Author Topic: Edward Michael Cardinal Egan on Orthodox Saints  (Read 3218 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

Offline Marc1152

  • Toumarches
  • ************
  • Posts: 13,839
  • Probiotic .. Antibiotic
  • Jurisdiction: Rocor
Edward Michael Cardinal Egan on Orthodox Saints
« on: June 10, 2008, 07:14:08 PM »
Split from:  Saint Alexei Trupp: A Roman Catholic glorified by ROCOR

-- Friul


Two or three months ago I heard Cardinal Egan of New York on The Catholic Channel on Sirus radio. He has a regular program there.
When asked about non-Roman Catholic Saints he said that the Orthodox have.. "Something like Saints"... ( kind of like ' near beer'). He said that the Orthodox were not very careful about who they canonized and used as evidence the glorification of the Czar whom he said was not a very good person.

It was soooo offensive I am still muttering to myself about it. 
« Last Edit: June 10, 2008, 08:17:01 PM by Friul »
Your idea has been debunked 1000 times already.. Maybe 1001 will be the charm

Offline Papist

  • Patriarch of Pontification
  • Toumarches
  • ************
  • Posts: 12,746
  • Praying for the Christians in Iraq
Re: Edward Michael Cardinal Egan on Orthodox Saints
« Reply #1 on: June 10, 2008, 10:13:17 PM »
Can you provide a source so we can read about his statements?
You are right. I apologize for having sacked Constantinople. I really need to stop doing that.

Offline username!

  • Moderator
  • Protokentarchos
  • *****
  • Posts: 5,081
Re: Edward Michael Cardinal Egan on Orthodox Saints
« Reply #2 on: June 10, 2008, 11:50:11 PM »
From the Vatican website  http://www.vatican.va/news_services/liturgy/saints/ELENCO_SANTI_GPII.htmn
here is a list of those "blessed" which is a step on the way to becoming listed as a Saint
http://www.vatican.va/news_services/liturgy/saints/index_blessed_en.html
There were 482 Saints canonized under John Paul II

Totale:
52 celebrazioni;
38 in Vaticano;
14 fuori sede;
482 Santi

http://www.vatican.va/news_services/liturgy/saints/index_saints_en.html#
« Last Edit: June 10, 2008, 11:52:28 PM by username! »

Offline AMM

  • Archon
  • ********
  • Posts: 2,076
Re: Edward Michael Cardinal Egan on Orthodox Saints
« Reply #3 on: June 11, 2008, 07:54:53 AM »
I have to agree with him about the Tsar.

Offline Marc1152

  • Toumarches
  • ************
  • Posts: 13,839
  • Probiotic .. Antibiotic
  • Jurisdiction: Rocor
Re: Edward Michael Cardinal Egan on Orthodox Saints
« Reply #4 on: June 11, 2008, 05:07:14 PM »
Can you provide a source so we can read about his statements?

I thought the source was clear, he said this on his radio show on the Catholic Channel on Sirus Radio. I am a regular listner.
Your idea has been debunked 1000 times already.. Maybe 1001 will be the charm

Offline Anastasios

  • Webdespota
  • Administrator
  • Merarches
  • *******
  • Posts: 10,496
  • Metropolitan Chrysostomos of Florina
    • AnastasiosHudson.com
  • Faith: Orthodox Christian
  • Jurisdiction: Greek Old Calendarist
Re: Edward Michael Cardinal Egan on Orthodox Saints
« Reply #5 on: June 11, 2008, 05:13:59 PM »
I have to agree with him about the Tsar.

He certainly made many mistakes as emperor but from his writings I get the impression he was quite pious.

Just like St Constantine the Great, his life was a gradual move towards deeper sanctity.

I don't like how some people use his memory though in their attempts to recreate "Holy Russia" though.
Please Buy My Book!

Past posts reflect stages of my life before my baptism and may not be accurate expositions of Orthodox teaching. Also, I served as an Orthodox priest from 2008-2013, before resigning.

Offline Marc1152

  • Toumarches
  • ************
  • Posts: 13,839
  • Probiotic .. Antibiotic
  • Jurisdiction: Rocor
Re: Edward Michael Cardinal Egan on Orthodox Saints
« Reply #6 on: June 11, 2008, 05:20:07 PM »
I have to agree with him about the Tsar.

Yes, the Czar is certainly a tough one in the context of the American spin on the Russian Revolution. The "spin" is that the Revolution was solely economic. The reason it is seen that way is because our system sees things in terms of bucks/profits/markets. While the economic causes of the Russian Revolution is undeniable what is missing is the rest of the story. That other half is the profoundly anti-Christian nature of the Russian Revolution. In old Russian the Czar played a central role as benefactor and protector of the Church. So when there is a Revolution dedicated to destroying the Church and the primary benefactor of the Church is murdered, he is indeed a martyr. Wether or not he was a nice fella or  made other mistakes as leader of the Government is besides the point.

Plus, keep in mind that the good Cardinal has trouble with all Saints of the Orthodox Church. He simply picked out an easy target. But St. Seraphim of Sarov or St. John of Kronsdat all fall short with him, which once again shows the ignorance of Roman Catholics when it comes to the Eastern Church.  
Your idea has been debunked 1000 times already.. Maybe 1001 will be the charm

Offline Anastasios

  • Webdespota
  • Administrator
  • Merarches
  • *******
  • Posts: 10,496
  • Metropolitan Chrysostomos of Florina
    • AnastasiosHudson.com
  • Faith: Orthodox Christian
  • Jurisdiction: Greek Old Calendarist
Re: Edward Michael Cardinal Egan on Orthodox Saints
« Reply #7 on: June 11, 2008, 05:41:42 PM »
Interestingly enough, though, St Sava of Serbia made it on to the RC calendar and they were talking about him on EWTN on Sirius. Anyone know anything about that?
Please Buy My Book!

Past posts reflect stages of my life before my baptism and may not be accurate expositions of Orthodox teaching. Also, I served as an Orthodox priest from 2008-2013, before resigning.

Offline lubeltri

  • Latin Catholic layman
  • Protokentarchos
  • *********
  • Posts: 3,795
Re: Edward Michael Cardinal Egan on Orthodox Saints
« Reply #8 on: June 12, 2008, 07:16:58 PM »
I'd have to listen to His Eminence Cardinal Egan's statements or read a transcript before making any judgments about this. I tried to find it on google to no avail. The good Cardinal is one of the better prelates in the American Church.

Offline Marc1152

  • Toumarches
  • ************
  • Posts: 13,839
  • Probiotic .. Antibiotic
  • Jurisdiction: Rocor
Re: Edward Michael Cardinal Egan on Orthodox Saints
« Reply #9 on: June 12, 2008, 07:28:26 PM »
I'd have to listen to His Eminence Cardinal Egan's statements or read a transcript before making any judgments about this. I tried to find it on google to no avail. The good Cardinal is one of the better prelates in the American Church.

This show is in a question and answer format on The Catholic Channel.not an formal speech or paper. Go the Catholic Channel and look up when he is on, it's pretty often. Call in and ask him yourself.. He said the Orthodox Church as "Something like Saints" and then he slandered the martyred Tsar.... It was an ignorant and condescending statement,... But ring him up yourself..Sirus is a great value.
Your idea has been debunked 1000 times already.. Maybe 1001 will be the charm

Offline Marc1152

  • Toumarches
  • ************
  • Posts: 13,839
  • Probiotic .. Antibiotic
  • Jurisdiction: Rocor
Re: Edward Michael Cardinal Egan on Orthodox Saints
« Reply #10 on: June 12, 2008, 07:43:32 PM »
I went to the New York Archdiocese web page. Apparently they produce the entire Catholic Channel on Sirus.They even invite you to write him with your questions.... Knock yourself out
Here is the info:



A Conversation with the Cardinal


Thursdays 1 pm ET
A Conversation with the Cardinal is a weekly one-hour program featuring His Eminence, Edward Cardinal Egan, Archbishop of New York. Moderated by Program Director Rob Astorino, the show allows the Cardinal to speak directly with Catholics in the Diocese and around the nation. Among other things, scripture, current events, and news from the Vatican are discussed.

E-mail the Cardinal directly with any questions about the Church or faith you may have to info@thecatholicchannel.org

Your idea has been debunked 1000 times already.. Maybe 1001 will be the charm

Offline theistgal

  • Byzantine (Ruthenian) Catholic gadfly
  • Site Supporter
  • Archon
  • *****
  • Posts: 2,082
  • don't even go there!
Re: Edward Michael Cardinal Egan on Orthodox Saints
« Reply #11 on: June 17, 2008, 01:04:46 PM »
He certainly made many mistakes as emperor but from his writings I get the impression he was quite pious.

Just like St Constantine the Great, his life was a gradual move towards deeper sanctity.

I don't like how some people use his memory though in their attempts to recreate "Holy Russia" though.

Interestingly, there is a Catholic writer named Caryll Houselander who wrote, in her book "A Rocking Horse Catholic,"  about a vision she had as a child.  At the time the Tsar and his family were murdered, she looked up at the sky and saw an image of the Tsar being crowned with thorns.
"Sometimes, you just gotta say, 'OK, I still have nine live, two-headed animals' and move on.'' (owner of Coney Island freak show, upon learning he'd been outbid on a 5-legged puppy)

Offline Schultz

  • Christian. Guitarist. Scooterist. Zymurgist. Librarian.
  • Taxiarches
  • **********
  • Posts: 6,536
  • Scion of the McKeesport Becks.
Re: Edward Michael Cardinal Egan on Orthodox Saints
« Reply #12 on: June 17, 2008, 01:57:37 PM »
This doesn't surprise me.  Cardinal Egan was just unfortunately showing his ignorance, especially in saying that the glorification of the martyred Tsar was a mistake, in a word.  As others have pointed out, the man was a terrible administrator but that doesn't mean he was a bad person.  By all accounts, by the end of his life he was a very devout and pious Christian who did his best to serve God within the confines of his status.  Many people, especially Americans, fail to realize that even autocrats like the Russian Tsar were not and could not be true despots; the bureaucracy that surrounded them exerted far more power in decision making than people want to believe.  But, of course, it's far easier, especially after the demonization of cultures and heads of state during World War One, to believe in a simplistic understanding of monarchy as it was practiced at the beginning of the 20th century than to try to attempt to comprehend the incredibly complex world monarchs found themselves in at that time.

"Hearing a nun's confession is like being stoned to death with popcorn." --Abp. Fulton Sheen