Author Topic: What happened at the cross?  (Read 964 times)

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Offline eddybear

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Re: What happened at the cross?
« Reply #45 on: October 06, 2014, 05:11:28 PM »
This is a great thread for me, from several angles.

First, as an ex-Calvinist, I'd like to offer the encouragement that change is possible, and I'm now a lot closer to the historic Church. It's been a long, slow journey, but not one I regret in the slightest. An author who did help me was CSLewis, and one thing that helped overcome my anti-Catholic prejudices (back then I didn't know about Orthodoxy) was meeting Catholics who were (a) nice and friendly, and (b) had a living faith. Examples can be much more powerful than arguments.

Secondly, the "penal substitution" theory of atonement has been so deeply ingrained into me that I find it hard to understand the cross any other way - so I'm very interested in the Orthodox views on this thread.

And finally, if I do get to the point where I feel the need to formally convert to Orthodoxy, then reading others' experience of family matters will be helpful for me. And may the Lord bless those of you who are facing those difficult decisions.

Offline Shlomlokh

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Re: What happened at the cross?
« Reply #46 on: October 06, 2014, 07:47:42 PM »
I would personally have a problem with a Christian who would find the sign of the cross offensive.
Are they really Christian then?
"I will pour out my prayer unto the Lord, and to Him will I proclaim my grief; for with evils my soul is filled, and my life unto hades hath drawn nigh, and like Jonah I will pray: From corruption raise me up, O God." -Ode VI, Irmos of the Supplicatory Canon to the Theotokos

Offline biro

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Re: What happened at the cross?
« Reply #47 on: October 06, 2014, 09:08:02 PM »
I would personally have a problem with a Christian who would find the sign of the cross offensive.
Are they really Christian then?

Alfred Persson said once here that if he saw a cross in a church, he would like to take it down.
He will come again with glory to judge the living and the dead. His kingdom will have no end.

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And if I seem a little strange, well, that's because I am

Offline Shlomlokh

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Re: What happened at the cross?
« Reply #48 on: October 06, 2014, 09:25:37 PM »
I would personally have a problem with a Christian who would find the sign of the cross offensive.
Are they really Christian then?

Alfred Persson said once here that if he saw a cross in a church, he would like to take it down.
Ah, how I yearn for the good ol days of Alfredo. If he tried that at my church, he'd have to pry the cross from my cold dead hands. :D
« Last Edit: October 06, 2014, 09:26:56 PM by Shlomlokh »
"I will pour out my prayer unto the Lord, and to Him will I proclaim my grief; for with evils my soul is filled, and my life unto hades hath drawn nigh, and like Jonah I will pray: From corruption raise me up, O God." -Ode VI, Irmos of the Supplicatory Canon to the Theotokos

Offline NanaDeborah

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Re: What happened at the cross?
« Reply #49 on: October 06, 2014, 09:46:07 PM »
Welcome eddybear!  You also might find it interesting to watch the video of the recent "Monster God" debate where the resident theologian of Mike Bickle's IHOP squares off against Brian Zahnd on the subject of PSA.

http://www.ihopkc.org/resources/asset/2014_09_13_1400_EVENT_FCF/auto/true/
Thy Bridal Chamber, I see adorned, O my Savior, and have no wedding garment that I may enter.  Enlighten the vesture of my soul, O Giver of Light, and save me.

Offline Gamliel

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Re: What happened at the cross?
« Reply #50 on: April 19, 2015, 02:08:10 PM »
I have been wondering myself what happened at the cross.  I know that the Eastern Church is less legalistic than the Catholics and Protestants.  The Catholics and Protestants give a legalistic interpretation that the LORD paid a legal debt.  It seems that the Eastern Church somehow interprets it more along the lines of Jesus combining the human and God nature.  Currently I am reading The Experience of God: Orthodox Dogmatic Theology, vol. 3, The Person of Jesus Christ as God and Savior / Dumitru Staniloae, but he is going over my head, especially his chapter pertaining to Jesus as high priest.  Somehow Jesus is sacrificing toward God and sacrificing toward humanity, but I am having trouble understanding it.  Does anyone have any recommendations for a book that explains it in simpler terms?