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Marc1152
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« Reply #90 on: December 23, 2009, 03:01:12 PM »

How very anarchistic of you Smiley

I don't think the proper way to discuss nutritional idea's is to take such cheap shots. The Weston Price Foundation is a humble little organization. To miss represent them like you have is really bizarre and unnecessary. My Church has a board of directors and an IRS incorporation. We collect dues. We own some property. I bet your Church does too.

If you have some disagreement with the idea's of the Weston Price Foundation, then we can without rancour have a discussion and learn from each other. There is no need to go into  attack mode.  
Marc1152 - Somehow, I think our wires got crossed! Undecided
I wasn't taking cheapshots. It is the way I see the world. I trust the Church and do not think of it in the same way as corporations. The Church is required to fill out forms, hold a board meeting, and other functions to operate within the boundaries which the state has set. Without it, it can not function legally. You are correct, our church does own land and quite a bit (nearly 2 acres) with apartments, houses, a greenhouse garden, and a full communal kitchen to feed the homeless. But I don't think of this as a corporation per se, in negative terms. Infact, not all corporations are corrupt and I am not accusing Weston Price of such. I am however automatically distrusting of books and foundations which set themselves in a position which can interfere in the political arena (which in my mind is corrupt). And, maybe you find it "Anarchistic" of me to distrust said types of corporations...I dunno, maybe it's a streak that runs through my veins. I'm not offended by it. I do have some incendiary thoughts about the corrupt state of the world systems. There is sufficient enough evidence to support my claims (to find out those claims, pm me) too, I think.
But - as I said before,
"If I support the eating of good healthy food, I won't go overboard, I will support my local farmers, ranchers and dairys. And I won't risk the health of my children on spoiled fruit juices and dairy products. If I want fresh, I either milk it myself or juice it and drink it right away, otherwise I'll buy it pasturized thanks. I'm not overly concerned with my health to the point of where I'm going to spend gobs of time and money trying to make it perfect."
I think there is enough common ground to go on having a meaningful discussion. However you seem bent on a pulpit monologue as a spokesperson for Weston Price and if disagreeing with you makes me your antagonist, than that is a healthy debate.
Myrrh just raised an interesting point. What say you?  

  

Calling the Weston Price Foundation "A Corporation" is meant to be pejorative. Implying that they are corrupt and then making up a story (out of whole cloth) that they "Are the Lobbying Arm for the Meat and Dairy Industry" is wrong, unfair and a cheap shot by any measure. I think you should not worry about discrediting people who have different opinions than you and simply stick to the subject at hand.

I already agreed with Myrrh. To repeat, there is always a choice between good, better and best. How you line that up is certainly up to you. If someone has a different list then you, it's not okay attack them. This was meant to be a rather benign thread. Hopefully you can restrain your impulse to question peoples motivation and just write about Nutrition and Diet.

Thanks
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« Reply #91 on: December 23, 2009, 03:14:24 PM »

Well, now that this has been debated quite a bit, time to move on.

How about the beer & chips diet? Wink
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« Reply #92 on: December 23, 2009, 03:48:49 PM »



Calling the Weston Price Foundation "A Corporation" is meant to be pejorative. Implying that they are corrupt and then making up a story (out of whole cloth) that they "Are the Lobbying Arm for the Meat and Dairy Industry" is wrong, unfair and a cheap shot by any measure. I think you should not worry about discrediting people who have different opinions than you and simply stick to the subject at hand.

I already agreed with Myrrh. To repeat, there is always a choice between good, better and best. How you line that up is certainly up to you. If someone has a different list then you, it's not okay attack them. This was meant to be a rather benign thread. Hopefully you can restrain your impulse to question peoples motivation and just write about Nutrition and Diet.

Thanks
"Are the Lobbying Arm for the Meat and Dairy Industry" - this is not my quote. Huh
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« Reply #93 on: December 23, 2009, 03:59:36 PM »

If you don't want to go back 10,000 years,  just go back 60 and eat like grandmother. No highly refined foods, lots of meat full fat, raw whole milk and cheese, vegetables and fruit. Liver once per week.....etc.

The diet that your grandmother ate was probably all right for her because people of her time moved around much more than we do today, unless you want to go the gym rat route to stave off gaining weight. Many people today live a desk-jockey life, which doesn't seem to be in line with the high fat content that Grandmother's diet would entail.

There is a dilemma with understanding the role of fats. The problem is that when people ate saturated fats the incidence of Heart Disease was very low. Once saturated fats were demonized and there was a change to vegetable oils, and low fat eating, Heat Disease rates sored. Therefore, in order not to consider the change to low fat as the culprit, alternative explanations like being less active than previous generations are put forward.

There are a couple of problems with this. In the first place Heart Disease seems to effect both the active and inactive in our society. The list of athletes who drop dead from Heart Attacks is pretty long. Remember Jim Fix? As I recall, he was a long distance runner, very thin guy, who died of a massive coronary. 

But the most important evidence is the lack of good science linking ingestion of saturated fats with Heart Disease. There is even less evidence from what I have read that high colesterol causes Heart Disease. In fact, there is some indication that very low cholesterol counts may be linked to some forms of cancer.

Here are a couple links:


 http://www.hhcc.us/cholesterol.htm

http://www.ravnskov.nu/cholesterol.htm

I think, when it comes to saturated fats, there is a difference in them on the structure and length of the molecular chain. The saturated fat from animals is somehow different from the saturated fat of plant-based food sources. I'm not sure, but there's a lot of opinions and "research" and whatnot.

I do agree that humans are much better off mostly abstaining from processed foods. I say "mostly" 'cause there's no way in Hades you can keep me away from mac n cheese! Wink In taking a gander at the biology of the human digestive system and teeth, I wonder if humankind should just stick to an non-processed omnivore diet, save some trees from all these diet books, and move on. Omnivore: group hug between hippy vegetarians and happy meat-eaters! Tongue
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« Reply #94 on: December 23, 2009, 04:05:16 PM »

Well, now that this has been debated quite a bit, time to move on.

How about the beer & chips diet? Wink

I'm there.
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« Reply #95 on: December 23, 2009, 04:10:04 PM »

If you don't want to go back 10,000 years,  just go back 60 and eat like grandmother. No highly refined foods, lots of meat full fat, raw whole milk and cheese, vegetables and fruit. Liver once per week.....etc.

The diet that your grandmother ate was probably all right for her because people of her time moved around much more than we do today, unless you want to go the gym rat route to stave off gaining weight. Many people today live a desk-jockey life, which doesn't seem to be in line with the high fat content that Grandmother's diet would entail.

There is a dilemma with understanding the role of fats. The problem is that when people ate saturated fats the incidence of Heart Disease was very low. Once saturated fats were demonized and there was a change to vegetable oils, and low fat eating, Heat Disease rates sored. Therefore, in order not to consider the change to low fat as the culprit, alternative explanations like being less active than previous generations are put forward.

There are a couple of problems with this. In the first place Heart Disease seems to effect both the active and inactive in our society. The list of athletes who drop dead from Heart Attacks is pretty long. Remember Jim Fix? As I recall, he was a long distance runner, very thin guy, who died of a massive coronary. 

But the most important evidence is the lack of good science linking ingestion of saturated fats with Heart Disease. There is even less evidence from what I have read that high colesterol causes Heart Disease. In fact, there is some indication that very low cholesterol counts may be linked to some forms of cancer.

Here are a couple links:


 http://www.hhcc.us/cholesterol.htm

http://www.ravnskov.nu/cholesterol.htm

I think, when it comes to saturated fats, there is a difference in them on the structure and length of the molecular chain. The saturated fat from animals is somehow different from the saturated fat of plant-based food sources. I'm not sure, but there's a lot of opinions and "research" and whatnot.

I do agree that humans are much better off mostly abstaining from processed foods. I say "mostly" 'cause there's no way in Hades you can keep me away from mac n cheese! Wink In taking a gander at the biology of the human digestive system and teeth, I wonder if humankind should just stick to an non-processed omnivore diet, save some trees from all these diet books, and move on. Omnivore: group hug between hippy vegetarians and happy meat-eaters! Tongue
my omnivore eats hippies. Grin
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« Reply #96 on: December 23, 2009, 04:11:10 PM »

Well, now that this has been debated quite a bit, time to move on.

How about the beer & chips diet? Wink

I'm there.
Beer and chips diet for me can last about 2 hours...maybe per month. And I know the results first hand...not pretty. Tongue
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« Reply #97 on: December 23, 2009, 04:55:03 PM »

Well, now that this has been debated quite a bit, time to move on.

How about the beer & chips diet? Wink

I'm glad I didn't clarify whether I was referring to "crisps" or "fries" with my "chips" comment.
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« Reply #98 on: December 23, 2009, 10:10:29 PM »

If you don't want to go back 10,000 years,  just go back 60 and eat like grandmother. No highly refined foods, lots of meat full fat, raw whole milk and cheese, vegetables and fruit. Liver once per week.....etc.

The diet that your grandmother ate was probably all right for her because people of her time moved around much more than we do today, unless you want to go the gym rat route to stave off gaining weight. Many people today live a desk-jockey life, which doesn't seem to be in line with the high fat content that Grandmother's diet would entail.

There is a dilemma with understanding the role of fats. The problem is that when people ate saturated fats the incidence of Heart Disease was very low. Once saturated fats were demonized and there was a change to vegetable oils, and low fat eating, Heat Disease rates sored. Therefore, in order not to consider the change to low fat as the culprit, alternative explanations like being less active than previous generations are put forward.

There are a couple of problems with this. In the first place Heart Disease seems to effect both the active and inactive in our society. The list of athletes who drop dead from Heart Attacks is pretty long. Remember Jim Fix? As I recall, he was a long distance runner, very thin guy, who died of a massive coronary. 

But the most important evidence is the lack of good science linking ingestion of saturated fats with Heart Disease. There is even less evidence from what I have read that high colesterol causes Heart Disease. In fact, there is some indication that very low cholesterol counts may be linked to some forms of cancer.

Here are a couple links:


 http://www.hhcc.us/cholesterol.htm

http://www.ravnskov.nu/cholesterol.htm

I think, when it comes to saturated fats, there is a difference in them on the structure and length of the molecular chain. The saturated fat from animals is somehow different from the saturated fat of plant-based food sources. I'm not sure, but there's a lot of opinions and "research" and whatnot.

I do agree that humans are much better off mostly abstaining from processed foods. I say "mostly" 'cause there's no way in Hades you can keep me away from mac n cheese! Wink In taking a gander at the biology of the human digestive system and teeth, I wonder if humankind should just stick to an non-processed omnivore diet, save some trees from all these diet books, and move on. Omnivore: group hug between hippy vegetarians and happy meat-eaters! Tongue
my omnivore eats hippies. Grin

A lot of hippies are vegetarians, so at least you're getting your veggies! Grin
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« Reply #99 on: December 23, 2009, 10:19:13 PM »

Well, now that this has been debated quite a bit, time to move on.

How about the beer & chips diet? Wink

Thick sliced and deep fried, with sea salt and vinegar thank you very much.  And a Paulaner's Hefe Weizen to wash it down with.  Not to sound too picky...  Smiley
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« Reply #100 on: December 23, 2009, 10:34:19 PM »

Well, now that this has been debated quite a bit, time to move on.

How about the beer & chips diet? Wink

Thick sliced and deep fried, with sea salt and vinegar thank you very much.  And a Paulaner's Hefe Weizen to wash it down with.  Not to sound too picky...  Smiley
I'll take a tall Choclate Stout with a huge bowl of Poutine (I like my chips covered in gravy!)
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« Reply #101 on: December 23, 2009, 10:53:40 PM »

I had a footlong Chicken Fajita sub today, with extra banana peppers... mmmmm! But we seem to be getting off track on this thread, lol angel
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« Reply #102 on: December 23, 2009, 11:28:25 PM »

I'll take a tall Choclate Stout with a huge bowl of Poutine (I like my chips covered in gravy!)

If you are in ever in and around Montreal in the summer, check out Chez Bernard in Sainte-Madeleine.  They have some of the best poutine around.  Grin
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« Reply #103 on: December 24, 2009, 12:06:48 PM »

Well, now that this has been debated quite a bit, time to move on.

How about the beer & chips diet? Wink

Thick sliced and deep fried, with sea salt and vinegar thank you very much.  And a Paulaner's Hefe Weizen to wash it down with.  Not to sound too picky...  Smiley
Vinegar's the only sauce for chips. Ketchup is way too sugary. And although I do like Paulaner's, I've discovered recently the Leinenkugel Sunset Wheat. It's fantastic.

www.leinie.com
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« Reply #104 on: December 24, 2009, 12:22:22 PM »

I'll take a tall Choclate Stout with a huge bowl of Poutine (I like my chips covered in gravy!)

If you are in ever in and around Montreal in the summer, check out Chez Bernard in Sainte-Madeleine.  They have some of the best poutine around.  Grin
Sounds awesome! Wish I lived there...alas, I'm in Oregon. But the wife and I want to take a trip to Montreal one day. Have you been to a restaurant out there called Les Jardins d' Savages?
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« Reply #105 on: December 24, 2009, 01:17:07 PM »

If you don't want to go back 10,000 years,  just go back 60 and eat like grandmother. No highly refined foods, lots of meat full fat, raw whole milk and cheese, vegetables and fruit. Liver once per week.....etc.

The diet that your grandmother ate was probably all right for her because people of her time moved around much more than we do today, unless you want to go the gym rat route to stave off gaining weight. Many people today live a desk-jockey life, which doesn't seem to be in line with the high fat content that Grandmother's diet would entail.

There is a dilemma with understanding the role of fats. The problem is that when people ate saturated fats the incidence of Heart Disease was very low. Once saturated fats were demonized and there was a change to vegetable oils, and low fat eating, Heat Disease rates sored. Therefore, in order not to consider the change to low fat as the culprit, alternative explanations like being less active than previous generations are put forward.

There are a couple of problems with this. In the first place Heart Disease seems to effect both the active and inactive in our society. The list of athletes who drop dead from Heart Attacks is pretty long. Remember Jim Fix? As I recall, he was a long distance runner, very thin guy, who died of a massive coronary. 

But the most important evidence is the lack of good science linking ingestion of saturated fats with Heart Disease. There is even less evidence from what I have read that high cholesterol causes Heart Disease. In fact, there is some indication that very low cholesterol counts may be linked to some forms of cancer.

Here are a couple links:


 http://www.hhcc.us/cholesterol.htm

http://www.ravnskov.nu/cholesterol.htm

I think, when it comes to saturated fats, there is a difference in them on the structure and length of the molecular chain. The saturated fat from animals is somehow different from the saturated fat of plant-based food sources. I'm not sure, but there's a lot of opinions and "research" and whatnot.

I do agree that humans are much better off mostly abstaining from processed foods. I say "mostly" 'cause there's no way in Hades you can keep me away from mac n cheese! Wink In taking a gander at the biology of the human digestive system and teeth, I wonder if humankind should just stick to an non-processed omnivore diet, save some trees from all these diet books, and move on. Omnivore: group hug between hippy vegetarians and happy meat-eaters! Tongue

My understanding is that Coconut Oil (fat from the Coconut) is "Medium Chain" Fatty acid and is the most easily digested. I have found all kinds of benefits from using Coconut Oil. We even use it topically for aches and pains and dry skin etc. It works wonders.

As far as animal fats go there is certainly controversy. The standard dogma is that it is bad for you. But if you look at the research and the criticisms it seems to me that the evidence linking saturated fats to heart problems is very thin. The alternative theory is that the absence of these fats in or diets lately has caused problems. In any event the link between eating saturated fats and having high cholesterol is virtually nonexistent. That really shocks me.

I agree that the natural diet for Humans is Omnivore. Meat, lots of vegetables and fruit, etc. I would add raw milk and cheese but I agree.
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« Reply #106 on: December 24, 2009, 01:19:04 PM »



Calling the Weston Price Foundation "A Corporation" is meant to be pejorative. Implying that they are corrupt and then making up a story (out of whole cloth) that they "Are the Lobbying Arm for the Meat and Dairy Industry" is wrong, unfair and a cheap shot by any measure. I think you should not worry about discrediting people who have different opinions than you and simply stick to the subject at hand.

I already agreed with Myrrh. To repeat, there is always a choice between good, better and best. How you line that up is certainly up to you. If someone has a different list then you, it's not okay attack them. This was meant to be a rather benign thread. Hopefully you can restrain your impulse to question peoples motivation and just write about Nutrition and Diet.

Thanks
"Are the Lobbying Arm for the Meat and Dairy Industry" - this is not my quote. Huh

Wow sorry.. I confused you and Nacho who said that.. I must have been drunk on Beer and Chips.
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« Reply #107 on: December 24, 2009, 01:22:07 PM »

Well, now that this has been debated quite a bit, time to move on.

How about the beer & chips diet? Wink

Thick sliced and deep fried, with sea salt and vinegar thank you very much.  And a Paulaner's Hefe Weizen to wash it down with.  Not to sound too picky...  Smiley
I'll take a tall Choclate Stout with a huge bowl of Poutine (I like my chips covered in gravy!)

Have you been to Baltimore ( "Charm City"). The standard way to eat French Fries ( Chips) is covered with gravy.
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« Reply #108 on: December 24, 2009, 01:45:30 PM »

Wow sorry.. I confused you and Nacho who said that.. I must have been drunk on Beer and Chips.

LOL

Have you been to Baltimore ( "Charm City"). The standard way to eat French Fries ( Chips) is covered with gravy.

Hmmm - I suppose it would depend on the gravy whether or not I would enjoy that.  I do like Belgian-style (FF with spiced mayonnaise) chips better than the prospect of gravy, though.
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« Reply #109 on: December 24, 2009, 02:45:50 PM »

Well, now that this has been debated quite a bit, time to move on.

How about the beer & chips diet? Wink

Thick sliced and deep fried, with sea salt and vinegar thank you very much.  And a Paulaner's Hefe Weizen to wash it down with.  Not to sound too picky...  Smiley
I'll take a tall Choclate Stout with a huge bowl of Poutine (I like my chips covered in gravy!)

Have you been to Baltimore ( "Charm City"). The standard way to eat French Fries ( Chips) is covered with gravy.
No, but I'm familiar with the dish. Poutine is FF (short cut) with chicken gravy and melted cheese curds. To go a step further, add fried chichen livers. It was very foreign to me at first but Quebecois food is my new thing because I see so many similarities between it and Northwest cuisine (my style of cooking).
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« Reply #110 on: December 24, 2009, 02:50:48 PM »

Sounds awesome! Wish I lived there...alas, I'm in Oregon. But the wife and I want to take a trip to Montreal one day. Have you been to a restaurant out there called Les Jardins d' Savages?

In Saint-Roch-de-l'Achigan?  Yup!  A couple years ago.  It was a fascinating experience, to learn about the variety of products that grow in the wild that you could turn into a great meal.  The duck was amazing, and the place is a Mecca for mushroom lovers.  http://soupnancy.squarespace.com/recipes/ is the chef's blog where she hosts previous menus, information on ingredients, and even some recipes.  Smiley
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« Reply #111 on: December 24, 2009, 02:55:50 PM »

Sounds awesome! Wish I lived there...alas, I'm in Oregon. But the wife and I want to take a trip to Montreal one day. Have you been to a restaurant out there called Les Jardins d' Savages?

In Saint-Roch-de-l'Achigan?  Yup!  A couple years ago.  It was a fascinating experience, to learn about the variety of products that grow in the wild that you could turn into a great meal.  The duck was amazing, and the place is a Mecca for mushroom lovers.  http://soupnancy.squarespace.com/recipes/ is the chef's blog where she hosts previous menus, information on ingredients, and even some recipes.  Smiley
I know. She's a mentor and pen pal of mine. We specialize in the same cuisine approach. I teach wild food cooking at a cooking school here in Oregon (mushroom Capitol of the /US) .
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« Reply #112 on: December 24, 2009, 03:04:42 PM »

Nice, I have always that style of cooking.  My main experience with it is "survival cooking" though, from back when I was in military cadets.  In other words, dry, stringy, slightly burnt squirrel that was skewered and cooked over a flame. laugh
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« Reply #113 on: December 24, 2009, 03:24:12 PM »

Nice, I have always that style of cooking.  My main experience with it is "survival cooking" though, from back when I was in military cadets.  In other words, dry, stringy, slightly burnt squirrel that was skewered and cooked over a flame. laugh
That's actually very similar to how I got into Wild Foods! I was raised by my "survivalist "let's get ready for the Apocolypse" Father as a teenager. When I became a chef, and found you could actually make wild foods taste good, I went for it head first! How about braised squirrel with wild fennel, ramp, morels and fern fronds? Much better I think. Cheesy Wink

I'm hosting an upcoming Truffle booth at the Local Oregon Truffle Festival soon. It's too bad you are in CA. I love to spoil my friends with good food.
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« Reply #114 on: January 02, 2010, 02:30:42 PM »

In todays Washington Post (Sat.1/2/10), there is a great feature article about the Hunter - Gatherer Diet ("Paleo-Diet")


This link should work but if not go to the Washington Post web page and search on either Paleo Diet or Hunter Gatherer.

http://www.washingtonpost.com/ac2/wp-dyn/NewsSearch?st=paleo%20diet&

 
 
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« Reply #115 on: January 02, 2010, 10:20:30 PM »

^ The article requires registration. The Post say it's free, but I don't really feel like registering just to see what someone thinks about the newest fad diet that's based on questionable history and even worse science.
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« Reply #116 on: January 02, 2010, 10:28:13 PM »

^ The article requires registration. The Post say it's free, but I don't really feel like registering just to see what someone thinks about the newest fad diet that's based on questionable history and even worse science.

People who start eating healthier often notice that their anger issues subside. You should look into it.
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« Reply #117 on: January 03, 2010, 06:26:41 PM »

^ The article requires registration. The Post say it's free, but I don't really feel like registering just to see what someone thinks about the newest fad diet that's based on questionable history and even worse science.

People who start eating healthier often notice that their anger issues subside. You should look into it.
Anger. laugh Sure, that's what this is about.
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« Reply #118 on: January 03, 2010, 06:56:24 PM »

^ The article requires registration. The Post say it's free, but I don't really feel like registering just to see what someone thinks about the newest fad diet that's based on questionable history and even worse science.

People who start eating healthier often notice that their anger issues subside. You should look into it.
Anger. laugh Sure, that's what this is about.

"This" is about nutrition and diet. "Your" hostile and aggresive reactions are werid and uncalled for..
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« Reply #119 on: January 03, 2010, 07:15:28 PM »

^ The article requires registration. The Post say it's free, but I don't really feel like registering just to see what someone thinks about the newest fad diet that's based on questionable history and even worse science.

People who start eating healthier often notice that their anger issues subside. You should look into it.
Anger. laugh Sure, that's what this is about.

"This" is about nutrition and diet. "Your" hostile and aggresive reactions are werid and uncalled for..
I post on subjects I care about. I care about nutrition and diet. You are arguing that al of us ought to eat according to this unproven fad diet, and then you dodge all questions about it, preferring instead to parrot the advert for this diet book. I'm sorry you feel I'm being hostile, but you chose to become the salesperson for this guy's book.
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« Reply #120 on: January 03, 2010, 07:37:18 PM »

^ The article requires registration. The Post say it's free, but I don't really feel like registering just to see what someone thinks about the newest fad diet that's based on questionable history and even worse science.

People who start eating healthier often notice that their anger issues subside. You should look into it.
Anger. laugh Sure, that's what this is about.

"This" is about nutrition and diet. "Your" hostile and aggressive reactions are weird and uncalled for..
I post on subjects I care about. I care about nutrition and diet. You are arguing that al of us ought to eat according to this unproven fad diet, and then you dodge all questions about it, preferring instead to parrot the advert for this diet book. I'm sorry you feel I'm being hostile, but you chose to become the salesperson for this guy's book.

Hello..?  You have not been reading carefully. I have stated over and over that I follow the Weston Price type diet. I have posted their link about two dozen times. There are several serious differences between the Weston Price type of Traditional Diet and the Paleo Diet. For example, I use raw Milk and dairy, a big no no on the Paleo diet. Weston Price also emphasizes eating animal fat, the Paleo Diet is much more politically correct. One of the most scathing reviews of the Paleo Diet is by Sally Fallon, President of the Weston Price Foundation.

I also linked you to a feature article in the Washington Post, not an ad. The fact that you couldn't bare to read an article from a major paper is just a bit over the top IMHO.

Read ----Comprehend ---Comment --- Suggest alternatives. That's the ticket !
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« Reply #121 on: January 05, 2010, 09:43:49 PM »

politically correct
What do you mean by this term?
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« Reply #122 on: January 06, 2010, 01:11:25 PM »

politically correct
What do you mean by this term?

Dr. Cordain ( author of the Paleo Diet) sticks to the Establishment view of fats.


For example it is hard to believe that Paleo Man didn't eat the chicken ( bird) skin or passed up the fat on the animals he ate.

Go to : http://www.westonaprice.org/The-Paleo-Diet-by-Loren-Cordain.html

Sally Fallon , President of the Weston Price Foundation wrote a scathing review. I personally think the Plaeo Diet has some very good points. This is a bit of an inside baseball fight between two camps that both recommend meat based "Traditional " Diets
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« Reply #123 on: January 08, 2010, 01:59:56 PM »

Okay, what do you mean by this term? And while you're at it, you might as well define that first one too.
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« Reply #124 on: January 08, 2010, 02:44:43 PM »

Okay, what do you mean by this term? And while you're at it, you might as well define that first one too.

I am really not sure what you want.


I'll give it a shot.

Important factions within the Food Industry have villifed Saturated Fat and framed them as the villain for Chronic Heart Disease (CHD). This is based on what is called the Lipid Theory of Heart Disease. The replacement for Traditional Fats in our Diets ( Animal Fat, Whole Milk , Butter, etc.) has been vegetable oils, soy products and transfats ( artificial fat). The results have been just the opposite of the claims and there has been a massive increase in CHD.

The Vegetable Oil and Soy industry as well as the Pharmaceutical Industry have big big money at stake convincing you that low fat diets and low Cholesterol levels prevent CHD and that their products are "Healthy Alternatives" . The evidence that their claims are true it nonexistent..It's a scam on a massive and shocking scale. Money talks.

Dr. Cordain is on the Board of the Amercan Heat Association ( see 'Establishment"). If he doesn't tow the line on fats and CHD  he would be consigned to the outer reaches and his core message ( eat a more natural diet like Hunter Gatherers) would not be heard by what I assume is the audience he wants to reach.

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« Reply #125 on: January 08, 2010, 09:11:37 PM »

I see. Well, I don't choose my diet based on what screws the Man. Have fun with your hippie food.
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« Reply #126 on: January 08, 2010, 09:23:15 PM »

I see. Well, I don't choose my diet based on what screws the Man. Have fun with your hippie food.

I don't think Red Meat, Butter and Whole Raw Milk has ever been considered "Hippie Food". I think that's something more like tofu and granola.   
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« Reply #127 on: January 09, 2010, 01:56:36 AM »

Nice, I have always that style of cooking.  My main experience with it is "survival cooking" though, from back when I was in military cadets.  In other words, dry, stringy, slightly burnt squirrel that was skewered and cooked over a flame. laugh
That's actually very similar to how I got into Wild Foods! I was raised by my "survivalist "let's get ready for the Apocolypse" Father as a teenager. When I became a chef, and found you could actually make wild foods taste good, I went for it head first! How about braised squirrel with wild fennel, ramp, morels and fern fronds? Much better I think. Cheesy Wink

I'm hosting an upcoming Truffle booth at the Local Oregon Truffle Festival soon. It's too bad you are in CA. I love to spoil my friends with good food.

My family used to make money by gathering truffles on family hikes and selling them. Growing up in the great green NW has it's perks Smiley
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« Reply #128 on: January 24, 2010, 10:52:22 PM »

I had been controlling my diabetes fairly well up until the summer of last year. My a1c was between 6 or 7 at the time, which my doctor was fairly happy with. Unfortunately, about 6 months ago I started down a road where I wasn't taking care of myself (diet wise), with the main culprit being a major increase in the amount of soda I drank. Some people eat more food when they get depressed... well, I drink soda. Anyway, so my a1c went up to over 11 by December, which is apparently somewhere between "horribly negligent" and "you must have a death wish". However, I switched to diet soda around Christmas time, and have been pretty good at avoiding regular soda since then. And I've lost about 13 pounds since I made the switch.

I'm wondering what else I can do about my diet, though. Here's the thing, I am not likely to make major changes. I've tried countless times in the past to incorporate different foods into my diet, like salads, more nuts or beans, etc. That's just not me, and I can never stay on top of it. I do eat a fair amount of fruits for lunch or as a snack. And I enjoy cooking food for dinner at night. But I have a difficult time making other meals throughout the day, and generally eat something out of a box or a TV dinner. Yes, it's not the best choice, but I can pick things I actually enjoy eating, and such food is fairly quick/easy to make. So... I know it's probably not likely, but does anyone have any suggestions for stuff I could substitute for the Boxed/TV dinner stuff, without having me completely change things?
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« Reply #129 on: January 30, 2010, 11:34:54 PM »

I had been controlling my diabetes fairly well up until the summer of last year. My a1c was between 6 or 7 at the time, which my doctor was fairly happy with. Unfortunately, about 6 months ago I started down a road where I wasn't taking care of myself (diet wise), with the main culprit being a major increase in the amount of soda I drank. Some people eat more food when they get depressed... well, I drink soda. Anyway, so my a1c went up to over 11 by December, which is apparently somewhere between "horribly negligent" and "you must have a death wish". However, I switched to diet soda around Christmas time, and have been pretty good at avoiding regular soda since then. And I've lost about 13 pounds since I made the switch.

I'm wondering what else I can do about my diet, though. Here's the thing, I am not likely to make major changes. I've tried countless times in the past to incorporate different foods into my diet, like salads, more nuts or beans, etc. That's just not me, and I can never stay on top of it. I do eat a fair amount of fruits for lunch or as a snack. And I enjoy cooking food for dinner at night. But I have a difficult time making other meals throughout the day, and generally eat something out of a box or a TV dinner. Yes, it's not the best choice, but I can pick things I actually enjoy eating, and such food is fairly quick/easy to make. So... I know it's probably not likely, but does anyone have any suggestions for stuff I could substitute for the Boxed/TV dinner stuff, without having me completely change things?

 I think it would be good for you to eat high Protein and Fat and avoid all bread, potatoes etc and get your carbs just from plant food.. Take a look at  www.thepaleodiet.com and  www.westonaprice.org

In the early 1930's the mayo clinic used to treat diabetes with Raw Milk. They would only let you consume raw milk for about a month and the diabetes would improve dramatically.. Go figure
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« Reply #130 on: January 31, 2010, 12:03:31 AM »

I'm not recommending this for diabetes (which is a completely different story) but It is a strong tradition within the Church of the East (all Churches in fact) that the excessive consumption of meat is a bad thing.I read that the consumption of flesh meat inadvertently aids certain undesirable things such as for example the sin of lust. Let me explain this in a non-superstitious way: I read medical reports that your body is unable to digest meat fully when consumed in large quantities, the semi-undigested remains pile up within the intestines causing bacteria to breed, constipation, and other health problems. Your body mixes certain signals from your colon as indicative of "other" things. I can back up my "nutritional theory" with scripture:

Be not among winebibbers; among riotous eaters of flesh

Proverbs 23:20

you can't eat flesh meat (only fish and no crayfish) in the COE from Bishop onwards from what I understand. I think this is a good practice.
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« Reply #131 on: February 06, 2010, 03:58:45 PM »


 I think it would be good for you to eat high Protein and Fat and avoid all bread, potatoes etc and get your carbs just from plant food.. Take a look at  www.thepaleodiet.com and  www.westonaprice.org

In the early 1930's the mayo clinic used to treat diabetes with Raw Milk. They would only let you consume raw milk for about a month and the diabetes would improve dramatically.. Go figure

Thank you for the leads, I am going to look into this. I am also going to discuss this with a diabetes educator that is teaching a class I'm taking in February, just to sort of get a range of opinions.
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« Reply #132 on: February 06, 2010, 04:02:29 PM »

Apparently a Dutch study found that eating food containing gelatin or alpha-lactalbumin at breakfast decreased the calories that a person would consume at lunch by 20%.
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« Reply #133 on: February 06, 2010, 04:36:26 PM »

Unless you personally own a cow and milk it yourself, raw milk is a potential dangerous.  I have watched many teat cups fall onto the floor and into cow manure. The vacuum tubes continue to pulsate and suction up the manure into the milk supply until someone notices. Even if the teat cup doesn’t hit the floor, cows are notoriously covered with mud and manure so if the cow isn’t cleaned before milking, infectious material can enter the raw milk.

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« Reply #134 on: February 06, 2010, 06:32:34 PM »

Unless you personally own a cow and milk it yourself, raw milk is a potential dangerous.  I have watched many teat cups fall onto the floor and into cow manure. The vacuum tubes continue to pulsate and suction up the manure into the milk supply until someone notices. Even if the teat cup doesn’t hit the floor, cows are notoriously covered with mud and manure so if the cow isn’t cleaned before milking, infectious material can enter the raw milk.



Milk from ordinary dairies where they confine their cows should never be consumed Raw or not..

Raw milk must come from a grass fed cow (not confined) and either from a "Certified Dairy" or a source that you know keeps high standards.

The Dairy Industry has misled the public about the safety of Raw Milk. They need the longer shelf-life of boiled Milk to reap high profits. The fact is, Raw Milk has a lower rate of causing illness than Deli Meats.

The best book about Raw Milk for those who want to learn more is the "Untold Story of Milk". It will change your mind. I drink nothing but Raw Milk and I am scared of the damage  that can be done by processed Milk ( Pasturized and Homogenized). The very thing people consume to help Heart Health, Low Fat Milk, may in fact be dangerous to your Heart.

http://www.newtrendspublishing.com/USOMilk/

http://www.realmilk.com

http://www.altadenadairy.com/
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