OrthodoxChristianity.net
August 22, 2014, 10:06:28 PM *
Welcome, Guest. Please login or register.

Login with username, password and session length
News: Reminder: No political discussions in the public fora.  If you do not have access to the private Politics Forum, please send a PM to Fr. George.
 
   Home   Help Calendar Contact Treasury Tags Login Register  
Pages: 1   Go Down
  Print  
Author Topic: English in Europe  (Read 6175 times) Average Rating: 0
0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.
Νεκτάριος
Protokentarchos
*********
Offline Offline

Posts: 5,437



« on: March 05, 2009, 04:38:21 PM »

This article caught my attention:
http://www.economist.com/opinion/displaystory.cfm?story_id=13103967

Quote
The evidence points to the imminent collapse of the European Union’s official language policy, known as “mother tongue plus two”, in which citizens are encouraged to learn two foreign languages as well as their own (ie, please learn something besides English). Among Europeans born before the second world war, English, French and German are almost equally common. But according to a Eurobarometer survey, 15-to-24-year-olds are five times more likely to speak English as a foreign language than either German or French. Add native speakers to those who have learnt it, and some 60% of young Europeans speak English “well or very well”.

This is a clear win for English. But paradoxically, it does not amount to a win for Europe’s native English-speakers. There are several reasons for this. Start with a political one. European politicians long feared that the use of English in the EU would lead to the dominance of Anglo-Saxon thinking. They were wrong. The example of newspapers is instructive: thanks to English (and the internet), a genuinely pan-European space for political debate is being created. It has never been easier for other Europeans to know what Poles think about the credit crunch, Germans about the Middle East or Danes about nuclear power. English is merely “an instrument”, says Mr Versteegh of NRC Handelsblad, not “a surrender to a dominant culture.”
Logged
Ebor
Vanyar
Taxiarches
**********
Online Online

Posts: 6,380



« Reply #1 on: March 05, 2009, 07:28:45 PM »

That's interesting, indeed.  Thanks for posting the link. 

Re having other languages: I recently found out that my father had been stationed in Berlin for about a year and a half starting in July 1945. He told me a Russian officer that he would meet and talk to about different things including hobbies.  I asked how they did that and it was by both of them speaking French part of the time.  He also said that a Russian told him once that the best and most helpful thing the US ever sent to Russia was... Spam.  The small fighter planes were very good, too, but Spam was #1.
 Wink

Logged

"I wish they would remember that the charge to Peter was "Feed my sheep", not "Try experiments on my rats", or even "Teach my performing dogs new tricks". - C. S. Lewis

The Katana of Reasoned Discussion

For some a world view is more like a neighborhood watch.
Νεκτάριος
Protokentarchos
*********
Offline Offline

Posts: 5,437



« Reply #2 on: March 06, 2009, 12:56:35 AM »

That's a neat story.  Although it took me a minute to figure out what on earth spam (as in junk email) had to do with the story.  For those not familiar with this American cultural icon:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Spam_(food)

I'm quite glad to see that people are using English simply as means to communicate and that it isn't forcing Anglophone culture on those learning the language.  God willing, I'll be teaching English as a foreign language by this time next year, so this will be a useful reference to keep.
Logged
Entscheidungsproblem
Formerly Friul & Nebelpfade
Protokentarchos
*********
Offline Offline

Faith: Machine God
Posts: 4,495



WWW
« Reply #3 on: March 06, 2009, 12:58:20 AM »

I just cannot believe how well Europeans speak English.  They put us North American folk to shame at times.   laugh
Logged

As a result of a thousand million years of evolution, the universe is becoming conscious of itself, able to understand something of its past history and its possible future.
-- Sir Julian Sorell Huxley FRS
Νεκτάριος
Protokentarchos
*********
Offline Offline

Posts: 5,437



« Reply #4 on: March 06, 2009, 01:05:16 AM »

It's to the point that that is why it is so difficult for a native English speaker to learn another European language.  Chances are that wherever you end up, the locals will likely already speak decent enough English.   
Logged
Ebor
Vanyar
Taxiarches
**********
Online Online

Posts: 6,380



« Reply #5 on: March 06, 2009, 08:55:26 AM »

That's a neat story.  Although it took me a minute to figure out what on earth spam (as in junk email) had to do with the story.  For those not familiar with this American cultural icon:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Spam_(food)

lol!! Cheesy  You gave me a good chuckle with that. We still sometimes have Spam in the house as it can be a quick source of protein.  There are also places where is it a standard food to this day such as Hawaii (the Spam Musubi which is rather tasty) and Korea the last I read.  http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Spam_musubi

As you saw in the link, the junk email got it's name from the Monty Python "Spam" sketch with the chorus of vikings.  Grin

Quote
I'm quite glad to see that people are using English simply as means to communicate and that it isn't forcing Anglophone culture on those learning the language.  God willing, I'll be teaching English as a foreign language by this time next year, so this will be a useful reference to keep.

It would be interesting to compare the teaching of English and growth of its use in Europe with the situation in Japan.  There are several books I know of people from the US, Canada or Great Britain who go to Japan and teach English.  While there is a rise in the use of English words on tee shirts, in ads and other places, the students, at least in the high school levels, weren't always becoming proficient.  It was more to pass a required test.  One book that leaps to mind is Learning to Bow by Bruce Feiler
http://www.bookmice.net/darkchilde/japan/bow.html (beware of music track on this review, but it can be turned off)

Ebor
Logged

"I wish they would remember that the charge to Peter was "Feed my sheep", not "Try experiments on my rats", or even "Teach my performing dogs new tricks". - C. S. Lewis

The Katana of Reasoned Discussion

For some a world view is more like a neighborhood watch.
Heorhij
Merarches
***********
Offline Offline

Faith: Orthodox
Jurisdiction: GOA, for now, but my heart belongs to the Ukrainian Orthodox Church
Posts: 8,576



WWW
« Reply #6 on: March 06, 2009, 10:55:51 AM »

I just cannot believe how well Europeans speak English.  They put us North American folk to shame at times.   laugh

That reminds me of an old joke that a US citizen returned from Canada and said, "over there, they teach English so well in their schools - look, their people speak English almost without an accent..."  Grin
Logged

Love never fails.
Entscheidungsproblem
Formerly Friul & Nebelpfade
Protokentarchos
*********
Offline Offline

Faith: Machine God
Posts: 4,495



WWW
« Reply #7 on: March 06, 2009, 12:33:33 PM »

I just cannot believe how well Europeans speak English.  They put us North American folk to shame at times.   laugh

That reminds me of an old joke that a US citizen returned from Canada and said, "over there, they teach English so well in their schools - look, their people speak English almost without an accent..."  Grin

LOL!   laugh
Logged

As a result of a thousand million years of evolution, the universe is becoming conscious of itself, able to understand something of its past history and its possible future.
-- Sir Julian Sorell Huxley FRS
Orthodox11
Archon
********
Offline Offline

Posts: 2,999


« Reply #8 on: March 06, 2009, 02:43:58 PM »

I was reading one of those free London papers they always hand out on the Tube (Subway) here the other day. There's a section where people write in with random comments, suggestions, etc. One comment was from an Englishman on holiday in the south of France, complaining about how "rude and lazy" the French were since hardly any of them could speak any English.  Roll Eyes
Logged
ialmisry
There's nothing John of Damascus can't answer
Hypatos
*****************
Online Online

Faith: جامعي Arab confesssing the Orthodox Faith of the One, Holy, Catholic and Apostolic Church
Jurisdiction: Antioch (for now), but my heart belongs to Alexandria
Posts: 37,372



« Reply #9 on: March 06, 2009, 03:02:34 PM »

That's a neat story.  Although it took me a minute to figure out what on earth spam (as in junk email) had to do with the story.  For those not familiar with this American cultural icon:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Spam_(food)

I'll just add, what's in it:
Quote
In the interest of thoroughness I thought that somebody here at Dopecorp should actually eat some Spam before we wrote about it. You'd think I was asking these guys to throw themselves on a grenade. "Cecil, I ate a damn Circus Peanut," wailed my assistant Jane. "I did laundry. Hell, I even sniffed out sperm trees. This is where I draw the line." Little Ed was likewise unwilling, the pup. So it was up to me.

I bought a tin and popped it open, fully expecting to be bowled over by who knows what awful aroma. Didn't happen. The smell was … surprisingly mild. Moreover, the stuff was edible, if salty. Granted, I ate Circus Peanuts without ill effects, and I've had a couple of airline meals that I considered tasty, so maybe I just have a high threshold of disgust. Still, when I see the reaction some people have to this stuff — come on, folks, get a grip. Our ancestors ate meat they'd just killed with a rock. What's so bad about Spam?

What does make you a bit queasy is the nutritional labeling on the side of the can. A single serving — two thin slices — contains 30 percent of your daily saturated-fat quota, 31 percent of your sodium, and 13 percent of your cholesterol. If people ate Spam exclusively we'd solve the Social Security crisis in a generation. Nobody would live long enough to collect.

On to your questions. The common assumption is that Spam is made of stuff even pigs don't like to admit they've got. Not so, says a spokeswoman for Hormel Foods, which manufactures Spam. It contains a mixture of ham and chopped pork shoulder. (Ham is the pig's thigh; pork is everything else.) Ham is Hormel's top-of-the-line product, and Spam was created in 1937 partly to use up what was left of the pig after the ham had been removed. But only the wholesome parts.

The name Spam, dreamed up by the actor brother of a Hormel vice president, is short for "spiced ham." (Cute story: Said brother supposedly had this brainstorm at a name-the-product party, in which you had to contribute a possible name in order to get a drink. It took a few rounds, so nobody is sure whether the guy was inspired or just drunk.) Since Hormel is in Austin, Minnesota, these are Minnesota spices: sugar and salt.


http://www.straightdope.com/columns/read/1161/whats-really-in-spam

It goes on to the question "Do Polynesians eat Spam because it tastes like humand flesh?"

Quote
Marketing Spam must present some unique challenges. Imagine the conversation in the boardroom:

Spam product manager #1: I've got some good news and some bad news. The good news is that Spam is hugely popular among the people of the South Pacific. The bad news is that, according to the famous travel writer Paul Theroux, the islanders dig it because they're ex-cannibals and they think Spam tastes like human flesh.

Spam product manager #2: Hmm. Is this a problem … or an opportunity?

Still, let's concede one point to Theroux. Does Spam taste corpsy? Of course it tastes corpsy — it's meat. We're just arguing about the identity of the deceased.



« Last Edit: March 06, 2009, 03:04:53 PM by ialmisry » Logged

Question a friend, perhaps he did not do it; but if he did anything so that he may do it no more.
A hasty quarrel kindles fire,
and urgent strife sheds blood.
If you blow on a spark, it will glow;
if you spit on it, it will be put out;
                           and both come out of your mouth
ialmisry
There's nothing John of Damascus can't answer
Hypatos
*****************
Online Online

Faith: جامعي Arab confesssing the Orthodox Faith of the One, Holy, Catholic and Apostolic Church
Jurisdiction: Antioch (for now), but my heart belongs to Alexandria
Posts: 37,372



« Reply #10 on: March 06, 2009, 03:09:00 PM »

I just cannot believe how well Europeans speak English.  They put us North American folk to shame at times.   laugh

That reminds me of an old joke that a US citizen returned from Canada and said, "over there, they teach English so well in their schools - look, their people speak English almost without an accent..."  Grin

I always said I had no interest in going to Canada except Quebec, because if I was going to a foreign country, I was going to a foreign country.  Loved Quebec last June, but did go through Ontario, and I have to say not exactly the same (the monuments to the American Loyalists and Benedict Arnold were a tip off).
Logged

Question a friend, perhaps he did not do it; but if he did anything so that he may do it no more.
A hasty quarrel kindles fire,
and urgent strife sheds blood.
If you blow on a spark, it will glow;
if you spit on it, it will be put out;
                           and both come out of your mouth
Νεκτάριος
Protokentarchos
*********
Offline Offline

Posts: 5,437



« Reply #11 on: March 07, 2009, 04:09:23 PM »

It would be interesting to compare the teaching of English and growth of its use in Europe with the situation in Japan.  There are several books I know of people from the US, Canada or Great Britain who go to Japan and teach English.  While there is a rise in the use of English words on tee shirts, in ads and other places, the students, at least in the high school levels, weren't always becoming proficient.  It was more to pass a required test.  One book that leaps to mind is Learning to Bow by Bruce Feiler
http://www.bookmice.net/darkchilde/japan/bow.html (beware of music track on this review, but it can be turned off)

I did a lot of work on the side interpreting and translating when I was in Central Asia, and it was always an uphill battle to work with Japanese tourists because their English was very often quite poor.  The French were about 50/50 but usually had at least one person in each group that spoke quite well.  Of the Germans nearly 100% had passable English.  Nobody beats the Dutch - not only did all of them have absolutely perfect English, they even spoke with American accents  Grin

I'd always ask people about their English language courses and found that only the Germans and Dutch focused on communication and conversational English, and it showed.  While many French would have no difficulty reading a very advanced text of English literature, a basic conversation was not easy.  French people would tell me that even advanced English courses still used French as the medium of instruction. 

It frustrates me that such a poor methodology tends to be typical in the US as well.  Despite most kids taking a few years of Spanish in the States, hardly any real Spanish speakers are produced.  I've taken upper division courses in both German and Russian here in the US, and it is appalling how much English is still used in the classroom.       
Logged
Elisha
Protokentarchos
*********
Offline Offline

Faith: Orthodox
Jurisdiction: OCA
Posts: 4,411


« Reply #12 on: March 07, 2009, 04:28:42 PM »

I did a lot of work on the side interpreting and translating when I was in Central Asia, and it was always an uphill battle to work with Japanese tourists because their English was very often quite poor.  The French were about 50/50 but usually had at least one person in each group that spoke quite well.  Of the Germans nearly 100% had passable English.  Nobody beats the Dutch - not only did all of them have absolutely perfect English, they even spoke with American accents  Grin
Don't know about that....the Norgies and Swede's (heck - all Scandinavians) are damn good too.

I'd always ask people about their English language courses and found that only the Germans and Dutch focused on communication and conversational English, and it showed.  While many French would have no difficulty reading a very advanced text of English literature, a basic conversation was not easy.  French people would tell me that even advanced English courses still used French as the medium of instruction. 
Interesting....while I remember communication/conversation being taught/practiced in school (both high school and college), it certainly wasn't "emphasized" - more of an occasional thing.  I do find this interesting though, because you have things from both ends.
1) It is much easier to understand foreign languages while learning (hearing and reading) than it is too speak and write.  Speaking and writing involve a more active translating and formulation of thought - much more challenging.  This is where immersion is just vital.  When I came back from my summer internship in Switzerland, one of my classmates was like, "Damn, you can speak well now!" and I thought, "What!  I don't think I speak much better."  but my "host parents" and coworkers spoke mostly in German to me (and as a side note, were good about speaking a "higher" German with me as opposed to with each other).
2) You then have the case though of, for example, our Eritrean kids in the churches or even some Mex-Americans who can speak the language, but have never been taught how to read/write.  The OCA parish in Las Vegas has a sizeable Eritrean community and holds Tigrini classes on Saturdays to teach the language to the kids (read/write).

It frustrates me that such a poor methodology tends to be typical in the US as well.  Despite most kids taking a few years of Spanish in the States, hardly any real Spanish speakers are produced.  I've taken upper division courses in both German and Russian here in the US, and it is appalling how much English is still used in the classroom.       
Yup - sure noticed this too.  While I was taking my German classes purely as electives, I did take a couple of Upper Division classes and several of the students still didn't speak that well.  Too much English used.  It's like a banging the head against the well method - you just need to tough it out and take the pain in your head for a little while. 
Logged
Heorhij
Merarches
***********
Offline Offline

Faith: Orthodox
Jurisdiction: GOA, for now, but my heart belongs to the Ukrainian Orthodox Church
Posts: 8,576



WWW
« Reply #13 on: March 07, 2009, 04:37:30 PM »

I always said I had no interest in going to Canada except Quebec, because if I was going to a foreign country, I was going to a foreign country.  Loved Quebec last June, but did go through Ontario, and I have to say not exactly the same (the monuments to the American Loyalists and Benedict Arnold were a tip off).

I have been to Montreal once, in 1994, as a young postdoc (it was my first serious scientific presentation at a meeting where some pretty big stars were present; I had 5 minutes at a "minisymposium" and thought I'd die of anxiety). What a lovely city... My then-boss, a very American guy from Montana, said afterwards, "well... I used to think, Canada, so, big deal... money is funny, but otherwise - it's just like here... but Quebec, guys, that's different, I tell you - it IS a foreign country!!!"  Grin
Logged

Love never fails.
Νεκτάριος
Protokentarchos
*********
Offline Offline

Posts: 5,437



« Reply #14 on: March 07, 2009, 05:42:37 PM »

Nobody beats the Dutch - not only did all of them have absolutely perfect English, they even spoke with American accents  Grin
Don't know about that....the Norgies and Swede's (heck - all Scandinavians) are damn good too.

That's true.  They also have an interesting mix of speaking with entirely American pronunciation but with British vocabulary and grammar. 

I forgot to mention what is perhaps the single most important thing in all of this: whether a country tends to dub or subtitle American movies and TV shows. 

Interesting....while I remember communication/conversation being taught/practiced in school (both high school and college), it certainly wasn't "emphasized" - more of an occasional thing.  I do find this interesting though, because you have things from both ends.

Of course both are important if one wishes to be truly proficient in another language.  On the other hand, unless one has a specific job that requires obtaining higher level information in another language, basic conversational proficiency is much more likely to be useful.  The problem I ran into a lot is this is the exact opposite of conventional wisdom about teaching in the former USSR.  When I'd tutor people I'd usually start out with going through their regular homework with them.  Very often it would consists of pages of exercises over obscure and advanced grammatical concepts (seldom used tenses, complex conditional sentences, etc.).  After working through that, I'd try to just chat for a few minutes and not get anywhere.  A simple "Tell me what you did last weekend" was impossible.  I'd then repeat the question in Russian, and then they could answer with a few memorized phrases.   

With American learners of Spanish, one is FAR more likely to use Spanish in basic communication with an Hispanic who speaks no or limited English.  I use it every time that I go grocery shopping since the Mexican Market is almost have the price of the regular grocery store  Smiley  So to not teach a communicative approach seems crazy to me.  Even with German or French it is the same thing; most internationally oriented companies use English as their operating language anyway so using either will likely be in an informal conversation setting. 

Yup - sure noticed this too.  While I was taking my German classes purely as electives, I did take a couple of Upper Division classes and several of the students still didn't speak that well.  Too much English used.  It's like a banging the head against the well method - you just need to tough it out and take the pain in your head for a little while. 

It really is embarrassing when you think about it - many universities in Germany, the Netherlands and Scandinavia offer regular courses in English (many entire majors are English only even), and we can't even offer an upper division German course entirely in German here. 
Logged
Elisha
Protokentarchos
*********
Offline Offline

Faith: Orthodox
Jurisdiction: OCA
Posts: 4,411


« Reply #15 on: March 07, 2009, 06:02:05 PM »

Can't say I disagree to anything here - just a couple of more comments.

That's true.  They also have an interesting mix of speaking with entirely American pronunciation but with British vocabulary and grammar. 
When I had another internship summer of 99 in Frankfurt for Siemens, I was (somewhat disappointingly) working for an English teaching department and typing of hard copy manuals into word.  I would "correct" some of the British English to American.   Grin


Of course both are important if one wishes to be truly proficient in another language.  On the other hand, unless one has a specific job that requires obtaining higher level information in another language, basic conversational proficiency is much more likely to be useful.  The problem I ran into a lot is this is the exact opposite of conventional wisdom about teaching in the former USSR.  When I'd tutor people I'd usually start out with going through their regular homework with them.  Very often it would consists of pages of exercises over obscure and advanced grammatical concepts (seldom used tenses, complex conditional sentences, etc.).  After working through that, I'd try to just chat for a few minutes and not get anywhere.  A simple "Tell me what you did last weekend" was impossible.  I'd then repeat the question in Russian, and then they could answer with a few memorized phrases.   
My experience exactly - to much just stock phrases w/o much opportunity to really think and develop responses.
Logged
Starlight
Site Supporter
OC.net guru
*****
Offline Offline

Faith: Eastern Orthodox Christianity
Jurisdiction: Ukrainian Orthodox Church of USA (Ecumenical Patriarchate)
Posts: 1,537


« Reply #16 on: March 09, 2009, 09:54:02 PM »

It really is embarrassing when you think about it - many universities in Germany, the Netherlands and Scandinavia offer regular courses in English (many entire majors are English only even),

Yes, but very often there the student body comes from all over the world.

As for German, I did start to study it in the past. What a great language. Honestly, I am really ashamed that I did not continue.
Logged
Ebor
Vanyar
Taxiarches
**********
Online Online

Posts: 6,380



« Reply #17 on: March 10, 2009, 09:03:40 PM »

It would be interesting to compare the teaching of English and growth of its use in Europe with the situation in Japan.  There are several books I know of people from the US, Canada or Great Britain who go to Japan and teach English.  While there is a rise in the use of English words on tee shirts, in ads and other places, the students, at least in the high school levels, weren't always becoming proficient.  It was more to pass a required test.  One book that leaps to mind is Learning to Bow by Bruce Feiler
http://www.bookmice.net/darkchilde/japan/bow.html (beware of music track on this review, but it can be turned off)

I did a lot of work on the side interpreting and translating when I was in Central Asia, and it was always an uphill battle to work with Japanese tourists because their English was very often quite poor.   

That does not surprise me from reading the accounts of people who have worked at teaching English in Japan.  There are accounts in some of the memoirs of the writer while in Japan meeting people who have a hard time believing that a non-Japanese person can even speak Japanese.  The Roads To Sata by the late Alan Booth has some very entertaining incidents in that regard.

Ebor
Logged

"I wish they would remember that the charge to Peter was "Feed my sheep", not "Try experiments on my rats", or even "Teach my performing dogs new tricks". - C. S. Lewis

The Katana of Reasoned Discussion

For some a world view is more like a neighborhood watch.
Ebor
Vanyar
Taxiarches
**********
Online Online

Posts: 6,380



« Reply #18 on: March 10, 2009, 09:11:58 PM »

I have been to Montreal once, in 1994, as a young postdoc (it was my first serious scientific presentation at a meeting where some pretty big stars were present; I had 5 minutes at a "minisymposium" and thought I'd die of anxiety). What a lovely city... My then-boss, a very American guy from Montana, said afterwards, "well... I used to think, Canada, so, big deal... money is funny, but otherwise - it's just like here... but Quebec, guys, that's different, I tell you - it IS a foreign country!!!"  Grin

 Cheesy  I can understand that quite well, Heorhij.  Montana has a very long border with Canada (British Columbia, Alberta, and Saskatchewan) and it's always been common for people to cross the border with out much thought. In some places the "border" is basically a clear patch between wheat fields or identical kinds of forest.  So it was/is just like Montana.  When I was a kid we'd get Canadian coins in change sometimes and they were treated like any other money.  My father would go to bridge tournaments in Canada all the time and in two days some Canadian bridge-players are staying with him and my mother for a tournament in Great Falls.  But back east in Quebec is different and they *do* speak a different language there.  Wink

Ebor
Logged

"I wish they would remember that the charge to Peter was "Feed my sheep", not "Try experiments on my rats", or even "Teach my performing dogs new tricks". - C. S. Lewis

The Katana of Reasoned Discussion

For some a world view is more like a neighborhood watch.
LakaYaRabb
Sr. Member
****
Offline Offline

Faith: Orthodox Christian
Jurisdiction: Orthodox Church in America
Posts: 209



WWW
« Reply #19 on: March 10, 2009, 11:59:51 PM »

::::
« Last Edit: March 11, 2009, 12:06:42 AM by LakaYaRabb » Logged
ialmisry
There's nothing John of Damascus can't answer
Hypatos
*****************
Online Online

Faith: جامعي Arab confesssing the Orthodox Faith of the One, Holy, Catholic and Apostolic Church
Jurisdiction: Antioch (for now), but my heart belongs to Alexandria
Posts: 37,372



« Reply #20 on: March 11, 2009, 12:17:39 AM »

I have been to Montreal once, in 1994, as a young postdoc (it was my first serious scientific presentation at a meeting where some pretty big stars were present; I had 5 minutes at a "minisymposium" and thought I'd die of anxiety). What a lovely city... My then-boss, a very American guy from Montana, said afterwards, "well... I used to think, Canada, so, big deal... money is funny, but otherwise - it's just like here... but Quebec, guys, that's different, I tell you - it IS a foreign country!!!"  Grin

 Cheesy  I can understand that quite well, Heorhij.  Montana has a very long border with Canada (British Columbia, Alberta, and Saskatchewan) and it's always been common for people to cross the border with out much thought. In some places the "border" is basically a clear patch between wheat fields or identical kinds of forest.  So it was/is just like Montana.  When I was a kid we'd get Canadian coins in change sometimes and they were treated like any other money.  My father would go to bridge tournaments in Canada all the time and in two days some Canadian bridge-players are staying with him and my mother for a tournament in Great Falls.  But back east in Quebec is different and they *do* speak a different language there.  Wink

Ebor

Here in Chicago, at least when I was a kid, people would take Canadian coins (not paper money though, too funny looking and the Canadian dollar was 11 cents less).
Logged

Question a friend, perhaps he did not do it; but if he did anything so that he may do it no more.
A hasty quarrel kindles fire,
and urgent strife sheds blood.
If you blow on a spark, it will glow;
if you spit on it, it will be put out;
                           and both come out of your mouth
GabrieltheCelt
Hillbilly Extraordinaire
Taxiarches
**********
Offline Offline

Faith: Eastern Orthodox Christian
Jurisdiction: OCA
Posts: 6,987


Chasin' down a Hoodoo...


« Reply #21 on: March 11, 2009, 02:54:36 AM »

One book that leaps to mind is Learning to Bow by Bruce Feiler
http://www.bookmice.net/darkchilde/japan/bow.html (beware of music track on this review, but it can be turned off)

The part of the review I particularly enjoyed was the raison d'être for the Japanese educational system vs. the American system.  Personally, I think our educational system could take a cue from them.  But then again, it might not work for pluralistic, heterogeneous America.
« Last Edit: March 11, 2009, 02:55:05 AM by GabrieltheCelt » Logged

"The Scots-Irish; Brewed in Scotland, bottled in Ireland, uncorked in America."  ~Scots-Irish saying
Orthodox11
Archon
********
Offline Offline

Posts: 2,999


« Reply #22 on: March 11, 2009, 05:37:37 AM »

I forgot to mention what is perhaps the single most important thing in all of this: whether a country tends to dub or subtitle American movies and TV shows. 

This is true. When I was a kid, we'd probably learn 80% of our conversational English from subtitled movies and TV programs (the amount of English/American/Australian TV you get in Norway and Sweden is absolutely ridiculous).
Logged
rakovsky
Warned
Protokentarchos
*********
Offline Offline

Faith: Orthodox
Jurisdiction: Orthodox Church in America
Posts: 4,206



WWW
« Reply #23 on: July 13, 2010, 09:48:35 PM »

That's interesting, indeed.  Thanks for posting the link. 

Re having other languages: I recently found out that my father had been stationed in Berlin for about a year and a half starting in July 1945. He told me a Russian officer that he would meet and talk to about different things including hobbies.  I asked how they did that and it was by both of them speaking French part of the time.  He also said that a Russian told him once that the best and most helpful thing the US ever sent to Russia was... Spam.  The small fighter planes were very good, too, but Spam was #1.
 Wink

It's true. Nikita Sergeevich talks about this in memoirs and says spam was very tasty. I feel like eating some now.
Logged
fanlynne
Newbie
*
Offline Offline

Faith: Christianity
Jurisdiction: USA
Posts: 9


WWW
« Reply #24 on: January 27, 2011, 05:05:16 AM »

Hello everyone,glad to meet you here,hope to know more about you...........
Logged

Tags:
Pages: 1   Go Up
  Print  
 
Jump to:  

Powered by MySQL Powered by PHP Powered by SMF 1.1.18 | SMF © 2013, Simple Machines Valid XHTML 1.0! Valid CSS!
Page created in 0.108 seconds with 53 queries.