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Author Topic: No Passion (Holy) Week services and no Pascha for me this year...  (Read 16985 times) Average Rating: 0
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« on: April 19, 2008, 07:12:18 PM »

My dear wife categorically refuses to go to an Orthodox church out of town for this year's Holy Week services or for Pascha, and categorically refuses to let me go.

Maybe next year... Please pray for us...
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« Reply #1 on: April 19, 2008, 07:23:40 PM »

Dear Brother-you are in my thoughts and prayers!!
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« Reply #2 on: April 19, 2008, 08:18:07 PM »

Heorhij, that must be so disappointing! I am sorry.  You are in my prayers.   Embarrassed
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« Reply #3 on: April 19, 2008, 10:03:22 PM »

God be with you, Professor.

If any consolation, I'm not attending all, if not most of Holy Week either, not even Palm Sunday (pray that I may have time to do any day).  I'll only be able to have time for Easter liturgy.

God bless you.
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« Reply #4 on: April 19, 2008, 10:17:06 PM »

Lord, have mercy, and may He give you the strength that you need!
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« Reply #5 on: April 19, 2008, 10:20:06 PM »

Thank you guys. Dear Mina, I'm just George; "Professor" with a capital P is way too much. Smiley May I ask, why can't you attend more services?
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« Reply #6 on: April 19, 2008, 10:35:38 PM »

I'm sorry that you're having this happen, George.  Sad 

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« Reply #7 on: April 19, 2008, 10:38:05 PM »

I am sorry as well friend.  I hope you find the strength you need. 
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« Reply #8 on: April 19, 2008, 10:41:10 PM »

I pray that you have patience with the situation at hand and know that our merciful Lord knows of your wish that you could attend the services.

Juliana
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« Reply #9 on: April 20, 2008, 02:48:20 AM »

Thank you guys. Dear Mina, I'm just George; "Professor" with a capital P is way too much. Smiley May I ask, why can't you attend more services?

Medical school.  I can't afford a day without studying, especially these days.  As one of my friends here joke around saying, "Women, what women?  My only woman is medical school.  I spend 24 hours a day, 7 days a week with her."
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« Reply #10 on: April 20, 2008, 03:03:12 AM »

Medical school.  I can't afford a day without studying, especially these days.  As one of my friends here joke around saying, "Women, what women?  My only woman is medical school.  I spend 24 hours a day, 7 days a week with her."
Well, I guess it beats a friend of mine who was instructed by his priest to celebrate the non-clergy parts of all the Holy Week and Pascha services at home a few years ago because his whole family had chicken pox.  (His bout with the disease as a child made him immune.) Tongue
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« Reply #11 on: April 20, 2008, 04:57:03 AM »

This year with the high cost of gasoline, we will be doing the Bridegroom services for ourselves, the kids and grandkids at the family icon corner.  the hundred miles round trip gets to be really expensive on a limited budget.  We will make it to the  services after Wednesday thru Pascha.  We serve the Agape service at a park near our home and usually have about 25 non-orthodox attend the service and then share our Pascha Feast with them, otherwise we would be on the road constantly Holy saturday thru Agape---not to mention sleeping the 10 of us in a single car is really too much of a sacrifice for these tired bones.

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« Reply #12 on: April 20, 2008, 07:39:16 AM »

I'm not gona lie.  It is really inspiring to hear some of your stories in regards to your struggles for Holy Week.  Makes me realize how spoiled I am, and ungrateful! 

I hope you guys achieve your crowns in heaven.   angel
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« Reply #13 on: April 20, 2008, 10:19:54 AM »

I suggest that those of us who are able to attend Services this week light an extra candle for each of our friends here who cannot attend.
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« Reply #14 on: April 20, 2008, 10:44:24 AM »

Well, I guess it beats a friend of mine who was instructed by his priest to celebrate the non-clergy parts of all the Holy Week and Pascha services at home a few years ago because his whole family had chicken pox.  (His bout with the disease as a child made him immune.) Tongue

ouch....I also have to say, I didn't write enough, but I do live far.  The closest Orthodox Church (Antiochian) is an hour away and the closest Coptic Church for me is an hour and a half away.  That's why I can't "afford" to lose time (and gas money as well).

But my God, I feel bad for the pox people.  I would rather be healthy and studying than have nothing to study for and get the pox.

God bless.
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« Reply #15 on: April 20, 2008, 03:30:52 PM »

George my condolences.  I will light a candle for you though, maybe next year you will be able to attend, God willing.
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« Reply #16 on: April 20, 2008, 04:09:02 PM »

Lord, have mercy, and may He give you the strength that you need!
Yea. The strength to stand up to his wife.
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« Reply #17 on: April 20, 2008, 04:23:34 PM »

Lord have mercy, and grant to Your servant George strength and clarity of mind.
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« Reply #18 on: April 20, 2008, 04:47:52 PM »

But my God, I feel bad for the pox people.  I would rather be healthy and studying than have nothing to study for and get the pox.
No need to feel sorry for them now, for the incident I mentioned happened about four years ago. Smiley
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« Reply #19 on: April 20, 2008, 05:24:59 PM »

Yea. The strength to stand up to his wife.

You know, Christ said that whoever loves his relatives more than Him, is not worthy of Him. But he did not command us to love them LESS than Him. And "standing up" to my wife is not my kind of loving her.
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« Reply #20 on: April 20, 2008, 09:14:41 PM »

You know, Christ said that whoever loves his relatives more than Him, is not worthy of Him. But he did not command us to love them LESS than Him. And "standing up" to my wife is not my kind of loving her.
Love happens too be a two way street. After all. It's not like you are asking her to go to a strip club. Sometimes we have to stick too our guns.  We have too show that we mean business. Wink

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« Reply #21 on: April 20, 2008, 10:42:10 PM »

You know, Christ said that whoever loves his relatives more than Him, is not worthy of Him. But he did not command us to love them LESS than Him. And "standing up" to my wife is not my kind of loving her.

Allowing her to heap sin upon herself by 1) failing to submit to your authority as head of the household and 2) forbidding you to worship on the most Holy of Holy days is not love, either.
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« Reply #22 on: April 20, 2008, 11:05:54 PM »

Brothers in Christ,  Heorhij didn't ask us what we think.  Nor did he ask our advice.  He simply asked that we pray for him and his wife; anything beyond our offering kind words (right or wrong) and prayers is simply not our business IMO.  Undecided  BTW, Brother Heorhij, I'll be praying for you.  Smiley

In Christ,

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« Reply #23 on: April 20, 2008, 11:08:14 PM »

My dear wife categorically refuses to go to an Orthodox church out of town for this year's Holy Week services or for Pascha, and categorically refuses to let me go.

Maybe next year... Please pray for us...

Lord, have mercy on the both of you.  God willing, maybe things will turn around in time.  Smiley  You will both be in my prayers, George.
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« Reply #24 on: April 20, 2008, 11:15:46 PM »

Lord, have mercy on your servants!

We are being hit with a spring snow storm here.....a total of almost 3 feet by the time the week is out....my last exam is on Wednesday and I start summer vacation with my world looking more like Christmas....

I will be able to make it to most of the services this week although between the bus system and weather and other circumstances I haven't decided precisely which parish hehe.

I will be able to attend Pascha as well, although certain circumstances have proven once again that the Evil One is "interested" in me....

With Love in Christ
Ivan

P.S. George, if you have access to iTunes, might I recommend purchasing "Chants of the Russian Orthodox Church: Choirs and Monks of Kiev Pechersk Lavra". It's amazing.
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« Reply #25 on: April 20, 2008, 11:50:23 PM »

Heorhij,

You have my sympathy and prayers as well. I also don't expect to make it to any Holy Week or Pascha services. I did make it to services today, which was wonderful (first Divine Liturgy in years) and unexpected. But with the time effect of the distance as much as the gas prices, I don't expect more. But... Don't give up hope! At the end of last week, it looked like we wouldn't be able to make it to church at all for several weeks. Since this bugged me so to speak, I made a point of praying harder and more diligently than is typical for me. ( I am working on that... honest!)  Well, later that day, I saw a rainbow!  I know that sounds normal, but it isn't. It was 2:00 in the afternoon and the sky was as clear and blue as could be! There was just one or two of those high wispy clouds.  And then everything worked out so we could go! So, my long winded point is keep praying and don't give in to despondency.
 
 
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« Reply #26 on: April 21, 2008, 03:20:57 AM »

George asked for prayers not advice.

Lord have mercy on George and his wife and their situation; which is one only they know and understand.
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« Reply #27 on: April 21, 2008, 04:44:05 AM »

George asked for prayers not advice.

Lord have mercy on George and his wife and their situation; which is one only they know and understand.

Well, he got both.  Consider it a bonus.
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« Reply #28 on: April 21, 2008, 05:06:54 AM »

Well, he got both.  Consider it a bonus.

A bonus, or extremely rude?  Roll Eyes
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« Reply #29 on: April 21, 2008, 08:54:07 AM »

My dear wife categorically refuses to go to an Orthodox church out of town for this year's Holy Week services or for Pascha, and categorically refuses to let me go.

Maybe next year... Please pray for us...

In the meantime, you may be able to see some or all of the services online, if you wish.  I don't know if the parishes are broadcasting the weekday services, but it may be worth a try, if you'd like.  Here's a link to a short list of parishes:
http://www.goarch.org/en/Chapel/live.asp
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« Reply #30 on: April 21, 2008, 09:20:21 AM »

Well, he got both.  Consider it a bonus.

Well, you've surely illustrated the point that you get what you pay for. Roll Eyes
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« Reply #31 on: April 21, 2008, 10:31:34 AM »

In the meantime, you may be able to see some or all of the services online, if you wish.  I don't know if the parishes are broadcasting the weekday services, but it may be worth a try, if you'd like.  Here's a link to a short list of parishes:
http://www.goarch.org/en/Chapel/live.asp

Thank you, Cleveland, that's most helpful.
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« Reply #32 on: April 21, 2008, 10:50:34 AM »

Allowing her to heap sin upon herself by 1) failing to submit to your authority as head of the household and 2) forbidding you to worship on the most Holy of Holy days is not love, either.

Punch, I know... I wish I could change her and I am really trying very hard to do all I can. However, at the moment, she, even though she is a cradle infant-baptized Orthodox, is not a believer. She has exactly ZERO belief in anything written in Scriptures, conisiders all that an idle and harmful myth invented to facilitate the exploitation of people by priests and churches. She says that there may be a god, but there is absolutely no way for us to know whether this god is or is not. What she really believes in is all this mosaic of "progressive" politically correct ideas, like that a husband and a wife must share both responsibilities and authority, that no one should be forced to believe or not believe in any myths (that is, religions), and that we all simply need to be honest and kind and good to each other.

At this stage of our life, she is terribly vulnerable to any outward manifestation of religious beliefs by me. There are reasons for that, and I am very much to blame. In the past, I used to be susceptible to different kinds of non-Orthodox teachings; there was even a time when I listened to Jehovah's Witnesses (thank God, not for long - but she can't forget that). About four and a half years ago, I decided that I was a Protestant, and was baptized in a Presbyterian church, and became a member and an elser there, and dragged her into membership there. So, right now, my wife might fear that this "Orthodoxy" is just a next emotional attachment on my part, a next "hype" if you will.

Another thing is, she is very entrenched in thinking that only dumb, un-developed, un-sophisticated people do things like praying at home, signing themselves with the sign of the cross in public places, etc. Partially, this is so because we live in the deep South of the US, where religiosity is really, at least to some extent, a mark of being a redneck, a person who either has little brain or does not have the habit of using the brain. All our friends are "anti-rednecks," mostly international graduate students and faculty from Europe (France, Germany, the Netherllands, Portugal, Bulgaria), all having a "chip on the shoulder" against what they perceive as this stupid redneck provincial backward demeaning thing called "religion." We just don't have ANY other friends. We never socialize with anyone who has any religious beliefs, any religious convictions, habits, etc.

So yes, I am sinning greatly by allowing her to do exactly what you said - heaping sin on herself. But I don't know how to change this, save keeping my own faith, sticking to my prayer rule (trying to pray even when she deliberately turns the TV on to the max, or begins vacuum-cleaning right next to the corner in our living room where the icons are Smiley), fasting, and being very good and kind and tender to her. And also keeping in touch with you guys through this Web forum. Smiley
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« Reply #33 on: April 21, 2008, 10:54:47 AM »

Lord have mercy.

George, the best you or any of us can do is just pray.  I'm not good at giving advice and therefore I won't.  Smiley  Prayers for you and your family, brother. 
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« Reply #34 on: April 21, 2008, 11:00:49 AM »

fyi - some other webcasts available here:

http://www.myocn.net/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=785&Itemid=254

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« Reply #35 on: April 21, 2008, 11:36:25 AM »

George, I so fear I will say something untoward-if so, please forgive me and have patience with me. Firstly, to a large degree, I can understand what a complicated situation this is. My father also "tried out" many different faith traditions against my mother's will (although she was very submissive to him and tried not to show her discomfort too openly-rather she always went along with him to all services no matter how much they were out of her comfort zone).

Now a second point. You mention the "rednecks", as simple people of Very Little Brain, objects of dirision by More Sophisticated, Highly Educated Europeans. This truthfully, really saddens me, and seems to be a form of pride. If I as an American were to live in a Euopean country and openly mock and hold myself up as superior to the local villagers or whatever, I think this would be very rude and not appreciated even by the more cosmopolitan members of society in that country. This battle of the continents seems to go on ad nauseum, sadly. Americans (at least the "redknecks") are branded as arrogant simpletons by Europeans,( who are  also prone to their own brand of arrogance/superiority). Truth to tell, the European pride bothers me more-perhaps I see less excuse for them, since they are so "well educated". It must be remembered that the cost of education is very high in America-we never had the luxury of receiving free higher education as was offered, say in the former CCCP. Many people are simply too poor to afford it, and I deeply sympathize with them, because I have suffered the same plight.

Let's not forget, please, that amongst Christ's disciples were simple, rough, crude, uneducated fishermen AS WELL as educated men. I think this was not accidental...

Please forgive my rant, and may the Lord have mercy on your situation. May He lovingly draw your dear wife to Himself and may she find the "peace which passeth all understanding" as she yields and submits herself to our loving Lord and Savior, and that He will give you strength to be a godly example to her, despite the terrible temptation she is exposing you to.

Forgive me...
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« Reply #36 on: April 21, 2008, 11:37:19 AM »

So yes, I am sinning greatly by allowing her to do exactly what you said - heaping sin on herself. But I don't know how to change this, save keeping my own faith, sticking to my prayer rule (trying to pray even when she deliberately turns the TV on to the max, or begins vacuum-cleaning right next to the corner in our living room where the icons are Smiley), fasting, and being very good and kind and tender to her. And also keeping in touch with you guys through this Web forum. Smiley

Heorhij, I'm so sorry.   Embarrassed  I will pray that the Lord softens her heart as he did mine.  I used to be just like her.
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Heorhij
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« Reply #37 on: April 21, 2008, 11:48:41 AM »

Thanks again, all, and especially thank you for the links!

Rosehip, I know, it saddens me, too, when people mock those who have less education than themselves. Although I must say that where we live, there are some highly "educated" full university professors with capital letters following their last names who have a weird, shockingly primitive view of the world (like the belief that the US "liberates" the world from evil "terrorists" by rightfully invading any foreign territory; or that the more guns are sold, the better; or that Orthodox and Catholics are idol worshippers, or that all these colored people on welfare are just a bunch of crazy and lazy losers, etc. etc. etc.). I know this forum is not a place for political discussion, so I will stop here.

Many thanks for your prayers. I will mention all of you in my unworthy prayers, too. My hope is unshaken, God is good!
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« Reply #38 on: April 21, 2008, 12:27:16 PM »

So yes, I am sinning greatly by allowing her to do exactly what you said - heaping sin on herself. But I don't know how to change this, save keeping my own faith, sticking to my prayer rule (trying to pray even when she deliberately turns the TV on to the max, or begins vacuum-cleaning right next to the corner in our living room where the icons are Smiley), fasting, and being very good and kind and tender to her. And also keeping in touch with you guys through this Web forum. Smiley

This struck a chord with me, George, because my husband does the same thing - except it most definitely doesn't vacuum  Wink   But he will listen to music or podcasts while I'm praying, and going around the whistling (and yes, I have mentioned it to him, but I only get belligerent "It wasn't that loud." answers back).  It causes me great sadness for my husband, who is a very serious Christian.  I just feel so sorry and afraid for him when he does these things.   God has been good to me and I've been able to get up, without a clock, around 5:30-5:45 most mornings to say my prayers in the quiet.  Its those days that I oversleep or procrastinate (darn computers) that I pay the price for my laziness.
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ComingHome
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« Reply #39 on: April 21, 2008, 12:33:26 PM »

George, I am so sorry.  Lord, have mercy!

We who are not in the kind of situations as George and Princess Mommy should be extremely thankful and yet we are so prone to take everything for granted.  Lord, have mercy on us and forgive our ungratefulness.
« Last Edit: April 21, 2008, 01:15:34 PM by ComingHome » Logged
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« Reply #40 on: April 21, 2008, 12:51:43 PM »

George, I am so sorry.  Lord, have mercy!

We who are not in the kind of situations as George and Rosehip should be extremely thankful and yet we are so prone to take everything for granted.  Lord, have mercy on us and forgive our ungratefulness.

Thank you, but I can't say at this point I'm at all in the same situation as George. Mercifully, I do not have to endure this problem presently. I think Princess Mommy's situation is more comparable.

And George, I also do not want to continue a political conversation on this forum, but I will say I do agree with you about the educated professors with whom you work. I thought you were referrring to simple folks living a la Foxfire series... Wink
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+ Our dear sister Martha (Rosehip) passed away on Dec 20, 2010.  May her memory be eternal! +
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« Reply #41 on: April 21, 2008, 01:18:20 PM »

Rosehip and Princess Mommy, my apologies to you both.  I picked up the wrong name when I was posting.  Again, I apologize to you both for this mistake. Embarrassed  (PS, I have corrected my post)   
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Heorhij
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« Reply #42 on: April 21, 2008, 01:48:22 PM »

It causes me great sadness for my husband, who is a very serious Christian. 

Looks like we are in the same boat, PrincessMommy Smiley

But I don't know what it is, to live with a "serious Christian" under the same roof... Never happened... All people I ever lived with were/are secular humanists and either agnostics or atheists. Maybe my mother-in-law, a retired high school math teacher who lives in Ukraine, is the only exception - she at least says that she believes in God, and she crosses herself, and she even says that the Mother of God comes to her in her dreams. But she never goes to church and never prays, either.
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« Reply #43 on: April 21, 2008, 02:10:56 PM »

George,

I have two questions:

1.)  Why does your wife refuse to atend an Orthodox liturgy outside of town?

2.)  Why are you being a wimp and staying "home" just because your wife refuses to let you go?  Come on, MAN!  Smiley
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ozgeorge
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« Reply #44 on: April 21, 2008, 02:16:08 PM »

George,

I have two questions:

1.)  Why does your wife refuse to atend an Orthodox liturgy outside of town?

2.)  Why are you being a wimp and staying "home" just because your wife refuses to let you go?  Come on, MAN!  Smiley

And I have a question for you: why are you making ad hominems after we have just put a poster on moderated posts for the same reason?
« Last Edit: April 21, 2008, 02:17:06 PM by ozgeorge » Logged

If you're living a happy life as a Christian, you're doing something wrong.
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