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Author Topic: What are your thoughts on this saying?  (Read 1188 times) Average Rating: 0
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Myrrh23
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« on: December 06, 2008, 05:32:23 AM »

What are your thoughts on the saying, "Treat your friends like family and your family like friends"? Just out of curiosity... Smiley
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« Reply #1 on: December 06, 2008, 07:57:17 AM »

What are your thoughts on the saying, "Treat your friends like family and your family like friends"? Just out of curiosity... Smiley

My ex and my in-laws (who lived with us Shocked) thought manners are something you don't waste on family.  The result?  I've never met such a group of people dedicated to each other's destruction.
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A hasty quarrel kindles fire,
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Ian Lazarus
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« Reply #2 on: December 06, 2008, 09:11:59 AM »

Uh.....I left home for a reason.   Roll Eyes
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ialmisry
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« Reply #3 on: December 06, 2008, 09:18:26 AM »

Uh.....I left home for a reason.   Roll Eyes

LOL with tears: I just lost again yesterday with my ex over custody.  The children Wednesday were talking about their plans of running away.  Evidently, they don't agree with the judge's assessment of their best interests (actually, the problem is that there has never been a hearing on that in the whole 8 years.  The judge would have to admit her the mistake that the criminal court and DCFS has been pointing out) and they have decided they will take matters into their own hands.  They say that they can't take what the psychological report called mom's "uncontrollable rage."  I told them they shouldn't.
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Question a friend, perhaps he did not do it; but if he did anything so that he may do it no more.
A hasty quarrel kindles fire,
and urgent strife sheds blood.
If you blow on a spark, it will glow;
if you spit on it, it will be put out;
                           and both come out of your mouth
Myrrh23
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« Reply #4 on: December 06, 2008, 03:36:05 PM »

I'll pray for your family, Ialmisry, because my own mother has that uncontrollable rage! Sad Shocked
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We all have a Black Dog and a White Dog inside of us. The One you feed the most eventually eats the Other.

All are tempted, but it is the courageous person who clings to God during the storm. For the Ego is a prison, but Christ is the Liberator
ialmisry
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« Reply #5 on: December 06, 2008, 05:52:40 PM »

I'll pray for your family, Ialmisry, because my own mother has that uncontrollable rage! Sad Shocked

Thanks. I remind them that their mother has a problem, and try to focus their anger on the problem, not her.
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Question a friend, perhaps he did not do it; but if he did anything so that he may do it no more.
A hasty quarrel kindles fire,
and urgent strife sheds blood.
If you blow on a spark, it will glow;
if you spit on it, it will be put out;
                           and both come out of your mouth
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« Reply #6 on: December 06, 2008, 07:58:30 PM »

What are your thoughts on the saying, "Treat your friends like family and your family like friends"? Just out of curiosity... Smiley

Would it apply to High Conflict Individuals?

Ultimately, the goal is to treat everyone as equals, friends, family, foes alike.  It's not easy; However, it has to be done.
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« Reply #7 on: December 06, 2008, 09:08:42 PM »

If you have a criminal court ruling and DCFS on your side, why not appeal the case and take it out of the hands of a family court...an appellate court is far more capable to rule on these matters. I actually agree that family court, in general, is a joke...these proceedings should probably be heard and decided upon by a jury like any other case and if one is going to insist on using a judge, it should probably be a judge from a Criminal Court...the idea of having a separate family court is a proven failure.
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ialmisry
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« Reply #8 on: December 07, 2008, 09:53:23 AM »

If you have a criminal court ruling and DCFS on your side, why not appeal the case and take it out of the hands of a family court...an appellate court is far more capable to rule on these matters. I actually agree that family court, in general, is a joke...these proceedings should probably be heard and decided upon by a jury like any other case and if one is going to insist on using a judge, it should probably be a judge from a Criminal Court...the idea of having a separate family court is a proven failure.

I have appealed, the hitch has been that the judge refused to certify the record as required for the Appellate court to review, in particular the Bystander Report (what is given in lieu of a transcript). The Appellate Court issued an order to her to ammend her refusal with an explanation: Judge M- (can I say her name?) just refused to acknowledge the order. Further, her refusal to hold a hearing meant all that evidence (e.g. DCFS, criminal records, etc. the divorce judge has, but refuses to release, the police records) held for a trial that didn't take place didn't make it into the record.  Meanwhile she allows my ex to continue litigation which keeps me busy. 

So what I have done is stopped filing pleadings as if they are going to be heard by the circuit court and instead packed the motions with citations of case law, etc. more appropriate for a appeallate brief. I also included accounts of what has gone on in court: my ex has filed motions to dismiss and strike, by Illinois law she admits the allegations contained therein. (I have, however, had to be careful until very recently, to reveal what the kids have been saying, so as not to endanger them). 

The juge has actually said that she doesn't care what happens in the appellate court, and that their orders don't count, but I had no stenographer there for that.  So I also begged, borrowed and stole to get the money for a stenographer, which now can bypass the need for the judge to certify.  I'm waiting now for Friday's transcript: the latest reduction in time with the children was filed pursuant to the Parentage Act, the law governing custody for illegitimate children.  Since we were married (a fact the judge should have noticed as she first got her claws on my kids by presiding over the divorce), the court has no jurisdiction over the matter, a fact that the transcript is going to show was hammered and the judge igonred.  By all accounts (including my ex's lawyer, since he made a similar mistake on another motion and filed to ammend, missing his deadline, though), the order is void for want of subject matter jurisdiction.  As all the previous orders have been entered without a determination of the children's best interests, necessary according to Illinois public policy and statute, they are all void, and therefore can be attacked as well now.   I already have the transcript of the court refusing to certify the record when the Appellate court determined that the appeal should be an expedited custody  appeal and thus, according to the Illinois Supreme Court Rules, the burden to make sure the record is delievered to the higher court shifts partially from me (usually it is 100% on the appellant) to the judge and chief judge of the division. Friday I had the whole record thus far, and the transcript will show that although offered, the judge refused to see the appellant court's orders, again.  So once the transcript is finished, it is only a 16 day wait and the appellate court with have its record.

Yes, family court is a joke but only the divorce lawyers are laughing.  In Chicago it's worse, as it is the catch basin of the dreggs of the patrponage system: my judge actually wrote the ward gerrymandering in Chicago for the 90's. Btw, check those Obama judicial picks very carefully.

Btw, I believe there are only two states that have jury custody trials.  In Illinois, trial by jury is denied by statute.  And yes, the criminal court was a WHOLE different experience, for one thing the absence of arrogance.  I don't know if that was a family (de facto divorce)/criminal court distinction, a suburb/city distinction (the criminal stuff has all been in the suburbs, which is how she has managed to hide/keep it out of divorce court, something that is now specifically barred by Supreme court rule), or a Democrat machine/Republican distinction (the husband of the one criminal judge who convicted Spider was a big politico when the Republicans controlled the Senate, and now has a prison term to match).

A year ago the Supreme Court issued a whole new article of its rules that specifically deal with the problems with "family court" and custody, explicitely putting custody cases on  a par with capital offense. In Illinois, over half the custody cases were being overturned, and the number was rising: in fact, a custody order had become the most appeallable order in Illinois (which makes me wonder why Jefferey Leving of Elian Gonzalez fame in his book calls appeals a waste), over twice as appeallabe as a murder conviction.  Since this court has managed to break every one of the rules, and the only precedent on the new rules is another appellate district which, even after disposing of the case on other grounds, went on to apply the new rules, its explanation explicitely making the precedent of taking up making case law on the new rules a chief priority, my case has a far better chance than most on being heard.
« Last Edit: December 07, 2008, 09:58:37 AM by ialmisry » Logged

Question a friend, perhaps he did not do it; but if he did anything so that he may do it no more.
A hasty quarrel kindles fire,
and urgent strife sheds blood.
If you blow on a spark, it will glow;
if you spit on it, it will be put out;
                           and both come out of your mouth
Heorhij
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« Reply #9 on: December 07, 2008, 11:23:47 AM »

Dear Ialmisry, I will pray for you, to.

I think I agree that this saying is wise. I wish I followed it more in my life. The thing is, we really tend to say to our close blood relatives certain things that we would not normally say to our "just friends." My mom, for example, is a very opinionated woman whose views on various things are very different from mine. When I was younger, I would argue with her about our differences, sometimes too rudely, insisting that I was right and she wrong. Now, with my wisdom of the 20/20 hindsight, I regret that I did that, and think, perhaps I should have treated her more like I treat my friends when we argue: say "OK, think what you want, let's better talk about something else," or even, "hey, mom, let's just have a drink!" Smiley

The other part of this saying applies to me as well. Just recently, I suddenly began to think: why is it that I keep forgetting to congratulate my good old friends with their birthdays? I never forget to congratulate my wife, daughter, mother, mother-in-law, sister-in-law. Could I just treat my wonderful, dear old buddies the same way?
« Last Edit: December 07, 2008, 11:24:17 AM by Heorhij » Logged

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