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Myrrh23
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« on: April 08, 2008, 11:37:15 PM »

Hey Guys!


I realize this might be a very tired old dog, and I couldn't find what I was looking for in Search, but I'd like to ask what all of you think of the Orthodox Church of America? It is an accepted Orthodox branch or is it a joke, etc.? I ask this because I'm thinking of moving to Bloomington, Illinois for further schooling and an OCA is 3 miles from Bloomington....
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« Reply #1 on: April 08, 2008, 11:46:15 PM »

Hey Guys!


I realize this might be a very tired old dog, and I couldn't find what I was looking for in Search, but I'd like to ask what all of you think of the Orthodox Church of America? It is an accepted Orthodox branch or is it a joke, etc.? I ask this because I'm thinking of moving to Bloomington, Illinois for further schooling and an OCA is 3 miles from Bloomington....

Not a joke - it's the real deal.  If an OCA parish is the closest to you, then by all means, go there.
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« Reply #2 on: April 09, 2008, 12:13:52 AM »

Hey Guys!


I realize this might be a very tired old dog, and I couldn't find what I was looking for in Search, but I'd like to ask what all of you think of the Orthodox Church of America? It is an accepted Orthodox branch or is it a joke, etc.? I ask this because I'm thinking of moving to Bloomington, Illinois for further schooling and an OCA is 3 miles from Bloomington....

No kidding? That's my parish. We'd love to have you!
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wynd
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« Reply #3 on: April 09, 2008, 12:46:59 AM »

Also:

http://www.scoba.us/jurisdictions.html

Note the presence of Metropolitan Herman.
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Myrrh23
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« Reply #4 on: April 09, 2008, 01:00:22 AM »

Hey Wynd---


What is Bloomington like? Are you a cradle or a convert? Do you like Bloomington? I was thinking of attending ISU, or maybe moving to Bloomington and working for 6 months. I've been trying to get a degree from SIUC for..ohhh...about 6 years. It's like pulling teeth... Tongue
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« Reply #5 on: April 09, 2008, 01:54:15 AM »

And I thought I had less tact!  C'mon! Shocked Angry

Not you Elisha! You are the epitome of tact and diplomacy... Cheesy

 Smiley Wink Tamara

« Last Edit: April 09, 2008, 01:54:31 AM by Tamara » Logged
Salpy
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« Reply #6 on: April 09, 2008, 02:48:37 AM »

There's an OCA church about a half hour from where I live.  My friends and I will sometimes go there on Saturday nights for their vigil services.  OCA vigil services are beyond beautiful.
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« Reply #7 on: April 09, 2008, 02:57:18 AM »

There's an OCA church about a half hour from where I live.  My friends and I will sometimes go there on Saturday nights for their vigil services.  OCA vigil services are beyond beautiful.

 You mean the Russian Sat. evening Vigil?  Indeed they are awesome!
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Myrrh23
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« Reply #8 on: April 09, 2008, 03:10:59 AM »

Are OCA services in nothing but English? Where do you live, Salpy?
« Last Edit: April 09, 2008, 03:11:38 AM by Myrrh23 » Logged

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« Reply #9 on: April 09, 2008, 03:16:10 AM »

Are OCA services in nothing but English? Where do you live, Salpy?

For the most part all OCA services are in English.  Some use other languages just for the "Lord Have Mercy" responses.  Some use Slavonic, there are few in the East that do.  The Cathedral in DC has a Slavonic liturgy on Sundays, but they have an English Liturgy as well on Sundays.  Even the ROCOR churches I have been to use English, sometimes up to 50 percent.  But the OCA is generally English usage with a few parish exceptions.
There are even OCA parishes that use strictly prostopinije!  Ok, I only know two off hand though!

I am guessing by vigil Salpy means, hours, vespers, hours, matins, hours? 
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Myrrh23
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« Reply #10 on: April 09, 2008, 03:19:13 AM »

What about the Greek and Bulgarian and Serbian and Antiochian OCs?
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« Reply #11 on: April 09, 2008, 03:23:33 AM »

What about the Greek and Bulgarian and Serbian and Antiochian OCs?

Greek-depends on the parish

Bulgarian- no clue

Antiochian- convert parish, English.  Arab parish probably not.

ACROD-English with some Slavonic

Ukrainian-English in some parishes, Ukrainian in others

OCA- English mostly, save for a few parishes

ROCOR- depends on the parish

Serbian-depends on the parish

As a matter of fact, I live in the heartland of Orthodoxy/Greek Catholicism.  Almost all parishes use mostly English that I am familiar with.  They may use Slavonic a bit, but only for the fixed parts of the Liturgy.  Not the Epistle, Gospel, Tropar, Kondak, etc...
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« Reply #12 on: April 09, 2008, 08:41:16 AM »

I edited out some negative comments about OCA that did not address the issue presented (see  Convert Issues Forum purpose).

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« Reply #13 on: April 09, 2008, 09:22:26 AM »

Question: Growing up, I had heard that the OCA couldn't have our own Patriarch because we couldn't get/ refused? Autocephaly. Is it true? What does that mean? Explain Please? I heard a lot as a kid that I was too young to really understand.
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« Reply #14 on: April 09, 2008, 09:30:37 AM »

Question: Growing up, I had heard that the OCA couldn't have our own Patriarch because we couldn't get/ refused? Autocephaly. Is it true? What does that mean? Explain Please? I heard a lot as a kid that I was too young to really understand.

This issue is one which may stir some emotions amongst members.  I'll try to answer it as delicately as possible, taking all thngs into account.

There are two questions embeded in your one question: Autocephaly, and Patriarchate. As to the first - there are many varied opinions as to whether or not a Church can become "Autocephalous" (literally "self-headed," signifying that all its bishops are chosen by its own synod and it does not have a higher synod to answer to, other than the Ecumenical Synods) and how.  The OCA operates under the premise that it is an Autocephalous Church, granted Autocephaly from Moscow in the 1970's.  Some of the Orthodox Churches agree with this, others do not.  Only time will tell whether or not it holds up.

As to the question of "Patriarch," not all Autocephalous Churches (which are thought of as "independent," although that is an incorrect understanding of how diocese interact with one another within the One Church) are "Patriarchs," a title which is supposed to be reserved for those Senior and important diocese.  So one can be "self-headed" without being a "Patriarch."  Most of the Autocephalous Churches at one point were Autocephalous without being headed by a Patriarch, and to this day some still are (Athens and Cyprus, for example).
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« Reply #15 on: April 09, 2008, 10:28:50 AM »

Ok. Your answer fits the vauge feeling I had always had. Now you have given me the words for it. Thanks.
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« Reply #16 on: April 09, 2008, 10:36:59 AM »

Hey Wynd---


What is Bloomington like? Are you a cradle or a convert? Do you like Bloomington? I was thinking of attending ISU, or maybe moving to Bloomington and working for 6 months. I've been trying to get a degree from SIUC for..ohhh...about 6 years. It's like pulling teeth... Tongue

Bloomington is OK. I actually live in Normal, which is just north of Bloomington if you don't know. I went to ISU for college and stayed here after I graduated. What do you want to go to ISU for, degree-wise?

Quote from: Myrrh23
Are OCA services in nothing but English?

Ours are 99% English. One reader likes to throw in some Kyrie Eleisons or Gospodi Pomiluijs once in a while, but that's it.
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« Reply #17 on: April 09, 2008, 02:31:44 PM »

Autocephalous Churches (which are thought of as "independent," although that is an incorrect understanding of how diocese interact with one another within the One Church)

Is there a link or thread where I may get further explanation.  The topic comes up in conversation with non-Orthodox from time to time.
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« Reply #18 on: April 09, 2008, 02:37:24 PM »

98% of this stuff has nothing to do with the average lay person who wants to go to church in Bloomington, IL.

Amen.
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Myrrh23
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« Reply #19 on: April 09, 2008, 02:50:04 PM »

Hey Wynd, what is your Bloomington OCA Church like?
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« Reply #20 on: April 09, 2008, 03:12:56 PM »

Is there a link or thread where I may get further explanation.  The topic comes up in conversation with non-Orthodox from time to time. 

There isn't one at the moment - but feel free to start one, and we'll all contribute as best as we can!
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« Reply #21 on: April 09, 2008, 03:42:08 PM »

Hey Wynd, what is your Bloomington OCA Church like?

Pretty small, about 50/50 cradle/convert. Mostly Russian-style choral music with a few Byzantine-style hymns here and there. Check out the website: http://www.holyapostlesbn.org/
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« Reply #22 on: April 09, 2008, 03:45:15 PM »

There isn't one at the moment - but feel free to start one, and we'll all contribute as best as we can!

Done.  Thanks!
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« Reply #23 on: April 09, 2008, 04:17:11 PM »


Antiochian- convert parish, English.  Arab parish probably not.

As a matter of fact, I live in the heartland of Orthodoxy/Greek Catholicism.  Almost all parishes use mostly English that I am familiar with.  They may use Slavonic a bit, but only for the fixed parts of the Liturgy.  Not the Epistle, Gospel, Tropar, Kondak, etc...

Well, it depends on the Arab parish. If most of the members are second, third or fourth generation then it will probably be all in English with a few 'Lord have mercys' in Arabic. I would say go and see for yourself.
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« Reply #24 on: April 09, 2008, 06:28:53 PM »

My experience with the OCA is awesome! The style of parish varies though. There are two OCA parishes where I live. Both are in the same deanery under Archbishop Job, but one is like 98% Convert and the other is like a 80% immigrant cradle to 20% convert or American cradle. One liturgy is 100% English and the other is 50% English and 50% Slavonic, Romanian, and Greek. The first church has an American born priest, the 2nd a Serbian one. Both are excellent and preach the true gospel.
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« Reply #25 on: April 09, 2008, 07:29:03 PM »

Myrhh23,

almost every parish around here sings "Christos Anesti" during Pascha up to the Leavetaking.  The OCA parish I am familiar with will sing it in Romanian, English, Slavonic~Russian pronunciation, Christos Anesti.  Most other parishes here will sing the Christos Voskres a'la Ukrainian pronunciation.  So you will get to hear Christos Anesti sang in non-Greek parishes! 
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« Reply #26 on: April 09, 2008, 08:32:05 PM »

Are OCA services in nothing but English? Where do you live, Salpy?

I'm in southern California.  The OCA church I'm talking about has both immigrants and American born members, so they use both English and Russian (or perhaps it's Old Church Slavonic?)  They have two liturgies on Sundays, with the earlier one being in English.  For the Saturday night vigils they alternate, with  English every other week.
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« Reply #27 on: April 10, 2008, 02:14:59 AM »

I am guessing by vigil Salpy means, hours, vespers, hours, matins, hours? 

I'm not sure.  They call it "all-night vigil."  It starts at 6:00 p.m. and lasts about 2 hours.  It's wonderful.  I'm assuming all OCA parishes have it, but I could be wrong.
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« Reply #28 on: April 10, 2008, 07:59:27 AM »

We don't have a vigil, but we do have vespers on Saturday night. We then gather again early Sunday morning for matins before Liturgy. So what we do is sort of like what username! described.
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« Reply #29 on: April 10, 2008, 01:03:59 PM »

I have split off the topic all discussion about problems or scandals in the OCA.  It will be redirected to Free for all Religous Forum.  Please stick to the simple request for information about which churches are available in the area our poster is interested in going to Church in.

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« Reply #30 on: April 15, 2008, 10:25:52 PM »

I am guessing by vigil Salpy means, hours, vespers, hours, matins, hours? 

An old thread explaining the all night vigil services:

http://www.orthodoxchristianity.net/forum/index.php/topic,1487.0.html
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« Reply #31 on: April 16, 2008, 02:54:31 PM »

^ Thank you. I had not read that thread.
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