Author Topic: Another difference between WRO and EC  (Read 3210 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

Offline Peter J

  • Formerly PJ
  • Taxiarches
  • **********
  • Posts: 6,268
  • Faith: Melkite Catholic
Another difference between WRO and EC
« on: March 28, 2008, 05:56:27 PM »
This is really an add-on to the earlier discussion about the differences between WRO and EC and whether WRO is "reverse uniatism". But I can't remember which thread that was in, so I'm taking the liberty of starting a new one.

It occurs to me that another difference (which I'm pretty sure hasn't been mentioned) is that anyone who converts from Orthodoxy to Catholicism is automatically enrolled in an EC Church:

Quote
Canon 35 - Baptized non-Catholics coming into full communion with the Catholic Church should retain and practice their own rite everywhere in the world and should observe it as much as humanly possible. Thus, they are to be enrolled in the Church sui iuris of the same rite with due regard for the right of approaching the Apostolic See in special cases of persons, communities or regions.
 

But, obviously, a convert from Catholicism to Orthodoxy is not automatically WRO.

God bless,
Peter.
- Peter Jericho (a CAF poster)

Offline ozgeorge

  • I'll take you for who you are if you take me for everything.
  • Hoplitarches
  • *************
  • Posts: 16,382
  • My plans for retirement.
    • Greek Orthodox Archdiocese of Australia
Re: Another difference between WRO and EC
« Reply #1 on: March 28, 2008, 06:26:13 PM »
It occurs to me that another difference (which I'm pretty sure hasn't been mentioned) is that anyone who converts from Orthodoxy to Catholicism is automatically enrolled in an EC Church.....
But, obviously, a convert from Catholicism to Orthodoxy is not automatically WRO.

Which is a good thing, because we are not automatons. ;)
Often, it's a case of what is available. Thankfully, here in Australia, we have St. Petroc Monastery, a "Continuing Anglican" Community under ROCOR which does a lot of missionary work establishing WRO missions and has now brought five Australian Anglican Churches into the Orthodox Church.
If you're living a happy life as a Christian, you're doing something wrong.

Offline prodromas

  • OC.net guru
  • *******
  • Posts: 1,239
  • Greek Orthodox
Re: Another difference between WRO and EC
« Reply #2 on: March 28, 2008, 06:56:06 PM »
Which is a good thing, because we are not automatons. ;)
Often, it's a case of what is available. Thankfully, here in Australia, we have St. Petroc Monastery, a "Continuing Anglican" Community under ROCOR which does a lot of missionary work establishing WRO missions and has now brought five Australian Anglican Churches into the Orthodox Church.

Thats really cool George, where exactly are these WRO churches in OZ? The chaplain for my university is an Anglican convert to the Antiochian jurisdiction and I asked him about WRO churches and he said there is only one in the whole of Victoria, I am cradle Greek Orthodox so I have never seen a western rite divine liturgy (and also have never been to a Catholic mass) and I would love to see one but Melbourne is a big city and Connex doesn't help with their immaculate train system (For the Americans replace "Connex" with poorly managed recently privatized train system that is almost never on time).
« Last Edit: March 28, 2008, 06:56:26 PM by prodromas »
The sins I don't commit are largely due to the weakness of my limbs.

1915-1923 Հայոց Ցեղասպանութիւն ,never again,
ܩܛܠܐ ܕܥܡܐ ܐܬܘܪܝܐ 1920-1914, never again,
השואה  1933-1945, never again,
(1914-1923) Ελληνική Γενοκτονία, never again

Offline Veniamin

  • Fire for Effect!
  • Archon
  • ********
  • Posts: 3,372
  • St. Barbara, patroness of the Field Artillery
Re: Another difference between WRO and EC
« Reply #3 on: March 28, 2008, 06:57:17 PM »
(For the Americans replace "Connex" with poorly managed recently privatized train system that is almost never on time).

So a private sector Amtrak.
Artillery adds dignity to what would otherwise be a vulgar brawl. ~Frederick the Great

Offline arimethea

  • Getting too old for this
  • Moderator
  • Archon
  • *****
  • Posts: 2,968
  • Does anyone really care what you think?
Re: Another difference between WRO and EC
« Reply #4 on: March 28, 2008, 10:41:25 PM »
Am I right that the canon 35 quoted is from the The Revised Code of Eastern Canon Law? If yes then the canon that is quoted has no bearing on the Orthodox practice since it comes from a set of canons that no Orthodox Church recognizes. The Revised Code are made up canons that came out of Vatican II.
Joseph

Offline Entscheidungsproblem

  • Formerly Friul & Nebelpfade
  • Protokentarchos
  • *********
  • Posts: 4,495
    • Amsterdam Declaration 2002
Re: Another difference between WRO and EC
« Reply #5 on: March 28, 2008, 11:10:52 PM »
Am I right that the canon 35 quoted is from the The Revised Code of Eastern Canon Law? If yes then the canon that is quoted has no bearing on the Orthodox practice since it comes from a set of canons that no Orthodox Church recognizes. The Revised Code are made up canons that came out of Vatican II.

Yup, 'tis from the Code of Canons of the Eastern/Oriental Churches from 1990.
As a result of a thousand million years of evolution, the universe is becoming conscious of itself, able to understand something of its past history and its possible future.
-- Sir Julian Sorell Huxley FRS

Offline James2

  • Mr.
  • High Elder
  • ******
  • Posts: 753
Re: Another difference between WRO and EC
« Reply #6 on: April 01, 2008, 12:35:27 PM »
It occurs to me that another difference (which I'm pretty sure hasn't been mentioned) is that anyone who converts from Orthodoxy to Catholicism is automatically enrolled in an EC Church:

So what would happen in the case of a Western-rite Orthodox who converted to Catholicism?

Offline Peter J

  • Formerly PJ
  • Taxiarches
  • **********
  • Posts: 6,268
  • Faith: Melkite Catholic
Re: Another difference between WRO and EC
« Reply #7 on: April 01, 2008, 02:05:01 PM »
So what would happen in the case of a Western-rite Orthodox who converted to Catholicism?

I've been wondering about that myself. (Irish Melkite, are you around?)
- Peter Jericho (a CAF poster)

Offline Peter J

  • Formerly PJ
  • Taxiarches
  • **********
  • Posts: 6,268
  • Faith: Melkite Catholic
Re: Another difference between WRO and EC
« Reply #8 on: April 13, 2008, 05:39:13 PM »
So what would happen in the case of a Western-rite Orthodox who converted to Catholicism?

I posted this question over at ByzCath, originally planning to post the answer here. What I got, however, was more a discussion than a simple answer. If anyone wants to read it, the thread is called "Orthodox to Catholic: questions", in the East-N-West forum.

Blessings,
Peter.
- Peter Jericho (a CAF poster)

Offline dantxny

  • OC.net Mineshaft gap
  • High Elder
  • ******
  • Posts: 769
Re: Another difference between WRO and EC
« Reply #9 on: May 04, 2008, 11:29:13 PM »
I've been wondering about that myself. (Irish Melkite, are you around?)

Or here's an even more pondering question for you:

What about a Roman Catholic that converts to Eastern Orthodoxy and then is received later back in to the RCC?
"If you give the average Frenchman a choice between a reforming president who would plug the country's huge deficit and a good cheese, he would probably opt for the cheese." - Stephen Clarke
I think the French may be on to something here.

Offline Entscheidungsproblem

  • Formerly Friul & Nebelpfade
  • Protokentarchos
  • *********
  • Posts: 4,495
    • Amsterdam Declaration 2002
Re: Another difference between WRO and EC
« Reply #10 on: May 04, 2008, 11:35:06 PM »
Or here's an even more pondering question for you:

What about a Roman Catholic that converts to Eastern Orthodoxy and then is received later back in to the RCC?

I'm am pretty sure they would "re-enter" the Latin Rite.  Since they are technically healing their schism and not entering the RCC for the first time.
As a result of a thousand million years of evolution, the universe is becoming conscious of itself, able to understand something of its past history and its possible future.
-- Sir Julian Sorell Huxley FRS

Offline Reader KevinAndrew

  • Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 138
Re: Another difference between WRO and EC
« Reply #11 on: May 04, 2008, 11:58:39 PM »
I posted this question over at ByzCath, originally planning to post the answer here. What I got, however, was more a discussion than a simple answer. If anyone wants to read it, the thread is called "Orthodox to Catholic: questions", in the East-N-West forum.

Blessings,
Peter.

I know someone who left a WR parish in the Antiochian Archdiocese and joined the RCC. He attends a Byzantine Rite parish. I don't think it was a matter of where the RCC placed him, but rather what rite in the RCC was where he wanted to go. It may be more of a case-by-case basis.
« Last Edit: May 04, 2008, 11:59:26 PM by Reader KevinAndrew »

Offline Peter J

  • Formerly PJ
  • Taxiarches
  • **********
  • Posts: 6,268
  • Faith: Melkite Catholic
Re: Another difference between WRO and EC
« Reply #12 on: May 05, 2008, 11:51:37 AM »
Or here's an even more pondering question for you:

What about a Roman Catholic that converts to Eastern Orthodoxy and then is received later back in to the RCC?

I've been thinking about too, as a matter of fact. As I said on the ByzCath thread, the impression I get is that Rome doesn't recognize any "change of Rite" which takes place outside of the Roman Catholic Communion.

So I think that said person would be "received back" into the Latin Church, or whichever particular church he/she belonged to when he/she was a Catholic the first time around.
- Peter Jericho (a CAF poster)

Offline Peter J

  • Formerly PJ
  • Taxiarches
  • **********
  • Posts: 6,268
  • Faith: Melkite Catholic
Re: Another difference between WRO and EC
« Reply #13 on: May 05, 2008, 11:58:14 AM »
I know someone who left a WR parish in the Antiochian Archdiocese and joined the RCC. He attends a Byzantine Rite parish. I don't think it was a matter of where the RCC placed him, but rather what rite in the RCC was where he wanted to go. It may be more of a case-by-case basis.

Well, to be fair to the [Roman] Catholic Church, all those rules about what Rite or what Church a person belongs to don't affect one's ability to receive the sacraments of Reconciliation and Eucharist. Those two sacraments can be received in any particular church that the individual chooses.

I myself am technically in the Latin Church, even though in the last five years I have been to more Melkite liturgies than Roman ones.

-Peter.
- Peter Jericho (a CAF poster)