Author Topic: This is why Orthodoxy is the best...  (Read 2926 times)

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Offline samkim

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This is why Orthodoxy is the best...
« on: October 26, 2009, 11:52:10 PM »


Bring back the Curious George hats! BTW, in what icons can I see these vestments depicted?
주 예수 그리스도 하느님의 아들이시여 저 이 죄인을 불쌍히 여기소서.

Offline Justin Kissel

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Re: This is why Orthodoxy is the best...
« Reply #1 on: October 26, 2009, 11:53:04 PM »
I've seen jokes about the Orthodox having "funny hats," but this is taking it to a whole other level!  ;D
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Offline samkim

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Re: This is why Orthodoxy is the best...
« Reply #2 on: October 27, 2009, 12:17:58 AM »
That's why George converted.

« Last Edit: October 27, 2009, 12:19:55 AM by samkim »
주 예수 그리스도 하느님의 아들이시여 저 이 죄인을 불쌍히 여기소서.

Offline LBK

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Re: This is why Orthodoxy is the best...
« Reply #3 on: October 27, 2009, 03:40:02 AM »
BTW, in what icons can I see these vestments depicted?

The hats on the left are often found in icons of the Fathers of the Ecumenical Councils, and the Triumph of Orthodoxy. As for the vestments, I'd have to trawl through my archive.
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Offline Basil 320

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Re: This is why Orthodoxy is the best...
« Reply #4 on: October 27, 2009, 04:19:12 AM »
What in the world is this?  The church looks traditional, the clergy don't; they're garb is Western, perhaps?  This isn't a church within SCOBA is it?
« Last Edit: October 27, 2009, 04:19:52 AM by Basil 320 »
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Offline ytterbiumanalyst

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Re: This is why Orthodoxy is the best...
« Reply #5 on: October 27, 2009, 06:24:36 AM »
What in the world is this?  The church looks traditional, the clergy don't; they're garb is Western, perhaps?  This isn't a church within SCOBA is it?
Ah, yes. The old traditional v. Western false dichotomy.
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Offline 88Devin12

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Re: This is why Orthodoxy is the best...
« Reply #6 on: October 27, 2009, 10:13:01 AM »
The double-headed eagle is present, but that def doesn't mean it couldn't still be Byzantine Catholic...

From what I can tell from the Iconostasis, it's the Chuch of Ss. Peter & Paul, so that doesn't help much (there are a lot of those, i think)...

It also looks too big to be Western Rite. Also the present of the belts (i forgot what they are called) are very western in style, but I could be wrong.

Personally I don't care if it's western, as long as it's Orthodox.

Offline pensateomnia

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Re: This is why Orthodoxy is the best...
« Reply #7 on: October 27, 2009, 10:29:02 AM »
Icons and vestments and architecture really don't tell you much of anything anymore. There are all kinds of fringe episcopi vagantes groups that look OO, EO or RC, but have nothing to do with them.
But for I am a man not textueel I wol noght telle of textes neuer a deel. (Chaucer, The Manciple's Tale, 1.131)

Offline HandmaidenofGod

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Re: This is why Orthodoxy is the best...
« Reply #8 on: October 27, 2009, 10:52:46 AM »
It can't be Orthodox -- where are the beards??!!!  :laugh:  :P  ;)
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Offline arimethea

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Re: This is why Orthodoxy is the best...
« Reply #9 on: October 27, 2009, 11:44:19 AM »
This is a Byzantine Choir based out of Philadelphia, PA who did a concert of ancient Byzantine Chant and decided to wear the traditional choral uniforms of the Great Church prior to the fall of Constantinople.

http://www.romeikoensemble.com/
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Offline pensateomnia

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Re: This is why Orthodoxy is the best...
« Reply #10 on: October 27, 2009, 12:24:59 PM »
This is a Byzantine Choir based out of Philadelphia, PA who did a concert of ancient Byzantine Chant and decided to wear the traditional choral uniforms of the Great Church prior to the fall of Constantinople.

Ah. That makes sense. I have heard that the Orthodox in Oxford have even done some Cathedral Rite services...dunno if they went as far as to make 12th century costumes.
But for I am a man not textueel I wol noght telle of textes neuer a deel. (Chaucer, The Manciple's Tale, 1.131)

Offline Basil 320

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Re: This is why Orthodoxy is the best...
« Reply #11 on: October 27, 2009, 06:47:55 PM »
TO REPLY NO. 9  Whew, what a relief.  Thanks for the information.
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Offline samkim

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Re: This is why Orthodoxy is the best...
« Reply #12 on: October 27, 2009, 07:52:20 PM »
TO REPLY NO. 9  Whew, what a relief.  Thanks for the information.

???
주 예수 그리스도 하느님의 아들이시여 저 이 죄인을 불쌍히 여기소서.

Offline samkim

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Re: This is why Orthodoxy is the best...
« Reply #13 on: October 27, 2009, 07:54:04 PM »
What in the world is this?  The church looks traditional, the clergy don't; they're garb is Western, perhaps?  This isn't a church within SCOBA is it?

HAHAHA....
주 예수 그리스도 하느님의 아들이시여 저 이 죄인을 불쌍히 여기소서.

Offline samkim

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Re: This is why Orthodoxy is the best...
« Reply #14 on: October 27, 2009, 07:54:52 PM »
Icons and vestments and architecture really don't tell you much of anything anymore. There are all kinds of fringe episcopi vagantes groups that look OO, EO or RC, but have nothing to do with them.

HAHAHAHAH...
주 예수 그리스도 하느님의 아들이시여 저 이 죄인을 불쌍히 여기소서.

Offline ignatius

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Re: This is why Orthodoxy is the best...
« Reply #15 on: October 27, 2009, 08:12:51 PM »
Grace and Peace,

It is good to have a light hearted post. Blessings.
St Basil the Great (330-379 A.D.): “I think then that the one goal of all who are really and truly serving the Lord ought to be to bring back to union the churches who have at different times and in diverse manners divided from one another.”

Offline believer74

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Re: This is why Orthodoxy is the best...
« Reply #16 on: October 27, 2009, 11:39:26 PM »
That's why George converted.



It seems the Latvian archbishop sent a letter to Larry David to thank him for bringing their church to light. They never got so many inquiries as after that episode aired. LOL.

Offline ialmisry

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Re: This is why Orthodoxy is the best...
« Reply #17 on: October 27, 2009, 11:56:39 PM »
That's why George converted.



It seems the Latvian archbishop sent a letter to Larry David to thank him for bringing their church to light. They never got so many inquiries as after that episode aired. LOL.

Btw, Fr. Alexander Garklavs, the OCA Chancellor, is the (adopted) grandson of the last Metropolitan of Latvia before the Soviet Occupation, Arb. John of Chicago of blessed memory.  His adopted son, Fr. Sergei, btw recalls with greatest fondness (I think he actually said it was his favorite memory of this life) being huddled with the other refugees in Czechoslovakia, one step ahead of communist and nazis, in a barn around the Tikhvin Mother of God, bombs bursting all around them.
« Last Edit: October 27, 2009, 11:59:39 PM by ialmisry »
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Offline Ortho_cat

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Re: This is why Orthodoxy is the best...
« Reply #18 on: October 28, 2009, 12:39:43 AM »
It can't be Orthodox -- where are the beards??!!!  :laugh:  :P  ;)

Our priests in our parish have very little facial hair. One of our priests has a very finely trimmed goatee, and the other maintains a perpetual appearance of several day's growth.  I assumed the "rule" was that you had to have some type of facial hair.  Of course, the bishops usually have the all-out beards.

Offline Basil 320

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Re: This is why Orthodoxy is the best...
« Reply #19 on: October 28, 2009, 12:43:29 AM »
At the time, SCOBA took issue with NBC, protesting their having made fun of Orthodoxy, in this episode, through a letter to either NBC or Seinfeld's production company, I don't recall which.
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Offline Ortho_cat

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Re: This is why Orthodoxy is the best...
« Reply #20 on: October 28, 2009, 01:22:23 AM »
Was there a Seinfeld episode where George converted? Why is he holding the chalice? Why is that guy in front of him putting his hands together like a RC?

Offline John of the North

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Re: This is why Orthodoxy is the best...
« Reply #21 on: October 28, 2009, 01:28:27 AM »
Was there a Seinfeld episode where George converted? Why is he holding the chalice? Why is that guy in front of him putting his hands together like a RC?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Conversion_%28Seinfeld_episode%29

"The Conversion" is the seventy-fifth episode of the NBC sitcom Seinfeld. This was the 11th episode for the 5th season. It aired on December 16, 1993.

Plot
George converts to Latvian Orthodoxy in order to keep a girlfriend who would otherwise break up with him for their religious differences. He jokingly refers to his cheapness, remarking to her about ordering lobster, "You know? You are the first woman that I haven't thought about the price." Jerry finds a fungus cream in his girlfriend's medicine cabinet and, wondering what the cream might treat, convinces Elaine to ask her boyfriend, a podiatrist. Jerry mocks podiatrists by stating that they aren't real doctors and that even George could get into Podiatry school. It is later revealed that the cream was for Jerry's girlfriend's cat and somehow ends up in Elaine's medicine cabinet only to be discovered by her current boyfriend. Kramer meets a nun (Sister Roberta) at George's church but must break up with her when she decides to forsake her religion for him, due to Kramer having "kavorka" (the lure of the animal). Sister Roberta gives Kramer two toys as a gifts, one of them being a Slinky.

Interestingly, the writer of the episode, Bruce Kirschbaum, revealed later that he was unaware that the Latvian Orthodox church actually existed while writing the episode. His original intention was to have a fictitious sect.[1] Kirschbaum received many Thank You letters from the church for bringing attention to the denomination.
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Offline ialmisry

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Re: This is why Orthodoxy is the best...
« Reply #22 on: October 28, 2009, 01:29:52 AM »
Was there a Seinfeld episode where George converted? Why is he holding the chalice? Why is that guy in front of him putting his hands together like a RC?

The whole thing is what the a-religious think a Latvian Orthodox Church looks like.  It actually looks like this:
Question a friend, perhaps he did not do it; but if he did anything so that he may do it no more.
A hasty quarrel kindles fire,
and urgent strife sheds blood.
If you blow on a spark, it will glow;
if you spit on it, it will be put out;
                           and both come out of your mouth

Offline Justin Kissel

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Re: This is why Orthodoxy is the best...
« Reply #23 on: October 28, 2009, 01:31:40 AM »
Ok, it's probably been 10 years since I saw the episode, but I'll try to do a summary. In that episode George found out that he couldn't date a certain girl that he really liked because she was Latvian Orthodox and he wasn't. So George went to a Latvian Orthodox Church and said that he wanted to join the Church, and they gave him a bunch of books to study, and (after about a week catechumenate) they had some type of ceremony. I don't recall much other than that.
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Offline ozgeorge

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Re: This is why Orthodoxy is the best...
« Reply #24 on: October 28, 2009, 07:37:12 AM »
in what icons can I see these vestments depicted?

Here is a portrait of Emperor John VIII Paleologos (reigned from 1425 to 1448) preserved the the Holy Monastery of St. Catherine, Sinai wearing a similar hat:
http://nauplion.net/CP-JOHN-VIII.html

Below is a funeral fresco of a man who died in 1445 and was buried in the Pantanassa monastery at Mystra in the Peleponese. The inscription on the fresco identifies him as "Manuel Laskaris Hatzikes, servant of the Despot Constantine". Note the similar hat. You'll also notice the eyes on the Icon are gouged out. The Turks did this to many icons at the time of the Ottoman conquest to protect themselves from the Evil Eye.

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Offline believer74

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Re: This is why Orthodoxy is the best...
« Reply #25 on: October 29, 2009, 12:06:01 AM »
my fave seinfeld quote ever was in that episode, by george's father:
"latvian orthodox? is that the group that goes around murdering squirrels??" george: "no, dad it's a regular religion!"


Offline samkim

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Re: This is why Orthodoxy is the best...
« Reply #27 on: February 04, 2010, 03:13:54 PM »
It's a bit disturbing that the immediate reaction from some people when they saw the picture was that this must be some kind of innovation, an infiltration of foreign traditions into our holy tradition, when in reality these vestments were apart of our ancient tradition.
주 예수 그리스도 하느님의 아들이시여 저 이 죄인을 불쌍히 여기소서.

Offline Justin Kissel

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Re: This is why Orthodoxy is the best...
« Reply #28 on: February 04, 2010, 03:27:11 PM »
Yeah, you'd think that most Orthodox would have embraced the funny hat sub-culture.  :angel:  On a completely different note, why is it that when I look at the hats on the left, the first word that pops into my head is burrito?
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