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Author Topic: Question for Uturn/Abdur  (Read 948 times) Average Rating: 0
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Anastasios
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« on: June 20, 2003, 04:36:23 PM »

Abdur,

When you apostasized back to Islam, did your 83 year old mother return with you?

I'm just sincerely curious.

In Christ,

anastasios
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uturn
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« Reply #1 on: June 24, 2003, 02:07:22 PM »

I suppose from your pov, we are apostates. I won't argue that point.

The god I believe in is found in the first layer of that great folk-lore tradition some are very much at home--and hearth-- with identifying as the Greek-Byzantine-Ottoman continuum.

Sorry, but theologically, like many of my background and generation, I am an agnostic. I am doing the best I can and cling to our common tradition for cultural reasons, not because of theological convictions. Now, that places me among the majority.

When four of my uncles escaped across the border to Greece, they crossed as Muslims. Three of those four converted to Greek Orthodoxy, while the other brother remained Muslim. He spent his whole life, living among Christians in Ioannina, known as the 'kalos anthropos,' or, 'good man.' A life well lived, whether as a Muslim or Orthodox, and one to be grateful for.

CNN aside, there are many Muslims who are happy people, and are deserving to be known as 'kalos anthropos.'
« Last Edit: June 24, 2003, 02:34:24 PM by uturn » Logged

"It follows, therefore, that imagination is a power of the soul such that, by its very nature, it has no capacity for entering the realm of union with God."--Unseen Warfare.

"For this reason the holy fathers call the devil a painter...a br
Anastasios
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« Reply #2 on: June 24, 2003, 02:51:04 PM »

Abdur,

I spent a several months in India among Muslims and was engaged to a Muslim girl once, so throwing references to me about CNN style things doesn't mean anything to me.  I was for the war in Iraq but generally I am not as antagonistic to Muslims as others, due to my positive experiences with Indian Muslims.

You claim to be an agnostic but obviously not always as I could pull out your old posts where you speak of salvation and enlightenment in Jesus. Perhaps you are one of those mentioned in the parables that received the word with joy but fell away.  That is why I am concerned more for your mother, for if you are her caretaker perhaps you pushed her one way and then the other.

As far as your history about your four uncles I thank you, but I am curious, did one of them then become a priest?  Because you said your aunt was a presbytera.  If so, that must have shown religion in your family.

Finally, the talk about good life, etc., is meaningless, for this life is meaningless outside of a theological context.  Your uncle was good, but he died or will die.  You will die. I will die.  Without God our works mean nothing and are empty, even if they are good, for they are then pointless.  If we do everything "en Christo" and await the resurrection of our bodies and eternal glory worshipping the creator of the universe, we will not only be free in the next life but will be free in this life.  You quote the likes of Kazantzakis but you ignore the saints around you in this century who can guide your faith journey.

Since you call yourself an agnostic I have great respect for you--you are humble.  If you were an "atheist" who could think there is no God and that you had the proof of it, I would roll my eyes.  But to say "agnostic" means a search is on.  We who have known you know of your search and have witnessed your progression.  We are praying for your return to Orthodoxy or if you were never received into Orthodoxy your acceptance into it--not on ethnic terms but on ORTHODOXY'S terms--not a Greek thing, not a cultural thing, a CHRISTIAN thing.

If you are truly searching, you will search through all the evidence and evaluate it on its own terms.

In Christ,

anastasios
« Last Edit: June 24, 2003, 02:51:40 PM by anastasios » Logged

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Past posts reflect stages of my life before my baptism may not be accurate expositions of Orthodox teaching. Also, I served as an Orthodox priest from 2008-2013, before resigning.
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