Orthodoc
Supporter & Defender Of Orthodoxy
Archon
 Offline
Faith: Orthodox Catholic
Jurisdiction: OCA
Posts: 2,526
Those who ignore history tend to repeat it.
|
 |
« on: October 31, 2003, 12:00:11 PM » |
|
The OCA website just put some absolutely beautiful pictures of Metropolitan Herman receiving the Holy Protection Monastery in Florida into Holy Orthodoxy! http://www.oca.org/pages/events/2003/10.October/1028MiamiFL-Protection/index.htmlOrthodoc |
|
|
|
|
Logged
|
Oh Lord, Save thy people and bless thine inheritance.
Grant victory to the Orthodox Christians over their adversaries.
And by virtue of thy Cross preserve thy habitation.
|
|
|
|
JoeZollars
|
|
« Reply #1 on: October 31, 2003, 12:19:33 PM » |
|
pardon my ignorance, but from whence did this monastary come originally?
Joe Zollars
|
|
|
|
|
Logged
|
These posts no longer represent my beliefs and I in no way endorse their contents.
|
|
|
|
David
|
|
« Reply #2 on: October 31, 2003, 12:22:31 PM » |
|
Was it HOOM? I don't recall....
|
|
|
|
|
Logged
|
"When looking at faults, use a mirror, not a telescope."
-Yazid Ibrahim
|
|
|
|
JoeZollars
|
|
« Reply #3 on: October 31, 2003, 12:25:42 PM » |
|
hmm I thought it might be Uniate or one of the Vagante groups cause it would have taken quite a while to get all those Icons written.
Joe Zollars
|
|
|
|
|
Logged
|
These posts no longer represent my beliefs and I in no way endorse their contents.
|
|
|
Orthodoc
Supporter & Defender Of Orthodoxy
Archon
Offline
Faith: Orthodox Catholic
Jurisdiction: OCA
Posts: 2,526
Those who ignore history tend to repeat it.
|
|
« Reply #4 on: October 31, 2003, 12:33:44 PM » |
|
The Monastery was part of the Byzantine Catholic Church and under Bishop Pataki.
Orthodoc
|
|
|
|
|
Logged
|
Oh Lord, Save thy people and bless thine inheritance.
Grant victory to the Orthodox Christians over their adversaries.
And by virtue of thy Cross preserve thy habitation.
|
|
|
|
Hypo-Ortho
Guest
|
|
« Reply #5 on: October 31, 2003, 12:44:31 PM » |
|
You're absolutely right, Orthodoc! The pics are absolutely magnificent! What a great joy for Holy Orthodoxy to receive Holy Protection Monastery and Holy Cross Academy into Holy Orthodoxy in the jurisdiction of the Orthodox Church in America from the Unia--from all I could see in the pics, the monastery church was already as Orthodox as could be in its beautiful iconography and appointments. MANY YEARS to the monks of Holy Protection Monastery and the faculty and students of Holy Cross Academy! AXIOS to the newly-vested priests and newly-tonsured monks of Holy Protection Monastery!
Hypo-Ortho
|
|
|
|
|
Logged
|
|
|
|
|
David
|
|
« Reply #6 on: October 31, 2003, 12:58:21 PM » |
|
Indeed Hypo...those of us in the SE now have another monastery to visit. Glory to God!
|
|
|
|
|
Logged
|
"When looking at faults, use a mirror, not a telescope."
-Yazid Ibrahim
|
|
|
|
Linus7
|
|
« Reply #7 on: December 05, 2003, 09:35:49 AM » |
|
I know this thread was posted sometime back (Oct. 31), but I just saw it last night.
I was awestruck by the beauty of the frescoes at Holy Protection Monastery and Holy Cross Academy.
Wow!
They have much of the Gospel right there on their walls!
Breathtaking.
|
|
|
|
|
Logged
|
The first condition of salvation is to keep the norm of the true faith and in no way to deviate from the established doctrine of the Fathers.
- Pope St. Hormisdas
|
|
|
|
Tikhon29605
|
|
« Reply #8 on: December 08, 2003, 06:10:00 PM » |
|
While this is indeed wonderful news, I have a more practical question: What this group in a Byzantine Catholic Jurisdiction (in Communion with Rome) before it was received into Orthodoxy. If so, how ON EARTH were they able to keep these beautiful buildings? Was there a lawsuit beforehand? I didn't think the Church of Rome every let is property go (at least not without a fight) regardless of whether its Eastern or Western Rite. Anybody know anything about this?
|
|
|
|
|
Logged
|
|
|
|
Byzantine Christian
Jr. Member
Offline
Posts: 96
|
|
« Reply #9 on: December 11, 2003, 01:04:48 PM » |
|
The Byzantine Catholic Church, proabley just handed it over to the Monks, because if they kept the property, they would have not use for it, and it would have costed them more in the end, then just giving it to the Monks.
In Christ
The ByzCath
|
|
|
|
|
Logged
|
|
|
|
Anastasios
Webdespota
Administrator
Stratopedarches
Offline
Faith: Eastern Orthodox
Jurisdiction: Greek Old Calendarist
Posts: 10,431
Metropolitan Chrysostomos of Florina
|
|
« Reply #10 on: December 11, 2003, 01:13:14 PM » |
|
While this is indeed wonderful news, I have a more practical question: What this group in a Byzantine Catholic Jurisdiction (in Communion with Rome) before it was received into Orthodoxy. If so, how ON EARTH were they able to keep these beautiful buildings? Was there a lawsuit beforehand? I didn't think the Church of Rome every let is property go (at least not without a fight) regardless of whether its Eastern or Western Rite. Anybody know anything about this?
They were never erected according the proper canonical form under Bp Michael Dudick, hence when they left they were able to keep their property because they had never signed it over to the bishop. anastasios |
|
|
|
|
Logged
|
Check out my personal website with 130+ articles: www.anastasioshudson.comDisclaimer: Past posts reflect stages of my life before my baptism may not be accurate expositions of Orthodox teaching. I served as an Orthodox priest from June 2008 to April 2013, before resigning for personal reasons |
|
|
|
TonyS
|
|
« Reply #11 on: December 11, 2003, 04:21:10 PM » |
|
While this is indeed wonderful news, I have a more practical question: What this group in a Byzantine Catholic Jurisdiction (in Communion with Rome) before it was received into Orthodoxy. If so, how ON EARTH were they able to keep these beautiful buildings? Was there a lawsuit beforehand? I didn't think the Church of Rome every let is property go (at least not without a fight) regardless of whether its Eastern or Western Rite. Anybody know anything about this?
They were never erected according the proper canonical form under Bp Michael Durichard, hence when they left they were able to keep their property because they had never signed it over to the bishop. anastasios Durichard? The Ruthenian bishop under which that monastery was established was MICHAEL Dudick (I was there for many of those events while he was still bishop). Who is Durichard? |
|
|
|
« Last Edit: December 11, 2003, 04:31:11 PM by TonyS »
|
Logged
|
Tómame como al tequila, de un golpe y sin pensarlo. - Ricardo Arjona
I'd be a fool to surrender when I know I can be a contender
and if everbody's a sinner then everybody can be a winner
...
I'll see you when yo
|
|
|
|
TonyS
|
|
« Reply #12 on: December 11, 2003, 04:34:50 PM » |
|
OK. Someone or something is playing games with my post. Maybe it is a hacker...that sounds good. Maybe "they changed the Matrix." It can be disregarded if correct information is not appreciated.
|
|
|
|
|
Logged
|
Tómame como al tequila, de un golpe y sin pensarlo. - Ricardo Arjona
I'd be a fool to surrender when I know I can be a contender
and if everbody's a sinner then everybody can be a winner
...
I'll see you when yo
|
|
|
Anastasios
Webdespota
Administrator
Stratopedarches
Offline
Faith: Eastern Orthodox
Jurisdiction: Greek Old Calendarist
Posts: 10,431
Metropolitan Chrysostomos of Florina
|
|
« Reply #13 on: December 11, 2003, 04:51:13 PM » |
|
hhahahahah you know why? because I wrote Dud*i*c*k and our software filters it out hahahahaah We need to fix that
anastasios
|
|
|
|
|
Logged
|
Check out my personal website with 130+ articles: www.anastasioshudson.comDisclaimer: Past posts reflect stages of my life before my baptism may not be accurate expositions of Orthodox teaching. I served as an Orthodox priest from June 2008 to April 2013, before resigning for personal reasons |
|
|
|
TonyS
|
|
« Reply #14 on: December 11, 2003, 05:27:08 PM » |
|
Good grief! Let's see if D.u.d.i.c.k works....
|
|
|
|
|
Logged
|
Tómame como al tequila, de un golpe y sin pensarlo. - Ricardo Arjona
I'd be a fool to surrender when I know I can be a contender
and if everbody's a sinner then everybody can be a winner
...
I'll see you when yo
|
|
|
Maria
Orthodox Christian
Archon
Offline
Posts: 3,441
O most Holy Theotokos, save us.
|
|
« Reply #15 on: December 21, 2003, 11:50:12 PM » |
|
Does anyone know why this monastery chose to convert to Orthodoxy?
The tonsured monks looked angelic in their picture on the website.
|
|
|
|
|
Logged
|
Glory to Jesus Christ!
Glory to Him forever!
|
|
|
Byzantine Christian
Jr. Member
Offline
Posts: 96
|
|
« Reply #16 on: January 20, 2004, 06:56:31 PM » |
|
Dont know why, accept they proabley were having problems with their unia bishop and never believed in the Papal Doctrines any way so just decided to convert to Orthodoxy the fullness of the Faith. That would be my gusse. Why would did they join the OCA, thats what I want to know. In Christ BC |
|
|
|
« Last Edit: January 20, 2004, 06:57:02 PM by Byzantine Christian »
|
Logged
|
|
|
|
Tony
Member
Offline
Faith: Orthodox
Jurisdiction: ROCOR
Posts: 188
|
|
« Reply #17 on: January 20, 2004, 07:28:19 PM » |
|
I hear there may be more involved than doctrinal issues. In Christ, Anthony Dont know why, accept they proabley were having problems with their unia bishop and never believed in the Papal Doctrines any way so just decided to convert to Orthodoxy the fullness of the Faith. That would be my gusse. Why would did they join the OCA, thats what I want to know.
In Christ
BC
|
|
|
|
|
Logged
|
|
|
|
|
Mor Ephrem
|
|
« Reply #18 on: January 20, 2004, 08:23:52 PM » |
|
Why not join the OCA?
|
|
|
|
|
Logged
|
"I'm a huge fan of Mor." - Carmen Electra Laying claim to the Phanar since 9 December 2003 |
|
|
|
|
|
Brendan03
|
|
« Reply #20 on: January 22, 2004, 12:02:54 PM » |
|
Well this is certainly interesting. What a blunder!?! The Catholics have canons that are designed to prevent this from happening. You can bet that someone has been read the riot act by Rome in the wake of this.
I'm sure that there were more than doctrinal issues involved -- there usually are when this kind of a switch happens. But still it will be interesting to see what happens down the road. Some of those monks who have come into Orthodoxy from Catholicism have remained (one prominent Monastery I have in mind is New Skete), while others have at some point found their way back into the Catholic world (like the Holy Resurrection monastery here in DC). I guess it depends in part on what the real motivation for the change was, on the one hand, and what the real experience is within the Orthodox Church.
B
|
|
|
|
|
Logged
|
B
|
|
|
jbc1949
Member
Offline
Posts: 194
St. Adeodatus--Given by God
|
|
« Reply #21 on: January 22, 2004, 01:18:12 PM » |
|
An Eastern Catholic priest (of the Ruthenian Metropolia) once told me that the monks used to be Roman Catholics (i.e., Latin rite)--Franciscans--who adopted with the permission of their superiors the Byzantine rite liturgy to minister to immigrants from Eastern Europe. I don't know what politics went on but in one of their books (In Search of Happiness) . . . http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/tg/detail/-/0316606944/qid=1074791160/sr=1-1/ref=sr_1_1/002-9440110-9645663?v=glance&s=books. . . Fr. Laurence (their abbot) stated that they tried to change to an Eastern Catholic jurisdiction without success. Eventually they were accepted into the OCA jurisdiction. I mentioned them to a Russian Orthodox nun (OCA) who is a prioress of a monastery in Lake George, CO. The look of disapproval on her face was obvious. She didn't explain but I surmised that she thought that the New Skete was just too liberal for her. I read the aforementioned book. Although they are Orthodox they talked more like Catholics than Orthodox, at least in my perception. JBC |
|
|
|
|
Logged
|
|
|
|
Byzantine Christian
Jr. Member
Offline
Posts: 96
|
|
« Reply #22 on: January 22, 2004, 04:23:35 PM » |
|
Let me ask you guys some thing, I just got sent an "Offical Warning" for asking why this paticular monastery joined the OCA, did any of you find it offensive about me inquirering into why this monastery joined this paticular jurisdiction? Just wondering since I have been sent a bad conduct Private Message by a Moderater here.
In Christ
BC
|
|
|
|
|
Logged
|
|
|
|
|
Father Peter
|
|
« Reply #23 on: January 22, 2004, 04:32:33 PM » |
|
Well I do keep picking up vibes about the OCA and it's obvious that some people - can't be bothered to read back and see who - are making some sort of veiled comments that I don't get and don't want to because I'm not US.
Since you have asked in public let me ask you whether you had any sinful intent in starting the thread in the way you did? I don't know if you have been PM'd previously, I don't know if you have a history of attacking the OCA.
So I'm not sure you can ask the question you have. It would be like one of my kids coming in and saying that Mum had told them off for just asking for a biscuit. If they had been asking for an hour and been repeatedly told off then that is different to the having politely asked for a biscuit, well away from meal time. etc etc.
Check your own heart first I guess, and then pray for the ministry of the Moderators, that they be given wisdom.
|
|
|
|
|
Logged
|
|
|
|
|
Brendan03
|
|
« Reply #24 on: January 22, 2004, 04:34:48 PM » |
|
The monastery that is the subject of this thread isn't New Skete. The reference to the book refers to New Skete and, yes, they were Byzantine Rits franciscans who were subject to the Roman Ordinary in Albany and apparently couldn't transfer to an Eastern Catholic jurisdiction, so they entered OCA. They haven't, however, returned.
|
|
|
|
|
Logged
|
B
|
|
|
|
Schultz
|
|
« Reply #25 on: January 22, 2004, 04:37:12 PM » |
|
Well this is certainly interesting. What a blunder!?! The Catholics have canons that are designed to prevent this from happening. You can bet that someone has been read the riot act by Rome in the wake of this.
I'm sure that there were more than doctrinal issues involved -- there usually are when this kind of a switch happens. But still it will be interesting to see what happens down the road. Some of those monks who have come into Orthodoxy from Catholicism have remained (one prominent Monastery I have in mind is New Skete), while others have at some point found their way back into the Catholic world (like the Holy Resurrection monastery here in DC). I guess it depends in part on what the real motivation for the change was, on the one hand, and what the real experience is within the Orthodox Church.
B
That would be the Monastery of the Holy Cross here in DC  |
|
|
|
|
Logged
|
"Hearing a nun's confession is like being stoned to death with popcorn." --Abp. Fulton Sheen
|
|
|
|
Brendan03
|
|
« Reply #26 on: January 22, 2004, 04:41:38 PM » |
|
Ah yes, that's right, thanks for the correction! |
|
|
|
|
Logged
|
B
|
|
|
the slave
intolerant of intolerance
Sr. Member
Offline
Faith: Greek Catholic
Jurisdiction: UGCC
Posts: 805
|
|
« Reply #27 on: January 22, 2004, 05:16:29 PM » |
|
Let me ask you guys some thing, I just got sent an "Offical Warning" for asking why this paticular monastery joined the OCA, did any of you find it offensive about me inquirering into why this monastery joined this paticular jurisdiction? Just wondering since I have been sent a bad conduct Private Message by a Moderater here.
In Christ
BC
Strangely enough I regret bringing this up in public - but as you have asked my to refrain from contacting you by PM - i seem to have no option. I would suggets that you read my PM again. once more you are raising things on more than one Site. Daniel - this behaviour is very damaging to your Spiritual health. Please ask for guidance as to your posting behaviour from your Spiritual Father In sorrow - not anger |
|
|
|
|
Logged
|
"Never let anyone try to tell you that, in order to be Orthodox, you must also be eastern. The West was fully Orthodox for a thousand years; and her venerable liturgy is far older than any of her heresies."
- St. John Maximovitch
|
|
|
Anastasios
Webdespota
Administrator
Stratopedarches
Offline
Faith: Eastern Orthodox
Jurisdiction: Greek Old Calendarist
Posts: 10,431
Metropolitan Chrysostomos of Florina
|
|
« Reply #28 on: January 22, 2004, 05:29:14 PM » |
|
I have been informed by Bobby, who did the warning, that it was the result of the totality of BC's actions on this forum, not due to his one post. Bobby will take up the issue with BC if he so desires but let's stop discussing it now.
thanks
anastasios
|
|
|
|
|
Logged
|
Check out my personal website with 130+ articles: www.anastasioshudson.comDisclaimer: Past posts reflect stages of my life before my baptism may not be accurate expositions of Orthodox teaching. I served as an Orthodox priest from June 2008 to April 2013, before resigning for personal reasons |
|
|
Byzantine Christian
Jr. Member
Offline
Posts: 96
|
|
« Reply #29 on: January 22, 2004, 06:35:14 PM » |
|
I was Asking a Legit Question! I wanted to know why this monastery chose this paticular jurisdiction, I didnt know that was against the rules of the Board.
|
|
|
|
|
Logged
|
|
|
|
Anastasios
Webdespota
Administrator
Stratopedarches
Offline
Faith: Eastern Orthodox
Jurisdiction: Greek Old Calendarist
Posts: 10,431
Metropolitan Chrysostomos of Florina
|
|
« Reply #30 on: January 22, 2004, 06:46:01 PM » |
|
They way you asked it was loaded--especially given your previous statements here, on ecafe, and byzcath.org that you think World Orthodoxy is pretty much heretical except the Antiochians--you could have asked, "why did they join the OCA" but you asked instead "why WOULD they join the OCA" which gave most people that read it the reaction that you were amazed by/dissaproved of that decision.
anastasios
|
|
|
|
|
Logged
|
Check out my personal website with 130+ articles: www.anastasioshudson.comDisclaimer: Past posts reflect stages of my life before my baptism may not be accurate expositions of Orthodox teaching. I served as an Orthodox priest from June 2008 to April 2013, before resigning for personal reasons |
|
|
KO63AP
Jr. Member
Offline
Posts: 50
Óрðù, úþñ÷ðрю! ÛÃÂÂ
|
|
« Reply #31 on: January 22, 2004, 07:25:15 PM » |
|
Dear Byzantine Christian,
Only the community in question can explain why they made the decisions they have. If you are truly interested you might consider contacting the monastery directly.
|
|
|
|
|
Logged
|
âі, щþ ÑÂÂÑ–ÑŽÑ‚ÑŒ у ÑÂÂûьþ÷ðх, ÿþöýуть у рðôþÑÂÂÑ
|
|
|
|
