Author Topic: Birth control-church stances?  (Read 470 times)

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Offline Anastasia1

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Birth control-church stances?
« on: April 29, 2015, 08:38:11 PM »
Do Orthodox churches usually have the same stances among the different jurisdictions? How much is official?
« Last Edit: April 29, 2015, 09:04:49 PM by Anastasia1 »
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Offline ialmisry

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Re: Birth control-church stances?
« Reply #1 on: April 29, 2015, 09:22:22 PM »
Christ is risen!
Do Orthodox churches usually have the same stances among the different jurisdictions? How much is official?
you asking OO, EO or both?
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Re: Birth control-church stances?
« Reply #2 on: April 29, 2015, 09:23:59 PM »
-sub-
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Offline Agabus

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Re: Birth control-church stances?
« Reply #3 on: April 29, 2015, 09:55:13 PM »
Do Orthodox churches usually have the same stances among the different jurisdictions? How much is official?
Define official.
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THE OPINIONS HERE MAY NOT REFLECT THE ACTUAL OR PERCEIVED ORTHODOX CHURCH

Offline Anastasia1

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Re: Birth control-church stances?
« Reply #4 on: April 30, 2015, 01:34:13 AM »
Christ is risen!
Do Orthodox churches usually have the same stances among the different jurisdictions? How much is official?
you asking OO, EO or both?
I would be happy to learn about both, but my stronger curiosity is about OO-seemed better to start with asking about OO for obvious reasons. If you would like to answer for EO, you can as long as I also get answers for OO.
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Offline Anastasia1

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Re: Birth control-church stances?
« Reply #5 on: April 30, 2015, 01:37:39 AM »
Do Orthodox churches usually have the same stances among the different jurisdictions? How much is official?
Define official.
I guess what the Church says we must follow? Is there a difference between that and what Church Fathers might have thought? Would there possibly be another definition?
« Last Edit: April 30, 2015, 01:38:48 AM by Anastasia1 »
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Offline Pravoslavac

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Re: Birth control-church stances?
« Reply #6 on: April 30, 2015, 03:36:23 AM »
I still don't get this, is this forum Eastern Orthodox or Oriental Orthodox? There can be only one Orthodox. lol xD


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Offline Anastasia1

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Re: Birth control-church stances?
« Reply #7 on: April 30, 2015, 04:40:54 AM »
I still don't get this, is this forum Eastern Orthodox or Oriental Orthodox? There can be only one Orthodox. lol xD
The board has predominant emphasis on EO in things like convert, faith issues, liturgy, etc. This section is OO because we have some quirks of discussion compared to EO. While not in communion, EO and OO have enough in common that you will fine some overlap in discussing certain liturgical things, when Easter is for most, a few of the saints, sacraments... so there will be overlap on some of the sections. If a thread is on something that differentiates OO from EO or is specifically about OO, then it goes here. Looking at the faith/jurisdiction of the posters on threads might be helpful.
« Last Edit: April 30, 2015, 04:45:15 AM by Anastasia1 »
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Offline wgw

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Re: Birth control-church stances?
« Reply #8 on: April 30, 2015, 12:39:14 PM »
I'm fairly certain the Coptic Church is officially opposed to it; I have a booklet by HH Pope Shenouda of most blessed memory, that condemns it with abortion and homosexuality if memory serves...ai would have to dig it out.  It was part of the impressive set he compiled on faith, morals and theology, of which On Calmness is my favorite.

While I am not sure that I am absolutely opposed to birth control as a means of timing the birth of children and allowing marital relations to resume which might perhaps allow the wife a chance to recover more fully between pregnancies, in order to increase the likelihood of success on the next pregnancy (assuming birth control actually does that; I think some forms of it like IUDs might well have the opposite effect and traumatized the uterus, decreasing the likelihood of a successful pregnancy further on, I think the use of it to limit the size of a family as abhorrent.  Particularly in the case of the Oriental Orthodox, who are facing the real prospect of attempted genocide even in Egypt, and whose numbers are low everywhere except Ethiopia.  In particular, a high birth rate for critically endangered Suroye populations I think is warranted.  But I wish there were 60 million Armenians and not 10 or so, and for that matter, as many Copts as Muslims in Egypt, and tens of millions of Suroye, and for that matter Assyrians, and Syriac, Chaldean and Maronite Catholics, enough population to make a dent in the Islamic hegemony.  And millions more Nasranis, so that Christians might go from being the third largest religion in India to the second or even the first.

And happily towards that end I'm pleased to report the local Syriac and Coptic parishes are full of children and youth.  And I love the way I see parents here in the diaspora treating their children.  It's beautiful to see the families existing in such a state of love, so happy and excited, in the social hall, after liturgy.   And birth control would turn those social halls into empty, tomb like places.  Which is why I think the Pope is spot on in just outright banning birth control, that all of his parishes might ring with the laughter of children in the warm glow that follows the Eucharistic banquet.

I really wish Alexandra read this forum so she could see this post, I might link her.
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Offline Anastasia1

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Re: Birth control-church stances?
« Reply #9 on: May 03, 2015, 11:03:14 PM »
I'm fairly certain the Coptic Church is officially opposed to it; I have a booklet by HH Pope Shenouda of most blessed memory, that condemns it with abortion and homosexuality if memory serves...ai would have to dig it out.  It was part of the impressive set he compiled on faith, morals and theology, of which On Calmness is my favorite.

While I am not sure that I am absolutely opposed to birth control as a means of timing the birth of children and allowing marital relations to resume which might perhaps allow the wife a chance to recover more fully between pregnancies, in order to increase the likelihood of success on the next pregnancy (assuming birth control actually does that; I think some forms of it like IUDs might well have the opposite effect and traumatized the uterus, decreasing the likelihood of a successful pregnancy further on, I think the use of it to limit the size of a family as abhorrent.  Particularly in the case of the Oriental Orthodox, who are facing the real prospect of attempted genocide even in Egypt, and whose numbers are low everywhere except Ethiopia.  In particular, a high birth rate for critically endangered Suroye populations I think is warranted.  But I wish there were 60 million Armenians and not 10 or so, and for that matter, as many Copts as Muslims in Egypt, and tens of millions of Suroye, and for that matter Assyrians, and Syriac, Chaldean and Maronite Catholics, enough population to make a dent in the Islamic hegemony.  And millions more Nasranis, so that Christians might go from being the third largest religion in India to the second or even the first.

And happily towards that end I'm pleased to report the local Syriac and Coptic parishes are full of children and youth.  And I love the way I see parents here in the diaspora treating their children.  It's beautiful to see the families existing in such a state of love, so happy and excited, in the social hall, after liturgy.   And birth control would turn those social halls into empty, tomb like places.  Which is why I think the Pope is spot on in just outright banning birth control, that all of his parishes might ring with the laughter of children in the warm glow that follows the Eucharistic banquet.

I really wish Alexandra read this forum so she could see this post, I might link her.
IUDs are scary-weird implants into inner parts... Eeyuh.

I am assuming medical complications fall into an ask your priest category, but perhaps this would be best posted also in the faith issues section or parenting section?
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Offline Alveus Lacuna

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Re: Birth control-church stances?
« Reply #10 on: May 03, 2015, 11:16:40 PM »
Orthodoxy has always opposed birth control. Only recently have some begun compromising on this; to encourage barren wombs and fruitless marriages is beyond ludicrous.

Offline Salpy

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Re: Birth control-church stances?
« Reply #11 on: May 03, 2015, 11:23:12 PM »
I think the Armenian Church, at least today, is OK with birth control as long as it's not abortive and as long as the couple are not trying to completely avoid having kids.  And of course it goes without saying that the couple need to be married.

And it's always a good idea to talk to your priest.   :)

Offline Volnutt

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Re: Birth control-church stances?
« Reply #12 on: May 04, 2015, 02:12:19 AM »
Orthodoxy has always opposed birth control. Only recently have some begun compromising on this; to encourage barren wombs and fruitless marriages is beyond ludicrous.

I don't think anybody who is for birth control is against fruitfulness. What they're against is forcing abstinence on couples who are in a bad position to have kids due to poverty, health problems, etc.

Offline lovesupreme

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Re: Birth control-church stances?
« Reply #13 on: May 04, 2015, 03:43:57 AM »
I've always understood it be a private matter with one's priest, with guidelines determined on a case-by-case basis, and the primary goals of marriage being marital union and the fruits of that union.

Also, no abortifacients.

[Not OO]
« Last Edit: May 04, 2015, 03:46:14 AM by lovesupreme »

Offline ialmisry

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Re: Birth control-church stances?
« Reply #14 on: May 07, 2015, 11:22:00 PM »
Christ is risen!
I still don't get this, is this forum Eastern Orthodox or Oriental Orthodox? There can be only one Orthodox. lol xD
The board has predominant emphasis on EO in things like convert, faith issues, liturgy, etc. This section is OO because we have some quirks of discussion compared to EO. While not in communion, EO and OO have enough in common that you will fine some overlap in discussing certain liturgical things, when Easter is for most, a few of the saints, sacraments... so there will be overlap on some of the sections. If a thread is on something that differentiates OO from EO or is specifically about OO, then it goes here. Looking at the faith/jurisdiction of the posters on threads might be helpful.
I see the same spectrum among the OO on this issue as among the EO. 
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A hasty quarrel kindles fire,
and urgent strife sheds blood.
If you blow on a spark, it will glow;
if you spit on it, it will be put out;
                           and both come out of your mouth

Offline Stavro

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Re: Birth control-church stances?
« Reply #15 on: May 07, 2015, 11:51:16 PM »
The Coptic Church allows Birth Control in principle, as long as it does not incorporate abortion.   
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