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Author Topic: Kids in Ministry...  (Read 933 times) Average Rating: 0
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ironsiderodger
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« on: January 15, 2009, 10:03:33 AM »

Any one heard of this? It seems like a very cultish charismatic group that whips kids into guilt ridden frenzies that they need to repent, repent, and repent some more; then they need to take on the full mission of being a Christian (including of course the hap-hazard use of tongues, healing, etc). Here's a statement from their "mission" (and when I went there I was hoping they'd be arians or modelists- so much easier to nail them down on where exactly they went wrong, but in that regard they seemed to say the right things).

"We believe we have a mandate from heaven to teach children the word of God (John 21:15/Deuteronomy 6:1-9 and 20:21.) We believe that children are a part of God's end time army and that the Great Commission of preaching the gospel to all nations, laying hands on the sick, raising the dead, speaking in tongues (Matthew 28:19-20/Mark 16:15-16/Acts 2:16-17) fully applies to born again children as well as adults."

-Kids in Ministry


Not that I want to bring in you as Orthodox into protestant in-fighting, but it seems like when it comes to dealing with dilemma's like this Holy Orthodoxy has, shall we say, quite a bit more history and resource (such as the Church Fathers) than protestantism.
« Last Edit: January 15, 2009, 10:03:51 AM by ironsiderodger » Logged
ialmisry
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« Reply #1 on: January 15, 2009, 01:22:51 PM »

Any one heard of this? It seems like a very cultish charismatic group that whips kids into guilt ridden frenzies that they need to repent, repent, and repent some more; then they need to take on the full mission of being a Christian (including of course the hap-hazard use of tongues, healing, etc). Here's a statement from their "mission" (and when I went there I was hoping they'd be arians or modelists- so much easier to nail them down on where exactly they went wrong, but in that regard they seemed to say the right things).

"We believe we have a mandate from heaven to teach children the word of God (John 21:15/Deuteronomy 6:1-9 and 20:21.) We believe that children are a part of God's end time army and that the Great Commission of preaching the gospel to all nations, laying hands on the sick, raising the dead, speaking in tongues (Matthew 28:19-20/Mark 16:15-16/Acts 2:16-17) fully applies to born again children as well as adults."

-Kids in Ministry


Not that I want to bring in you as Orthodox into protestant in-fighting, but it seems like when it comes to dealing with dilemma's like this Holy Orthodoxy has, shall we say, quite a bit more history and resource (such as the Church Fathers) than protestantism.

Are baptized infants "born again children?"

The reason why I ask, besides the obvious, is this repent, repent, repent self flagelation I think come in part from trying to work out this salvation that supposedly you can't earn: one of the ironies of Calvinist theolgoy and the Protestant ethic.
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ironsiderodger
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« Reply #2 on: January 15, 2009, 01:56:27 PM »


Are baptized infants "born again children?"

The reason why I ask, besides the obvious, is this repent, repent, repent self flagelation I think come in part from trying to work out this salvation that supposedly you can't earn: one of the ironies of Calvinist theolgoy and the Protestant ethic.

Ah one of my conundrums, because before I would have railed tooth and nail against infant baptism- the problem is that Peter didn't seem to have a problem when baptized Cornelius' household, which from what I can tell in my feeble-ish attempts- means adults through babies and was a very specific word used in that verse- which is funny because supposedly many of those in my ilk are very concerned with original languages and such. But I'm appearing to dodge the issue, forgive me.

By my protestant experience an infants baptism would be meaningless because the infant hadn't made the "choice" which is also hard for me to reconcile with my former Calvanistic approach to salvation- because if that view was correct they didn't have a "choice" anyway, so would it matter? This whole area has moved from a rigid limited understanding to me to more of a "?".

Your point is well made, there is that wierd tension between works and faith- and these people seem especially confused; but there's the other problem, their salvation is defined almost singularly by the letter as "getting to heaven"- fire insurance. Thus, if there are works involved it means you must think the "works" are brownie points; the thought that works aid in a larger view of salvation- restoring the Image of God within us, a marvelous synergy if you will- this doesn't seem to properly cross their minds (or my own at times). Why are they carrying out these acts; to grow? I think not. It looks like they're trying to do something to assuage God's wrath. And that is irony, because that's what they would accuse Orthodox and Catholics of doing.
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