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Author Topic: What is this icon?  (Read 1889 times) Average Rating: 0
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mike
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« on: April 15, 2009, 06:34:21 PM »

I hadn't known where to put it and I chose this topic.

What is this icon?
« Last Edit: April 15, 2009, 06:34:52 PM by mike » Logged
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« Reply #1 on: April 16, 2009, 12:15:22 AM »

You would have actually done better to just start a new thread with this question rather than insert the question into a thread where it's totally off-topic.  Don't worry that it's going to derail the thread where you posted it, though.  Your question now has its own thread. Wink
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« Reply #2 on: April 16, 2009, 12:33:21 AM »

It looks like the Theotokos is knighting someone, but I have no idea who.
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« Reply #3 on: April 16, 2009, 12:41:23 AM »

But the custom of "dubbing" someone a knight is a western one.
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« Reply #4 on: April 16, 2009, 02:41:15 AM »

But the custom of "dubbing" someone a knight is a western one.

Yep, it's cross-pollination in action.
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« Reply #5 on: April 16, 2009, 06:44:55 AM »

But the custom of "dubbing" someone a knight is a western one.

Yep, it's cross-pollination in action.

Yeah, the crowns are a giveaway.  Probably from someplace under the Polish-Lithuanian Commonwealth.
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« Reply #6 on: April 16, 2009, 09:17:03 AM »

Is that a sword, though? It looks more like the Holy Water thingy, (not sure of the name of it) that the Theotokos has in the icon of the joy of all who sorrow found here:
http://www.firebirdvideos.com/pamphlets/Joy%20of%20All%20Who%20Sorrow.JPG
Just my 2 cents. I am in no way an icon expert.
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« Reply #7 on: April 16, 2009, 10:44:10 AM »

Is that a sword, though? It looks more like the Holy Water thingy, (not sure of the name of it)

LOL.  That's what everybody calls it.  It has come up before:
(the Holy Pastry Brush -does anyone know the real name?).

Holy Water stick ? - found that in dictionary

Kropidło/randistirion/sprinker/aspergillum/asperillium/aspergil/wisk.

We use basil, so we call it "the Basil."
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« Reply #8 on: April 16, 2009, 02:31:22 PM »

I found it on one Greek Catholic site and it made me very curious. Deacon Lance? Maybe you would be able to answer?

Sadly there is no higher resolution and I'm not able to read the titles and the story on the left side.
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« Reply #9 on: April 16, 2009, 02:33:02 PM »

I hadn't known where to put it and I chose this topic.

What is this icon?

Do you have a link to where you found this icon?
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« Reply #10 on: April 16, 2009, 02:40:15 PM »


http://www.muzeum.walcz.pl/

The icon in question is of Polish Greek Catholic origin, and is called the Świat Icon. It is housed in the Muzeum Ziemi Wałeckiej in Wystawa.

"Świat" is the old traditional polish Christmas decoration made of wafer and straw.

http://www.articlearchives.com/society-social/families-children-marriage/1692611-1.html

This icon is thus now an alternate Christmas rendition of the famous Black Madonna of Częstochowa (Matka Boska Częstochowska) associated especially with the Feast of the Nativity. It symbolizes the role of the Theotokos, as the Mother of God and Queen of Heaven, in bestowing the ennobling divine gift of eternal life upon mankind and the world through the Birth of Christ, thereby treading upon the serpent/dragon symbolic of Satan.

Christ is Born. Glorify Him!

+Cosmos

« Last Edit: April 16, 2009, 02:49:01 PM by Cosmos » Logged

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« Reply #11 on: April 16, 2009, 02:45:30 PM »

http://cerkiew.net.pl/Galerie_foto/Ikony/muzeum_ziemi_waleckiej_2007.php

It's an official site of Wrocław - Gdansk Diocese of Ukrainian Catholic Church. It comes from some museum or something like that.

This icon is thus now an alternate Christmas rendition of the famous Black Madonna of Częstochowa (Matka Boska Częstochowska) associated especially with the Feast of the Nativity. It symbolizes the role of the Theotokos, as the Mother of God and Queen of Heaven, in bestowing the ennobling divine gift of eternal life upon mankind and the world through the Birth of Christ, thereby treading upon the serpent/dragon symbolic of Satan.

Christ is Born. Glorify Him!

+Cosmos



First heard of thath, thanks. How have you found this?
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« Reply #12 on: April 16, 2009, 03:09:45 PM »


I apologize for any confusion created by my post. I meant only to say that the Świat Icon has that symbolism in relation to Christmas, not specifically the Black Madonna Icon.

It is my understanding, as related to me by an elderly retired Polish priest, the firsthand source of my information, that virtually all Polish Icons of the Mother of God are inspired by the Black Madonna of Częstochowa (Matka Boska Częstochowska or Czarna Madonna z Częstochowy), Our Lady of Czestochowa, the Queen and Protector of Poland.


Czarna Madonna z Częstochowy

+Cosmos
« Last Edit: April 16, 2009, 03:18:07 PM by Cosmos » Logged

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« Reply #13 on: April 18, 2009, 10:48:39 PM »

It is my understanding, as related to me by an elderly retired Polish priest, the firsthand source of my information, that virtually all Polish Icons of the Mother of God are inspired by the Black Madonna of Częstochowa (Matka Boska Częstochowska or Czarna Madonna z Częstochowy), Our Lady of Czestochowa, the Queen and Protector of Poland.

+Cosmos

I don't think so. Veneration of this icon by the Orthodox and Greek Catholics is quite a new tradition. It certainly has a great influence on venerating Mary in Poland by generally by Roman Catholics. I wouldn't say they're connected in any way.

If I could read the passage...
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« Reply #14 on: April 19, 2009, 11:46:44 PM »

Hello Mike:

You probably know better than I, so I will bow to your opinion. In doing so, perhaps you would be so kind as to provide the proper information regarding the symbolism and history of the Świat Icon.

Thanks.

+Cosmos
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« Reply #15 on: April 20, 2009, 04:19:03 AM »

Ok, I finally understood what you meant. Polish mixed with English causes trouble to me, I'm sorry
I have to admit that I'm impressed with your knowledge
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« Reply #16 on: April 20, 2009, 09:54:29 AM »

Christ is Risen!

Hello, Mike:

Not a problem. I am not Polish and have little knowledge of the Polish language, while your command of the English language is quite impressive, so you are definitely doing better than I am in discussing Polish traditions.  Smiley

I am wondering if you have seen this new liturgical evangeliary in Polish Language, and if so, what is your opinion of it?


New Liturgical Evangeliary in Polish Language


Mandylion from the Old Polish-Lithuanian Republic

May God grant you the Peace and Light of Christ Risen in Glory!

+Cosmos
« Last Edit: April 20, 2009, 09:58:14 AM by Cosmos » Logged

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« Reply #17 on: April 20, 2009, 02:41:36 PM »

He is risen indeed!

I am wondering if you have seen this new liturgical evangeliary in Polish Language, and if so, what is your opinion of it?

Unfortunately I haven't seen it yet. I've heard different opinions about it. It's main drawback is that it's not an official Polish Evangeliary of the Church of Poland, but it only fills up the place until the official one will be made. We still don't have an officially approved Bible in Polish Wink

In doing so, perhaps you would be so kind as to provide the proper information regarding the symbolism and history of the Świat Icon.


Where did you found that the icon is called 'World'?

BTW I've found an icon which looks quite similar. It's called 'Healer' and is a copy on an ancient Georgian icon. It was painted in Moscow in XVIIIth century when Theothokos cured an ill priest.

Greetings,
mike
« Last Edit: April 20, 2009, 02:41:55 PM by mike » Logged
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« Reply #18 on: April 20, 2009, 02:45:37 PM »


http://www.muzeum.walcz.pl/

The icon in question is of Polish Greek Catholic origin, and is called the Świat Icon. It is housed in the Muzeum Ziemi Wałeckiej in Wystawa.

"Świat" is the old traditional polish Christmas decoration made of wafer and straw.

http://www.articlearchives.com/society-social/families-children-marriage/1692611-1.html

This icon is thus now an alternate Christmas rendition of the famous Black Madonna of Częstochowa (Matka Boska Częstochowska) associated especially with the Feast of the Nativity. It symbolizes the role of the Theotokos, as the Mother of God and Queen of Heaven, in bestowing the ennobling divine gift of eternal life upon mankind and the world through the Birth of Christ, thereby treading upon the serpent/dragon symbolic of Satan.

Christ is Born. Glorify Him!

+Cosmos


Very cool!
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« Reply #19 on: April 20, 2009, 04:28:31 PM »

Where did you found that the icon is called 'World'?

The name of that icon, the Świat Icon, is the title by which it is identified at the Muzeum Ziemi Wałeckiej in Wystawa, where it is currently displayed.

I do not know whether that is the original title of the icon, or simply a name given to it by the museum, but I would also like to know which is the case. Please let me know if you discover more details.

+Cosmos 
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