|
Rosehip
|
 |
« on: December 06, 2009, 03:55:02 PM » |
|
I'm quite surprised that many people on this forum (I'm assuming they are christians) seem to like death metal music. I was always taught that this was not suitable music for the christian, and seeing some of the images recently posted in another thread, I can appreciate why it was forbidden in my former faith. So, I would like to ask those of you who seem to like and listen to this genre why you enjoy this and why you feel it is acceptable for a christian to listen to something with such horrific and psychologically traumatizing imagery. Thanks.
|
|
|
|
« Last Edit: December 06, 2009, 03:56:16 PM by Rosehip »
|
Logged
|
+ Our dear sister Martha (Rosehip) passed away on Dec 20, 2010. May her memory be eternal! +
|
|
|
|
Asteriktos
|
|
« Reply #1 on: December 06, 2009, 04:04:53 PM » |
|
Don't forget black metal!  |
|
|
|
|
Logged
|
|
|
|
|
Rosehip
|
|
« Reply #2 on: December 06, 2009, 04:43:55 PM » |
|
Yes, indeed. Thanks, Asteriktos. Now, I am curious why christians would want to listen to this kind of stuff. I personally can't get through a few seconds of this music without feeling ill and very traumatized, so I haven't listened to much. I'd like to hear from those of you who listen to this stuff and to know how you reconcile it to being a christian.
|
|
|
|
|
Logged
|
+ Our dear sister Martha (Rosehip) passed away on Dec 20, 2010. May her memory be eternal! +
|
|
|
|
Jetavan
|
|
« Reply #3 on: December 06, 2009, 05:00:57 PM » |
|
It's a guy thing.  |
|
|
|
|
Logged
|
If you will, you can become all flame.
Extra caritatem nulla salus.
In order to become whole, take the "I" out of "holiness".
सर्वभूतहित
Ἄνω σχῶμεν τὰς καρδίας
"Those who say religion has nothing to do with politics do not know what religion is." -- Mohandas Gandhi
Y dduw bo'r diolch.
|
|
|
minasoliman
Mr., Sir, Dude, Guy, Male, tr. Minas in Greek, Menes in white people Egyptologists :-P
Section Moderator
Merarches
 Offline
Faith: Oriental Orthodox
Jurisdiction: Coptic Orthodox Archdiocese of North America
Posts: 8,548
Pray for me, Sts. Mina & Kyrillos VI for my exams
|
|
« Reply #4 on: December 06, 2009, 05:06:14 PM » |
|
I'm a dude, and I thought that stuff was for crazy people. But then again, I used to listen to provocative hip hop music when I was a teen.
|
|
|
|
|
Logged
|
Vain existence can never exist, for \\\"unless the LORD builds the house, the builders labor in vain.\\\" (Psalm 127)
If the faith is unchanged and rock solid, then the gates of Hades never prevailed in the end.
|
|
|
|
Alpo
|
|
« Reply #5 on: December 06, 2009, 05:18:04 PM » |
|
|
|
|
|
|
Logged
|
The great thing about this forum is that no matter what you say in your message you will always get a polite, informative reply. A reply that is really helpful.
|
|
|
|
Asteriktos
|
|
« Reply #6 on: December 06, 2009, 05:53:32 PM » |
|
When I was a Christian, I reconciled it in the same way that early Christians reconciled that they read literature filled with immorality: I took what I found enjoyable or useful, and rejected the rest. I didn't listen to much black or death metal, but I did listen to bands that had lyrics which most Christians would dislike. Personally, I find so-called classical music to be much more traumatizing, but that's just me.  |
|
|
|
|
Logged
|
|
|
|
|
GabrieltheCelt
|
|
« Reply #7 on: December 06, 2009, 06:29:50 PM » |
|
I'm a dude, and I thought that stuff was for crazy people.
I'm a dude and I still do. |
|
|
|
|
Logged
|
"The Scots-Irish; Brewed in Scotland, bottled in Ireland, uncorked in America." ~Scots-Irish saying
"Yes, you are a white supremacist, ..." ~Iconodule
|
|
|
|
Alveus Lacuna
|
|
« Reply #8 on: December 06, 2009, 06:46:30 PM » |
|
Rosehip, I don't still listen to Satanic black metal. I sold all of it about a year ago. I just occasionally reference it for kicks. It's the "culture" I cut my teeth in. I've been listening to extreme metal since I was about 14, and before that more extreme forms of rock since I was about 10. So I've been listening to metal now for about 15 years.
I still listen to some death and black metal, but I'm very selective as far as the content of the music is concerned. However, as I move close and closer to Orthodoxy, I am less and less interested in the music and culture at all. Maybe it's just growing up, or maybe its wising up.
But most of it is very disturbing; that's sort of the point. I hope God forgives me for many things in that period of my life, but most of "metal" isn't really a big deal. The imagery is theatrical, just like in the liturgy.
The really disturbing Satanic stuff is pretty far in the underground. But as a teen, Christian metal was my gateway drug. I still listen to some Christian metal like Extol, but again, I'm just not as interested these days. Maybe it will come back at some other point in my life, but for now I don't really care. I'm too busy lapping up desert wisdom and figuring out my many sins to listen to depressing, evil music.
|
|
|
|
« Last Edit: December 06, 2009, 06:46:55 PM by Alveus Lacuna »
|
Logged
|
|
|
|
|
Rosehip
|
|
« Reply #9 on: December 06, 2009, 07:34:58 PM » |
|
Thanks for your gracious replies. I am sorry if I offended anyone, because that wasn't my desire. Just trying to understand.
|
|
|
|
|
Logged
|
+ Our dear sister Martha (Rosehip) passed away on Dec 20, 2010. May her memory be eternal! +
|
|
|
|
Jetavan
|
|
« Reply #10 on: December 06, 2009, 10:02:51 PM » |
|
I used to listen to King's X, back in the day. Not Christian death metal, though -- more like Christian Jimi Hendrix-meets-Zeppelin.  |
|
|
|
« Last Edit: December 06, 2009, 10:15:01 PM by Jetavan »
|
Logged
|
If you will, you can become all flame.
Extra caritatem nulla salus.
In order to become whole, take the "I" out of "holiness".
सर्वभूतहित
Ἄνω σχῶμεν τὰς καρδίας
"Those who say religion has nothing to do with politics do not know what religion is." -- Mohandas Gandhi
Y dduw bo'r diolch.
|
|
|
|
Papist
|
|
« Reply #11 on: December 07, 2009, 12:04:24 PM » |
|
Not a fan of metal at all. To me its just "ugly" music.
|
|
|
|
|
Logged
|
"The only-begotten Son of God, wanting us to be partakers of his divinity, assumed our human nature so that, having become man, he might make men gods." - St. Thomas Aquinas
|
|
|
|
EofK
|
|
« Reply #12 on: December 07, 2009, 02:11:08 PM » |
|
I don't care at all for modern metal as it seems many of the artists try too hard to be shocking or to push the envelope on what can be legally shown in public (I'm thinking of Marilyn Manson here). I do still like the old metal bands like Black Sabbath and Alice Cooper, though. They actually had a story to tell and as far as I can tell their stage act was theatre.
|
|
|
|
|
Logged
|
Human beings, who are almost unique in having the ability to learn from the experience of others, are also remarkable for their apparent disinclination to do so. -- Douglas Adams
|
|
|
|
scamandrius
|
|
« Reply #13 on: December 07, 2009, 08:33:18 PM » |
|
I happen to like a lot of Death Metal, Black Metal, etc. It's good music. Lyrically, it may leave something to be desired as well as their vocals, but it's good music. One can like the music and not subscribe to the ideology behind it.
Hell, I like U2, but I'm no fan of Bono's political ideology. I don't think, though, that the black metal guys are out there promoting whatever they believe like Bono does.
|
|
|
|
|
Logged
|
I seek the truth by which no man was ever harmed--Marcus Aurelius
Those who do not read history are doomed to get their facts from Hollywood--Anonymous
What earthly joy remains untouched by grief?--St. John Damascene
|
|
|
|
Jetavan
|
|
« Reply #14 on: December 08, 2009, 04:04:48 PM » |
|
Hell, I like U2, but I'm no fan of Bono's political ideology.
You don't support debt relief? |
|
|
|
|
Logged
|
If you will, you can become all flame.
Extra caritatem nulla salus.
In order to become whole, take the "I" out of "holiness".
सर्वभूतहित
Ἄνω σχῶμεν τὰς καρδίας
"Those who say religion has nothing to do with politics do not know what religion is." -- Mohandas Gandhi
Y dduw bo'r diolch.
|
|
|
|
Feanor
|
|
« Reply #15 on: December 10, 2009, 10:40:12 PM » |
|
I adore metal and have a massive death, black and thrash metal collection. Among the many anti-Christian albums in my collection I have one called 'Dechristianize' by a band called Vital Remains which has songs with titles such as 'At War With God,' 'Hammer Down The Nails,' and 'Saviour To None, Failure To All.' My favourite song by the Swedish thrash/death metal band At The Gates is 'Raped By The Light Of Christ,' which has some beautiful guitar melodies and is really well composed. I also have a huge collection of nihilistic black metal such as Gorgoroth, who have songs such as 'Twilight Of The Idols.' One of my favourite bands, Amon Amarth, have a song which describes (and glorifies) a party of Vikings pillaging a Christian village, raping the women and burning the church to the ground. It's an awesome song, too. I can practice artistic distancing when I listen to music - I don't have to agree with the message of the lyrics to appreciate it musically, from a compositional and instrumental standpoint. I have to admire the existential consciousness of the lyrics, though.
|
|
|
|
|
Logged
|
|
|
|
|
GabrieltheCelt
|
|
« Reply #16 on: December 10, 2009, 10:54:17 PM » |
|
I adore metal and have a massive death, black and thrash metal collection. Among the many anti-Christian albums in my collection I have one called 'Dechristianize' by a band called Vital Remains which has songs with titles such as 'At War With God,' 'Hammer Down The Nails,' and 'Saviour To None, Failure To All.' My favourite song by the Swedish thrash/death metal band At The Gates is 'Raped By The Light Of Christ,' which has some beautiful guitar melodies and is really well composed. I also have a huge collection of nihilistic black metal such as Gorgoroth, who have songs such as 'Twilight Of The Idols.' One of my favourite bands, Amon Amarth, have a song which describes (and glorifies) a party of Vikings pillaging a Christian village, raping the women and burning the church to the ground. It's an awesome song, too. I can practice artistic distancing when I listen to music - I don't have to agree with the message of the lyrics to appreciate it musically, from a compositional and instrumental standpoint. I have to admire the existential consciousness of the lyrics, though.
Friend, this is gonna be something you don't want to hear; It's not meant to be judgmental towards you, but it's gonna be harsh and it's something that needs to be said. What you've described is not only Satanic, but absolutely detrimental. If you think you can truly listen to this Satanic music and not have it affect your nous, you not only lack discernment but you lack even a basic understanding of your faith. As your friend and fellow brother-in-Christ, I urge you to please reconsider. |
|
|
|
|
Logged
|
"The Scots-Irish; Brewed in Scotland, bottled in Ireland, uncorked in America." ~Scots-Irish saying
"Yes, you are a white supremacist, ..." ~Iconodule
|
|
|
|
Jetavan
|
|
« Reply #17 on: December 10, 2009, 10:54:49 PM » |
|
I adore metal and have a massive death, black and thrash metal collection. Among the many anti-Christian albums in my collection I have one called 'Dechristianize' by a band called Vital Remains which has songs with titles such as 'At War With God,' 'Hammer Down The Nails,' and 'Saviour To None, Failure To All.' My favourite song by the Swedish thrash/death metal band At The Gates is 'Raped By The Light Of Christ,' which has some beautiful guitar melodies and is really well composed. I also have a huge collection of nihilistic black metal such as Gorgoroth, who have songs such as 'Twilight Of The Idols.' One of my favourite bands, Amon Amarth, have a song which describes (and glorifies) a party of Vikings pillaging a Christian village, raping the women and burning the church to the ground. It's an awesome song, too. I can practice artistic distancing when I listen to music - I don't have to agree with the message of the lyrics to appreciate it musically, from a compositional and instrumental standpoint. I have to admire the existential consciousness of the lyrics, though.
Do you hum the lyrics? |
|
|
|
|
Logged
|
If you will, you can become all flame.
Extra caritatem nulla salus.
In order to become whole, take the "I" out of "holiness".
सर्वभूतहित
Ἄνω σχῶμεν τὰς καρδίας
"Those who say religion has nothing to do with politics do not know what religion is." -- Mohandas Gandhi
Y dduw bo'r diolch.
|
|
|
|
Asteriktos
|
|
« Reply #18 on: December 10, 2009, 11:24:17 PM » |
|
Regarding lyrics, I think there are a lot of factors to consider. Take Slayer. They use an anti-Christian facade as a gimmick to sell themselves, they don't actually believe the stuff they have in their lyrics. Then you have a band like Megadeth, whose lyric-writer Mustaine was interested in the occult early on, but later became a Christian. One of my favorite Megadeth songs is Looking Down the Cross, but the lyrics aren't nearly as bad as one might assume. Certainly Metallica have stuff that's anti-Christian... I mean, who do you think the song The God That Failed is about? But are their lyrics really so far out there that they are unlistenable for a Christian? Then there's a band like Manowar--a whole world unto themselves. They have lyrics like: Rip Their Flesh Burn Their Hearts Stab Them In The Eyes Rape Their Women As They Cry Kill Their Servants Burn Their Homes Till There’s No Blood Left To Spill Hail And Kill Ok, not exactly peaceful and loving. But Manowar lyrics and their image are generally so cheesy that no one takes them seriously (though they do get some wonderfully-corny lines in here and there, like "If you do not like metal, you are not my friend!") Then there are bands like Mastodon, who fluctuate between seemingly meaningless words strung together, to trippy stuff like: Spiraling up through the crack in the sky Leaving material world behind I see your face in constellations The martyr is ending his life for mine I have a moderate amount of Christian metal, and their lyrics can be just as bad. Not that they sing about killing and raping people, but the theology can sometimes be so poor, and the lyrics so triumphalistic and condescending, that they are about as unlistenable or unlikeable as anything put out by secular bands. |
|
|
|
« Last Edit: December 10, 2009, 11:25:10 PM by Asteriktos »
|
Logged
|
|
|
|
|
Rosehip
|
|
« Reply #19 on: December 10, 2009, 11:28:57 PM » |
|
This is all even worse than I ever imagined...  |
|
|
|
|
Logged
|
+ Our dear sister Martha (Rosehip) passed away on Dec 20, 2010. May her memory be eternal! +
|
|
|
|
Alveus Lacuna
|
|
« Reply #20 on: December 10, 2009, 11:32:48 PM » |
|
I adore metal and have a massive death, black and thrash metal collection. Among the many anti-Christian albums in my collection I have one called 'Dechristianize' by a band called Vital Remains which has songs with titles such as 'At War With God,' 'Hammer Down The Nails,' and 'Saviour To None, Failure To All.' My favourite song by the Swedish thrash/death metal band At The Gates is 'Raped By The Light Of Christ,' which has some beautiful guitar melodies and is really well composed. I also have a huge collection of nihilistic black metal such as Gorgoroth, who have songs such as 'Twilight Of The Idols.' One of my favourite bands, Amon Amarth, have a song which describes (and glorifies) a party of Vikings pillaging a Christian village, raping the women and burning the church to the ground. It's an awesome song, too. I can practice artistic distancing when I listen to music - I don't have to agree with the message of the lyrics to appreciate it musically, from a compositional and instrumental standpoint. I have to admire the existential consciousness of the lyrics, though. You're still a teenager. If you stay involved, you'll likely head deeper into the underground. Gorgoroth is only phase one. It gets a lot more serious and a lot darker the further in you get. Be aware, I used to own thousands of these albums. Whether you acknowledge it or not, these things affect you. I do still listen to At the Gates. I love the Gardens of Grief EP. Old school Swedish Death Metal is my vice. |
|
|
|
« Last Edit: December 10, 2009, 11:33:21 PM by Alveus Lacuna »
|
Logged
|
|
|
|
|
GabrieltheCelt
|
|
« Reply #21 on: December 10, 2009, 11:36:41 PM » |
|
Regarding lyrics, I think there are a lot of factors to consider...(snip) But are their lyrics really so far out there that they are unlistenable for a Christian? My answer would be, "For all Christians? Yes. For this Christian? Absolutely." |
|
|
|
|
Logged
|
"The Scots-Irish; Brewed in Scotland, bottled in Ireland, uncorked in America." ~Scots-Irish saying
"Yes, you are a white supremacist, ..." ~Iconodule
|
|
|
|
Asteriktos
|
|
« Reply #22 on: December 10, 2009, 11:41:06 PM » |
|
Regarding lyrics, I think there are a lot of factors to consider...(snip) But are their lyrics really so far out there that they are unlistenable for a Christian? My answer would be, "For all Christians? Yes. For this Christian? Absolutely." You know, some people in the early Church said the same thing about ancient Greek literature. "How could a real Christian read such immoral tales?" Not a few apologists detailed all the immoral stuff in such texts. Yet St. Basil says that Christian youth should read such literature, taking what is good and leaving what isn't. He even likens it to a primer for the Bible. |
|
|
|
|
Logged
|
|
|
|
|
Feanor
|
|
« Reply #23 on: December 11, 2009, 12:06:18 AM » |
|
It doesn't affect me, though. It used to, back when I was a fifteen year-old atheist who spent his time plotting ways to burn churches. I used to be a wholly anti-Christian militant. Some friends and I came very near to burning a church on one occasion, and it wasn't just for thrills, it was out of a deep hatred for Christianity. That was long before I found God, found Christ, and found his Church. My attitudes are vastly different now - I certainly don't endorse any of the things those songs do. Nonetheless, the powerful rhythms and epic melodies of those kinds of music are still extremely aesthetically pleasing. I enjoy the guitar riffs, I enjoy the powerful thumping drum beat which mirrors the lyrics - 'ten heavy feet walk the blood-soiled ground,' the brutal vocals, the epic solos, etc. It's uplifting and empowering. That kind of music feels you with strength. I'm an adult, and capable of discernment enough to differentiate between message and medium. I can admire the Qur'an as well - I've read it, and it is quite beautiful in some places. I've also read the Norse sagas, of the death of Baldur, Odin's crucifixion upon Yggdrasil, Ragnarok, etc. It's epic, and I was powerfully moved as I read it. That doesn't mean I believe these stories, even though they are of a religious nature. It absolutely is possible to admire something artistically even if you disagree with the concept that underpins it fundamentally.
Alveus - yes, I'm still a teenager, but I'm long past my lowest point in that scene, as I mentioned above. I don't listen to a fraction of the amount of metal I used to. When I was a young angsty kid it was extremely cathartic and matched my feelings at the time. The same cannot be said now.
I also listen to Islamic nasheeds. I even sing along to them. They're beautiful. I can assure you, I'm not a Muslim, nor am I in any danger of becoming one, no matter how many times I sing along with "la ilaha il-Allah, Muhammad'un rasul-ullah." It's called artistic distancing. Just because it may not be possible for you does not mean it is impossible for me.
|
|
|
|
« Last Edit: December 11, 2009, 12:24:50 AM by Feanor »
|
Logged
|
|
|
|
|
Rosehip
|
|
« Reply #24 on: December 11, 2009, 12:09:55 AM » |
|
Okay, I just listened to "Twilight of the Thunder God" by Amon Amarth. I can see how the Viking setting is appealing, romantic in a way. But the "singing" itself I found very neanderthalish. I couldn't understand a word of it, so I had to look up the lyrics. Haven't listened to the one about the pillaging of a Christian village yet though.
|
|
|
|
« Last Edit: December 11, 2009, 12:10:28 AM by Rosehip »
|
Logged
|
+ Our dear sister Martha (Rosehip) passed away on Dec 20, 2010. May her memory be eternal! +
|
|
|
|
GabrieltheCelt
|
|
« Reply #25 on: December 11, 2009, 12:12:43 AM » |
|
Regarding lyrics, I think there are a lot of factors to consider...(snip) But are their lyrics really so far out there that they are unlistenable for a Christian? My answer would be, "For all Christians? Yes. For this Christian? Absolutely." You know, some people in the early Church said the same thing about ancient Greek literature. "How could a real Christian read such immoral tales?" Not a few apologists detailed all the immoral stuff in such texts. Yet St. Basil says that Christian youth should read such literature, taking what is good and leaving what isn't. He even likens it to a primer for the Bible. And yet I'm equally as sure that St. Basil would have these same youths submit to their spiritual father... even if that meant they weren't allowed to read such literature. I'm not suggesting you're advocating this, but to assume all youths are spiritually equally inclined and/or have the same discernment abilities would be remiss at best and dangerous at worst. |
|
|
|
|
Logged
|
"The Scots-Irish; Brewed in Scotland, bottled in Ireland, uncorked in America." ~Scots-Irish saying
"Yes, you are a white supremacist, ..." ~Iconodule
|
|
|
|
Feanor
|
|
« Reply #26 on: December 11, 2009, 12:15:34 AM » |
|
The growls are an aquired taste, for sure. When I first got into death metal I couldn't stand the vocals, but over time I got used to the sound, and soon began to appreciate that style of vocals quite a lot. I don't struggle at all to understand the lyrics now - as you get used to the sound it becomes easier to understand what is being said.
The one that features the lyrics about pillaging the Christian village is 'Victorious March,' possibly my favourite song from its album.
|
|
|
|
« Last Edit: December 11, 2009, 12:17:45 AM by Feanor »
|
Logged
|
|
|
|
|
GabrieltheCelt
|
|
« Reply #27 on: December 11, 2009, 12:16:40 AM » |
|
It doesn't affect me, though. It used to, back when I was a fifteen year-old atheist who spent his time plotting ways to burn churches. I used to be a wholly anti-Christian militant. Some friends and I came very near to burning a church on one occasion, and it wasn't just for thrills, it was out of a deep hatred for Christianity. That was long before I found God, found Christ, and found his Church. My attitudes are vastly different now - I certainly don't endorse any of the things those songs do. Nonetheless, the powerful rhythms and epic melodies of those kinds of music are still extremely aesthetically pleasing. I enjoy the guitar riffs, I enjoy the powerful thumping drum beat which mirrors the lyrics - 'ten heavy feet pound the blood-soiled ground,' the brutal vocals, the epic solos, etc. It's uplifting and empowering. That kind of music feels you with strength. I'm an adult, and capable of discernment enough to differentiate between message and medium. I can admire the Qur'an as well - I've read it, and it is quite beautiful in some places. I've also read the Norse sagas, of the death of Baldur, Odin's crucifixion upon Yggdrasil, Ragnarok, etc. It's epic, and I was powerfully moved as I read it. That doesn't mean I believe these stories, even though they are of a religious nature. It absolutely is possible to admire something artistically even if you disagree with the concept that underpins it fundamentally.
Alveus - yes, I'm still a teenager, but I'm long past my lowest point in that scene, as I mentioned above. I don't listen to a fraction of the amount of metal I used to. When I was a young angsty kid it was extremely cathartic and matched my feelings at the time. The same cannot be said now.
I also listen to Islamic nasheeds. I even sing along to them. They're beautiful. I can assure you, I'm not a Muslim, nor am I in any danger of becoming one, no matter how many times I sing along with "la ilaha il-Allah, Muhammad'un rasul-ullah." It's called artistic distancing. Just because it may not be possible for you does not mean it is impossible for me.
Relax, friend. No one's forcing you to give up anything. But what kind of a brother would I be if I didn't say anything? And in addition, Alveus seems to have come from the same background (musically speaking) as yourself, so I would pay close attention to his cautions. |
|
|
|
|
Logged
|
"The Scots-Irish; Brewed in Scotland, bottled in Ireland, uncorked in America." ~Scots-Irish saying
"Yes, you are a white supremacist, ..." ~Iconodule
|
|
|
FormerReformer
Convertodox of the convertodox
Site Supporter
Archon
Offline
Faith: Eastern Orthodox
Jurisdiction: I'll take (e) for "all of the above"
Posts: 2,388
|
|
« Reply #28 on: December 11, 2009, 12:18:33 AM » |
|
Metallica? Megadeth? I thought this conversation was about death metal! Posers!  Well, I don't listen to death metal, myself.  I do enjoy a few variations of the metal sub-genre's, however. With me, as with most of the respondents (when they aren't trying to shock Rosehip, bad, bad respondents!) it boils down to the music. Now, as with just about every musical style one needs to be acquainted with said music in order to appreciate that there is actually music and not just some noise. To the uneducated even classical could sound a horrid cacophony. I mention classical because the metal I appreciate hits many of the same notes and variations of classical music, just does it at a faster tempo and with distorted guitars replacing violins, though I also enjoy the bluesier metal as well. As regards Satanism in metal, in the late '60s and early '70s many rock bands realized that they could fairly easily spike record sales by injecting the odd reference to Satan or criticism of religion. This was because not only did the parental "shock factor" induce many rebellious teens to buy the album; but it also induced many of the more "fundamentalist Christian" variety to go out and buy as many copies of said albums as could be afforded, in order to throw said albums on big fires and "keep them from the hands of impressionable youth". Album sales are album sales, and as the '70s wore on it became increasingly necessary to "up the ante" on the objectionable content as parents became more and more immune to "shock". By the '80s, the only metal bands that weren't using satanic imagery were "Christian" metal bands (which had a "shock factor" all it's own). During the mid-80s there was enough cross-pollination between the hardcore punk "thrash" bands and metal bands that the satanic imagery was somewhat diluted, and the metal scene further fragmented. Radio played "hair metal", college radio played "heavy metal", with death metal being seen as being too objectionable to be marketable, as the 80s were also the decade that many politicians decided to take aim at Ozzy Osbourne because a few suicidal teens owned his albums<----- the reason I did not vote for Al Gore in 2000. During the 1990s the more satanic metal got a boost in popularity, again thanks to "Fundamentalist Christians". I remember a nearby church buying up all the tickets to a Marilyn Manson show in order to prevent children from hearing his "anti-Christian message". Mr Manson was so pleased at the sold-out ticket sales that he scheduled another show the following night (far more effective, IMO, was the other nearby church that bought pizza for all the kids waiting in line to get tickets. There were some VERY confused kids in the line that night). And rebellious teenagers for whom dressing in plaid shirts and ripped jeans wasn't rebellious enough, but who just couldn't get into that whole "Goth" thing, had a new Mecca for ticking off their parents. At the end of the day, however, the lyrics really have little impact, and are more often cartoonish parodies of satanism than actual satanism itself. That said, one thing I would love to hunt down, just for the curiosity value, would be the album by Kryst the Konqueror, the christian metal band started by Jerry Only of the Misfits in response to ex-Misfits Danzig's band Samhain. Posted by: Rosehip
Insert Quote
Okay, I just listened to "Twilight of the Thunder God" by Amon Amarth. I can see how the Viking setting is appealing, romantic in a way. But the "singing" itself I found very neanderthalish. I couldn't understand a word of it, so I had to look up the lyrics. Haven't listened to the one about the pillaging of a Christian village yet though. Very good, you deserve something nice for that punishment: do a google search for "Cats immigrant song" |
|
|
|
|
Logged
|
"Funny," said Lancelot, "how the people who can't pray say that prayers are not answered, however much the people who can pray say they are." TH White Oh, no: I've succumbed to Hyperdoxy! |
|
|
|
Rosehip
|
|
« Reply #29 on: December 11, 2009, 12:35:40 AM » |
|
LOL. Yes indeed, I do deserve some sort of compensation for dutifully looking up and listening to those songs. After listening to this "Victorious March" (actually it didn't manage to even capture my interest long enough to listen to the whole thing-and the way they thrashed their heads about was just plain weird, not to speak of possibly dangerous), I'm not so worried anymore. No offense to you, Feanor, but it wasn't really that exciting... |
|
|
|
|
Logged
|
+ Our dear sister Martha (Rosehip) passed away on Dec 20, 2010. May her memory be eternal! +
|
|
|
|
Feanor
|
|
« Reply #30 on: December 11, 2009, 12:57:32 AM » |
|
I understand - not many people enjoy that sort of music. It certainly is amazingly uplifting and empowering once you really get into it, but it's not for everyone. People who listen to death metal usually get into it via a bridge of bands/genres which progressively increase in heaviness. For example, someone might start out listening to rock, and then hard rock such as Led Zeppelin or AC/DC, and then move on to thrash like Metallica or Megadeth, and then even heavier thrash such as Slayer, which then leads to death metal, which then leads to black metal. It's a gradual slope of acquired taste. It's pretty much impossible to jump in at the deep end and reap any satisfaction or enjoyment. |
|
|
|
|
Logged
|
|
|
|
|
GabrieltheCelt
|
|
« Reply #31 on: December 11, 2009, 01:06:52 AM » |
|
... Ozzy Osbourne...
Interesting you should bring up the Oz-man. I love the guy and his music going way back to his Black Sabbath days. But I've really had to struggle to curb my listening of him because a lot of his stuff truly is satanic. I use this example simply to show that it is truly difficult in being an Orthodox Christian. |
|
|
|
|
Logged
|
"The Scots-Irish; Brewed in Scotland, bottled in Ireland, uncorked in America." ~Scots-Irish saying
"Yes, you are a white supremacist, ..." ~Iconodule
|
|
|
minasoliman
Mr., Sir, Dude, Guy, Male, tr. Minas in Greek, Menes in white people Egyptologists :-P
Section Moderator
Merarches
Offline
Faith: Oriental Orthodox
Jurisdiction: Coptic Orthodox Archdiocese of North America
Posts: 8,548
Pray for me, Sts. Mina & Kyrillos VI for my exams
|
|
« Reply #32 on: December 11, 2009, 01:19:34 AM » |
|
I don't know what genre this is as it is unique. But it does have an element of "heaviness" to it in their music, and that is the band Evanescence. I never would have imagined such heavy music can be beautified by the amazing voice of the band's lead singer. I was hooked and I became a fan.
What genre would that be? Because if anything, when I hear other band's heavy metals, the loudness and darkness mixed with their lyrics and their yelling (that's an understatement, more like daily laryngeal bleeding), was really hard to swallow. Does Evanescence fall into the same genre? It seems she mixes classical with heavy metal in a way I could never have imagined.
|
|
|
|
|
Logged
|
Vain existence can never exist, for \\\"unless the LORD builds the house, the builders labor in vain.\\\" (Psalm 127)
If the faith is unchanged and rock solid, then the gates of Hades never prevailed in the end.
|
|
|
|
Alveus Lacuna
|
|
« Reply #33 on: December 11, 2009, 01:37:01 AM » |
|
Some of the lyrics and images in the videos below may be controversial. User discretion is advised.
--YtterbiumAnalystEverybody keeps talking about the lamest, non-Death Metal bands in this thread! If you want some truly blasphemous and evil death metal, stop talking about top 40 bands. Dead Congregation (from Greece and specifically rejecting Orthodoxy) : http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=29U55hcbAzw at 6:30 it even has Byzantine Chant. This song is actually about the Eucharist being cast on the ground and consumed by rodents. I don't post this to endorse it, but just to give an example of how serious this material can get. Incantation - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gcPVF2jd6X0Ignivomous - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pucsXy3qgS4This will likely sound like total cacophony to many of you, but the music is actually highly technical and deliberate in its style.
|
|
|
|
« Last Edit: December 13, 2009, 07:05:41 AM by ytterbiumanalyst »
|
Logged
|
|
|
|
|
Rosehip
|
|
« Reply #34 on: December 11, 2009, 01:53:27 AM » |
|
^^That stuff's definitely the most sinister and unsettling I've heard so far. Weirdly, the haunting greek church singing seems to fit right in... I guess I should be thankful I've enough gloom in my life without needing any more...The growls certainly are not appealing in the least. But I suppose this caveman-style is appealing men?  |
|
|
|
« Last Edit: December 11, 2009, 02:12:16 AM by Rosehip »
|
Logged
|
+ Our dear sister Martha (Rosehip) passed away on Dec 20, 2010. May her memory be eternal! +
|
|
|
|
witega
|
|
« Reply #35 on: December 11, 2009, 02:06:36 AM » |
|
I don't know what genre this is as it is unique. But it does have an element of "heaviness" to it in their music, and that is the band Evanescence. I never would have imagined such heavy music can be beautified by the amazing voice of the band's lead singer. I was hooked and I became a fan.
What genre would that be? Because if anything, when I hear other band's heavy metals, the loudness and darkness mixed with their lyrics and their yelling (that's an understatement, more like daily laryngeal bleeding), was really hard to swallow. Does Evanescence fall into the same genre? It seems she mixes classical with heavy metal in a way I could never have imagined.
I would call Evanescence hard rock (though on the 'lighter' side of that genre). Some would also characterize it as Goth Rock, but I don't find that genre definition very useful as it has more to do with visual style and song themes than the actual music which still falls into a fairly broad swathe. It's not heavy metal. And *definitely* not death metal. Those are much heavier styles. If you like hard rock with ethereal vocals (a particular weakness of mine as well), you might see if you can find anything by Olivia or Nakashima Mika's album the End (both Japanese artists so no idea how easy they'd be for you to find). Maybe also the Sisters of Mercy album Floodland and Concrete Blonde. |
|
|
|
|
Logged
|
Ariel Starling - New albumFor it were better to suffer everything, rather than divide the Church of God. Even martyrdom for the sake of preventing division would not be less glorious than for refusing to worship idols. - St. Dionysius the Great
|
|
|
|
Alveus Lacuna
|
|
« Reply #36 on: December 11, 2009, 02:08:32 AM » |
|
The growls certainly are not appealing in the least. The vocals are an acquired taste. I've been listening to the stuff for so long that it's totally normal to me. This is an example of Black Metal, which is much more strongly associated with Satanism and anti-Christianity than Death Metal: Watain - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iItLyszPK2A |
|
|
|
« Last Edit: December 11, 2009, 02:09:37 AM by Alveus Lacuna »
|
Logged
|
|
|
|
|
Feanor
|
|
« Reply #37 on: December 11, 2009, 02:09:35 AM » |
|
Try this, if you feel up to some punishment. Watch the video, don't just listen to the songs. This is genuinely disturbing, and I struggle to get through it: Vital Remains - 'Let The Killing Begin' & 'Dechristianize' http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uH15p4WbEUcI'm enjoying the music of Dead Congregation so far, though the guitarist is fairly average by death metal standards. I'm quite impressed by the drummer. They're still pretty solid though. |
|
|
|
« Last Edit: December 11, 2009, 02:10:31 AM by Feanor »
|
Logged
|
|
|
|
|
Alveus Lacuna
|
|
« Reply #38 on: December 11, 2009, 02:18:25 AM » |
|
I'm enjoying the music of Dead Congregation so far, though the guitarist is fairly average by death metal standards. I'm quite impressed by the drummer. They're a part of the traditional or "old school" revival. They're not trying to be Cryptopsy. It's much more about the atmosphere than pin-drop accuracy. It's even a little "sloppy." Anyway, it was just an example. I caution people to stay away from a lot of this material. I hope I'm not causing people grief by posting this stuff. I absolutely hate stuff like Vital Remains. Drawn & Quartered are much better. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FEP92HbDdew |
|
|
|
« Last Edit: December 11, 2009, 02:21:10 AM by Alveus Lacuna »
|
Logged
|
|
|
|
|
GabrieltheCelt
|
|
« Reply #39 on: December 11, 2009, 03:27:28 AM » |
|
I caution people to stay away from a lot of this material. I hope I'm not causing people grief by posting this stuff.
Makes no sense whatsoever to caution people to stay away from something and then turn around and give access to or display it. And if I were a mod, I would lock this extremely disturbing and satanic thread; having videos being posted of extremely anti-Christian blasphemy is unacceptable!!!! |
|
|
|
|
Logged
|
"The Scots-Irish; Brewed in Scotland, bottled in Ireland, uncorked in America." ~Scots-Irish saying
"Yes, you are a white supremacist, ..." ~Iconodule
|
|
|
|
Rosehip
|
|
« Reply #40 on: December 11, 2009, 03:31:28 AM » |
|
Gabriel, the thread is entirely my fault. I encouraged it all by my insatiable curiosity...  Mods, if this thread is not acceptable, then please do lock it, or take whatever measures are required. However, any blame please place only on my shoulders. |
|
|
|
|
Logged
|
+ Our dear sister Martha (Rosehip) passed away on Dec 20, 2010. May her memory be eternal! +
|
|
|
|
GabrieltheCelt
|
|
« Reply #41 on: December 11, 2009, 03:37:27 AM » |
|
Gabriel, the thread is entirely my fault. I encouraged it all by my insatiable curiosity... Mods, if this thread is not acceptable, then please do lock it, or take whatever measures are required. However, any blame please place only on my shoulders. No, no dear sister; you are not to blame. And I'm not really as mad as my words seem to make me. It's just that the question was answered long ago and now this thread is becoming extremely dangerous, IMO. Please don't blame yourself though. |
|
|
|
|
Logged
|
"The Scots-Irish; Brewed in Scotland, bottled in Ireland, uncorked in America." ~Scots-Irish saying
"Yes, you are a white supremacist, ..." ~Iconodule
|
|
|
|
Alpo
|
|
« Reply #42 on: December 11, 2009, 04:47:44 AM » |
|
Oh come on, folks! Do you really take those lyrics seriously? I'm starting to understand why metal band have started to use provoking lyrics in the first place while reading this thread. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XL3mYKr5tZ4Black Metal or no metal at all! Wimps and posers leave the hall! |
|
|
|
« Last Edit: December 11, 2009, 04:49:27 AM by Alpo »
|
Logged
|
The great thing about this forum is that no matter what you say in your message you will always get a polite, informative reply. A reply that is really helpful.
|
|
|
|
Gebre Menfes Kidus
|
|
« Reply #43 on: December 11, 2009, 04:56:44 AM » |
|
I'm quite surprised that many people on this forum (I'm assuming they are christians) seem to like death metal music. I was always taught that this was not suitable music for the christian, and seeing some of the images recently posted in another thread, I can appreciate why it was forbidden in my former faith. So, I would like to ask those of you who seem to like and listen to this genre why you enjoy this and why you feel it is acceptable for a christian to listen to something with such horrific and psychologically traumatizing imagery. Thanks.
I'm with you Rosehip. I too am surprised by the prevalence of Orthodox Christians on this forum that seem to like this genre of music. I try not to be a fundamentalist about artistic tastes, but certain artistic expressions are purely demonic and should be avoided and condemned IMHO. I'm not going to crusade against "death metal," but I will point out that it's not redemptive and is full of negative energy, negative emotion, and negative thoughts. In this glorious world with so much beauty and so many uplifting forms of music and song, I do have to wonder why a professed Christian would be drawn towards such darkness. That may sound judgmental, but it really does cause me to wonder. Good question Rosehip! Selam |
|
|
|
« Last Edit: December 11, 2009, 04:57:24 AM by Gebre Menfes Kidus »
|
Logged
|
"Many people will fight you down when you see JAH light."
~Bob Marley (Berhane Selassie)~
|
|
|
|
|
|
