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Author Topic: "The Ice Storm" (Ang Lee 1997 movie)  (Read 3577 times) Average Rating: 0
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Heorhij
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« on: May 24, 2009, 10:16:12 PM »

Lesya and I just have watched this film for the gazillonth time and we are both sobbing insessanly, shaking in each other's arms and shedding tears...

If there is anything contrary or outside of the Orthodox faith in this movie, then I am not Orthodox...

God, please have mercy on us all... You proponents of the American "right" wing politics - please... this was (and is) the reaction to what you thought you'd achieve... the very, very legitimate one...

God, have mercy on us all. Christ, have mercy...
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« Reply #1 on: May 24, 2009, 10:39:10 PM »

This movie always brings me to tears, as well. 
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« Reply #2 on: May 24, 2009, 10:53:10 PM »

 Hmmm... well... according to the reviews on Netflix we have: adult language, nudity,strong sexual content. Not my cup of tea although I will say that the premise of the movie sounded somewhat interesting. However, movies like this really bum me out; sort of like the Days of Wine and Roses. I leave the movie feeling worse than when I sat down to watch it. I know it's reality... life... but when I watch a movie, I guess I'm looking more for something to entertain me for a few hours (i.e. just finished watching "Guarding Tess" with Nicholas Cage. Loved it.

But we're all different. You know... different strokes for different folks. Take care. Wink
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« Reply #3 on: May 25, 2009, 12:38:08 AM »

Heorhij and Schultz,

I liked it too.
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Heorhij
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« Reply #4 on: May 25, 2009, 08:26:59 AM »

Hmmm... well... according to the reviews on Netflix we have: adult language, nudity,strong sexual content. Not my cup of tea although I will say that the premise of the movie sounded somewhat interesting. However, movies like this really bum me out; sort of like the Days of Wine and Roses. I leave the movie feeling worse than when I sat down to watch it. I know it's reality... life... but when I watch a movie, I guess I'm looking more for something to entertain me for a few hours (i.e. just finished watching "Guarding Tess" with Nicholas Cage. Loved it.

But we're all different. You know... different strokes for different folks. Take care. Wink

Douglas, I am not a fan of profane language or pornography either, but "The Ice Storm" is not about that at all. You need to see it to find out what is it really about. It's actually about how precious, unique every human life is, and how we all fail to value it every day. There is no "entertainment" whatsoever in the movie - rather, a slowly building but exceedingly powerful Aristotelian "catharsis," like in Shakespeare's tragedies. That's Ang Lee, a real master of cinematography - I think quite comparable with Bergman, Fellini, Antonioni, Tarkovsky and other great directors.

Schultz, Serge, - thanks, guys, I am glad that Lesya and I are not all that unique! (And my apologies to all about the political remark - I should have known better, this is not the right place for political debate.)

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« Reply #5 on: May 25, 2009, 01:50:09 PM »

Part of me would like to watch this film and another part of me is afraid it will cause a lot of depression...
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« Reply #6 on: July 01, 2009, 03:25:27 AM »

Lesya and I just have watched this film for the gazillonth time and we are both sobbing insessanly, shaking in each other's arms and shedding tears...

If there is anything contrary or outside of the Orthodox faith in this movie, then I am not Orthodox...

God, please have mercy on us all... You proponents of the American "right" wing politics - please... this was (and is) the reaction to what you thought you'd achieve... the very, very legitimate one...

God, have mercy on us all. Christ, have mercy...

I saw this movie, but it was a long time ago. I remember the "key party" scene. While the movie was entertaining, I found it to be a typical Hollywood portrayal of the depravity and cluelessness of man without God. But ironically this wasn't at all the idea that Hollywood was trying to portray. They always make these movies which try to rationalize and justify human sin based on human struggle. In other words, humans are justified in their sinning because humans struggle with their existence.

The Hollywood messsage is: "Human beings are desperately struggling to find purpose and meaning in a difficult and chaotic world. See how understandable it is that these poor human beings look for happiness and satisfaction in sin and wickedness. And please feel sorry for them as you watch them hurt others and hurt themselves. They don't mean to. They're just good people trying to make sense of it all. etc. etc..." (Gosh, isn't existentialism a bit cliche by now? But Hollywood loves to bang that one note over and over again. We get it already! At least try to give us some original propaganda. Roll Eyes)  In other words, we are supposed to sympathize with these self-indulgent fools who wreak havoc on their children's psyches through their sinful choices. But to willfully reject God and live according our own ideas will always cause pain and suffering for others as well as ourselves.

Now I do have to ask, why is this the result of the Religious Right and conservative politics? Can you please start another thread to answer this? I have no dog in that hunt, because I do not vote and am neither a conservative nor a liberal. But I am curious why you make such a bold statement in connection with the movie. Like I said, it's been a while since I've seen it, so if you can be specific perhaps I can see where you're going with your assertion. It may indeed be valid.

Selam
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« Reply #7 on: July 01, 2009, 07:57:54 AM »

It was a good movie..I liked it and became somewhat depressed but in a good way..I am a clinical psychologist so I found it very interesting. I can see the connection to the "right wing". I never thought of it that way but it is very interesting to ponder that issue.
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« Reply #8 on: July 01, 2009, 08:10:39 AM »

Dear Gebre,

The movie is NOT "entertaining" to me. Again, I saw in it a tragedy through and through.

Tragedy cleanses the soul, I believe.

I think it is bad that a lot of young (and maybe also older) folks in the USA just do not see art in cinematography, only entertainment.
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« Reply #9 on: July 01, 2009, 10:37:50 AM »

I think Mr. Y and I will have to check this one out, then.  Sounds really interesting!  I can usually forgive a film for having sexual situations when it's important to the story.  Or I can at least close my eyes or hit fast forward if it's too much.  I can't, however, stomach violence and gore in film. 
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« Reply #10 on: July 01, 2009, 11:18:44 AM »



I think it is bad that a lot of young (and maybe also older) folks in the USA just do not see art in cinematography, only entertainment.

It seems to me (mind you... it just "seems" to me [I could be misunderstanding your statement]) that you're being a bit condescending towards "some" folks in the USA. Why just limit it to the USA? And what exactly is wrong with wanting to be entertained? Why must we see "art" in film? Why must we seek reality and ensure that our movies have a message? I get plenty of reality every day from 9 to 5... sometimes more than I can handle. I don't want to see nudity and I don't care that the film demands it. Explicit sexual content (for me at least) does not play a critical role in any movie I've ever seen (and I've seen plenty of movies in my time). Like I posted earlier... we're all different and what one might find meaningful might be any but for the next person. Don't disparage entertainment. It plays a very important role in many people's lives. As for art, I'm not educated enough to appreciate it (nor do I really care). I know what I like and much that is classified as fine art (including many movies I've heard trumpeted by professional reviewers) leaves me numb. Please don't take offense to my words. In reading them they sound harsh and they're not meant to be. Let's just chalk them up to a defensive posture on my part.
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« Reply #11 on: July 01, 2009, 11:37:21 AM »

A defensive posture is always interesting to this psychologist.
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« Reply #12 on: July 01, 2009, 12:47:29 PM »

Why?  Wink
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« Reply #13 on: July 01, 2009, 12:50:53 PM »

I'm a psychologist..its what I do..
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« Reply #14 on: July 01, 2009, 01:12:38 PM »

Naturally.   Smiley

I think, however, that your skills would be better trained on Metropolitan Philip's behavior these past few months. He's a much more intriguing study.  Wink
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« Reply #15 on: July 01, 2009, 01:19:14 PM »

Indeed...and people thought the Antiochian Archdiocese was the "future" of Orthodoxy. I remember when a group of people here left the GOA parish they refused to consider the OCA because of the scandal..its all very sad. I think he has severe issues with self esteem and could use a course of anger management treatment.I really do fear that he is self destructive and ,obviously, a danger to others..
Getting back on topic Ang Lee could do a movie about all this. Wouldn't that be scary!
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« Reply #16 on: July 01, 2009, 01:23:59 PM »

Getting back on topic Ang Lee could do a movie about all this. Wouldn't that be scary!

LOL... Would there be nudity and sexual content? Actually... come to think about it... there very well could be! Now that IS a scary thought and it's reality to boot!  Shocked
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« Reply #17 on: July 01, 2009, 01:28:08 PM »

I'd like Ang Lee to film Metropolitan Phillip's reaction when the Patriarch of Antioch walks into the Antiochian Convention in a couple of weeks.
It is rumored he is coming and has applied for a visa.
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« Reply #18 on: July 01, 2009, 05:13:50 PM »

Dear Gebre,

The movie is NOT "entertaining" to me. Again, I saw in it a tragedy through and through.

Tragedy cleanses the soul, I believe.

I think it is bad that a lot of young (and maybe also older) folks in the USA just do not see art in cinematography, only entertainment.

I should have qualified what I mean by "entertaining." I thought the movie was well directed, well filmed, and well acted. I though the plot was intriguing and the movie definitely held my interest. Thus I found it entertaining because of those things. I certainly wasn't amused by it, and it was indeed a heavy film. I thought it was a well crafted piece of Hollywood propaganda. I give Hollywood a lot of credit; they are much more creative and artistic in promoting their world view than the Christian community is in portraying ours. As much as I admire the intent behind contemporary Christian music and Christian movies (such as often seen on TBN), the music is usually vapid and the movies are poorly acted and just don't ring true.

I agree that tragedy can cleanse the soul, IF there is redemption at the end of it. Before I was a Christian I used to love nihilistic movies and existential literature. I related it to those things because that was my own life experience. But over time it became very stale. Thank God for His mercy and grace!

One of my favorite movies is "East of Eden." The movie is very depressing and heart wrenching on many levels. It deals with the cruel realities of darkness and evil, and the movie doesn't necessarily have a "happy" ending. But there is redemption, and redemption is never possible without precursors of agony and pain.

BTW, I'm still interested in learning more about the political connection you referenced regarding the movie. But make sure you start another thread so you don't get warned like I did.  Embarrassed

Selam
 
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« Reply #19 on: July 01, 2009, 09:28:39 PM »

I remember when I first saw this movie.  I was a senior in college about to graduate and my roomate, a few friends and I rented it.  I was at first blinded by the star power it had including Kevin Kline, Sigourney Weaver, a very young Toby McGuire, Christina Ricci (of the Addams Family fame), Elijah Wood and a few others.

But when you get down to it, I remember just how empty I felt at the end.  At the time I saw it, I was very much in a "if it feels good, do it" mentality and I was spiritually a wreck.  And when I saw that same mentality plastered all over the big screen and the consequences it wrought, I couldn't help but weep at the end just as Kevin Kline did.  What good is all of that if you're still empty on the inside and have no anchor to keep you from going adrift if the pleasure of this world, which you seek, is out of reach.  I think that the end of the movie leaves in the people who seek it the hope that things can improve. I think Ang Lee leaves it up to every individual as to how that improvement can come about.  It's an excellent film. 

I have to disagree, Heorhij, that Ang Lee is as masterful a cinematographer as you think he is, but, hey, to each his own. Wink
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« Reply #20 on: July 02, 2009, 09:37:32 AM »

^^Yes, Scamandrius, I agree that it leaves you empty at the end; but that's exactly what a tragedy should do to a reader/viewer, IMHO. Otherwise it would be a melodrama (e.g., if there are some "notes of hope" at the end - there are none in "Hamlet" or in "The Sound and The Fury" or in the "Brothers Karamazov," except maybe for a totally superfluous Alyosha's soliloque at the end). That's the Aristotelian "catharsis," I believe.

As far as "The Ice Storm" being either Hollywood or propaganda, oh no, I don't want to even respond to that, it's so low...

Re. "why the USA?" - I don't know, I just live here and observe... I am not so sure about Western Europe or Australia or Japan.
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« Reply #21 on: July 02, 2009, 05:44:16 PM »

^^Yes, Scamandrius, I agree that it leaves you empty at the end; but that's exactly what a tragedy should do to a reader/viewer, IMHO. Otherwise it would be a melodrama (e.g., if there are some "notes of hope" at the end - there are none in "Hamlet" or in "The Sound and The Fury" or in the "Brothers Karamazov," except maybe for a totally superfluous Alyosha's soliloque at the end). That's the Aristotelian "catharsis," I believe.

As far as "The Ice Storm" being either Hollywood or propaganda, oh no, I don't want to even respond to that, it's so low...

Re. "why the USA?" - I don't know, I just live here and observe... I am not so sure about Western Europe or Australia or Japan.

Perhaps your great love for this movie has clouded your objectivity? I know I have often made the same mistake with certain works of art that I hold dear.

Selam
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« Reply #22 on: November 09, 2009, 04:55:57 PM »

You know, you people made me watch that movie. Maybe because I'm too young (or because I didn't live in the 70s), I could't actually grasp its meaning. To me though, the movie was pure realism (of which I am becoming a fan).
Some scenes were fun, breaking the ice and giving you a different touch. It had no basic plot, which made it look like an episode rather than a movie. The actors were all great, I loved the direction too.
I also got closer to the 70s. It was like a meme-movie. Tongue

But, by the Nine Divines, the cast was awesome! Who could have imagined Spiderman reading Fantastic Four (yes, he's playing the nerd again!) or Frodo having an affair with the girl from Addam's family?! Cheesy
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« Reply #23 on: November 09, 2009, 06:29:13 PM »

This movie was extremely painful to watch.  Why would anyone repeatedly subject themselves and their wife to pain?  (Uh...please don’t answer that...)
 
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