Topic: The non-Catholic counterfeit Vatican II sect

[_Seraphim_]

I recently received spam mail to this link:
http://www.mostholyfamilymonastery.com/


As far as I can tell, it is a "True Catholic" group that considers post Vatican II Roman Catholicism to no longer truly be Catholic.

From an Orthodox perspective, this "news" seems to be about 908 years too late. 
Several "faults" they find in RC are pretty much the same faults that Orthodoxy sees in RC... only this group is obviously failing to see the bigger picture.

May they be brought into the fullness of Truth.  May they find the True Faith.
+Lord have mercy

[scamandrius]

There are several groups of Roman Catholics who believe that there has been no true heir to St. Peter since Vatican II, hence they are called sedevacantists.  This group appears no different than the Lefebrevists (sp.) or even the SSPX (Society of St. Pius X).  These small, but very vocal minority, are demanding a repeal of Vatican II and as much as the current pope has been doing much to go back towards Roman CAtholicism's Orthodox roots, Benedict XVI has plainly spoken that he will still continue to implement Vatican II's decrees.  So, these groups will probably not be reconciled with the pope anytime soon.

[lubeltri]

Seraphim, one problem with those groups (from your perspective):

Eastern "Orthodoxy" is an illogical farce, which rejects the clear teaching of Scripture and the fathers on the Papal Primacy, and which causes those who accept it to truly wind up believing in no dogma at all.  That’s why Pope Leo XIII says those who reject one dogma reject all Faith.  I guess the fact that E. Orthodoxy does not -- and cannot -- really believe in any dogmatic councils (as shown above) is why it’s so appealing to so many: it’s provides the comfort of Protestantism, yet the appearance of ancient tradition, at the same time the feel of liturgical piety, with the illusion of hierarchical authority.h

By the way, I think we agree that the post-Vatican II sect is a huge manifestation of evil at the very least, a Counter Church of the Devil.  Well, the post-Vatican II sect loves Eastern Orthodoxy.  That should tell you something.  If E. Orthodoxy were true, the post-Vatican II antipopes would hate it.  The post-Vatican II antipopes, whose mission from the Devil is to embrace all the major breaches of God’s truth in history (the pagan religions, the Islamic religion, the heretical sects and the E. Orthodox schism) reaches out to and wants to unite with E. Orthodoxy (and Protestantism) because the Devil knows that E. Orthodoxy was one of those major movements of rejection of God’s truth by which he has ensnared millions of souls.

http://www.mostholyfamilymonastery.com/refuting_eastern_orthodox.html

They are very anti-Orthodox and see Rome's increasing embrace of episcopal collegiality (seeing the pope as more primus inter pares than absolute monarch) as heresy.

The SSPX, (in irregular canonical situation with Rome but not in schism) and the sedevacantists SSPV and CMRI are also very distrustful of ecumenism with the EO.

In most ways, they are further from EO than the authentic Catholicism of Benedict XVI.

[ytterbiumanalyst]

If E. Orthodoxy were true, the post-Vatican II antipopes would hate it.

And they call us illogical....

[stanley123]

I recently received spam mail to this link:
http://www.mostholyfamilymonastery.com/


As far as I can tell, it is a "True Catholic" group that considers post Vatican II Roman Catholicism to no longer truly be Catholic.

I am not sure if they are the true Catholics, since there is a different true Catholic Church which has Pope Pius XIII as Pope:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/True_Catholic_Church

[prodromas]

I am not sure if they are the true Catholics, since there is a different true Catholic Church which has Pope Pius XIII as Pope:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/True_Catholic_Church

Aren't these claims ludicrous as a Roman Catholic is distinguished by a belief that the Roman Pontiff is universal and supreme ruler of the church? So how can you create a sect holding Roman Catholic beliefs?

[Anastasios]

Aren't these claims ludicrous as a Roman Catholic is distinguished by a belief that the Roman Pontiff is universal and supreme ruler of the church? So how can you create a sect holding Roman Catholic beliefs?

If I understand their logic (which is from an opinion of Cardinal Robert Bellarmine from around the 17th century):

Pope is infallible & this infallibility is guaranteed by HS
Therefore, if Pope says something ex cathedra that is heretical, he is not actually a Pope

Also, the claim is that John XXIII was a Mason and thus was not eligible for Papal election.

[Entscheidungsproblem]

If I understand their logic (which is from an opinion of Cardinal Robert Bellarmine from around the 17th century):

Pope is infallible & this infallibility is guaranteed by HS
Therefore, if Pope says something ex cathedra that is heretical, he is not actually a Pope

Also, the claim is that John XXIII was a Mason and thus was not eligible for Papal election.

Pretty much.  Especially with the heresy of modernism, they pretty much claim anything post-Pius XII is heretical.

[Jakub]

They are squirrel food...

[Entscheidungsproblem]

  Thread Split:  Modernism in the RCC, liturgical abuses and can it happen here?

Discussions about modernism within the RCC, groups they view as heretical/illicit, liturgical abuses, and if this is foreshadowing of things to come in Orthodoxy should be kept in the thread I linked to above.

-- Friul