PeterTheAleut
The Right Blowhard Peter the Furtive of Yetts O'Muckhart
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« on: December 28, 2008, 01:00:41 AM » |
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I ask this question on behalf of a housemate who asked me.
I am aware that the Divine Liturgy can be celebrated only once on an altar between midnight and midnight of one day, and that a priest can (con)celebrate the Liturgy only once in the same span of time. But can a layperson RECEIVE Holy Communion twice in one day (again defined as midnight to midnight)? Citation of canons or rules from the Typikon are highly recommended to back up your assertions.
Personally, I don't think so, since the Divine Liturgy is the work of the entire assembly--bishop/priest and faithful--and not just the work of the clergy. Thus, even the laity can and should in this sense be considered concelebrants and not just receivers of the Holy Mysteries. But I don't know for certain how the canons/Typikon understand this, and I don't want to push forward my reasoning as authoritative.
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Tallitot
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« Reply #1 on: December 28, 2008, 01:15:13 AM » |
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No because by virtue of receiving the first time you haven't fasted.
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If people cry at weddings...why don't they laugh at funerals?
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ialmisry
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« Reply #2 on: December 28, 2008, 01:40:04 AM » |
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I ask this question on behalf of a housemate who asked me.
I am aware that the Divine Liturgy can be celebrated only once on an altar between midnight and midnight of one day, and that a priest can (con)celebrate the Liturgy only once in the same span of time. But can a layperson RECEIVE Holy Communion twice in one day (again defined as midnight to midnight)? Citation of canons or rules from the Typikon are highly recommended to back up your assertions.
Personally, I don't think so, since the Divine Liturgy is the work of the entire assembly--bishop/priest and faithful--and not just the work of the clergy. Thus, even the laity can and should in this sense be considered concelebrants and not just receivers of the Holy Mysteries. But I don't know for certain how the canons/Typikon understand this, and I don't want to push forward my reasoning as authoritative.
I have a better question: why would you commune twice in a day?  |
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Question a friend, perhaps he did not do it; but if he did anything so that he may do it no more.
A hasty quarrel kindles fire,
and urgent strife sheds blood.
If you blow on a spark, it will glow;
if you spit on it, it will be put out;
and both come out of your mouth
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PeterTheAleut
The Right Blowhard Peter the Furtive of Yetts O'Muckhart
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« Reply #3 on: December 28, 2008, 01:49:40 AM » |
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I ask this question on behalf of a housemate who asked me.
I am aware that the Divine Liturgy can be celebrated only once on an altar between midnight and midnight of one day, and that a priest can (con)celebrate the Liturgy only once in the same span of time. But can a layperson RECEIVE Holy Communion twice in one day (again defined as midnight to midnight)? Citation of canons or rules from the Typikon are highly recommended to back up your assertions.
Personally, I don't think so, since the Divine Liturgy is the work of the entire assembly--bishop/priest and faithful--and not just the work of the clergy. Thus, even the laity can and should in this sense be considered concelebrants and not just receivers of the Holy Mysteries. But I don't know for certain how the canons/Typikon understand this, and I don't want to push forward my reasoning as authoritative.
I have a better question: why would you commune twice in a day? I don't know why. My housemate just posed this question to me as a hypothetical. |
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ialmisry
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« Reply #4 on: December 28, 2008, 02:07:03 AM » |
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I ask this question on behalf of a housemate who asked me.
I am aware that the Divine Liturgy can be celebrated only once on an altar between midnight and midnight of one day, and that a priest can (con)celebrate the Liturgy only once in the same span of time. But can a layperson RECEIVE Holy Communion twice in one day (again defined as midnight to midnight)? Citation of canons or rules from the Typikon are highly recommended to back up your assertions.
Personally, I don't think so, since the Divine Liturgy is the work of the entire assembly--bishop/priest and faithful--and not just the work of the clergy. Thus, even the laity can and should in this sense be considered concelebrants and not just receivers of the Holy Mysteries. But I don't know for certain how the canons/Typikon understand this, and I don't want to push forward my reasoning as authoritative.
I have a better question: why would you commune twice in a day? I don't know why. My housemate just posed this question to me as a hypothetical. Lost count of the angels on the pin did he? |
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Question a friend, perhaps he did not do it; but if he did anything so that he may do it no more.
A hasty quarrel kindles fire,
and urgent strife sheds blood.
If you blow on a spark, it will glow;
if you spit on it, it will be put out;
and both come out of your mouth
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wynd
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Transfiguration
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« Reply #5 on: December 28, 2008, 03:27:59 PM » |
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No because by virtue of receiving the first time you haven't fasted.
What about in the case of vesperal liturgies? Is it required to fast the whole day? Our priest tells us to fast from at least noon. |
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VirSpeluncaeOrthodoxae
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« Reply #6 on: December 28, 2008, 03:49:23 PM » |
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I ask this question on behalf of a housemate who asked me.
I am aware that the Divine Liturgy can be celebrated only once on an altar between midnight and midnight of one day, and that a priest can (con)celebrate the Liturgy only once in the same span of time. But can a layperson RECEIVE Holy Communion twice in one day (again defined as midnight to midnight)? Citation of canons or rules from the Typikon are highly recommended to back up your assertions.
Personally, I don't think so, since the Divine Liturgy is the work of the entire assembly--bishop/priest and faithful--and not just the work of the clergy. Thus, even the laity can and should in this sense be considered concelebrants and not just receivers of the Holy Mysteries. But I don't know for certain how the canons/Typikon understand this, and I don't want to push forward my reasoning as authoritative.
I have a better question: why would you commune twice in a day? My thoughts exactly. |
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Medieval, backwards, rigid, narrow-minded Traditionalist, Western Rite lover and proud of it! Make my day.
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Asteriktos
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« Reply #7 on: December 28, 2008, 04:06:55 PM » |
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Maybe he/she figures it'd be twice the grace, which brings up an interesting question in itself.
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« Last Edit: December 28, 2008, 04:07:23 PM by Asteriktos »
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Michał Kalina
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« Reply #8 on: December 28, 2008, 04:41:12 PM » |
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What about in the case of vesperal liturgies? Is it required to fast the whole day? Our priest tells us to fast from at least noon.
I was told that Eucharistic Lent has to be 8 hours long at least. So if You won't to receive Holy Communion eg. on Liturgy of the Presanctified Gifts which starts at 5 pm noon won't be enough. On the other hand if Pashal or Nativity Service begins at night, You may start fasting later. |
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« Last Edit: December 28, 2008, 04:45:06 PM by mike »
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formerly known as mikeDespite being a Polish citizen I am not a Pole.  Long live Belarus! "It's my constitutional right!" |
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ozgeorge
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« Reply #9 on: December 28, 2008, 06:14:02 PM » |
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Maybe he/she figures it'd be twice the grace, Grace is the Divine Energies which is God. God x 2 = God x 1 = God x 43 = God |
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« Last Edit: December 28, 2008, 06:17:53 PM by ozgeorge »
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If you're living a happy life as a Christian, you're doing something wrong.
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Jonathan
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« Reply #10 on: December 28, 2008, 06:50:56 PM » |
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In the Coptic Church at least in addition to the rule on fasting for 9 hrs there is a rule that it can only be once per day. But if you define it as midnight to midnight we have Communion twice a day quite frequently. In a few weeks we'll have a Liturgy Sunday morning, but we'll have to end by 10 am so the altar can fast for 9 hr before we start the Liturgy for Eve of Theophany/Epiphany at 7:00 pm. So from a western perspective it's Sunday morning and Sunday evening, but by our calendar it's Sunday and Eve of Monday.
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Asteriktos
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« Reply #11 on: December 28, 2008, 07:56:30 PM » |
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Grace is the Divine Energies which is God.
God x 2 = God x 1 = God x 43 = God Using that logic, why receive at all? You could receive once, have the grace that is God, and be set, never benefiting from receiving after that. |
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ytterbiumanalyst
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« Reply #12 on: December 28, 2008, 08:04:50 PM » |
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Grace is the Divine Energies which is God.
God x 2 = God x 1 = God x 43 = God Using that logic, why receive at all? You could receive once, have the grace that is God, and be set, never benefiting from receiving after that. Only if you never sin after communing. Grace is the same always, but our ability to receive grace fluctuates with each action for or against God. |
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"It is remarkable that what we call the world...in what professes to be true...will allow in one man no blemishes, and in another no virtue."--Charles Dickens
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Asteriktos
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« Reply #13 on: December 28, 2008, 08:27:14 PM » |
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That's true, though I don't see how either that or the explanation that George gave would rule out taking communion twice on the same day? After all, you could sin during the day after you partake in the morning... what would then prevent you from partaking again in the evening supposing you had the chance? I am not personally in favor of doing so, I'm just trying to figure out the reasons behind not doing so (though I admit that I think Peter gave a good reason in the first post... just wondering if there is more to it).
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« Last Edit: December 28, 2008, 08:28:08 PM by Asteriktos »
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Jetavan
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« Reply #14 on: December 28, 2008, 08:41:56 PM » |
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(Waiting for someone to invoke Aristotelian logic and Neo-scholastic metaphysics, to help disentangle such conundrums as produced by the human intellect.  ) |
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If you will, you can become all flame.
Extra caritatem nulla salus.
In order to become whole, take the "I" out of "holiness".
I'm not a witch.
Ἄνω σχῶμεν τὰς καρδίας
"Those who say religion has nothing to do with politics do not know what religion is." -- Mohandas Gandhi
Y dduw bo'r diolch.
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PeterTheAleut
The Right Blowhard Peter the Furtive of Yetts O'Muckhart
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« Reply #15 on: December 28, 2008, 10:45:01 PM » |
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In the Coptic Church at least in addition to the rule on fasting for 9 hrs there is a rule that it can only be once per day. But if you define it as midnight to midnight we have Communion twice a day quite frequently. In a few weeks we'll have a Liturgy Sunday morning, but we'll have to end by 10 am so the altar can fast for 9 hr before we start the Liturgy for Eve of Theophany/Epiphany at 7:00 pm. So from a western perspective it's Sunday morning and Sunday evening, but by our calendar it's Sunday and Eve of Monday.
Following your practice, and our other practice, of defining the liturgical day as Vespers to Vespers, there are actually a few times during the year when we who follow the Byzantine Rite will celebrate the Liturgy twice in one day. We do so at least for Pascha, Theophany, and Christmas. However, if Christmas or Theophany falls on a Monday, we will not celebrate the Vesperal Liturgy on Sunday evening, since we already celebrated the Sunday Liturgy that morning. |
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