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Author Topic: Churches in Italy  (Read 4281 times) Average Rating: 0
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mike
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« on: June 25, 2009, 05:29:47 PM »

I've been doing a research 'bout Parishes in Italy. I've found EP's (Greek and Russian), MP's (Korsun's (1, 2) and ROCOR's), Serbian (1, 2), Romanian, Bulgarian and Polish.

According to the website of the Georgian Parish in London there is also St. Andrew's Georgian Church (in Rome). Does anybody know the address of them?

And I've got another one question: are there any AP's Parishes there? It's such a big jurisdiction that I cannot believe there aren't but I couldn't find any.
« Last Edit: June 25, 2009, 05:39:19 PM by mike » Logged

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« Reply #1 on: June 25, 2009, 10:50:31 PM »

By AP, do you mean Albanian Patriarchate?

If you do, I wouldn't be surprised by their absence in Rome or in any other parts of Europe.  The communists, more or less, dismantled the Albanian Church and it's finally now starting to recover and I pray it does.  And because of that, I think many Albanian expatriates basically became members of other jurisdictions.  Here in the USA, the Albanians have their own jurisdiction within the OCA.
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« Reply #2 on: June 26, 2009, 07:40:06 AM »

This what I would call good service. I've been considering a little trip to Milan on August and I was going to start a new topic to ask whether there are any Orthodox parishes in Milan. It seems that there are several. Now the only problem is that I won't propably understand anything of the services because of language issues. Tongue
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« Reply #3 on: June 26, 2009, 02:18:58 PM »

By AP, do you mean Albanian Patriarchate?

If you do, I wouldn't be surprised by their absence in Rome or in any other parts of Europe.  The communists, more or less, dismantled the Albanian Church and it's finally now starting to recover and I pray it does.  And because of that, I think many Albanian expatriates basically became members of other jurisdictions.  Here in the USA, the Albanians have their own jurisdiction within the OCA.

Actually I mean Patriarchate of Anioch. You are her (its?) member, lol.
« Last Edit: June 26, 2009, 02:19:33 PM by mike » Logged

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« Reply #4 on: June 30, 2009, 02:13:24 AM »

Actually I mean Patriarchate of Anioch. You are her (its?) member, lol.

I don't believe the Antiochian Church has any parishes in Italy.  The Archdiocese of Western and Central Europe website doesn't list anything, with the closest parishes being in Austria or Switzerland.
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« Reply #5 on: July 20, 2009, 02:04:47 AM »

I know that the Russian church in Rome used to be under the ROCOR but has moved (either to the MP or Paris Exarchate).

Is Orthodoxy gaining a foothold in Italy?  How many converts have been received?

I know that Southern Italy and Sicily were under the EP way back when.  It's a shame that they had to be captured by Rome, probably due to Norman influences.  If they would have stayed under the EP then I probably would have been cradle Orthodox.


Also, what language was the DL and services in when S.  Italy was Orthodox?

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« Reply #6 on: July 20, 2009, 02:19:18 AM »

REPLY TO REPLY #5

I'd guess the language of the services in Southern Italy would have been Greek; it was during Byzantine times and was under the Ecumenical Patriarchate.  I also think they were Greek people, essentially, too.
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« Reply #7 on: July 20, 2009, 05:08:22 AM »

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Is Orthodoxy gaining a foothold in Italy?  How many converts have been received?

It is growing, but this growth is almost entirely due to the influx of migrants from Eastern Europe, especially Romania.
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« Reply #8 on: July 20, 2009, 07:46:57 AM »

As an Italian, I think I can intervene on this point.
There are many Orthodox Churches in Italy. Orthodoxy is growing through the conversion of Italians married to immigrants, but it must be said I know of full-Italian clergy in Italy, so definitely Italy is becoming "more Orthodox". The main reason might be the infiltration of RCism in Italy which is often looked at as a bad interference.
As for the churches, here's a list of main movements within the Orthodox in Italy:
The Archdiocese of Italy, under the omophorion of Archbishop Gennadios (Zervos), of the Patriarchate of Constantinople. It's legal see is in Venice.
The Russian Archdiocese of Western Europe, which has divided from the Patriarchate of Moscow and is now under the EP. It's legal see is in Florence.
The Patriarchate of Moscow, represented by the Diocese of Korsun, Decanate of Italy. The Decane is Archpriest Antonio Liotti, and its legal see is in Brindisi.
The Metropolia of Zagabria, Lubiana and Italy, under the Serbian Orthodox Church, under the omophorion of Metropolitan Jovan (Pavlovic).
The Diocese of Italy, under the Patriarchate of Romania. Its legal see is in Rome.
The Patriarchate of Bulgaria, whose legal see is in Rome.
The Autocephalous Church of Polland, entrusted to Fr Pietro Nazaruk, legal see in Sassari.
The Russian Orthodox Church Abroad, actually represented with only one community in Bari - the other pre-existent communities have passed to the Patriarchate of Moscow or the papovcy Old Believers.
The Greek Old Calendarists, not in communion with the EP or any other Patriarchate.
The Orthodox Church in Italy, whose see is in Ravenna. This church has his own Metropolitan but is in communion with the Ukrainian Church of Patriarch Filaret and with the Bulgarian Church of Metropolitan Innokenti of Sophia, but not with the EP.

There are no Antiochians in Italy. Our country has been literally (and positively, of course) invaded by Greeks, Romanians, Serbians, and recently Russians. Albanians would be present if it weren't that the communities of Albanians hadn't been absorbed in antiquity by the RC: there are in fact some Albanian Rite Catholic Churches in Souther Italy! I don't know anything of that Georgian Church you mentioned.

In Milan, there are five communities in communion with the EP:
The Greek Orthodox Church of the Annunciation to the Mother of God, under Archimandrite Timotheos Moschoupolos
The Orthodox Church of st. Anargiri, Cosma, Damian and Panteleimon, under Fr Nicola Ramaudo
The Orthodox Parish of st Serge and Seraphim, under Igumen Fr Dimitri (Fantini)
The Serbian Orthodox Parish, under Fr Dusan Tomic
The Romanian Orthodox Church of the Descent of the Holy Spirit, under Archpresbyter Traian Valdman.

You just have to pick and choose...

In Rome, there are too many parishes to list here. For anyone interested, try and give a look here: http://digilander.libero.it/ortodossia/Indirizzi.htm

Quote
This what I would call good service. I've been considering a little trip to Milan on August and I was going to start a new topic to ask whether there are any Orthodox parishes in Milan. It seems that there are several. Now the only problem is that I won't propably understand anything of the services because of language issues. Tongue

I live in Bergamo, not far from Milan (it takes 50 minutes by train). If you need some support, just ask... maybe I could help you. If you are coming in the last week of August, for example, I might even be at your disposal as a guide: just ask! Anyway, I read that you're a member of the Finnish Orthodox Church. Maybe a Russian Church might be of your interest? There's on in Bergamo, if you like (the one I'm attending  Wink)

In Christ,   Alex


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« Reply #9 on: July 20, 2009, 08:14:57 AM »

I was wondering how the Church is doing in Italy as well. Being interested in architecture & as an architecture student, we are taught about Early Christian Architecture early on in our schooling & we learn about some of the oldest churches in Italy like San Vitale (Rome & Ravenna), Sante Apollinare en Classe, St. Peters Basilica (original), Sant'Apollinare Nuovo etc...

I was also told by an Orthodox man once that there is an old Orthodox monastery that used to be under the EP on the coast of Italy, however it is now under Franciscans or Benedictines. However he said when he visited, they still preserved things like the eastern-style of bell ringing & the rythymic board tapping (sorry, as a newbie I dunno what its called).
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« Reply #10 on: July 20, 2009, 08:35:17 AM »

I was wondering how the Church is doing in Italy as well. Being interested in architecture & as an architecture student, we are taught about Early Christian Architecture early on in our schooling & we learn about some of the oldest churches in Italy like San Vitale (Rome & Ravenna), Sante Apollinare en Classe, St. Peters Basilica (original), Sant'Apollinare Nuovo etc...

I was also told by an Orthodox man once that there is an old Orthodox monastery that used to be under the EP on the coast of Italy, however it is now under Franciscans or Benedictines. However he said when he visited, they still preserved things like the eastern-style of bell ringing & the rythymic board tapping (sorry, as a newbie I dunno what its called).

I suggest you to put this in the list of Early Christian Churches:

(it is the building in the middle)
This is the Cathedral of St. Mary the Mother of God (now dedicated to the Assumption of Mary by RCs). It was built in 639 in Torcello, one of the islands of Venice. It is a byzantine-style church in the Exarchate of Ravenna, which was only partially rebuilt in 1008 (still pre-schism). It is wonderful and you can "sense" its history. It is also famous for preserving an enormous open-air baptismal pool dedicated to st John the Baptist edificated in the 7th century together with the first cathedral.
Hope you like it! ;-)
« Last Edit: July 20, 2009, 08:38:44 AM by AlexanderOfBergamo » Logged

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« Reply #11 on: July 20, 2009, 04:08:56 PM »

My mothers family comes from around Foggia, in the province of Puglia (Apulia).  Most of the people in the south have Greek  blood in them and even look somewhat Greek (even after centuries).  Southern Italy and Sicily were once part of "Magna Greca" and colonized by Greeks. 

You can still see much Byzantine influence among the people and churches in the south, especially in their conception of God and religion.  The southern Italian people hold a much more Orthodox conception of God as a loving and merciful father, rather then a just judge who seeks to strike down people for the slightest infraction.  They are also more lax in church attendance (except for women and children) and preserve many colorful pageantry and religious processions like the Greeks do.

The Southern Italian/Sicilian ways put them at odds with the majority thinking and culture of most RC's.  This is why they have always been looked down on by people (especially the Irish dominated RCC in America).  It is my hope that the people will eventually return to their Orthodox roots.

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« Reply #12 on: July 26, 2009, 09:03:38 AM »

The Diocese of Italy, under the Patriarchate of Romania. Its legal see is in Rome.
The Patriarchate of Bulgaria, whose legal see is in Rome.

Behold, the competing Vicars of Christ!  

Quote
I live in Bergamo, not far from Milan (it takes 50 minutes by train). If you need some support, just ask... maybe I could help you. If you are coming in the last week of August, for example, I might even be at your disposal as a guide: just ask! Anyway, I read that you're a member of the Finnish Orthodox Church. Maybe a Russian Church might be of your interest? There's on in Bergamo, if you like (the one I'm attending  Wink)
Thank you for the offer and the information you've given. I'll send you a PM if I end up making this trip. Smiley
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« Reply #13 on: July 26, 2009, 09:42:30 AM »

Quote
Quote from: AlexanderOfBergamo on July 20, 2009, 07:46:57 AM
The Diocese of Italy, under the Patriarchate of Romania. Its legal see is in Rome.
The Patriarchate of Bulgaria, whose legal see is in Rome.

Behold, the competing Vicars of Christ!
Huh, don't tell the Pope... he might be offended  Grin

Quote
Quote
Quote
I live in Bergamo, not far from Milan (it takes 50 minutes by train). If you need some support, just ask... maybe I could help you. If you are coming in the last week of August, for example, I might even be at your disposal as a guide: just ask! Anyway, I read that you're a member of the Finnish Orthodox Church. Maybe a Russian Church might be of your interest? There's on in Bergamo, if you like (the one I'm attending  Wink)
Thank you for the offer and the information you've given. I'll send you a PM if I end up making this trip. Smiley

Ok, I'm here at your disposal

In Christ,   Alex
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« Reply #14 on: August 06, 2009, 10:16:42 AM »

St. Januarius is my patron saint and I've understanded that he's quite popular at least among the Catholics in Italy. I'd be grateful of any information you can give about how he is commemorated among the Orthodox and the Catholic alike.
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« Reply #15 on: August 10, 2009, 07:57:34 AM »

I asked about Orthodox churches in Verona on another forum and an RC deacon told me the following.

VERONA
1. Parrocchia Ortodossa Romena di San Elia
Indirizzo: c/o Istituto Piccole Suore della sacra Famiglia, via Nascimbeni 10, Verona
Parroco: inviato dalla Parrocchia di Padova
2. Parrocchia Ortodossa
Indirizzo: Chiesa di S.Salvatore Vecchio - v. S. Salvatore ang. v. Emilei - Verona
Rettore: p. Sergio Borskij


Here are more options for Veneto region: http://digilander.libero.it/ortodoss...zzi.htm#Veneto.

I checked and the one where Sergio Borskij is priest is Serbian. I am going to Verona soon and will try to find it.

Regards
Margaret
in Edinburgh
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« Reply #16 on: August 11, 2009, 05:07:11 PM »

what about Orthodox Churches in Sicily?  Have any of the Albenisian people retunred to Orthodoxy?
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« Reply #17 on: September 03, 2009, 12:41:55 PM »

The Polish St. Catherine Church in Alghero (Sicilly) has been transfered to the EP.
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« Reply #18 on: September 03, 2009, 02:13:34 PM »

St. Januarius is my patron saint and I've understanded that he's quite popular at least among the Catholics in Italy. I'd be grateful of any information you can give about how he is commemorated among the Orthodox and the Catholic alike.
On the Catholic side, I can tell you that on the feast day of st. Januarius there's the so-called miracle of the st. Januarius' blood. In the presence of the faithful in his cathedral, the Roman Catholic bishop of Naples shows whether the relic of Januarius' blood held in a sort of ostensorium has become fluid as ordinary blood or if it's remained coagulated. As far as I know, the miracle is said not to repeat only when in proximity or coincidence of terrible events... the last ones I can remember was during World War II, if I'm not wrong, and also in 1976. For the reason of this miracle, st. Januarius is the official patron saint of blood donors.
It is incredible how much hostility was held by RCs against this saint: after the Second Vatican Council, st. Januarius was one of those saints in the list with st. George and st. Barnaba to be cancelled for martyrologies and calendars due to the "legendary" character of this bishop. Fortunately, there was a public "rebellion" of the faithful in Naples, the only city where st. Januarius is venerated in Italy, but also one of the most influential in the Catholic church of Italy. On the miracle of the blood there have also been studies by CICAP, an institution which oversees religions, cults and occult phenomena. CICAP was able to obtain the same effect of the blood "liquefying" on occasion with a thyxotropic substance; yet no true analysis has been made on the relic but a spectroscopy which detected the presence of real human emoglobine, and the case of 1976 can still not be explained using the thyxotropic theory. In other words: only God knows!

Unfortunately I have no idea of how this great martyr might be honoured in Orthodoxy: I don't think there might be communities named after him, but for sure he is an Orthodox saint living between the 2nd and 3rd century.

In Christ,    Alex
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