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Question: Which of these prayers do you pray the most and why?
The Jesus Prayer because...
Both
The Rosary because...
Other

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Author Topic: The Jesus Prayer or the Rosary?  (Read 6766 times) Average Rating: 0
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GabrieltheCelt
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« on: April 07, 2008, 09:45:13 PM »

Hey y'all,

I wanted to spark up a conversation about these two different prayers and maybe discuss why/why not you like one in particular.  Since I brought it up, I try to say both prayers on a daily basis, but the prayer I've particularly come to love is the Rosary (with a few differences than the RC version), though I still say the Jesus Prayer. 

The way I say the Rosary goes like this;
At the Cross, I say, "In the Name...Now and ever and unto ages of ages. Amen"  Where RC's say the Apostle's Creed, I say the Nicene Creed.  The next three beads I say the Jesus Prayer and then I go on to recite the Mysteries of that particular day.  For each of the decades(sets of ten beads), I say the RC version of Hail Mary (with a few changes) only because at the end there is a petition for the Theotokos to pray for us (...pray for us sinners, now and at the hour of our death.) rather than the EO version which ends with "For thou hast borne the Savior of our Souls."  At the end, I usually say the Prayer Before Commencing a Task found in the little red Antiochian prayer book.  This is how I've come to pray it, but I've heard other EO versions.

 
Here is how I say the Hail Mary-

Hail Mary full of grace, the Lord is with thee. 
Blessed art thou among women
and blessed is the fruit of thy womb, Lord Jesus Christ. 
Holy Mary, Lady Theotokos, pray for us sinners,
now and at the hour of our death. Amen


But throughout the day at work, I recite the Jesus Prayer whenever I get the chance.

I know there are many EO's like myself who regularly pray the Mysteries of the Rosary or simply The Hail Mary.  For those of you who don't, I'm curious what you think about them?  Do you see a problem for EO's to pray the Rosary?  Why/Why not?  For those of you who focus solely on the Jesus Prayer, what impact has it had on your life?

In Christ,

Gabriel

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« Reply #1 on: April 07, 2008, 10:07:43 PM »

The Jesus Prayer because...

1) That is the Kanon (Prayer Rule) given me by my Spiritual Father.
2) It is like an S.O.S signal being sent out by a sinking ship.
3) It calls on the only Name Which saves.
4) It rhytmically accompanies prostrations.
5) I try to avoid all mental imagery in prayer and focus on the words I'm praying.
6) It assists me tremendously in the practice of mindfulness.
7) It is free of sentimentality.
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« Reply #2 on: April 07, 2008, 10:29:36 PM »

The Jesus Prayer because...

1) That is the Kanon (Prayer Rule) given me by my Spiritual Father.
2) It is like an S.O.S signal being sent out by a sinking ship.
3) It calls on the only Name Which saves.
4) It rhytmically accompanies prostrations.
5) I try to avoid all mental imagery in prayer and focus on the words I'm praying.
6) It assists me tremendously in the practice of mindfulness.
7) It is free of sentimentality.


This is what I came in here to say, only to find that it was already said better than I could have.  Smiley
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« Reply #3 on: April 07, 2008, 11:34:52 PM »

The Jesus Prayer because...



6) It assists me tremendously in the practice of mindfulness.
7) It is free of sentimentality.

What is 'mindfulness'?  Also, I'm not sure I understand 'sentimentality' here.  Can you explain what you're talking about?  Thanks so much.
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« Reply #4 on: April 07, 2008, 11:47:14 PM »

The Jesus Prayer for me--it's shorter and therefore easier to remember in time of need.
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« Reply #5 on: April 08, 2008, 02:43:35 AM »

Both.

I usually just sub out the Fatima Prayer for the Jesus Prayer when reciting the Rosary.  My Spiritual Father encourages me to continue using the Rosary, so I do.

Helps me keep my Latin at a healthy sub-par level as well.   laugh
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« Reply #6 on: April 08, 2008, 02:57:05 AM »

Helps me keep my Latin at a healthy sub-par level as well.   laugh

So does that mean you could comfortably converse with Julius Caesar like a certain somebody...?  Wink Cheesy
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« Reply #7 on: April 08, 2008, 07:32:44 AM »

The Jesus Prayer.

The outward prayer isn’t so important, what is important is the inner prayer. So if the longer prayer works for you in regards to developing your inner prayer, than that is great.   The Jesus prayer does not necessarily work for everybody.

In the introduction of the Unseen Warfare, the writer mentioned two other forms of prayers that some of the fathers used outside of the Jesus prayer.

“Lord Jesus”

“O God, make speed to save me; O Lord, make haste to help me”

For me, I find the Jesus Prayer to be very beneficial. The Jesus prayer, or perhaps prayer itself, has helped me accept the Trinity in my heart as true, while at the same time it does not logically make sense.  It has helped me accept Jesus as God the Creator, something that I found very difficult to accept in the beginning. It also helps to bring the presense of God to me, during the Divine Liturgy when my mind is wandering, and when I am at work and doing othing things.

I would highly recommend the Art of Prayer, if you don’t have it.  I’ll type for you a passage from this book related to the topic.

"Prayer should be short, but often repeated"

“From those who have experience in raising their mind to God, I learned that, in the case of prayer made by the mind from the heart, a short prayer, often repeated, is warmer and more useful than a long one.  Lengthy prayer is also very useful, but only for those who are reaching perfection, not for beginners.  During lengthy prayer, the mind of the inexperienced cannot stand long before God, but is generally overcome by its own weakness and mutability, and drawn away by external things, so that warmth of the spirit quickly cools down. Such prayer is no longer prayer, but only disturbances of the mind, because of the thoughts wandering hither and thither; which happens both during prayers and psalms recited in church, and also during the rule of prayer for the cell, which takes a long time.  Short frequent prayer, on the other hand, has more stability, because the mind, immersed for short time in God, can perform it with greater warmth.  Therefore the Lord also says, ‘When ye pray, use not vain repetitions’ (matt 4:7), for it is not for your prolixity that you will be heard.  And St. John of the Ladder also teaches: ‘Do not try to use many words, lest your mind become distracted by the search for words.  Because of one short sentence, the Publican received the mercy of God, and one brief affirmation of belief saved the Robber.  An excessive multitude of words in prayer disperses the mind in dreams, while one word or a short sentence helps to collect the mind.’

…………………….

“Consequently do not let your oft-repeated but short prayer be expanded into too many words.  This is what the Holy Fathers also advice.  In his commentary on the Gospel of St. Matthew (6:7), St Theophylact states, “’You should not make long prayers, for it is better to pray little but often.’ And St. John Chrysostom, in his commentary on St Paul’s Epistles, observes, ‘Whoever says to much in prayer, does not pray, but indulges in idle talk.’ St Theophylact also says in his interpretation of Matthew 6:6 “’Superfluous words are idle talk.’ The Apostle said well, ‘I had rather speak five words with my understanding …. Than ten thousand words in an unknown tongue’ (I Cor. 14:19): that is, it is better for me to pray to God briefly but with attention, than to pronounce innumerable words without attention, vainly the air with noise.

There is also another sense in which the Apostle’s words must be interpreted. ‘Pray without ceasing’ (1 Thess. 5:17) must be taken in the sense of prayer performed by the mind:  whatever a man is doing, the mind can always be directed towards God, and in this way it can pray to Him unceasingly.

Therefore begin now, O my soul, little by little, the course of training set out for you, begin in the name of the Lord, according to the Apostle’s instruction: ‘And whatsoever ye do in word or deed, do all in the name of the Lord Jesus’ (Col 3:17)” ................ (St Dimitri of Rostov, from the Art of Prayer complied by Igumen Chariton of Valamo)

In Christ
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« Reply #8 on: April 08, 2008, 08:01:15 AM »

The Jesus Prayer because (a) I'm with PtA in the shorter and easier to remember when needed and (b) I don't know the Rosary by memory.
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« Reply #9 on: April 08, 2008, 08:46:32 AM »

I actually use the Jesus prayer but do not use the chotki normally.  Most of my use of the Jesus Prayer is as I write icons, as a prayer rule everytime the brush touches the board the iconographer says the Jesus Prayer.  In this manner each icon that is handwritten (or hand painted) has hundreds, even thousands of prayers said on it before it even goes to be blessed.  It assists the iconographer to empty him(her)self and focus upon our God or the Glory of His saints.

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« Reply #10 on: April 08, 2008, 09:22:45 AM »

So does that mean you could comfortably converse with Julius Caesar like a certain somebody...?  Wink Cheesy

LoL!  If he doesn't mind that I mix up my Latin pronunciations with my Italian ones sometimes  laugh
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« Reply #11 on: April 08, 2008, 11:42:43 AM »

What is 'mindfulness'?  Also, I'm not sure I understand 'sentimentality' here.  Can you explain what you're talking about?  Thanks so much.
Mindfulness is part of "sobriety". If we think of the state of mind which is the opposite of sobriety- drunkenness- in which the mind is dispersed, unable to focus, not collected, not attentive, self absorbed, grandiose etc; then sobriety is the opposite of this.
The scriptures say:
Therefore let us not sleep, as others do, but let us watch and be sober. 1 Thessalonians 5:6

But let us who are of the day be sober, putting on the breastplate of faith and love, and as a helmet the hope of salvation. 1 Thessalonians 5:8

be hospitable, a lover of what is good, sober-minded, just, holy, self-controlled,Titus 1:8

that the older men be sober, reverent, temperate, sound in faith, in love, in patience Titus 2:2

Likewise, exhort the young men to be sober-minded,Titus 2:6

Be sober, be vigilant; because your adversary the devil walks about like a roaring lion, seeking whom he may devour.1 Peter 5:8

Mindfulness is the "pulling together" of the mind to focus it. Instead of a few small piles of straw scattered about and lit, it is akin to making one huge haystack and set on fire in a bonfire.The Jesus Prayer is excellent at doing this because (a)it is short, and (b) it contains all the fundamentals.
In the Jesus Prayer, the words "Lord Jesus Christ Son of God" sum up our Christology into one phrase. Jesus is Lord, He is God, He is Christ, He is the Second Hypostasis of the Trinity, Begotton of the Father. His Name is the Name to which "every knee shall bend". At the other end of the Jesus Prayer, the words "me the sinner" is set up as a contrast and polarity to the words "Lord Jesus Christ, Son of God." He is LORD, I am the sinner. I am dust and ashes and mud gone wrong. I need saving, and the only one Who can save me is the "Lord Jesus Christ, Son of God." And He knows exactly how to save me. He knows better than I exactly what I need. But He will not force Himself on me, so I need to ask. And so I place everything in His Hands by asking simply for mercy rather than specific things, since our prayer should always be "Thy Will be done".
All this, and much much more is focused by the simple words of the Jesus Prayer. That is what is meant by mindfulness.

Sentimentality is part of the opposite of mindfulness. Sentimentality is the arousing of the emotions through the imagination. Liturgical chanting is designed to be free of sentimentality- there are no emotional inflexions of tones or notes. Icons are deliberately styalized for the same reason- Christ's face appears the same whether He is being Transfigured on Mount Tabor or Despoiling Hades or being Crucified. It is the same, dispassionate face with no sentimentality. Prayer is work, a duty. It is a "job which needs to be done", and this is how we should approach it- not with flowery wool-gathering, allowing our mind to wander in different directions, nor by trying to "meditate" on events while at the same time "concentrate" on the words we are praying (which, as a psychologist, I believe is impossible anyway- the only way the mind can do this is to shift back and forth from the meditation to the words).







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« Reply #12 on: April 08, 2008, 11:49:40 AM »

I think Ozgeorge's point number five is good, and Fr. Seraphim Rose talked about it too:

Again drawing from the Holy Fathers, Fr. Seraphim counseled his spiritual children not to trust in or get carried away by their imagination, especially in prayer. Fr. Alexey Young recalls how, when he was still a Roman Catholic preparing to become Orthodox, he was given an important lesson by Fr. Seraphim: “I asked Fr. Seraphim about meditation, which my wife and I, still under the influence of our Roman Catholic background, had made part of our regular routine of morning prayer. We did not yet realize that the Orthodox understanding of meditation is quite different from the Western Christian view. In conversation, Fr. Seraphim explained that the use of imagination in Western spiritual systems of meditation—viz., while saying the Rosary, reciting the Stations of the Cross, or doing the Spiritual Exercises of Ignatius of Loyola, etc.—was not compatible with Orthodox spirituality and was forbidden because imagination came into use only after the fall of Adam and Eve; it is one of the lowest functions of the soul and the favorite playground of the devil, who can and does use human imagination in order to deceive and mislead even well-meaning people.” from http://www.orthodoxinfo.com/praxis/fsr_84.aspx
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« Reply #13 on: April 08, 2008, 12:09:01 PM »

Mindfulness is part of "sobriety". If we think of the state of mind which is the opposite of sobriety- drunkenness- in which the mind is dispersed, unable to focus, not collected, not attentive, self absorbed, grandiose etc; then sobriety is the opposite of this.
Mindfulness is the "pulling together" of the mind to focus it. Instead of a few small piles of straw scattered about and lit, it is akin to making one huge haystack and set on fire in a bonfire.The Jesus Prayer is excellent at doing this because (a)it is short, and (b) it contains all the fundamentals.
In the Jesus Prayer, the words "Lord Jesus Christ Son of God" sum up our Christology into one phrase. Jesus is Lord, He is God, He is Christ, He is the Second Hypostasis of the Trinity, Begotton of the Father. His Name is the Name to which "every knee shall bend". At the other end of the Jesus Prayer, the words "me the sinner" is set up as a contrast and polarity to the words "Lord Jesus Christ, Son of God." He is LORD, I am the sinner. I am dust and ashes and mud gone wrong. I need saving, and the only one Who can save me is the "Lord Jesus Christ, Son of God." And He knows exactly how to save me. He knows better than I exactly what I need. But He will not force Himself on me, so I need to ask. And so I place everything in His Hands by asking simply for mercy rather than specific things, since our prayer should always be "Thy Will be done".
All this, and much much more is focused by the simple words of the Jesus Prayer. That is what is meant by mindfulness.
Thanks for explaining this.  I was sort of familiar with the term in it's Buddhist application; to me, the two applications appear to be similar.  I suppose this is why Orthodoxy has been compared to Buddhism 'with Christ'.  Where can I read more about the Orthodox understanding of 'mindfulness' so that I have a better understanding?

Sentimentality is part of the opposite of mindfulness. Sentimentality is the arousing of the emotions through the imagination. Liturgical chanting is designed to be free of sentimentality- there are no emotional inflexions of tones or notes. Icons are deliberately styalized for the same reason- Christ's face appears the same whether He is being Transfigured on Mount Tabor or Despoiling Hades or being Crucified. It is the same, dispassionate face with no sentimentality. Prayer is work, a duty. It is a "job which needs to be done", and this is how we should approach it- not with flowery wool-gathering, allowing our mind to wander in different directions, nor by trying to "meditate" on events while at the same time "concentrate" on the words we are praying (which, as a psychologist, I believe is impossible anyway- the only way the mind can do this is to shift back and forth from the meditation to the words).
So, is apatheia the practice of moving away from sentimentality?  Also,  I don't know about you, but sometimes when I'm reading scripture (or praying), I do become emotional at times (whether that be happy and elated or very sad at times).  Am I not supposed to feel these emotions or are you speaking of something entirely different?

And re: #5- How can we avoid mental imagery when we're surrounded by icons? 

Again, thanks for helping me...








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« Reply #14 on: April 08, 2008, 12:32:37 PM »

Hey Ozzy,


I've found that when I become lazy and stop praying the Rosary and the Jesus Prayer, I become anxious, depressed and scatterbrained...very much like being spiritually drunk...now, I have an official name for it..thankies! Grin

Quote
and then I go on to recite the Mysteries of that particular day.

Do you have to focus on the particular Mystery of a particular day? 'Cause I just say the prayers as if I'm speaking to the person....I focus on my love, affection and desire to learn from them...
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« Reply #15 on: April 08, 2008, 12:41:32 PM »

Where can I read more about the Orthodox understanding of 'mindfulness' so that I have a better understanding?
A good source is the Philokalia. It's heavy going, but Orthodox Spirituality can't really be "learned" or "studied"- it needs to be practiced. You can't really learn the "theory behind it"- you have to do it.

So, is apatheia the practice of moving away from sentimentality?  Also,  I don't know about you, but sometimes when I'm reading scripture (or praying), I do become emotional at times (whether that be happy and elated or very sad at times).  Am I not supposed to feel these emotions or are you speaking of something entirely different?
"Apatheia" is the conquering of the passions. The emotions are part of the passions. The aim of apatheia is not to deny or eradicate the passions, but rather, to bridle them- to control them rather than let them control us.

And re: #5- How can we avoid mental imagery when we're surrounded by icons? 
Because an Icon is (a)external, and (b)stylized. There is no room for the imagination to move in an Icon. Because of the strict rules of Iconography, an Icon does not allow us to "imagine what it would be like" or "imagine what's going on in their mind". For instance, if you look at the Icon of the martydom of a martyr, the executioner is not made to "look evil" or show any expression on his face, the same goes for the martyr. The only way you can tell the difference between the martyr and the executioner is by noting which one has the halo. The same goes for Christ. In Icons, He has the same calm expression on His Face whether he is being Glorified in the Transfiguration or being Crucified on the Cross or despoiling Hades.
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« Reply #16 on: April 08, 2008, 04:54:43 PM »

So does that mean you could comfortably converse with Julius Caesar like a certain somebody...?  Wink Cheesy

Nektarios, who are you referencing here?  I'm sure I probably could do just that, if I do say so myself. Grin

I, of course, said the Jesus Prayer.  The thing is we Orthodox already say the "Rosary" in a slightly modified version during the Litya or at the end of Small Compline when we say "O Theotokos and Virgin, rejoice, O Mary, full of grace, the Lord is with thee.  Blessed art thou among women and blessed is the fruit of thy womb for thou hast borne the saviour of our souls."
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« Reply #17 on: April 08, 2008, 05:02:05 PM »

Nektarios, who are you referencing here?  I'm sure I probably could do just that, if I do say so myself. Grin

None other than Berlusconi.  I figured Friul as a fan of Italian politics would have enjoyed the reference. 
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« Reply #18 on: April 08, 2008, 10:19:00 PM »

Only the Jesus Prayer is short enough to fit on a ring:

http://www.holycross-hermitage.com/cgi-bin/commerce.cgi?search=action&category=RING&keywords=all&template=PDGCommTemplates/TopBotNav/Storebuilder_Type4.html

It's a cool ring.  I got one.   Smiley


Seriously, there are times when I feel I'm about to go crazy over something and the Jesus Prayer calms me.  It's an amazing prayer.
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« Reply #19 on: April 08, 2008, 11:13:59 PM »

I particularly like the idea of the Institutions in the Rosary, because it gives more of a structure to prayer in general. 

But also I like the deep mysticism associated with the hesychastic movement and the Jesus prayer, as others have mentioned. 
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« Reply #20 on: April 08, 2008, 11:29:55 PM »

I particularly like the idea of the Institutions in the Rosary, because it gives more of a structure to prayer in general.
But then, when I absolutely must have a prayer ready for a tense situation, I'm not looking for structure. Wink
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« Reply #21 on: April 09, 2008, 12:16:16 AM »

LoL!  If he doesn't mind that I mix up my Latin pronunciations with my Italian ones sometimes  laugh

That is funny; when I was learning Latin I found myself pronouncing it with an Italian accent/cadence! And I don't speak Italian! Grin
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« Reply #22 on: April 09, 2008, 12:19:47 AM »

But then, when I absolutely must have a prayer ready for a tense situation, I'm not looking for structure. Wink

I think that is the beauty of the Jesus Prayer - it's there at the tip of your mind, right when you need it.
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« Reply #23 on: April 09, 2008, 12:26:51 AM »

But then, when I absolutely must have a prayer ready for a tense situation, I'm not looking for structure. Wink

I agree in the spirit of what you are saying.  On the other hand, usually when things are tense, I tend to cry out to the Lord with a one word phrase.  like:  Panagia!  or Thee mou!  or Gospode! (Lord!) or Boze sacuvaj (lord save)! 

Jesus prayer is usually a calming prayer and one that not only reorientates you to the things around you, but also to God.  It helps you bring equilibrium.  For me, I find that in everyday prayer and with doing the komboskini that the Institutions of the Catholic church are very helpful.  I mean...if you do the Institutions like you're supposed to...you could really have a very fruitful personal prayer life. 

Just some more thoughts. 
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« Reply #24 on: April 09, 2008, 01:18:38 AM »

I particularly like the idea of the Institutions in the Rosary, because it gives more of a structure to prayer in general. 

This is what I particulary like about praying the Rosary- the structure, but also the fact that I'm asking the Theotokos to pray for me as well.  As has been said, the Jesus Prayer can be said anywhere and at any time; it's simple and easy to remember.  Praying the Rosary, though, takes a little time; one must set aside a certain amount of time to pray it correctly (and to get the most out of it.)  For example, each day is set aside for a particular 'mystery'.  Let's look at the Joyful Mysteries (since today -Monday- is the day set aside for the Joyful Mysteries.) After reciting the Nicene Creed on the Cross, the next bead I recite the 'Our Father'.  The next four beads I recite the Jesus Prayer.  I then recite the 'first' Joyful Mystery;

First Joyful Mystery - The Annunciation of Gabriel to Mary- Luke 1:26 

I read the Scripture verse and then I say my version of the Hail Mary (that I mentioned earlier) on the next 10 beads.  The next bead I say the Jesus Prayer and then announce the Second Joyful Mystery and read the appointed Scripture verse.  I proceed with the next three 'decades' in the same manner until I get to the very end.

Second Joyful Mystery - The Visitation of Mary to Elizabeth- Luke 1:39

Third Joyful Mystery - The Birth of Jesus - Luke 2:1

Fourth Joyful Mystery - The Presentation of Jesus in the Temple- Luke 2:22

Fifth Joyful Mystery - Finding Jesus in the Temple- Luke 2:41

When I'm reading these verses, I do think about them and their relevance and importance in our lives.  I can honestly say that praying the Rosary is a very important part of my day and I can't imagine going too many days without praying it (I try not to miss any more than one day at a time.)  I do want to say that before I began praying the Rosary, I spoke at length about it with my Spiritual Father.  He gave me some great advice, a little history about the Rosary, and then permission to pray it.  As I say, I love praying it and I would advocate that everyone at least look at the Rosary and, if interested in praying it, talk to their Spiritual Father first.  I also want to reiterate that I also pray the Jesus Prayer many times throughout the day- though not necessarily on the tchotki.

In Christ,
Gabriel

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« Reply #25 on: April 09, 2008, 01:49:20 AM »

I like the Jesus Prayer because it reminds me of the beauty of Christ's Love and Mercy towards unworthy sinners like myself..


This is my opinion on the rosary.. (Im sorry if I may offend others here)..

I kinda find it ironic that Im meditating on, for example, the Scourging of Jesus on the Pillar, but Im reciting the Angelic Salutation!.. It's like im to put my mindset on Christ's pain and suffering as the soldiers are beating Him up, but my prayer is about what Angel Gabriel said to the Holy Theotokos during the Annunciation..
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« Reply #26 on: December 23, 2012, 10:04:25 PM »

I voted 'other'.

I like rosaries, and usually keep one in my pocket so I can pray it while walking, but I substitute other prayers. Usually 'My hope the Father, my refuge the Son, my protection the Holy Spirit; Holy Trinity, glory to thee' on the ave beads, and the Axion Estin on the pater beads.

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« Reply #27 on: December 23, 2012, 10:18:28 PM »

I pray both. Jesus prayer when walking or doing something. Rosary when I have time to actually sit and reflect. The Rosary has been a treasure for me.
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« Reply #28 on: December 23, 2012, 10:27:59 PM »

I love the Jesus Prayer. I used to pray the Rosary as a Catholic, and I still have a fondness for it, but I haven't really prayed it in a while.
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« Reply #29 on: December 23, 2012, 11:33:21 PM »

I said both, but I don't do the Rosary the RC way, but more simply--basically 150 "Rejoice, O Virgin Theotokos, Mary full of grace, the Lord is with thee. Blessed art thou among women and blessed is the fruit of thy womb, for thou hast born Christ the Savior, the Deliverer of our souls." With Our Father, "Open unto us the door of thy lovingkindness, O blessed Theotokos..." and or "Greatly have mine iniquities multiplied, O Theotokos" and other hymns to Our Lady.
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« Reply #30 on: December 24, 2012, 12:51:56 AM »

I too do both. I love the Jesus Prayer as a spiritual "walking stick" throughout the day, keeping me mindful of the presence of God. I love the Rosary (one that employs scripture as a mean of lectio divina) as a more structured guide to contemplating the mysteries of our redemption. The Rosary is great to keep me rooted in reality and remind me of what's important, and it sort of leads into prayer of the heart and the Jesus Prayer.
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« Reply #31 on: April 17, 2013, 06:46:05 PM »

I was RC and converted to EO, my priest gave me his blessing to continue praying the rosary. Eventually, I learned about the Rule of the Theotokos or St. Seraphim o Sarov, and now pray this, but add a Jesus prayer before each Rejoice.

Rule of the Theotokos by St. Seraphim of Sarov

In the Name of the Father, the Son, and the Holy Spirit. Amen.

God be merciful to me, a sinner.

Glory to You, our God, glory to You.

O Heavenly King, Comforter, Spirit of Truth, Who is everywhere present and fills all things, O Treasury of every good and Bestower of life: come and dwell in us, and cleanse us from every stain, and save our souls, O Good One.

Holy God, Holy Mighty, Holy Immortal, have mercy on us. (3X)

Glory to the Father, and to the Son, and to the Holy Spirit, both now and ever and unto the ages of ages. Amen.

O Most Holy Trinity, have mercy on us. O Lord, blot out our sins. O Master, pardon our iniquities. O Holy One, visit and heal our infirmities, for Your Name's sake.

Lord, have mercy. (3X.)

Glory to the Father, and to the Son, and to the Holy Spirit, both now and ever and unto the ages of ages. Amen.

Our Father, Who art in heaven, hallowed be Thy Name. Thy kingdom come, Thy will be done on earth as it is in heaven. Give us this day our daily bread, and forgive us our trespasses as we forgive those who trespass against us. And lead us not into temptation, but deliver us from evil.

Lord, have mercy. (3X.)

Glory to the Father, and to the Son, and to the Holy Spirit, both now and ever and unto the ages of ages. Amen.

O come let us worship God our King. O come, let us worship and fall down before Christ our King and God. O come, let us worship and fall down before Christ Himself, our King and God.

I believe in one God, Father Almighty, Creator of heaven and earth, and of all things visible and invisible.
And in one Lord Jesus Christ, the only-begotten Son of God, begotten of the Father before all ages; Light of Light, true God of true God, begotten, not created, of one essence with the Father, through Whom all things were made. Who for us men and for our salvation came down from heaven and was incarnate of the Holy Spirit and the Virgin Mary and became man. He was crucified for us under Pontius Pilate, and suffered and was buried; And He rose on the third day, according to the Scriptures. He ascended into heaven and is seated at the right hand of the Father; And He will come again with glory to judge the living and dead. His kingdom shall have no end.
And in the Holy Spirit, the Lord, the Creator of life, Who proceeds from the Father, Who together with the Father and the Son is worshipped and glorified, Who spoke through the prophets.
In one, holy, catholic, and apostolic Church.
I confess one baptism for the forgiveness of sins.
I look for the resurrection of the dead, and the life of the age to come.
Amen.

O Lord, open my lips, and my mouth shall proclaim Your praise.

First decade: Let us remember the birth of the Mother of God. Let us pray for mothers, fathers, and children.

Rejoice, O Virgin Mother of God Mary, full of grace, the Lord is with you. Blessed are you among women and blessed is the fruit of your
womb, for you have borne the Savior of our souls. (10X)

After: Our Lady, Blessed Mother of God, save and preserve your servants, increase their faith and repentance, and when they die give them rest with the saints in your eternal glory.

Our Father, Who art in heaven, hallowed be Thy Name. Thy kingdom come, Thy will be done on earth as it is in heaven. Give us this day our daily bread, and forgive us our trespasses as we forgive those who trespass against us. And lead us not into temptation, but deliver us from evil.

Open unto us the door of your loving-kindness, O most blessed Mother of God. As we set our hope in you, let us not be confounded, but through you may we be delivered from all adversities. For you are the salvation of the Christian race.

Second decade: Let us remember the feast of the Presentation of the Blessed Virgin and Mother of God. Let us pray for those who have lost their way and fallen away from the church.

Rejoice O Virgin Mother of God Mary, full of grace, the Lord is with you. Blessed are you among women and blessed is the fruit of your
womb, for you have borne the Savior of our souls. (10X)

After: Our Lady, Blessed Mother of God, save and preserve and unite or re-unite to the Holy Orthodox Church your servants
who have lost their path and fallen away.

Our Father Our Father, Who art in heaven, hallowed be Thy Name. Thy kingdom come, Thy will be done on earth as it is in heaven. Give us this day our daily bread, and forgive us our trespasses as we forgive those who trespass against us. And lead us not into temptation, but deliver us from evil.

Open unto us the door of your loving-kindness, O most blessed Mother of God. As we set our hope in you, let us not be confounded, but through you may we be delivered from all adversities. For you are the salvation of the Christian race

Third decade: Let us remember the Annunciation of the Blessed Mother of God. Let us pray for the soothing of sorrows and the consolation of those who grieve.

Rejoice, O Virgin Mother of God Mary, full of grace, the Lord is with you. Blessed are you among women and blessed is the fruit of your
womb, for you have borne the Savior of our souls. (10X)

After: Our Lady, Blessed Mother of God, soothe our sorrows and send consolation to your servants who are grieving and ill
(names).

Our Father, Who art in heaven, hallowed be Thy Name. Thy kingdom come, Thy will be done on earth as it is in heaven. Give us this day our daily bread, and forgive us our trespasses as we forgive those who trespass against us. And lead us not into temptation, but deliver us from evil.

Open unto us the door of your loving-kindness, O most blessed Mother of God. As we set our hope in you, let us not be confounded, but through you may we be delivered from all adversities. For you are the salvation of the Christian race

Fourth decade: Let us remember the meeting of the Blessed Virgin with the righteous Elizabeth. Let us pray for the reunion of the separated, for those whose dear ones or children are living away from them or missing.

Rejoice, O Virgin Mother of God Mary, full of grace, the Lord is with you. Blessed are you among women and blessed is the fruit of your
womb, for you have borne the Savior of our souls. (10X)

After: Our Lady, Blessed Mother of God, unite your servants who are separated.

Our Father Who art in heaven, hallowed be Thy Name. Thy kingdom come, Thy will be done on earth as it is in heaven. Give us this day our daily bread, and forgive us our trespasses as we forgive those who trespass against us. And lead us not into temptation, but deliver us from evil

Open unto us the door of your loving-kindness, O most blessed Mother of God. As we set our hope in you, let us not be confounded, but through you may we be delivered from all adversities. For you are the salvation of the Christian race

Fifth decade: Let us remember the Birth of Christ. Let us pray for the rebirth of souls, for new life in Christ.

Rejoice, O Virgin Mother of God Mary, full of grace, the Lord is with you. Blessed are you among women and blessed is the fruit of your
womb, for you have borne the Savior of our souls. (10X

After: Our Lady, Blessed Mother of God, grant unto me, who has been baptized in Christ, to be clothed in Christ.

Our Father Who art in heaven, hallowed be Thy Name. Thy kingdom come, Thy will be done on earth as it is in heaven. Give us this day our daily bread, and forgive us our trespasses as we forgive those who trespass against us. And lead us not into temptation, but deliver us from evil

Open unto us the door of your loving-kindness, O most blessed Mother of God. As we set our hope in you, let us not be confounded, but through you may we be delivered from all adversities. For you are the salvation of the Christian race

Sixth decade: Let us remember the Feast of the Purification of the Lord, and the words uttered by St. Simeon: "Yea, a sword shall pierce through your own soul also." Let us pray that the Mother of God will meet our souls at the hour of our death, and will contrive that we receive the Holy Sacrament with our last breath, and will lead our souls through the terrible torments.

Rejoice, O Virgin Mother of God Mary, full of grace, the Lord is with you. Blessed are you among women and blessed is the fruit of your
womb, for you have borne the Savior of our souls. (10X)

After: Our Lady, Blessed Mother of God, let me receive the Holy Sacrament with my last breath, and lead my soul yourself through the terrible torments.

Our Father Who art in heaven, hallowed be Thy Name. Thy kingdom come, Thy will be done on earth as it is in heaven. Give us this day our daily bread, and forgive us our trespasses as we forgive those who trespass against us. And lead us not into temptation, but deliver us from evil

Open unto us the door of your loving-kindness, O most blessed Mother of God. As we set our hope in you, let us not be confounded, but through you may we be delivered from all adversities. For you are the salvation of the Christian race

Seventh decade: Let us remember the flight of the Mother of God with the God-Child into Egypt. Let us pray that the Mother of God will help us avoid temptation in this life and deliver us from misfortunes.

Rejoice, O Virgin Mother of God Mary, full of grace, the Lord is with you. Blessed are you among women and blessed is the fruit of your
womb, for you have borne the Savior of our souls. (10X

After: Our Lady, Blessed Mother of God, help me avoid temptation in this life and deliver me from misfortunes.

Our Father Who art in heaven, hallowed be Thy Name. Thy kingdom come, Thy will be done on earth as it is in heaven. Give us this day our daily bread, and forgive us our trespasses as we forgive those who trespass against us. And lead us not into temptation, but deliver us from evil

Open unto us the door of your loving-kindness, O most blessed Mother of God. As we set our hope in you, let us not be confounded, but through you may we be delivered from all adversities. For you are the salvation of the Christian race

Eighth decade: Let us remember the disappearance of the twelve-year old boy Jesus in Jerusalem and the sorrow of the Mother of God on this account. Let us pray, begging the Mother of God for the constant repetition of the Jesus Prayer.

Rejoice, O Virgin Mother of God Mary, full of grace, the Lord is with you. Blessed are you among women and blessed is the fruit of your
womb, for you have borne the Savior of our souls. (10X

After: Our Lady, Blessed Mother of God, grant to me the unceasing Jesus Prayer.

Our Father Who art in heaven, hallowed be Thy Name. Thy kingdom come, Thy will be done on earth as it is in heaven. Give us this day our daily bread, and forgive us our trespasses as we forgive those who trespass against us. And lead us not into temptation, but deliver us from evil

Open unto us the door of your loving-kindness, O most blessed Mother of God. As we set our hope in you, let us not be confounded, but through you may we be delivered from all adversities. For you are the salvation of the Christian race

Ninth decade: Let us remember-the miracle performed in Cana of Galilee, when the Lord turned water into wine at the words of the Mother of God: "They have no wine." Let us ask the Mother of God for help in our affairs and deliverance from need.

Rejoice, O Virgin Mother of God Mary, full of grace, the Lord is with you. Blessed are you among women and blessed is the fruit of your
womb, for you have borne the Savior of our souls. (10X

After: Our Lady, Blessed Mother of God, help me in all my affairs and deliver me from every need and sorrow.

Our Father Who art in heaven, hallowed be Thy Name. Thy kingdom come, Thy will be done on earth as it is in heaven. Give us this day our daily bread, and forgive us our trespasses as we forgive those who trespass against us. And lead us not into temptation, but deliver us from evil

Open unto us the door of your loving-kindness, O most blessed Mother of God. As we set our hope in you, let us not be confounded, but through you may we be delivered from all adversities. For you are the salvation of the Christian race

Tenth decade: Let us remember the Mother of God standing at the Cross of the Lord, when grief pierced through her heart like a sword. Let us pray to the Mother of God for the strengthening of our souls and the banishment of despondency.

Rejoice, O Virgin Mother of God Mary, full of grace, the Lord is with you. Blessed are you among women and blessed is the fruit of your
womb, for you have borne the Savior of our souls. (10X

After: Our Lady, Blessed Mother of God, strengthen my soul and banish my despair.

Our Father Who art in heaven, hallowed be Thy Name. Thy kingdom come, Thy will be done on earth as it is in heaven. Give us this day our daily bread, and forgive us our trespasses as we forgive those who trespass against us. And lead us not into temptation, but deliver us from evil

Open unto us the door of your loving-kindness, O most blessed Mother of God. As we set our hope in you, let us not be confounded, but through you may we be delivered from all adversities. For you are the salvation of the Christian race

Eleventh decade: Let us remember the Resurrection of Christ and ask the Mother of God in prayer to resurrect our souls and give us new courage for spiritual feats.

Rejoice, O Virgin Mother of God Mary, full of grace, the Lord is with you. Blessed are you among women and blessed is the fruit of your
womb, for you have borne the Savior of our souls. (10X

After: Our Lady, Blessed Mother of God, resurrect my soul and give me constant readiness for spiritual feats.

Our Father Who art in heaven, hallowed be Thy Name. Thy kingdom come, Thy will be done on earth as it is in heaven. Give us this day our daily bread, and forgive us our trespasses as we forgive those who trespass against us. And lead us not into temptation, but deliver us from evil

Open unto us the door of your loving-kindness, O most blessed Mother of God. As we set our hope in you, let us not be confounded, but through you may we be delivered from all adversities. For you are the salvation of the Christian race

Twelfth decade: Let us remember the Ascension of Christ, at which the Mother of God was present. Let us pray and ask the Queen of Heaven to raise up our souls from earthly and worldly amusements and direct them to striving for higher things.

Rejoice, O Virgin Mother of God Mary, full of grace, the Lord is with you. Blessed are you among women and blessed is the fruit of your
womb, for you have borne the Savior of our souls. (10X

After: Our Lady, Blessed Mother of God, deliver me from worldly thoughts and give me a mind and heart striving towards the salvation of my soul.

Our Father Who art in heaven, hallowed be Thy Name. Thy kingdom come, Thy will be done on earth as it is in heaven. Give us this day our daily bread, and forgive us our trespasses as we forgive those who trespass against us. And lead us not into temptation, but deliver us from evil

Open unto us the door of your loving-kindness, O most blessed Mother of God. As we set our hope in you, let us not be confounded, but through you may we be delivered from all adversities. For you are the salvation of the Christian race

Thirteenth decade: Let us remember the Upper Room and the descent of the Holy Spirit on the Apostles and the Mother of God.
Let us pray: Create in me a clean heart, O God; and renew a right spirit within me. Cast me not away from thy presence; and take not thy holy spirit from me (Psalm 51).

Rejoice, O Virgin Mother of God Mary, full of grace, the Lord is with you. Blessed are you among women and blessed is the fruit of your
womb, for you have borne the Savior of our souls. (10X

After: Our Lady, Blessed Mother of God, make me a clean temple in which God's Holy Spirit will ever dwell.

Our Father Who art in heaven, hallowed be Thy Name. Thy kingdom come, Thy will be done on earth as it is in heaven. Give us this day our daily bread, and forgive us our trespasses as we forgive those who trespass against us. And lead us not into temptation, but deliver us from evil

Open unto us the door of your loving-kindness, O most blessed Mother of God. As we set our hope in you, let us not be confounded, but through you may we be delivered from all adversities. For you are the salvation of the Christian race

Fourteenth decade: Let us remember the Dormition of the Blessed Mother of God, and ask for a peaceful and serene end.

Rejoice, O Virgin Mother of God Mary, full of grace, the Lord is with you. Blessed are you among women and blessed is the fruit of your
womb, for you have borne the Savior of our souls. (10X

After: Our Lady, Blessed Mother of God, grant me a peaceful and serene end.

Our Father Who art in heaven, hallowed be Thy Name. Thy kingdom come, Thy will be done on earth as it is in heaven. Give us this day our daily bread, and forgive us our trespasses as we forgive those who trespass against us. And lead us not into temptation, but deliver us from evil

Open unto us the door of your loving-kindness, O most blessed Mother of God. As we set our hope in you, let us not be confounded, but through you may we be delivered from all adversities. For you are the salvation of the Christian race

Fifteenth decade: Let us remember the glory of the Mother of God, with which the Lord crowned her after her removal from earth to heaven. Let us pray to the Queen of Heaven not to abandon the faithful who are on earth but to defend them from every evil, covering them with her honorable and protecting veil.

Rejoice, O Virgin Mother of God Mary, full of grace, the Lord is with you. Blessed are you among women and blessed is the fruit of your
womb, for you have borne the Savior of our souls. (10X

After: Our Lady, Blessed Mother of God, preserve me from every evil and cover me with your honorable protecting veil.

Our Father Who art in heaven, hallowed be Thy Name. Thy kingdom come, Thy will be done on earth as it is in heaven. Give us this day our daily bread, and forgive us our trespasses as we forgive those who trespass against us. And lead us not into temptation, but deliver us from evil

Open unto us the door of your loving-kindness, O most blessed Mother of God. As we set our hope in you, let us not be confounded, but through you may we be delivered from all adversities. For you are the salvation of the Christian race

It is truly meet to bless you, O Theotokos, ever blessed and most pure, and the Mother of God. More honorable than the Cherubim, and beyond compare more glorious than the Seraphim, who without corruption gave birth to God the Word, the very Theotokos, you do we magnify.

Glory to the Father, and to the Son, and to the Holy Spirit, both now and ever and unto the ages of ages. Amen.

Lord, have mercy. (3X.)

O Lord Jesus Christ, Son of God, for the sake of the prayers of Your most pure Mother, our holy and God-bearing fathers, and all the saints, have mercy on us. Amen.


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« Reply #32 on: April 17, 2013, 07:06:01 PM »

The Jesus Prayer because:

a) I am a member of an eastern church and follow their rite-rules.
b) This is a part of my Prayer Rule given to me by my Spiritual Father.
c) It is a prayer of the heart, no thinking and meditation involved.
d) It is free of creating uneccecary images
e) It is the best tool to defeat temptations and get closer to God.


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« Reply #33 on: April 17, 2013, 07:22:16 PM »

I do miss praying the Rosary. I am trying to pray the Jesus prayer more. However, I think the Rosary in its simplest form - the Hail Mary (or Rejoice O Virgin, the Orthodox prayer), Our Father, Glory Be and the Creed in the Orthodox form - is not inherently bad and is fine if done with the approval of one's spiritual father. Once I obtain a spiritual father, I'll ask him about it.
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« Reply #34 on: April 17, 2013, 07:31:42 PM »

When I'm being a good boy, I do both.  When I'm a bad boy, they both slip, and I slip right along with them.  Since there isn't much to explain about my use of the Jesus Prayer, I'll just explain my use of the Rosary.  

I use a fifty-knot prayer rope divided in "decades" (is this a particularly Slavic arrangement?  I've only been able to buy them like this at Russian monasteries).  Using the the standard beginning and concluding prayers of the Syriac tradition, I follow the RC structure of Paters, Aves, and Glorias, but nothing else (e.g., no "Fatima" additions) for the "beads".  

I don't "meditate" on any mysteries, however--I just focus on the words of the prayers as best I can, just as I do with the Jesus Prayer.  Even with an MDiv, I'm not sure I always understand the Orthodox prohibition on RC style meditation (I think there are probably some "safe" methods and other "unsafe" methods).  But since there's a question about it, I just avoid it.  Also, when I was in parochial school and we had to say the Rosary before class on October and May mornings, I could never figure out how they meditated while speaking.  Either I felt the vocal prayer was useless, or the meditation was meaningless.  It's just easier to do it the Orthodox way.  Maybe if I ever become holy, it'll make sense.  Tongue
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« Reply #35 on: April 17, 2013, 08:36:55 PM »

I said both, but the Rosary is not something I pray daily (or even weekly/monthly). I will utilize St. Seraphim's rosary rule when I do, however, with slight modifications, such as prayers at the medal of the BVM (EO theotokia, especially of the feast if it's a Theotokos feast day). I will also pray the Salve, Regina, which I think is beautiful and theologically Orthodox. I even know a ROCOR monastery that will sing it on occasion. But, if you object to it, I think "Beneath Thy Compassion" in place of it is quite beautiful.

I also refrain from any mysteries, and utilize the prayers as arrow prayers, a la the Jesus Prayer, which I (try) to say daily and often carry a chotki with me. I only take my Rosary out of my room on Theotokos feast days, which I will wear in place of my prayer rope.

is this a particularly Slavic arrangement?  I've only been able to buy them like this at Russian monasteries

I think so. The 100 knots Russian ropes I've seen are divided into decades, but Greek ones seem to be dividing into quarters (i.e., a bead every 25 knots). I think Russians also make 150 knot ropes that are divided into decades, which make them identical to RC rosaries, except for the entry beads.
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« Reply #36 on: April 17, 2013, 09:12:23 PM »

The Jesus Prayer (because I'm Orthodox), but I clicked 'both' because I don't want people on here to think I'm hyperdox.
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« Reply #37 on: April 17, 2013, 09:16:17 PM »

http://pinterest.com/pin/231724343299693568

I made my own Rule of the Theotokos prayer rope. It has 15 beads ("misteries") and 150 knots. I had it blessed by my priest. I also made two rosaries using Orthodox knots :-)

http://pinterest.com/pin/231724343299565405/
« Last Edit: April 17, 2013, 09:20:36 PM by Wilma » Logged

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« Reply #38 on: April 17, 2013, 10:30:22 PM »

I like the Jesus prayer, IF SAID ONCE.

I believe whole heartedly that God meant "Do not pray in vain repetitions".   

Every now and then, I'll say the prayer if I need God and don't know what else to say.

Otherwise, I think the ropes & rosary work people into trances of sorts, repeating the same prayer over and over and over again... Just as God told them NOT to.  I believe God is capable of hearing the prayer if said once, and I believe that men only fool themselves thinking that saying it X amount of times, is going to bring them closer to God - when really they are just "working themselves up".

Saying a prayer once, with a true and meaningful heart, is how to do it.
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« Reply #39 on: April 17, 2013, 10:45:19 PM »

I too am wholeheartedly against vain repetitions, which is why I try to say the Jesus Prayer over and over and over, so as not to repeat anything in vain.
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« Reply #40 on: April 17, 2013, 10:56:05 PM »

I like the Jesus prayer, IF SAID ONCE.

I believe whole heartedly that God meant "Do not pray in vain repetitions".   

Every now and then, I'll say the prayer if I need God and don't know what else to say.

Otherwise, I think the ropes & rosary work people into trances of sorts, repeating the same prayer over and over and over again... Just as God told them NOT to.  I believe God is capable of hearing the prayer if said once, and I believe that men only fool themselves thinking that saying it X amount of times, is going to bring them closer to God - when really they are just "working themselves up".

Saying a prayer once, with a true and meaningful heart, is how to do it.

Yeah, I think Jesus taught this because God the Father got so annoyed by the angels saying Holy, Holy, Holy, Holy, Holy, Holy, etc. on and on around the throne. Someone had to put a stop to it.
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« Reply #41 on: April 17, 2013, 10:56:48 PM »

I too am wholeheartedly against vain repetitions, which is why I try to say the Jesus Prayer over and over and over, so as not to repeat anything in vain.

The Orthodox response.
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« Reply #42 on: April 17, 2013, 10:57:30 PM »

I believe it is out of anyone's league to state what certain prayers do for people. If saînts of the church have found discipline and dedication to Lord through prayer rules, I will definitely follow on their footsteps.
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« Reply #43 on: April 17, 2013, 10:57:48 PM »

I like the Jesus prayer, IF SAID ONCE.

I believe whole heartedly that God meant "Do not pray in vain repetitions".   

Every now and then, I'll say the prayer if I need God and don't know what else to say.

Otherwise, I think the ropes & rosary work people into trances of sorts, repeating the same prayer over and over and over again... Just as God told them NOT to.  I believe God is capable of hearing the prayer if said once, and I believe that men only fool themselves thinking that saying it X amount of times, is going to bring them closer to God - when really they are just "working themselves up".

Saying a prayer once, with a true and meaningful heart, is how to do it.

Yeah, I think Jesus taught this because God the Father got so annoyed by the angels saying Holy, Holy, Holy, Holy, Holy, Holy, etc. on and on around the throne. Someone had to put a stop to it.

The funny Orthodox response.
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"Hades is not a place, no, but a state of the soul. It begins here on earth. Just so, paradise begins in the soul of a man here in the earthly life. Here we already have contact with the divine..." -St. John, Wonderworker of Shanghai and San Francisco, Homily On the Sunday of Orthodoxy
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« Reply #44 on: April 17, 2013, 11:33:10 PM »

I like the Jesus prayer, IF SAID ONCE.

I believe whole heartedly that God meant "Do not pray in vain repetitions".   

Every now and then, I'll say the prayer if I need God and don't know what else to say.

Otherwise, I think the ropes & rosary work people into trances of sorts, repeating the same prayer over and over and over again... Just as God told them NOT to.  I believe God is capable of hearing the prayer if said once, and I believe that men only fool themselves thinking that saying it X amount of times, is going to bring them closer to God - when really they are just "working themselves up".

Saying a prayer once, with a true and meaningful heart, is how to do it.

Yeah, I think Jesus taught this because God the Father got so annoyed by the angels saying Holy, Holy, Holy, Holy, Holy, Holy, etc. on and on around the throne. Someone had to put a stop to it.

The funny Orthodox response.

Yeah, but Jesus nonetheless, TAUGHT IT.

I've prayed the Jesus prayer, I've seen the prayer ropes, I've seen people do it.  It is vain & repetitious.  Sorry.
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