Author Topic: CONFUSION!!!  (Read 832 times)

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Offline Lauren_Elisse

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CONFUSION!!!
« on: March 25, 2010, 12:59:43 AM »
So I have seen in quotes on the board that Christ is our love, but in one of the quotes it stated that he is the bridegroom, when this is said, does it mean that we look for the more "in love" feeling with Christ also?

Psalms 23:6 Surely goodness and mercy shall follow me all the days of my life: and I will dwell in the house of the Lord forever.

Offline GabrieltheCelt

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Re: CONFUSION!!!
« Reply #1 on: March 25, 2010, 01:11:40 AM »
So I have seen in quotes on the board that Christ is our love, but in one of the quotes it stated that he is the bridegroom, when this is said, does it mean that we look for the more "in love" feeling with Christ also?



 The monastics speak of eros maniakos ("maniacal eros"), or "the attainment of a deeply erotic relationship with God that lies far beyond the most intense and the most passionate erotic rapture between human beings."  I read about this in The Mountain Of Silence by Kyriacos Markides.
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Offline Lauren_Elisse

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Re: CONFUSION!!!
« Reply #2 on: March 25, 2010, 01:20:12 AM »
So I have seen in quotes on the board that Christ is our love, but in one of the quotes it stated that he is the bridegroom, when this is said, does it mean that we look for the more "in love" feeling with Christ also?



 The monastics speak of eros maniakos ("maniacal eros"), or "the attainment of a deeply erotic relationship with God that lies far beyond the most intense and the most passionate erotic rapture between human beings."  I read about this in The Mountain Of Silence by Kyriacos Markides.



When you say "erotic" that is meant sexual right?
That just seems very..... not what I'm use to actually, yeah that seems weird to me
Psalms 23:6 Surely goodness and mercy shall follow me all the days of my life: and I will dwell in the house of the Lord forever.

Offline GabrieltheCelt

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Re: CONFUSION!!!
« Reply #3 on: March 25, 2010, 01:27:34 AM »
^^I remember being taken aback at this concept.  To this day, I still cannot fully comprehend, and thus explain, the exact meaning.  But if I am not mistaken, I believe the concept is tied to Theosis.  Perhaps our more learned members could elucidate.
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Offline FormerReformer

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Re: CONFUSION!!!
« Reply #4 on: March 25, 2010, 01:46:08 AM »
"Erotic" doesn't mean merely "sexual", at least not in the way that our society thinks of "sexual" in this day and age.  With that said, a lot of the imagery we find in the Bible and prayers imply sexual connotations, one where God is most definitely the male and mankind is most definitely the female (we ask God to fill us, but we could never hope to fill God).  The description of God as Bridegroom or Husband and his people as Bride or Wife is an old analogy that has been with the Church since the days of Israel and Judah, and continues on down through the Gospel teaching of Christ, the epistles of St Paul, before finding the final "consummation" in the ending pages of the Book of Revelation.  

It seems strange at first, because our culture has ingrained us to think of sex in certain ways; and far from "liberating" our idea of sex after an era of Victorian repression, the Sexual Revolution has managed to make sex both common and dirty, at least in our perceptions.  But sex was given to us by God, and when used properly in the love between a man and wife, becomes an icon of the Love of God for man: As Christ incarnated into the world to claim his bride (the Church) and bring about new life, so the man and wife bring new life into the world every day.  And as the union of Christ and his Church brings us into the Body of Christ, so the union of man and wife makes them one flesh.

I hope no one finds the above offensive, because it is indeed a common theme throughout all of the history of the Church.  
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Offline yochanan

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Re: CONFUSION!!!
« Reply #5 on: March 25, 2010, 02:08:05 AM »
What does the Greek word eros mean BTW?  :police:
"It seemed good to the Holy Spirit and to us..." (Acts 15: 28)

Offline FormerReformer

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Re: CONFUSION!!!
« Reply #6 on: March 25, 2010, 02:13:05 AM »
Actually comes from the Greek god of love, became a term that means romantic love, starting as a poetic device until it found it's way into everyday Hellenic usage through the philosophers.  C S Lewis wrote a book on the subject and the various Greek words for love, The Four Loves.  Excellent read.
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Offline yochanan

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Re: CONFUSION!!!
« Reply #7 on: March 25, 2010, 02:29:03 AM »
Actually comes from the Greek god of love, became a term that means romantic love, starting as a poetic device until it found it's way into everyday Hellenic usage through the philosophers.  C S Lewis wrote a book on the subject and the various Greek words for love, The Four Loves.  Excellent read.

Yeah:

Platonic, erotic, hmm.. what are the others?

Eros seems like intimate love right? But not necessarily sexual , I think..
"It seemed good to the Holy Spirit and to us..." (Acts 15: 28)

Offline ozgeorge

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Re: CONFUSION!!!
« Reply #8 on: March 25, 2010, 08:40:14 AM »
So I have seen in quotes on the board that Christ is our love, but in one of the quotes it stated that he is the bridegroom, when this is said, does it mean that we look for the more "in love" feeling with Christ also?
Christ is the Bridegroom (Nymphios) of the Church. But this is not what you think it means. Its not about a sentimental "feeling" of love.
Here is the Icon of the Bridegroom (Nymphios):



On Palm Sunday Evening, after the triumphant morning services of the Entry into Jerusalem, we suddenly shift into the preparation for the suffering and death of Christ with the "Bridegroom Service". The Church is in darkness, and in the middle of the Service, this Icon is brought out of the Sanctuary and carried around the people in the Church while we sing the following hymn:

Behold, the Bridegroom cometh in the middle of the night,
and blessed is that servant whom He shall find watching;
and again unworthy is he whom He shall find heedless.
Beware, therefore, O my soul, lest thou be overcome with sleep,
lest thou be given up to death, and be shut out from the Kingdom.
But rather rouse thyself and cry:
Holy, Holy, Holy art Thou, our God, through the Theotokos have mercy on us!

Our Bridegroom is not richly adorned wearing a beautiful marriage crown, but rather He is stripped and wears a robe meant to mock Him and He wears a crown of thorns. We too, as His Bride, must be prepared to accept our Cross and suffer with Him. This is what it means to be a Christian, as He Himself said: "If anyone desires to come after Me, let him deny himself, and take up his cross every day, and follow Me." (Luke 9:23)
Here is an extract of the Bridegroom Service on Palm Sunday night:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6N-sPbL3gYg

The Bridegroom Service recalls the story of the five wise and the five foolish virgins:
Matthew 25:1-13
"Then the kingdom of heaven shall be likened to ten virgins who took their lamps and went out to meet the bridegroom. Now five of them were wise, and five were  foolish. Those who were  foolish took their lamps and took no oil with them, but the wise took oil in their vessels with their lamps.  But while the bridegroom was delayed, they all slumbered and slept. And at midnight a cry was heard: ‘Behold, the bridegroom is coming; go out to meet him!’ Then all those virgins arose and trimmed their lamps. And the foolish said to the wise, ‘Give us some of your oil, for our lamps are going out.’ But the wise answered, saying, ‘No, lest there should not be enough for us and you; but go rather to those who sell, and buy for yourselves.’ And while they went to buy, the bridegroom came, and those who were ready went in with him to the wedding; and the door was shut.
Afterward the other virgins came also, saying, ‘Lord, Lord, open to us!’ But he answered and said, ‘Assuredly, I say to you, I do not know you.’
“Watch therefore, for you know neither the day nor the hour in which the Son of Man is coming."
« Last Edit: March 25, 2010, 08:48:34 AM by ozgeorge »
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