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Author Topic: went to the mikvah yesterday...  (Read 6898 times) Average Rating: 0
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Tallitot
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« on: December 22, 2009, 12:06:03 AM »

...to complete my conversion process! I'm a real Jew now!
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« Reply #1 on: December 22, 2009, 12:07:39 AM »

Mazel tov!
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« Reply #2 on: December 22, 2009, 12:52:03 AM »

Mazel Tov!
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« Reply #3 on: December 22, 2009, 02:31:41 AM »

So you denied Christ.
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« Reply #4 on: December 22, 2009, 02:35:26 AM »

So you denied Christ.
was that a question or an observation?
« Last Edit: December 22, 2009, 02:40:12 AM by Tallitot » Logged

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« Reply #5 on: December 22, 2009, 02:51:52 AM »

more like a rhetorical question.
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« Reply #6 on: December 22, 2009, 02:59:37 AM »

Is apostasy a cause for celebration?  Or do you still somehow claim Christ in this "Jewish" setting?
« Last Edit: December 22, 2009, 02:59:44 AM by Alveus Lacuna » Logged
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« Reply #7 on: December 22, 2009, 03:04:22 AM »

Alveus and Augustin,
Even if you think someone has denied Christ, why would you force them to say it in public? 
Why wouldn't you try to avoid this at all cost?
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« Reply #8 on: December 22, 2009, 03:06:37 AM »

Is apostasy a cause for celebration?  Or do you still somehow claim Christ in this "Jewish" setting?
He got baptized to try to wash off his baptism.  Given the Jews' ideas about descent and religion  and all, I'm not sure what "real Jew" means.
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« Reply #9 on: December 22, 2009, 03:11:37 AM »

I feel we need to leave the OP alone in his decision.

Good night.
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« Reply #10 on: December 22, 2009, 03:21:04 AM »

Alveus and Augustin,
Even if you think someone has denied Christ, why would you force them to say it in public? 
Why wouldn't you try to avoid this at all cost?

Well, saying things out loud now is a good warm up for the Dread Judgment.  Facing reality could provide an impetus for repentance, if it is necessary.

Do you think that he will somehow be in better shape if he doesn't verbalize his denial of Christ?
« Last Edit: December 22, 2009, 03:21:37 AM by Alveus Lacuna » Logged
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« Reply #11 on: December 22, 2009, 03:23:00 AM »

Do you think that he will somehow be in better shape if he doesn't verbalize his denial of Christ?
Yes, as a matter of fact that is precisely what I am saying. But I wouldn't expect you to understand that.

« Last Edit: December 22, 2009, 03:25:42 AM by ozgeorge » Logged

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« Reply #12 on: December 22, 2009, 06:08:08 AM »

Is this a prayer request? Lord have mercy!
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« Reply #13 on: December 22, 2009, 07:05:34 AM »

Is this a prayer request?
No it isn't. And to use prayer to make some point is sacrilege.
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« Reply #14 on: December 22, 2009, 07:34:06 AM »

"I urge you, first of all, to pray for all people. Ask God to help them; intercede on their behalf, and give thanks for them...This is good, and pleases God our Savior, who wants all men to be saved and to come to the knowledge of the truth."

I'm not sure why else the OP would come onto a Christian forum and tell us this, if not to ask for our prayers.  Surely his intentions are not to seek acceptance or approval?

« Last Edit: December 22, 2009, 07:40:34 AM by Ortho_cat » Logged
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« Reply #15 on: December 22, 2009, 07:48:13 AM »

Surely his intentions are not to seek acceptance or approval?
Tallitot has a long history on this forum. Longer than you. He is telling us the latest in his life. If you can't accept him that's your problem, but you don't speak for me as an Orthodox Christian nor as a member of this forum. And you certainly don't speak for Christ.

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« Reply #16 on: December 22, 2009, 08:54:08 AM »

I think Christ speaks for Himself on the matter:

Jesus said to him, “I am the way, and the truth, and the life; no one comes to the Father but through Me.

Jn. 14:6
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« Reply #17 on: December 22, 2009, 09:05:03 AM »

So in fact you were using "prayer" to make a point. Thanks for clarifying.
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« Reply #18 on: December 22, 2009, 10:33:12 AM »

I can accept this as an important milestone in Tallitot's life.  As such, I genuinely wish him well.  What is difficult to understand is why I should be excited about it?  By his decision, he has denied Christ.  True, this is done everyday all over the world, but what should I say about it when it's posted on a Christian forum?  I can only think to say, "Lord, have mercy." 
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« Reply #19 on: December 22, 2009, 10:34:37 AM »

I feel we need to leave the OP alone in his decision.



 Except when the OP shares it on a public forum... just sayin'.
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« Reply #20 on: December 22, 2009, 10:37:58 AM »

Congratulations, Tallitot Smiley
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« Reply #21 on: December 22, 2009, 01:27:00 PM »

[Removed my own post and am leaving the thread.]
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« Reply #22 on: December 23, 2009, 03:29:09 PM »

If you're happy, then God bless you.  If you're not happy, then God bless you.

It's not (from my POV) the best decision in the world to leave Christianity, but I pray that you still end up in God's Eternal Kingdom.  Happy Hanukkah.
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« Reply #23 on: December 23, 2009, 03:54:40 PM »

Mazel Tov!
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« Reply #24 on: December 23, 2009, 09:03:56 PM »

Why isn't there a jewish sub-forum .....Just asking .... Grin
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« Reply #25 on: December 23, 2009, 11:20:42 PM »

Why isn't there a jewish sub-forum .....Just asking .... Grin

Or maybe we could simply learn to accept our fellow human brethren for who they are...just asking Wink
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« Reply #26 on: December 23, 2009, 11:23:04 PM »

Why isn't there a jewish sub-forum .....Just asking .... Grin

The Jews control the world. But if they had a subforum on every site, people would start getting suspicious. So, they are playing it smart by keeping a low profile.

(For those who aren't sure, yes, I'm joking)
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« Reply #27 on: December 23, 2009, 11:33:13 PM »

Why isn't there a jewish sub-forum .....Just asking .... Grin

Or maybe we could simply learn to accept our fellow human brethren for who they are...just asking Wink

And you've shown such a wonderful example for us.... Just saying ...   Wink
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« Reply #28 on: December 24, 2009, 12:18:55 AM »

Why isn't there a jewish sub-forum .....Just asking .... Grin

Or maybe we could simply learn to accept our fellow human brethren for who they are...just asking Wink

And you've shown such a wonderful example for us.... Just saying ...   Wink

Considering the biggoted neo-nazi crap I've seen on this thread, It'll take that as a complement...just saying Smiley
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« Reply #29 on: December 25, 2009, 07:59:29 AM »

I'm not gonna comment on how denying Messiah fits into Tallilot's decision to convert to Rabbinical Judaism, that's for our Master to decide on Judgement Day. Though do keep in mind that neither we, nor Tallilot himself, know if he will indeed still be a Jew on his death bed. Today is not Judgement day and anything can happen, we don't know the future, including our own futures. I will instead wish Tallilot well, may he be healthy and blessed.
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« Reply #30 on: December 25, 2009, 04:06:35 PM »

Why isn't there a jewish sub-forum .....Just asking .... Grin

Or maybe we could simply learn to accept our fellow human brethren for who they are...just asking Wink

And you've shown such a wonderful example for us.... Just saying ...   Wink

Considering the biggoted neo-nazi crap I've seen on this thread, It'll take that as a complement...just saying Smiley
So because some folks express concern that a former Orthodox Christian has decided to become Jewish, you equate that with bigotry and neo-nazism?  That's quite an assertion, but since you continuously forget the purpose of this forum it makes sense why you would say something so goofy. 
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« Reply #31 on: December 25, 2009, 05:18:00 PM »

Why isn't there a jewish sub-forum .....Just asking .... Grin

Or maybe we could simply learn to accept our fellow human brethren for who they are...just asking Wink

Yes, we can all go live in Flat Land. All choices are equal, it's the fact that a choice has been made which is central. Keep everything grey. No right or wrong or anything in between. No Absolute Truth, just your own whims and feelings. Personal happiness is the ultimate goal so keeping everthing equal gives you a fair shot.

pass 
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« Reply #32 on: December 25, 2009, 05:19:51 PM »

So because some folks express concern
Stop worrying. It causes wrinkles and changes nothing. Its wasted energy.
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« Reply #33 on: December 25, 2009, 05:23:47 PM »

I dont know if you have explained your conversion before, but I would like to know your reasons. I am a Jew who converted to Christianity. My vote cancels yours Smiley
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« Reply #34 on: December 26, 2009, 12:24:28 AM »

So much that could be written about this from the Scriptures, the Fathers, and the Canons.  But, who wants to read the writings of Obersturmbahnfuhrer Paul, or Kreisleiter Ambrose, or for that matter, Reichsfuhrer Jesus, as quoted in the Gospel written by Gauleiter John.  Amazing that anyone who actually believes the teachings of the Orthodox Church is now a Nazi.  If only a dear departed Serbian Priest of mine would have known that when he was in Dachau with St. Nikolai (an Orthodox Saint who is considered to be "anti-Semitic" by many for his writings).   
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« Reply #35 on: December 26, 2009, 03:09:37 AM »

I dont know if you have explained your conversion before, but I would like to know your reasons. I am a Jew who converted to Christianity. My vote cancels yours Smiley

Cool. I would love to hear your story. I know of one other man who converted from Judaism to Eastern Orthodoxy.
He is married to a Syrian-American woman and attends a parish full of immigrants from Palestine and Israel.
The cultures actually mesh together quite nicely.
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« Reply #36 on: December 26, 2009, 03:12:17 AM »

I dont know if you have explained your conversion before, but I would like to know your reasons.

I'm curious about that also.  I haven't asked about that until now, only because I didn't want to be invasive.  However, I do think it would help us understand you if you explained why you left Christianity.  Specifically, I'm wondering if there was ever a time you believed in the divinity of Christ and whether something specific happened to make you abandon that belief. 

I don't mean to get too personal.  If this makes you uncomfortable, or if you just don't feel like answering, then you don't have to answer.  I just think it would help us understand where you are coming from.   Smiley
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« Reply #37 on: February 02, 2010, 10:23:16 PM »

This is interesting.  I hope that you find the peace that you are looking for in life and the spiritual font which offers wisdom.  Jews, while not Christian, have a lot of wisdom in their scriptures and teachings which is useful in navigating through everyday life.



« Last Edit: February 02, 2010, 10:26:38 PM by Robb » Logged

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« Reply #38 on: July 19, 2010, 02:07:57 PM »

Cool. I would love to hear your story. I know of one other man who converted from Judaism to Eastern Orthodoxy.
He is married to a Syrian-American woman and attends a parish full of immigrants from Palestine and Israel.
The cultures actually mesh together quite nicely.

Tallitot,

I would very much like to hear your story, and how the conversion has been. Please don't worry about any negative comments.  I am sorry to hear that the Orthodox priest was mean to you.


One thing you can please help me with is whether there is prejudice in the moderate - orthodox Jewish religious Community against those who were not born ethnically Jewish. Is this real or not? Or is it just in the State of Israel?

Quote
I recall a Greek Orthodox woman who converted to Judaism. One day, she confided to me how difficult it had been. On the one hand, there were still Jews who questioned her "authenticity," though her family was active in their Reform synagogue and their children had all had a Jewish education. On the other hand, given the deep link among family, church, and identity in Greek culture, her relatives couldn't quite accept her decision, creating permanent tension with people she loved.

Or take the case of a young woman who was the daughter of a European foreign minister. She was always interested in Judaism growing up, she said, and took the leap when she met an Israeli man. She converted through the Conservative movement in the US, but it wasn't good enough for the Jewish community back home [in Israel]. The minister called and asked for our help. He was flabbergasted. He couldn't grasp why, after all the intense study his daughter had gone through, she was still kept at arm's length by local Jewish leaders [in Israel]. Eventually, things worked out, but not before some ill feelings were created.

David Harris, In the Trenches: A welcome or a wall? , Jerusalem Post
http://cgis.jpost.com/Blogs/harris/entry/a_welcome_or_a_wall

Shalom. Peace. Salaam.
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« Reply #39 on: July 19, 2010, 03:59:40 PM »

With all due respect to everyone posting in this thread, one this is evident; the category in which this thread was posted in. I believe debate is in fact what one is supposed to do, at the very least discuss the thread. Had it have been posted in a different section, certain comments here would be unacceptable, otherwise I think they are appropriate. What can I say, I am a constitutionalist Smiley

nonetheless, mazol tov!
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« Reply #40 on: July 21, 2010, 06:15:54 PM »

Talliot,
I'll echo what Fr. George said God Bless.
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« Reply #41 on: July 21, 2010, 06:29:29 PM »

Why not Orthodox Judaism?
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« Reply #42 on: July 22, 2010, 03:12:54 AM »

Quick question: do you have to get re-circumcised if you were already circumcised in a secular hospital?

Curiousity only
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« Reply #43 on: July 22, 2010, 03:23:45 AM »

Jewish Attitudes Toward Proselytes

At times, Jews have embraced large numbers of converts, but hostile relations with Gentile neighbors often led to suspicion of proselytes as well.?

http://www.myjewishlearning.com/beliefs/Issues/Jews_and_Non-Jews/Attitudes_Toward_Non-Jews/Converts.shtml

Biblical Times
Those Gentiles who were members of Israelite society were known as gerim (strangers or foreigners), and the Bible repeatedly emphasizes the obligation to welcome such people.

Jews in biblical times were open to prospective proselytes, but they did not see it as their mission to convert Gentiles. [Not sure the author is right.]

Rabbinic Times
The most famous negative statement in the Talmud about converts was made by Rabbi Helbo, who believed proselytes were "as troublesome as a sore." Most sages appear to have disagreed with Helbo, however, and tried to list specific historical circumstances which led him to this conclusion. Most prominent among these was the fact that the proselyte and his new Jewish community often suffered punishment from Christian leaders following a conversion.

The Middle Ages

...On the other hand, the Zohar (the classic work of kabbalah, medieval Jewish mysticism) strikes a different chord. The Zohar emphasizes the superior position of the born Jew in relation to the proselyte. [Huh?]This theme probably reflects the extent to which Jews felt persecuted and, consequently, entirely separate from the Gentile majority.

Today's "Jews by choice" are in large part accepted by American Jewry. Most Jews consider them a welcome addition to a community struggling to ensure its own survival in future generations. Yet even as they might fully accept proselytes as co-religionists, American Jews often feel that Jews-by-choice cannot fully share the bond of Jewish ethnicity, peoplehood, or history--at least not immediately. The contemporary situation is especially complex in Israel, where only conversions performed by Orthodox rabbis are regarded as legitimate.

============================================================

The author seems to say that in Old Testament times it wasn't this way.
So, is this looking down on non-ethnic Jews as spiritually inferior just something from Zohar and somehow a reaction to Christian persecution?

Regards.
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Faith: Orthodox Christian
Jurisdiction: OCA (Diocese of Eastern Pennsylvania)
Posts: 7,006


"My god is greater."


« Reply #44 on: July 22, 2010, 09:04:47 AM »

Quick question: do you have to get re-circumcised if you were already circumcised in a secular hospital?

Curiousity only

Yes, but it's not really a re-circumcision- the mohel would just ritually prick you with a needle.
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"A riddle or the cricket's cry
Is to doubt a fit reply." - William Blake
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