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Author Topic: Benedict XVI on the role of the Pope  (Read 311 times) Average Rating: 0
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« on: September 27, 2014, 01:19:45 PM »

Could someone explain whether the quote below by then Pope Benedict XVI implied a change of the Petrine primacy as understood by Catholics?

http://godwinxuereb.blogspot.com/2014/09/benedict-xvi-on-role-of-pope.html
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"Επιτρέπεται εξ απόψεως Ρωμαιοκαθολικής να μεταλαμβάνουν εν καιρώ ανάγκης οι Ρωμαιοκαθολικοί εις Ορθοδόξους Εκκλησίας και οι Ορθόδοξοι εν καιρώ ανάγκης να μεταλαμβάνουν εις Ρωμαιοκαθολικάς Εκκλησίας."

His Eminence Athenagoras Kokkinakis, Orthodox Archbishop of Thyateira and Great Britain (1975)
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« Reply #1 on: September 27, 2014, 01:43:11 PM »

Could someone explain whether the quote below by then Pope Benedict XVI implied a change of the Petrine primacy as understood by Catholics?

http://godwinxuereb.blogspot.com/2014/09/benedict-xvi-on-role-of-pope.html

nope

He seems like he is reaffirming catholic doctrine by implicitly implying the separated brethren do not recognize the role of petrine primacy and how its exercised when he says :

Quote
so that it will be increasingly recognized in its true meaning by brothers who are still not in communion with us.”

however he does acknowledge somewhat explicitly that the primacy has been abused by the Holy Roman Bishops by asking for prayers for rightful exercise of primacy.

Note: The pope can't change catholic doctrine. He is the protector of it. The Holy ecumenical councils, Vatican 1 and 2, have outlined what the primacy is.
« Last Edit: September 27, 2014, 01:48:10 PM by Wandile » Logged

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« Reply #2 on: September 27, 2014, 03:06:42 PM »

In a way, that quote reflects what appeared yesterday in the news (from a Roman Catholic perspective):

http://vaticaninsider.lastampa.it/en/world-news/detail/articolo/ecumenismo-ecumenism-ecumenismo-36567/
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"Επιτρέπεται εξ απόψεως Ρωμαιοκαθολικής να μεταλαμβάνουν εν καιρώ ανάγκης οι Ρωμαιοκαθολικοί εις Ορθοδόξους Εκκλησίας και οι Ορθόδοξοι εν καιρώ ανάγκης να μεταλαμβάνουν εις Ρωμαιοκαθολικάς Εκκλησίας."

His Eminence Athenagoras Kokkinakis, Orthodox Archbishop of Thyateira and Great Britain (1975)
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« Reply #3 on: September 27, 2014, 03:55:38 PM »

Primacy of Peter is a Vatican Council doctrine ... I don't think it has anything to do with Orthodoxy in Theory and Practice.
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« Reply #4 on: September 27, 2014, 03:57:01 PM »

Could someone explain whether the quote below by then Pope Benedict XVI implied a change of the Petrine primacy as understood by Catholics?

http://godwinxuereb.blogspot.com/2014/09/benedict-xvi-on-role-of-pope.html

(I think) The goal is to assimilate the whole of the Councils.
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« Reply #5 on: September 30, 2014, 02:51:06 PM »

Could someone explain whether the quote below by then Pope Benedict XVI implied a change of the Petrine primacy as understood by Catholics?

http://godwinxuereb.blogspot.com/2014/09/benedict-xvi-on-role-of-pope.html

nope

He seems like he is reaffirming catholic doctrine by implicitly implying the separated brethren do not recognize the role of petrine primacy and how its exercised when he says :

Quote
so that it will be increasingly recognized in its true meaning by brothers who are still not in communion with us.”

however he does acknowledge somewhat explicitly that the primacy has been abused by the Holy Roman Bishops by asking for prayers for rightful exercise of primacy.

Note: The pope can't change catholic doctrine. He is the protector of it. The Holy ecumenical councils, Vatican 1 and 2, have outlined what the primacy is.

That is, of course, the madness of post VI theories of papal authority. He is the guardian and protector of tradition, but even if he isn't, you must still obey him. Which one you prioritize, fidelity to tradition or fidelity to the current teaching of the pope, is largely what determines if you will fall on the SSPX side of things or not.
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« Reply #6 on: September 30, 2014, 02:56:52 PM »

Could someone explain whether the quote below by then Pope Benedict XVI implied a change of the Petrine primacy as understood by Catholics?

http://godwinxuereb.blogspot.com/2014/09/benedict-xvi-on-role-of-pope.html

nope

He seems like he is reaffirming catholic doctrine by implicitly implying the separated brethren do not recognize the role of petrine primacy and how its exercised when he says :

Quote
so that it will be increasingly recognized in its true meaning by brothers who are still not in communion with us.”

however he does acknowledge somewhat explicitly that the primacy has been abused by the Holy Roman Bishops by asking for prayers for rightful exercise of primacy.

Note: The pope can't change catholic doctrine. He is the protector of it. The Holy ecumenical councils, Vatican 1 and 2, have outlined what the primacy is.

That is, of course, the madness of post VI theories of papal authority. He is the guardian and protector of tradition, but even if he isn't, you must still obey him. Which one you prioritize, fidelity to tradition or fidelity to the current teaching of the pope, is largely what determines if you will fall on the SSPX side of things or not.

Lest he teaches against the faith... Then we follow the words of Pope Pius who said "do not follow him"
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"There is no salvation outside the Catholic Church. Anyone who resists this truth perishes." - St. Louis Marie de Montfort

"When we pray, the voice of the heart must be heard more than that proceeding from the mouth." - St Bonaventure.
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« Reply #7 on: September 30, 2014, 03:48:02 PM »

Could someone explain whether the quote below by then Pope Benedict XVI implied a change of the Petrine primacy as understood by Catholics?

http://godwinxuereb.blogspot.com/2014/09/benedict-xvi-on-role-of-pope.html

nope

He seems like he is reaffirming catholic doctrine by implicitly implying the separated brethren do not recognize the role of petrine primacy and how its exercised when he says :

Quote
so that it will be increasingly recognized in its true meaning by brothers who are still not in communion with us.”

however he does acknowledge somewhat explicitly that the primacy has been abused by the Holy Roman Bishops by asking for prayers for rightful exercise of primacy.

Note: The pope can't change catholic doctrine. He is the protector of it. The Holy ecumenical councils, Vatican 1 and 2, have outlined what the primacy is.

That is, of course, the madness of post VI theories of papal authority. He is the guardian and protector of tradition, but even if he isn't, you must still obey him. Which one you prioritize, fidelity to tradition or fidelity to the current teaching of the pope, is largely what determines if you will fall on the SSPX side of things or not.

Lest he teaches against the faith... Then we follow the words of Pope Pius who said "do not follow him"

Great. I have never seen a consistent account though of how pre Vatican II and post Vatican II Catholicism are not essentially different. Do you think you could offer me any book that has a good account of how they do not differ?
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« Reply #8 on: Today at 05:38:31 AM »

Could someone explain whether the quote below by then Pope Benedict XVI implied a change of the Petrine primacy as understood by Catholics?

http://godwinxuereb.blogspot.com/2014/09/benedict-xvi-on-role-of-pope.html

nope

He seems like he is reaffirming catholic doctrine by implicitly implying the separated brethren do not recognize the role of petrine primacy and how its exercised when he says :

Quote
so that it will be increasingly recognized in its true meaning by brothers who are still not in communion with us.”

however he does acknowledge somewhat explicitly that the primacy has been abused by the Holy Roman Bishops by asking for prayers for rightful exercise of primacy.

Note: The pope can't change catholic doctrine. He is the protector of it. The Holy ecumenical councils, Vatican 1 and 2, have outlined what the primacy is.

That is, of course, the madness of post VI theories of papal authority. He is the guardian and protector of tradition, but even if he isn't, you must still obey him. Which one you prioritize, fidelity to tradition or fidelity to the current teaching of the pope, is largely what determines if you will fall on the SSPX side of things or not.

Lest he teaches against the faith... Then we follow the words of Pope Pius who said "do not follow him"

Great. I have never seen a consistent account though of how pre Vatican II and post Vatican II Catholicism are not essentially different. Do you think you could offer me any book that has a good account of how they do not differ?

Nope, no major author i know seems to have any need to Write such a book.

What essential differences do you think exist?
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"There is no salvation outside the Catholic Church. Anyone who resists this truth perishes." - St. Louis Marie de Montfort

"When we pray, the voice of the heart must be heard more than that proceeding from the mouth." - St Bonaventure.
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