigmenou monastery website. Esphigmenou refuses to be "obedient" to the Ecumenical Patriarch, because they deem the "dialogue of love" and talk of unity to be a betrayal of Orthodoxy. So while the Ecumenical Patriarchate is more than happy to recognize the sacraments of the heterodox, it uses worldly authorities to suppress opposition from within Orthodoxy. Pat. Bartholomew offers you a hand of love; he offers Orthodox monks a boot to the throat.
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« Reply #354 on: May 16, 2010, 07:37:54 PM »

To be Catholic is to look for unity of Brothers, in obedience to Our Lord's desire.


And for those who don't submit... well nothing makes someone submit like a boot to the throat, eh?


This looks to me like it is vicious anti-Catholic slander. I don;t think that these soldiers or police have anything at all to do with the Catholic religion.

I wasn't talking about Catholicism, I was commenting on how the Orthodox say, on the one hand, that they are committed to "unity" and "love," yet have no problem treating their own Orthodox brothers like dirt, persecuting them through the means of secular authorities. The picture in question came from the Orthodox Esphigmenou monastery website. Esphigmenou refuses to be "obedient" to the Ecumenical Patriarch, because they deem the "dialogue of love" and talk of unity to be a betrayal of Orthodoxy. So while the Ecumenical Patriarchate is more than happy to recognize the sacraments of the heterodox, it uses worldly authorities to suppress opposition from within Orthodoxy. Pat. Bartholomew offers you a hand of love; he offers Orthodox monks a boot to the throat.

Lovely unity among you
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What about frogs? I like frogs!


« Reply #355 on: May 16, 2010, 07:43:46 PM »

Alonso- what is your purpose with this thread? You are repeating yourself a great deal. And the pictures are so huge that anyone without a very highspeed connection couldn't even see them. If you want to revel in your catholicism why don't you go and join one of the catholic forums? They have plenty of catholics that would truly enjoy your photos. Here you are not likely to find a great deal of support in this area. In all honesty there isn't any beauty that the Catholic church has that the Orthodox church doesn't have in spades. And for some Orthodox the fact that there are pews alone means it is unacceptable! laugh

I really hope your goal isn't to persuade Orthodox Christians to be Catholic thru pretty pictures. If that is your goal you are barking up the wrong tree. For every beautiful picture you post there are just as many (if not more) images that show the beauty of the Orthodox church.
« Last Edit: May 16, 2010, 07:45:52 PM by Quinault » Logged
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« Reply #356 on: May 16, 2010, 07:49:09 PM »

Christ The Saviour, Holy Mother Russia..... Grin
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« Reply #357 on: May 16, 2010, 07:51:13 PM »

To be Catholic is to look for unity of Brothers, in obedience to Our Lord's desire.


And for those who don't submit... well nothing makes someone submit like a boot to the throat, eh?

Wrong!  The monks of Esphigmenou have not submitted!

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« Reply #358 on: May 16, 2010, 07:53:13 PM »

Holy Mother Russia Again... Grin
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Me when younger


« Reply #359 on: May 16, 2010, 07:55:54 PM »

Alonso- what is your purpose with this thread? You are repeating yourself a great deal. And the pictures are so huge that anyone without a very highspeed connection couldn't even see them. If you want to revel in your catholicism why don't you go and join one of the catholic forums? They have plenty of catholics that would truly enjoy your photos. Here you are not likely to find a great deal of support in this area. In all honesty there isn't any beauty that the Catholic church has that the Orthodox church doesn't have in spades. And for some Orthodox the fact that there are pews alone means it is unacceptable! laugh

The porpouse of this thread is as it reads, Catholicism, from a happy catholic, not more, to show you the happiness of being catholic, and answer those who would like to comment the pictures, you can enter here to watch and coment the pictures, or if you don't like  to see catholic pictures you can go to all the tousands of threads out of this one. I don't need support, I am not looking for support,  I said it before, we can't love what we don't know, ¿How do you expect to love catholicism if you don't know it?,, ¿How can we desire to be united if we don't love each other?, We are meant to be united, knowledge will drive us to love and love to unity that is my point. I am not calling anybody to catholicism but to know catholicism, out of prejudice, from a practicant catholic, and not from a desobedient one that has apostated or from a converted protestant who carries its anticatholicism into orthodoxy poissoning its heart against catholicism.

I really hope your goal isn't to persuade Orthodox Christians to be Catholic. If that is your goal you are barking up the wrong tree. For every beautiful picture you post there are just as many (if not more) images that show the beauty of the Orthodox church.

I know that Orthodoxy has beautiful images too, I only want you to know that catholicism is as baeutiful and ful of meaning  so you can desire unity over division, not conversion, that is not the goal.

« Last Edit: May 16, 2010, 08:09:55 PM by Alonso_castillo » Logged

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