Drinking Water before Holy Communion

[Alveus Lacuna]

During the pre-communion fast, are we allowed to drink water? On another forum some people were commenting that the Orthodox drink holy water during services for refreshment, and I have never seen anything like this. Apparently some OCA bishops say that water doesn't break the fast. So does it?

[Anastasios]

No, you are not supposed to drink water either.  Only if you need to take medicine with water as an absolute necessity.

[podkarpatska]

No, you are not supposed to drink water either.  Only if you need to take medicine with water as an absolute necessity.

That is our practice in ACROD as well.

[Michał Kalina]

Or unless you are little/elderly/pregnant/ill and no drinking would harm to you.

[Asteriktos]

I generally drink a little water with my medicine. On a related note, I do brush my teeth before communion (I've seen that question before). As for whether it's right to do, I've seen varying opinions... but then I've seen varying opinions on lots of things about communion, such as whether you fast from midnight or vespers, whether women can commune during certain times, etc.  When in doubt, ask your priest I suppose. I say that not to set priests up as the ultimate authority, but because in this case it's his responsibility to "guard the chalice," so he's the one that can best say what precautions one should take in that particular parish/group tradition.

[genesisone]

I generally drink a little water with my medicine. On a related note, I do brush my teeth before communion (I've seen that question before). As for whether it's right to do, I've seen varying opinions... but then I've seen varying opinions on lots of things about communion, such as whether you fast from midnight or vespers, whether women can commune during certain times, etc.  When in doubt, ask your priest I suppose. I say that not to set priests up as the ultimate authority, but because in this case it's his responsibility to "guard the chalice," so he's the one that can best say what precautions one should take in that particular parish/group tradition.

This is my practice as well, with the same reasoning. I tried delaying my meds until after Liturgy, but too often forgot to take them then. My priest even wants me to go ahead with medication for the relief of cold symptoms when necessary on a Sunday morning - small congregation - two at most three chanters - I can do it alone if necessary, but the others are rarely as well prepared. (Nothing against them or their abilities - I have more flexible time during the week to study and practise.)

[Punch]

I was told, by both a ROCOR Priest and a Monk, that FOOD was what we were supposed to avoid.  Water was OK, as was tea.  Some food was acceptable if you had a medical condition requiring it (such as diabetes).  My current Serbian Priest has not countered the above.  For my part, and this is just my opinion and not an attempt at a theological statement, I really don't see how a little water is going to be worse for the Body of Christ than stomach acid and a trip down the digestive tract.  I am not sure that someone thought their brilliant (and pious) plan all the way through. 

[Anastasios]

Or unless you are little/elderly/pregnant/ill and no drinking would harm to you.

Right, those are valid exceptions as well.

[Michał Kalina]

Water was OK, as was tea. 

Tea?

[Ortho_cat]

Please people, brush your teeth! Just don't swallow it.

[88Devin12]

Brushing teeth = okay...

However drinking water, even Holy Water should be avoided. However I know if you need to take medicine, or are in choir (and your throat is getting dry) then you can drink water, but it should be avoided unless absolutely necessary.

[PeterTheAleut]

Those who sing in the choir perform a special and very important ministry within the Church. If they need to drink some water to keep their vocal chords moist so they can sing properly, then my experience would say that this is one exception that needs to be granted a blessing. Most of the clergy I know in my city actually grant this.

[theistgal]

I'm a cantor and have been in both EC and EO choir lofts - water bottles everywhere!  The singers definitely need that H2O! 

[Shanghaiski]

I'm a cantor and have been in both EC and EO choir lofts - water bottles everywhere!  The singers definitely need that H2O! 

I'm a chanter and don't drink water before liturgy. I have not had a problem. Our choir  is the congregation, and I would venture to say they don't drink water before liturgy either. For something like liturgy, even matins and liturgy, I haven't had problems. I do drink water on Good Friday, however, because I'm reading and chanting all day, literally.

[ialmisry]

I was told, by both a ROCOR Priest and a Monk, that FOOD was what we were supposed to avoid.  Water was OK, as was tea.  Some food was acceptable if you had a medical condition requiring it (such as diabetes).  My current Serbian Priest has not countered the above.  For my part, and this is just my opinion and not an attempt at a theological statement, I really don't see how a little water is going to be worse for the Body of Christ than stomach acid and a trip down the digestive tract.  I am not sure that someone thought their brilliant (and pious) plan all the way through. 

When I was in the US and in the OCA, no nothing was supposed to be taken.  When I was in the Middle East, including at the Church of the Resurrection amongst monks, water, tea and coffee were fine but in Cairo an Egypto-Palestinian told me you should not drink water.  When I mentioned about drinking coffee before DL, a friend of mine heavily into Athonite spirituality told me that that the fathers there mention about getting ready for DL, including driking coffee (without cream of course: that distinction remains in any case).

[ialmisry]

Please people, brush your teeth! Just don't swallow it.

Should you ever swallow it?

[Father H]

Yes, the canons assume that we are "brushing our teeth" before Liturgy:

St. Timothy of Alexandria, Canon 16--
Question: If anyone fasting with a view to communion, while washing his mouth, or in the bath, has swallowed water involuntarily, ought he to commune?
Answer: Yes. Since Satan has found an occasion whereby to prevent him from partaking of communion, he will keep on doing this more frequently.

[Fr. George]

- I've never been told, nor have I heard others advised, that drinking water is ok before Holy Communion (except for the aforementioned cases: elderly, those taking medication, etc.).

- I had the conversation with a vocal music therapist about water and choir/chanters; her position was that if you're singing in a performance for even 1 hour per week, then you should be drinking 8 glasses per day, and with that conditioning you wouldn't need the water on Sunday morning.  I happen to agree: the people that I've seen get the most dry on Sunday mornings are also the folks that I'd never see drinking water during the week.  If you're a cantor or choir member, drink water during the week, and skip Sunday morning.

- Brushing teeth = ok, just don't swallow.

[Shanghaiski]

Yes, the canons assume that we are "brushing our teeth" before Liturgy:

St. Timothy of Alexandria, Canon 16--
Question: If anyone fasting with a view to communion, while washing his mouth, or in the bath, has swallowed water involuntarily, ought he to commune?
Answer: Yes. Since Satan has found an occasion whereby to prevent him from partaking of communion, he will keep on doing this more frequently.

Thanks for posting that, Father! May I ask how you found it? Is there a sourcebook for these things? I'd like to nominate it for the OCN obscure canon of the month also.

[Ortho_cat]

Yes, the canons assume that we are "brushing our teeth" before Liturgy:

St. Timothy of Alexandria, Canon 16--
Question: If anyone fasting with a view to communion, while washing his mouth, or in the bath, has swallowed water involuntarily, ought he to commune?
Answer: Yes. Since Satan has found an occasion whereby to prevent him from partaking of communion, he will keep on doing this more frequently.

Thanks for posting that, Father! May I ask how you found it? Is there a sourcebook for these things? I'd like to nominate it for the OCN obscure canon of the month also.

What a quote.

[88Devin12]

I would say that it is different for a choir to sing than it is for the congregation. The choir has to enunciate, project, etc... We have to switch between various types of singing as well (such as between using your full voice and power, and singing quietly with more reverence)

Also, I admire the point about drinking water earlier in the week. Most of the time, I try to drink at least 1 bottle of water before I go to bed Saturday night, that way I'm not only hydrated, but I also don't require additional water before communion.

[katherineofdixie]

I was told, by both a ROCOR Priest and a Monk, that FOOD was what we were supposed to avoid.  Water was OK, as was tea.  Some food was acceptable if you had a medical condition requiring it (such as diabetes). 

This is also what my husband (an insulin-dependent diabetic) was told by our priest.

[Twenty Nine]

Isn't the Eucharistic fast about "fasting"?

It seems that people look at the Eucharistic fast in two different ways:

1) Fast in the sense of depriving ourselves of food and water. In other words, feel hungry and thristy before reception.

2) Making sure that we have not allowed food or water into our bodies since we need to keep ourselves "clean"/"pure" before reception.

#2 above never made sense to me because 15 minutes later we are drinking coffee and eating donuts.

[Marc1152]

I drink water before communion but I feel guilty about it..... so I guess I'm good to go.

As for the donuts. I defer to the Master:  http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=X3ZcZ2h4Ths

[Father H]

Yes, the canons assume that we are "brushing our teeth" before Liturgy:

St. Timothy of Alexandria, Canon 16--
Question: If anyone fasting with a view to communion, while washing his mouth, or in the bath, has swallowed water involuntarily, ought he to commune?
Answer: Yes. Since Satan has found an occasion whereby to prevent him from partaking of communion, he will keep on doing this more frequently.

Thanks for posting that, Father! May I ask how you found it? Is there a sourcebook for these things? I'd like to nominate it for the OCN obscure canon of the month also.

Not a sourcebook I would recommend to most.   I know of it out of an already existing familiarity (I am the canonical advocate [canon lawyer] for the UOC of USA)

[Father H]

Isn't the Eucharistic fast about "fasting"?
It seems that people look at the Eucharistic fast in two different ways:
1) Fast in the sense of depriving ourselves of food and water. In other words, feel hungry and thristy before reception.
2) Making sure that we have not allowed food or water into our bodies since we need to keep ourselves "clean"/"pure" before reception.
#2 above never made sense to me because 15 minutes later we are drinking coffee and eating donuts.

One of the earliest references we have is that of St. Hippolytus, who informs us that this practice comes in order that, having fasted in preparation for our Lord's coming, we may be graced by having the Lord's Body and Blood as the first things eaten and drank before all else. 

[Melodist]

Isn't the Eucharistic fast about "fasting"?

It seems that people look at the Eucharistic fast in two different ways:

1) Fast in the sense of depriving ourselves of food and water. In other words, feel hungry and thristy before reception.

2) Making sure that we have not allowed food or water into our bodies since we need to keep ourselves "clean"/"pure" before reception.

#2 above never made sense to me because 15 minutes later we are drinking coffee and eating donuts.

I would say that the first thing I noticed about the practice of fasting before communion is that, at least when you recieve it, it's the only thing in your body.

[augustin717]

Old people back home would never eat or drink anything on a Sunday morning, until after coming back from church. And they wouldn't even commune except very rarely. But such was their custom and piety.

[Salpy]

I have a related question:  What does everyone eat the night before to keep from being light headed before you take communion in the morning?  That happens to me, and I was very bad last Sunday.  What can you eat that will keep you going the next morning without breakfast?

[Alveus Lacuna]

I have a related question:  What does everyone eat the night before to keep from being light headed before you take communion in the morning?  That happens to me, and I was very bad last Sunday.

I say try to hone in on the lightheadedness. Just don't confuse it with a mystical experience! 

[Asteriktos]

I have a related question:  What does everyone eat the night before to keep from being light headed before you take communion in the morning?  That happens to me, and I was very bad last Sunday.  What can you eat that will keep you going the next morning without breakfast?

I believe that the things that take longest to digest are beans, chicken, fish and other types of meats, and to a lesser extent veggies like potatoes. However, I don't think even these last in your stomach for more than a few hours. How long they're in your GI tract I don't recall, nor do I know how much being there 10+ hours later would help with light headedness. Even though I have diabetes, I've not had issues with going long stretches without food*, so I don't have much experience with what works and what doesn't.


* By long I mean 12-14+ hours for blood tests and communion and such.

[podkarpatska]

I have a related question:  What does everyone eat the night before to keep from being light headed before you take communion in the morning?  That happens to me, and I was very bad last Sunday.  What can you eat that will keep you going the next morning without breakfast?

I believe that the things that take longest to digest are beans, chicken, fish and other types of meats, and to a lesser extent veggies like potatoes. However, I don't think even these last in your stomach for more than a few hours. How long they're in your GI tract I don't recall, nor do I know how much being there 10+ hours later would help with light headedness. Even though I have diabetes, I've not had issues with going long stretches without food*, so I don't have much experience with what works and what doesn't.


* By long I mean 12-14+ hours for blood tests and communion and such.

There have been many good responses here, but I think that we all should keep in mind that each of us has a unique physiology to some extent and we should apply common sense and discuss any lingering issues or concerns with your pastor.

[Nigula Qian Zishi]

I have a related question:  What does everyone eat the night before to keep from being light headed before you take communion in the morning?  That happens to me, and I was very bad last Sunday.  What can you eat that will keep you going the next morning without breakfast?

Carb load. Rices, pastas, white potatoes, etc. And eat later.

[katherineofdixie]

There have been many good responses here, but I think that we all should keep in mind that each of us has a unique physiology to some extent and we should apply common sense and discuss any lingering issues or concerns with your pastor.

Excellent point!

[Marc1152]

I have a related question:  What does everyone eat the night before to keep from being light headed before you take communion in the morning?  That happens to me, and I was very bad last Sunday.  What can you eat that will keep you going the next morning without breakfast?

Carb load. Rices, pastas, white potatoes, etc. And eat later.

Carbs will make you hungry. It's not much beetter than eating candy to make you full. They spike your blood sugar and then you will crash.. Eat protein and fat.

[LizaSymonenko]

I cannot believe this is even an issue.

Unless the person, for medical reasons, needs to have water (necessary meds, pregnancy, etc.)...what is the problem of not eating or drinking for a few hours?

Seriously?

We cannot go for 5 or 6 hours without food or drink?  Really?

Even if you do "feel hungry"....overcome the feeling and keep going.  How often are we hungry at work, and yet we don't have the time to eat and just keep going?

A bit more discipline won't hurt us.

As for the comment of how would a bit of water, tea or food harm the "Body/Blood of Christ"....it wouldn't "harm" it...but, it's a sense of respect.  If you have a visitor coming to your home, don't you clean it up, dust and vacuum?  You have enough respect for the visitor that you don't lead them into the mess with magazines strewn all over the place, etc. 

[Nigula Qian Zishi]

I have a related question:  What does everyone eat the night before to keep from being light headed before you take communion in the morning?  That happens to me, and I was very bad last Sunday.  What can you eat that will keep you going the next morning without breakfast?

Carb load. Rices, pastas, white potatoes, etc. And eat later.

Carbs will make you hungry. It's not much beetter than eating candy to make you full. They spike your blood sugar and then you will crash.. Eat protein and fat.

Carbs take time to become sugars, that is why athetes carb load the night before a game or sporting event. You get the energy the next morning.

[Marc1152]

I cannot believe this is even an issue.

Unless the person, for medical reasons, needs to have water (necessary meds, pregnancy, etc.)...what is the problem of not eating or drinking for a few hours?

Seriously?

We cannot go for 5 or 6 hours without food or drink?  Really?

Even if you do "feel hungry"....overcome the feeling and keep going.  How often are we hungry at work, and yet we don't have the time to eat and just keep going?

A bit more discipline won't hurt us.

As for the comment of how would a bit of water, tea or food harm the "Body/Blood of Christ"....it wouldn't "harm" it...but, it's a sense of respect.  If you have a visitor coming to your home, don't you clean it up, dust and vacuum?  You have enough respect for the visitor that you don't lead them into the mess with magazines strewn all over the place, etc.  

Let's see. Go to bed at 11:00 pm. Drive to Church, attend liturgy recive communion at about 11:15. That's about 12 hours.

I have no problem doing without food. But I for one wake up bone dry. I run dyhydrated normally. Without a bit a water I am not sure I would be able to make it.

I have a parishioner friend who is a former Catholic Priest. He mentioned recently that the hardest thing for him is no water. I nodded but didn't mention that I cheat.  

[Punch]

I cannot believe this is even an issue.

As for the comment of how would a bit of water, tea or food harm the "Body/Blood of Christ"....it wouldn't "harm" it...but, it's a sense of respect.  If you have a visitor coming to your home, don't you clean it up, dust and vacuum?  You have enough respect for the visitor that you don't lead them into the mess with magazines strewn all over the place, etc. 

I don't believe it either.  Respect has nothing to do with it.  I still do not see how water is any worse than stomach acid.  But, if it makes you feel more pious, don't eat anything.  I have no problem having a cup of tea or coffee (with my priest's blessing) and have not one pang of concience for it.

[LizaSymonenko]

My comment of 5-6 hours, referred to "waking" hours.  I hardly count the hours I am off sleeping as "not eating" hours.

Not drinking water doesn't make me feel pious... not sure I can say the same for you with your coffee/tea/and better than Thou attitude.

Furthermore, the matter doesn't concern H20, or coffee, or tea, or a steak....it's a "fast".  You don't break your fast until after you have received the Body and Blood of Christ.

Just as many people strictly fast (no food or drink) on Holy Friday until after they have had an opportunity to fall on their knees before the Lord's shroud/Epitaphion, they fast before meeting the Lord in the Divine Liturgy.  I hardly think they are feeling "pious"....but, instead are doing what they can....to be prepared properly for that meeting.

However, if abstaining from food or drink makes one judge someone else in their personal adherence to what they think they should do and whether they are being pious or not...than it's better you should have that bloody steak before you enter the church.

Go for it.  Whatever your priest allows!

[Punch]

My comment of 5-6 hours, referred to "waking" hours.  I hardly count the hours I am off sleeping as "not eating" hours.

Not drinking water doesn't make me feel pious... not sure I can say the same for you with your coffee/tea/and better than Thou attitude.

Furthermore, the matter doesn't concern H20, or coffee, or tea, or a steak....it's a "fast".  You don't break your fast until after you have received the Body and Blood of Christ.

Just as many people strictly fast (no food or drink) on Holy Friday until after they have had an opportunity to fall on their knees before the Lord's shroud/Epitaphion, they fast before meeting the Lord in the Divine Liturgy.  I hardly think they are feeling "pious"....but, instead are doing what they can....to be prepared properly for that meeting.

However, if abstaining from food or drink makes one judge someone else in their personal adherence to what they think they should do and whether they are being pious or not...than it's better you should have that bloody steak before you enter the church.

Go for it.  Whatever your priest allows!

Even during the Great Fast, one is allowed to drink water, so you are not breaking a fast.  Perhaps we should change the Liturgy, too, while we are at it.  If a little water or tea is going to soil the new “home” for the Body of Christ, we probably should not pour hot water all over it in the chalice. 

I find it interesting that when confessing one’s sins prior to communing, an act that purifies the soul, the majority opinion seemed to be that it was not necessary for one reason or another.  Yet, it seems that drinking a little water (which makes up more than 70% of your body anyway, and is more pure than most of what is in your stomach and intestine) somehow defiles you.  It reminds me of the Pharisees who washed the outside of the cup but not the inside. 

BTW – who is talking about steak?  In any case, the fast, and type of fast, used pre-communion is a matter of tradition and piety.  The point that I am making is that, other than obedience, it serves no practical purpose to restrict water intake.  So, if your Church allows the consumption of water, tea, or even coffee, abstaining from such is for your own personal satisfaction and not for any theological purpose, hence the statement “if it makes you feel more pious”.  In any case, I should have said “if it makes one feel more pious” so that it did not sound like I was singling you out.  However, you seem to be one of those that likes to bat the word “judge” around a lot, particularly when referring to others.  Perhaps you thinking that I have a “better than thou” attitude is not a judgment in your mind?  How would I judge such a person anyway?  How the heck do I know what they had, or did not have, for breakfast?  If they think that it somehow shows more respect to not have anything in their stomach other than acid, I really could not care less.  I have attended “Orthodox” Churches where everyone communes, even though nearly nobody was at the previous evening’s services.  Many openly talk about having breakfast, and the Priest has a “don’t ask, don’t tell” attitude.  Do you think that I care?  I am not the one answering for either their actions or the Priest’s.  So again, what is to judge?  As long as my conscience is clear, I really don’t care about yours since I don’t answer for (or for that matter, to) you.  My views on water and communion are an OPINION, not a judgment.  It is really hard to have a “holier than thou” attitude when one really does not care what other people do or think.  But, if thinking that I have such an attitude makes you feel more pious, have at it.

As to going for what my Priest allows, thank you for your support!  I full well intend to do so.

[Fr. George]

Even during the Great Fast, one is allowed to drink water, so you are not breaking a fast.  Perhaps we should change the Liturgy, too, while we are at it.  If a little water or tea is going to soil the new “home” for the Body of Christ, we probably should not pour hot water all over it in the chalice. 

Different fasts, they are.  During the Great Fast, fasting is called for during an extended period of time (almost all day!), so a prohibition on water is fairly extreme.  A communion fast, however, is relatively short; if your parish begins Divine Liturgy at 9:30, and ends at, say, 11:30, and you wake up at, say, 7:30, then you're only without water for 4 hours while awake - that's not too bad.  Even if you wake up at 6am for 10am Liturgy that doesn't end until noon, that's 6 hours without water - a far cry from the prescription for fasting of the Great Fast, asking us to eat 1 meal in the evening and, thus, going 12 hours w/o food.

I find it interesting that when confessing one’s sins prior to communing, an act that purifies the soul, the majority opinion seemed to be that it was not necessary for one reason or another.  Yet, it seems that drinking a little water (which makes up more than 70% of your body anyway, and is more pure than most of what is in your stomach and intestine) somehow defiles you.  It reminds me of the Pharisees who washed the outside of the cup but not the inside.   

No, drinking water never "defiles you" - only sin does that.  I think you're trying too hard on your straw-man building.

[LizaSymonenko]

I find it interesting that when confessing one’s sins prior to communing, an act that purifies the soul, the majority opinion seemed to be that it was not necessary for one reason or another.  Yet, it seems that drinking a little water (which makes up more than 70% of your body anyway, and is more pure than most of what is in your stomach and intestine) somehow defiles you.  It reminds me of the Pharisees who washed the outside of the cup but not the inside.  

...just for the record...at my church everyone fasts from food and drink (except those with permission from the priest for a valid reason)....and everyone goes to Holy Confession....before daring to approach the Chalice.

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