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Author Topic: catholic answers forum bars orthodox dicussion  (Read 267111 times) Average Rating: 0
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Jimmy
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« Reply #180 on: November 12, 2007, 09:46:59 PM »

In the diaspora, as common as you will find staunch defenders of Eastern and Oriental tradition, maybe more so, I really don't know. For the Maronites, many of these communities were born out of the care of American Roman Catholic prelates, often times growing with Latinizations; these people don't even know what's not their tradition.

Peace and God Bless.

This makes even more sad that they are being forced out of their homeland.  They will be forced to migrate to western countries that will not be tollerant of their traditions and the tradition will be lost.  It is sad.
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« Reply #181 on: November 12, 2007, 09:48:56 PM »

Hello,

No matter how hard we show and discuss and prove how valid experiences, it's not good enough, which should be of no surprise.
I have seen you (and maybe one or two others) use this phrase of experiences recently. What exactly do you mean by it?
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« Reply #182 on: November 12, 2007, 09:51:40 PM »

I was very sad to see the archives of the Eastern Christianity taken out of public view. I enjoyed going back and reading those threads. Especially the one about Halloween that Father Ambrose contributed. I am still kicking myself for not saving the link to that blog he posted. Angry

Quinault, here is a little gift for you.  Grin

http://64.233.169.104/search?q=cache:H4x2OmSHIX0J:forums.catholic.com/showthread.php%3Fp%3D2912435+%22fr+ambrose%22+halloween+samhain&hl=en&ct=clnk&cd=3&gl=us
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« Reply #183 on: November 12, 2007, 09:52:37 PM »

Hello,

What a joy to be welcomed so warmly here by all the admins. and moderators!!  Never got any kind of welcome even close to that by the CAF folks.  I wonder if that, too, reflects a difference between the Orthodox and RC world-views?  Just a (tiny) thought!

Thank you all so much!

Many blessings,
Jeff
Do the moderators and admins welcome everyone on this forum - or just us refugees? It might not be fair to compare this warm welcome to that on CAF as I don't recall there being such a large concentrated influx coming to CAF at any one time.

Regardless of the answer, the welcome here is comforting and I am appreciative of it.

Thank you OrthodoxChristianity.net
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« Reply #184 on: November 12, 2007, 09:55:59 PM »



Wow! Thank you so much!
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« Reply #185 on: November 12, 2007, 10:06:08 PM »

Hello,
I have seen you (and maybe one or two others) use this phrase of experiences recently. What exactly do you mean by it?

Coder,

The reason why we are being so staunch is because the new trend is to deny that our experiences as Eastern and Oriental Christians are not valid, as in is wrong, because it violates some notion that all Eastern and Oriental Catholics are in some romantic unity, or at least right now they should be. I find this unhealthy for dialogue, for it is not being honest at the disunity that does exist, and creating some mass statement like, "well, it should be this otherwise you are not Catholic," doesn't even address the issues.

Like I said on CAF, the same issues that separate Orthodoxy exist in the Catholic Communion. The sooner we recognize the fact, and be honest about our positions, we can try and hash out these issues.

Peace and God Bless.
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« Reply #186 on: November 12, 2007, 10:17:58 PM »

I just posted on CA that I will not accept these either. It appears that the administration is preparing a response on the staff chat, but I can't be sure. It also seems that Joe Monahan is no longer a moderator...

here is their response;

Quote
Thank you for bearing with us while we get the new Eastern Catholicism forum up and running.
We have received a number of concerns over the past week. Perhaps this is the best place to try and answer at once the key issues that have been raised. So we are speaking in general to all of the members who have voiced concerns and not specifically to the issues raised above.

1 - CAF is an expensive site to run. The management, administrative, technical, moderation, and infrastructure costs are significant. It does not pay its own way.

2 - In fact, it is only through the good graces of several individuals who are willing to put in long, uncompensated hours, oft-times in the wee hours, that we are able to keep CAF online. Asking them to do even more is not possible. Because of this, situations that increase CAF's costs and administrative time generally must be viewed with a keen eye and a sharp pencil. Hindrances to the smooth functioning of the site increase costs. We believe that keeping our costs low is an important guiding principle for CAF, one that is certainly not unreasonable.

3 - That some guests were unwilling to adhere to even basic rules of civility has unfortunately been the case and has had to be dealt with in a strict manner. We believe this too is reasonable and ask you to look at it from our point of view: Would you allow a house guest to remain after he showed disrespect to others and repeatedly mischaracterized, even bad-mouthed, you? Belligerence by parties (on both sides) in the old EC forum had risen to the point where several members (on both sides) had to be suspended or put under review. We cannot and will not discuss individual cases. All that can be said here is that several of the individuals affected (on both sides) have been spinning the situation to put themselves in a favorable light. It does not surprise us to see that belligerence and pride can cloud objectivity, although we regret that the situation has taken such a turn in some quarters.

4 - The situation in the old forum had deteriorated to the point where many CAF members felt driven out or were unwilling to venture into that forum because of the behaviors therein. This was clearly an untenable situation necessitating that we act quickly and decisively. That some now see rule enforcement as somehow "unfair" is an indication of just how bad a turn the situation had taken.

5 – While it may be obvious, it bears repeating: The purpose of CAF is to serve Catholics and non-Catholics who are willing to come together for discussions while complying with the rules. In order to meet these objectives better, we are simply moving in a new direction, getting "back to basics" if you will. Perhaps this should have been the first step a few years ago. We know many members think so. Given this new direction at CAF we are strictly enforcing the rules and hope that those who enjoy this site will bear with us through the rough patches.

6 – The forums are provided to the community at large on an "at will" basis. If the process of changing direction has resulted in shock or hurt feelings, we sympathize and hope in turn that you can sympathize with our position. However, we simply do not have the time and resources to engage in group (let alone one-on-one) consultations. If there are those among you whose needs are no longer being met by CAF, we apologize for the inconvenience and wish you luck in finding a more suitable venue. We trust that most members will work with us to create a safe, pleasant, charitable atmosphere in the new Eastern Catholicism forum and find in it a place that will meet their needs.

7 - While we look for an oversight team appropriate for the new Eastern Catholicism forum, we ask that members bear with us in the interim. We hope to have it in place in very short order (days, not weeks).

8 - As noted elsewhere, the old EC forum has been pulled for review. We hope to return reference material to the new EC forum in short order.

Thank you again for your patience. It is our hope and prayer that CAF remains a pleasant experience for all its members.
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« Reply #187 on: November 12, 2007, 10:26:55 PM »

I wonder what is the % rate of censure in the Non Catholic Forum...

I don't think it is high, that is a pool for possible converts...
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« Reply #188 on: November 12, 2007, 10:28:32 PM »

. . . LakaYaRabb is a friend of mine from Steubenville and I can tell you he has no intent on submitting to the western views.
He is also a friend of mine.  We both used to live at the Trinity East dorm at FUS.
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« Reply #189 on: November 12, 2007, 10:32:22 PM »

I just posted on CA that I will not accept these either. It appears that the administration is preparing a response on the staff chat, but I can't be sure. It also seems that Joe Monahan is no longer a moderator...
Yes, I noticed that he is now a "retired" moderator.  I sent him a private message just after the crackdown began, but he never responded.  He was always fair to me, and I wish him the best.
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« Reply #190 on: November 12, 2007, 10:33:25 PM »

Hello,

Coder,

The reason why we are being so staunch is because the new trend is to deny that our experiences as Eastern and Oriental Christians are not valid, as in is wrong, because it violates some notion that all Eastern and Oriental Catholics are in some romantic unity, or at least right now they should be. I find this unhealthy for dialogue, for it is not being honest at the disunity that does exist, and creating some mass statement like, "well, it should be this otherwise you are not Catholic," doesn't even address the issues.

Like I said on CAF, the same issues that separate Orthodoxy exist in the Catholic Communion. The sooner we recognize the fact, and be honest about our positions, we can try and hash out these issues.

Peace and God Bless.
O.K. I think I may understand what you are saying.
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« Reply #191 on: November 12, 2007, 10:34:58 PM »

He is also a friend of mine.  We both used to live at the Trinity East dorm at FUS.

Yes, he has mentioned you Apotheoun.  He mentioned that he learned a great deal from you.  I just met him this semester.
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« Reply #192 on: November 12, 2007, 10:39:11 PM »

Yes, he has mentioned you Apotheoun.  He mentioned that he learned a great deal from you.  I just met him this semester.
He and several other of my friends at FUS gave me a beautiful icon of St. Gregory Palamas, which I will always cherish, both because I am devoted to the doctor of the uncreated energies, but also because of the wonderful people who gave the icon to me.
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« Reply #193 on: November 12, 2007, 11:00:04 PM »

Yes, I noticed that he is now a "retired" moderator.  I sent him a private message just after the crackdown began, but he never responded.  He was always fair to me, and I wish him the best.

Yes, he was extremely fair to both sides. I always felt there was alot more freedom to express views. Perhaps that's why he's now "retired." There were a great amount of threads that got out of hand, but I learned so much more from them. He probably got asked to take a break because of the huge freedom. Very few people got banned on the EC's...
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« Reply #194 on: November 12, 2007, 11:19:08 PM »

Indeed!  I'm sure, however, that they would say, "It's our web-site and we'll do with it what we want!"  And as far as that goes, it's true.  But the spirit of what they have done most definitely resembles a book burning.

Blessings,
Jeff

Sort of like Cardinal Humbert saying "It's our Church and we'll do with her what we want."

It seems all of us here, even those under Rome, had the same response to such a mentality.
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« Reply #195 on: November 12, 2007, 11:43:16 PM »

Hello,
Do the moderators and admins welcome everyone on this forum - or just us refugees? It might not be fair to compare this warm welcome to that on CAF as I don't recall there being such a large concentrated influx coming to CAF at any one time.

Regardless of the answer, the welcome here is comforting and I am appreciative of it.

Thank you OrthodoxChristianity.net

We welcome everyone!  It brings both Anastasios and myself great satisfaction to see the site that started with a small handful of people blossom into the community it has become.  Check out a recent thread in Board News on the history of OC.net to learn more.

Robert
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« Reply #196 on: November 12, 2007, 11:44:23 PM »

That's too bad. I'm glad to see you, Laka and Yeshua sticking up for Eastern/Oriental Catholicism on the new EC board.

I'll second that. I always appreciated Laka, Yeshua and Jimmy's posts.

And outside of the mentioned Syriac Fathers Grin, Apothuem.

There was another one from Steubenville, a Chaldean whose name began with an "R," who also made valuable contributions.  Is he still around too?

I feel like I'm in a displaced persons camp. Angry
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« Reply #197 on: November 12, 2007, 11:45:39 PM »

Do the moderators and admins welcome everyone on this forum - or just us refugees?
Oh, we try to welcome every new member of our forum, not just you "refugees". Wink
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« Reply #198 on: November 13, 2007, 12:10:54 AM »

Hello,

I asked the CAF if I could get access to the old archives to save some of my more memorable posts - and those of others. The response I got is:

We sympathize with the loss of posts important to you, but unfortunately
do not have the time and resources necessary to recover them for you.

ForumAdmin Staff
Catholic Answers Forums
(http://forums.catholic.com)


Bummer! When will I learn to never put off till tomorrow what you can backup today.  Smiley

Hello;  brother coder is it ...i liked the way you defended your  faith on catholic answers forum ,,you really put up some powerful responses in defense of what you believe,,,keep up the good work ,,,,brother stashko
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« Reply #199 on: November 13, 2007, 12:16:02 AM »

Yes, he was extremely fair to both sides. I always felt there was a lot more freedom to express views. Perhaps that's why he's now "retired." There were a great amount of threads that got out of hand, but I learned so much more from them. He probably got asked to take a break because of the huge freedom. Very few people got banned on the EC's...

"Retired" is another lie from that board...  They PAY their moderators, and Joe, who loved us Orthodox Christians and made sure that the few we had there were protected against the thousands of RC posters who would cheerfully have run us through, had they been given the chance, just as they are now doing to the EC's on the new section...  Joe needed the money he was making there - I pray he has found another job...  He was fair and protective at the same time, and I loved him, even though I still have the bruises of his ruler across the backs of my cyber-miscreantic hands!

He was terminated, and the termination was covered up, along with the rest of what they did...

Ghosty, another stand-up guy with whom I profoundly disagreed, but nevertheless utterly respected [he thinks there is no contradiction between the Creed with the Filioque in Latin and the Creed without it in Greek, for instance...] while sympathiizing with the move, because there was heat in the postings from the Orthodox there - eg the MORAL implications to the RC positions were DRAWN, rather than politely ignored - well, Ghosty is fed up and dismayed at what he is seeing them doing, and is about ready to leave - It is the cover-up that won't pass the sniff test that is driving him off...  And he was their best poster by far...

Arsenios
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« Reply #200 on: November 13, 2007, 12:16:49 AM »

I'll second that. I always appreciated Laka, Yeshua and Jimmy's posts.

And outside of the mentioned Syriac Fathers Grin, Apothuem.
laugh

There was another one from Steubenville, a Chaldean whose name began with an "R," who also made valuable contributions.  Is he still around too?
Ronyodish? I can't think of any others who fit that description. Aside from very recently I haven't seen him around in a while.
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« Reply #201 on: November 13, 2007, 12:29:39 AM »

"Retired" is another lie from that board...  They PAY their moderators, and Joe, who loved us Orthodox Christians and made sure that the few we had there were protected against the thousands of RC posters who would cheerfully have run us through, had they been given the chance, just as they are now doing to the EC's on the new section...  Joe needed the money he was making there - I pray he has found another job...  He was fair and protective at the same time, and I loved him, even though I still have the bruises of his ruler across the backs of my cyber-miscreantic hands!

He was terminated, and the termination was covered up, along with the rest of what they did...

Ghosty, another stand-up guy with whom I profoundly disagreed, but nevertheless utterly respected [he thinks there is no contradiction between the Creed with the Filioque in Latin and the Creed without it in Greek, for instance...] while sympathiizing with the move, because there was heat in the postings from the Orthodox there - eg the MORAL implications to the RC positions were DRAWN, rather than politely ignored - well, Ghosty is fed up and dismayed at what he is seeing them doing, and is about ready to leave - It is the cover-up that won't pass the sniff test that is driving him off...  And he was their best poster by far...

Arsenios

Yes, I agree wholeheartedly, Joe Monahan was above reproach when it came to being fair across the theological spectrum of opinions.  I was suspended by Joe on a few occassions but I knew I deserved them.

Joe would always PM me with a kind message as to why he had to do what he did.  I always commended him on his fair handling of sensitive subjects.  I will miss his input on many subjects. He was helpful in directing the thread into calmer waters many times.  Yes, he will be missed.

If Joe Monahan gets the chance to view our posts here Im sure all of us refugees wish him success and good health in anything he intends doing in the future.

In Christ,

JoeS (StMarkEofE)
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« Reply #202 on: November 13, 2007, 12:31:08 AM »

Hello;  brother coder is it ...i liked the way you defended your  faith on catholic answers forum ,,you really put up some powerful responses in defense of what you believe,,,keep up the good work ,,,,brother stashko

I have always had the feeling on CA that the Roman west looked down their theological noses at us in the east for some reason.  They view us as an anachronism of sorts, out of touch with reality and not relevant in this modern world.  If this doesnt solidify my beliefs I dont know what else would. The whole point in this life is NOT to be relevant, at least that is what I was taugh anyway. My personal feelings, barring the idea that those left behind will now get their info on Eastern spiritualization which will now be filtered and scrutinized, is that they may have done us a good favor without us knowing it.  Actually, I feel as if a heavy burden has been lifted but I dont know why just yet. But I do feel a lot better.

PS, I do miss the voluminous choices of smily faces though. They seemed to convey the feeling of the post.  Maybe someone can come up with those animated version of the smily faces sometime?

 :pumpkin: 
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« Reply #203 on: November 13, 2007, 12:32:16 AM »

I feel like I'm in a displaced persons camp. Angry

Oh quitch'er whinin', Isa! Wink

I am OVERJOYED to see you here -

The theology is proven in deeds [praxis]...

We made a gallant foray into their camp and made off with many worthy spoils...

And shamed them properly, as they so richly deserved...

It would be a lot of fun to invite those in communion with the Pope to come over here to find out about what has been being hidden from them, and about Orthodoxy, should they have questions...  I do not know if their board would allow that...

I mean, it is as if a Nash Rambler, reliable and slow, got yoked up with an Indy Car...  They simply HAD to break off...  And there was no way to do it cleanly...  And now they are reviewing the whole of Eastern Christianity, before they allow anything to be made available to the list...  By their deeds shall they be known...

Should we have kept a lower profile and plundered them longer?  Maybe...  But I sure like the idea of exposing those hiding in the bushes for who they really are, and what they really will do...   By their doing it...  The only greater joy would be in seeing their repentance from having done it...

Arsenios
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« Reply #204 on: November 13, 2007, 12:41:11 AM »

Oh quitch'er whinin', Isa! Wink

I am OVERJOYED to see you here -

The theology is proven in deeds [praxis]...

We made a gallant foray into their camp and made off with many worthy spoils...

And shamed them properly, as they so richly deserved...

It would be a lot of fun to invite those in communion with the Pope to come over here to find out about what has been being hidden from them, and about Orthodoxy, should they have questions...  I do not know if their board would allow that...

I mean, it is as if a Nash Rambler, reliable and slow, got yoked up with an Indy Car...  They simply HAD to break off...  And there was no way to do it cleanly...  And now they are reviewing the whole of Eastern Christianity, before they allow anything to be made available to the list...  By their deeds shall they be known...

Should we have kept a lower profile and plundered them longer?  Maybe...  But I sure like the idea of exposing those hiding in the bushes for who they really are, and what they really will do...   By their doing it...  The only greater joy would be in seeing their repentance from having done it...

Arsenios

Your post is most appropriate and makes a lot of sense.

JoeS
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« Reply #205 on: November 13, 2007, 01:00:11 AM »

I have always had the feeling on CA that the Roman west looked down their theological noses at us in the east for some reason. 

PS, I do miss the voluminous choices of smily faces though. They seemed to convey the feeling of the post.  Maybe someone can come up with those animated version of the smily faces sometime?

 :pumpkin: 

Well, we Easterners are unschooled and theologically barbaric...we didn't have the scholastic learning of the West Wink

Oh, and I miss those smileys, too!
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« Reply #206 on: November 13, 2007, 01:06:38 AM »

Well, we Easterners are unschooled and theologically barbaric...we didn't have the scholastic learning of the West Wink

Oh, and I miss those smileys, too!
Not only that, we are paralyzed, stagnant and stuck in the 8th century. Cool
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« Reply #207 on: November 13, 2007, 01:08:00 AM »

Oh, and I miss those smileys, too!
If they aren't copyrighted, you could upload them to some image hosting service and manually link to them.
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« Reply #208 on: November 13, 2007, 01:09:08 AM »

Not only that, we are paralyzed, stagnant and stuck in the 8th century. Cool

Yes, wonderfully so!

JoeS
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« Reply #209 on: November 13, 2007, 01:17:03 AM »

Your post is most appropriate and makes a lot of sense.

JoeS

They made that whole board as a place for Roman Catholics to hang out and talk about their faith...  And it was so well done that they attracted a LOT of readers [65,000??], and in the process, some pretty good apologists, and they expanded to have discussions with Protestants, and then, in a generous ecumenical mind, hoping for peace talks with their "other lung", the Eastern Orthodox Church, they opened up the Eastern Christianity board...  But the whole show was still primarily a place for Catholics to hang out and talk with each other...  They had their "toughs" to handle the Protestants, and the eastern Churches in communion with Rome were no problem, but when they ran into the EO's, they were simply outclassed in every way...  The Indy Car of the EO posters was a sledge hammer smashing a flea on an anvil, because the western mindset of the Roman Church in that Board was primarily a family show for their faithful...  They did not know what would come to them through their family oriented generosity...

And this in a way is reflected in their spirituality of service to the poor, vs our focus on the creation of saints in  monastic struggle and prayer...  Mother Theresa vs St. Gregory Palamas...  Where theology is relegated to the classrooms of Scholasticism, and true spirituality in service to the poor...  [Yet look what happened to poor Mother Theresa!]

So that when the family sedan of being nice to one another and keeping fuzzy on theological issues and no existing rigor of Church praxis of the Faith, they were simply outclassed and overrun...  Ghosty was not, but neither did his view hold up well... 

Their complaint that we were in their [eg family] living room and were behaving badly is reflective of the dismay they felt and the sense of betrayal they had at being run roughshod over by a small group of Orthodox posters who were both articulate and educated, like Isa, and inarticulate and uneducated, like me!  We all had a field day, and they are now sitting with the nightmares of their own deeds to eject the ungrateful plunderers of their ranks who do not respect Romes presumed "AUTHORITY"...

We went in there on the premise that Orthodoxy is authoritative without being authoritarian...  Bishops can err...  Any bishop can err...  Even one divinely illumined...

So that the more I think about what they did, the less I am inclined to hold their feet to the fire...  They have to deal with issues of conscience - It looks like they have sanitized [eg removed my posts and many others] from an old thread and re-posted it on "Why Would a Roman Catholic Convert to Orthodoxy?" - So it looks like they are TRYING to get at least some of the threads back on the boards, if somewhat neutered... 
http://forums.catholic.com/showthread.php?t=196984


I mean, if that had happened to a bunch of parish Orthodox folks who had a board for their discussions, I do not think the results would have been much different...  Even though here, they are welcome, for we are not unaware of their purposes and needs...  I can't believe I am actually feeling SORRY FOR them...

Lord have Mercy!

Arsenios 
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« Reply #210 on: November 13, 2007, 02:01:06 AM »

hello there

i knew something like this would happen, i once told the EO posters on the CAF, that dont entertain conversion procedures asked to them since CAF is a catholic website and a little respect to the website is to be expected. they can use PM instead. However, i was bombarded with hate replies, as though  the EO posters owns the website. A little respect could prevented things. Listening is a great virtue.

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« Reply #211 on: November 13, 2007, 02:49:37 AM »

Yes, wonderfully so!

JoeS

Amen!
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« Reply #212 on: November 13, 2007, 02:52:47 AM »

hello there

i knew something like this would happen, i once told the EO posters on the CAF, that dont entertain conversion procedures asked to them since CAF is a catholic website and a little respect to the website is to be expected. they can use PM instead. However, i was bombarded with hate replies, as though  the EO posters owns the website. A little respect could prevented things. Listening is a great virtue.



Welcome, I remember you!
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« Reply #213 on: November 13, 2007, 05:49:24 AM »

Hey Everyone, I post over at CAF, but came over here from a link on the new Eastern Catholicism forum. I just wanted to suggest - since I never was part of the thing at the Eastern Christianity forum that it would be interesting to post some thread similar to those (with the exception of any personal attacks) on here. I would be interested in seeing these apologetic arguments that are so powerful that no Latin could answer them.

Catholig

"A" thread? <chuckle>

Take a few 'minutes' and peruse the 'Orthodox-Catholic Discussion' boards here. You'll find plenty; IIRC, the "Thou Art Peter' thread was a quite memorable.

LOL! Cheesy "He don't know we very well, do he?"


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Amen!
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« Reply #214 on: November 13, 2007, 07:59:41 AM »

I have to agree with my brethren that the closure of the Eastern Christianity Forum at CAF is a sad end to a place where dialogue did happen - although it was sometimes hot and heavy. Sadder still is the removal of the archived material from public accessibility. In addition to all of the debate, there were significant numbers of threads that involved no argumentation, but were purely informative and educational. They included whole threads heavy with photos of temples and iconostases that evidenced the heavenly beauty of which the Russian legates spoke on their return from Constantinople. Others were replete with links to all manner of informative sites and texts. The polemics of either side apart, it was a treasure trove of information - pure and simple.

These past few days, I've been posting at CAF, something of which I've not done much in a while. But, in looking at the new Eastern Catholicism Forum, it seemed to be populated chiefly by Latin Catholics with little or no knowledge or understanding of the East, and appearing to have as their mission to "out" Eastern Catholics as really being Orthodox in disguise. Thus, I felt compelled to wade in and offer some accurate answers to the genuine queries, the baiting ones, and the outright strange ones. It's not something that I'll do for long, I don't think. It shows every indication of fast becoming the same type of forum that one sees on all the other Latin boards which have an Eastern Catholic forum - a place where the curious will come and innocently ask a question - only to receive an erroneous answer offered with certitude by a Latin Catholic, based on what he "once heard" or "remembers reading".

And looking at the few lonely threads regarding Orthodoxy on the Non-Catholic Religions Forum there is too depressing to deserve comment.

In short measure, it will again come down to there being only 2 places on-line where Eastern Catholics and Eastern Orthodox "dialogue, discuss, debate, educate, and are educated about each others' Churches" (think that was more or less the way that my friend and brother, Joe, used to describe the purpose of the former EC forum at CAF) - here and at ByzCath.


I don't get a lot of time to post lately at either site, because of the time demands of a project on which I'm working, but it's good to see so many of the CA regulars gathered here - both those of us who have been here in the past and those who've newly found it.

Many years,

Neil   
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« Reply #215 on: November 13, 2007, 08:12:36 AM »

Quote
8 - As noted elsewhere, the old EC forum has been pulled for review. We hope to return reference material to the new EC forum in short order.

Yikes! This sounds like they will only 'resurrect' stuff pertaining to Eastern Catholicism, not Orthodoxy.  Cry

I loved Joe Monahan's moderating too, especially his explanations for closing threads, complete with humorous chiding and lamenting over the topic that is now 'beyond redemption' etc.

Having browsed through EO/RC discussions here, I'm happy to say it IS possible to have open and honest disagreement without enmity.
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« Reply #216 on: November 13, 2007, 09:51:10 AM »

Hello,

Hello;  brother coder is it ...i liked the way you defended your  faith on catholic answers forum ,,you really put up some powerful responses in defense of what you believe,,,keep up the good work ,,,,brother stashko
Yes, it is I. I am flattered by your comments. I choose Athanasios in honor of Saint Athanasios of Alexandria (Greek spelling, Athanasius was already taken I believe). I can't remember clearly why I didn't use JMJ_coder, as this is the only forum that I don't use it.

But, anyways, it is good to see so many of the old gang here.
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« Reply #217 on: November 13, 2007, 09:53:37 AM »

Hello,

The whole point in this life is NOT to be relevant, at least that is what I was taugh anyway.
I don't know about that. I don't think it is proper to actively try to be irrelevant. I was taught to have a detachment from caring whether you are relevant or not. Proclaim the Truth, in-season/out-of-season, convenient/inconvenient.

Peace
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« Reply #218 on: November 13, 2007, 09:59:14 AM »

Hello,

And this in a way is reflected in their spirituality of service to the poor, vs our focus on the creation of saints in  monastic struggle and prayer...  Mother Theresa vs St. Gregory Palamas...  Where theology is relegated to the classrooms of Scholasticism, and true spirituality in service to the poor...  [Yet look what happened to poor Mother Theresa!]
I always see true spirituality (regardless of tradition) as combining both prayer and service. Remember Faith working unto Charity - and Christ tells us that what you do the least of His brethren, you do to Him (i.e., clothe naked, feed hungry, visit sick, etc.). We are also to pray without ceasing (though this doesn't necessarily mean active vocal and/or mental prayer).

As an aside, to discuss Mother Teresa (if it is even any of our business), we would have to have a nice long dialogue on what exactly the Catholic Church means by a dark night.

Peace.
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« Reply #219 on: November 13, 2007, 10:36:07 AM »

I believe that C Answers found themselves in a quandary. I cannot help but to see myself as an example. Born and raised Roman Catholic, I canonically switched to the Ruthenian Catholic Church after 35 + years. As a Byzantine Catholic, I was exposed to everything Orthodox. When I found C Answers, I was a staunch defender of Rome and I debated rigorously with the Orthodox members in defence of communion with Rome. At times I had some monumental battles--hi Bob!  Grin

But as I studied the faith, I slowly came to learn that my arguments were not holding as much water as I had anticipated. After much study, prayer, and discernment I came home to Holy Orthodoxy.  Suddenly, I found myself shoulder to shoulder with the same people that I vigorously opposed. The Roman Catholics were not pleased.  I received some disconcerting private messages.

In short, I discovered that you cannot oppose the truth. Holy Orthodoxy effortlessly answers all Roman Catholic objections. The cause of my conversion was not the Orthodox posters at Catholic Answers. It was the Holy Spirit revealing the truth to my heart.  Ironically, I believe that more people may consider Holy Orthodoxy after they witness the oppressive measures that were taken by the moderators.

I learned much from my years on that forum. I thank all of my Orthodox and Eastern Catholic brethren for the wonderful information they contributed. And I ask forgiveness for all I may have offended.

Special thanks to Arsenios and others who posted the information about the movie "Ostrov".  I weep every time I watch it. This movie truly conveys the essence of Holy Orthodoxy!

Peace and blessings to all!

Mickey
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« Reply #220 on: November 13, 2007, 10:53:41 AM »

I have to agree with my brethren that the closure of the Eastern Christianity Forum at CAF is a sad end to a place where dialogue did happen - although it was sometimes hot and heavy. Sadder still is the removal of the archived material from public accessibility. In addition to all of the debate, there were significant numbers of threads that involved no argumentation, but were purely informative and educational. They included whole threads heavy with photos of temples and iconostases that evidenced the heavenly beauty of which the Russian legates spoke on their return from Constantinople. Others were replete with links to all manner of informative sites and texts. The polemics of either side apart, it was a treasure trove of information - pure and simple.

These past few days, I've been posting at CAF, something of which I've not done much in a while. But, in looking at the new Eastern Catholicism Forum, it seemed to be populated chiefly by Latin Catholics with little or no knowledge or understanding of the East, and appearing to have as their mission to "out" Eastern Catholics as really being Orthodox in disguise. Thus, I felt compelled to wade in and offer some accurate answers to the genuine queries, the baiting ones, and the outright strange ones. It's not something that I'll do for long, I don't think. It shows every indication of fast becoming the same type of forum that one sees on all the other Latin boards which have an Eastern Catholic forum - a place where the curious will come and innocently ask a question - only to receive an erroneous answer offered with certitude by a Latin Catholic, based on what he "once heard" or "remembers reading".

And looking at the few lonely threads regarding Orthodoxy on the Non-Catholic Religions Forum there is too depressing to deserve comment...
 
Many years,

Neil   
Glory to Jesus Christ!

Hello Neil!

It's nice to run into you again!

I agree with everything you have stated here. I always appreciated the informative and detailed contributions you and others made, and the reference threads Joe put together. What a shame...

I hope to run into you more often now that I am "freelancing" and not committed to one forum.  Grin

In Christ,
Michael
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« Reply #221 on: November 13, 2007, 10:58:57 AM »

P.S.--God bless Joe Monahan! He moderated the now defunct forum with much wisdom and charity. Joe will always be in my prayers.
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« Reply #222 on: November 13, 2007, 11:00:42 AM »

I believe that C Answers found themselves in a quandary. I cannot help but to see myself as an example. ...
Peace and blessings to all!

Mickey
Hi Mickey,
Thanks for the beautiful testimonial. Your story seems so much like mine, I feel like we have known each other forever.

I also (I am sure you remember  Wink ) made the final decision to convert while posting as a Ruthenian on CAF and ByzCath.

Small world...

In Christ, always

Michael
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« Reply #223 on: November 13, 2007, 11:01:29 AM »

I believe that C Answers found themselves in a quandary. I cannot help but to see myself as an example. Born and raised Roman Catholic, I canonically switched to the Ruthenian Catholic Church after 35 + years. As a Byzantine Catholic, I was exposed to everything Orthodox. When I found C Answers, I was a staunch defender of Rome and I debated rigorously with the Orthodox members in defence of communion with Rome. At times I had some monumental battles--hi Bob!  Grin

But as I studied the faith, I slowly came to learn that my arguments were not holding as much water as I had anticipated. After much study, prayer, and discernment I came home to Holy Orthodoxy.  Suddenly, I found myself shoulder to shoulder with the same people that I vigorously opposed. The Roman Catholics were not pleased.  I received some disconcerting private messages.

In short, I discovered that you cannot oppose the truth. Holy Orthodoxy effortlessly answers all Roman Catholic objections. The cause of my conversion was not the Orthodox posters at Catholic Answers. It was the Holy Spirit revealing the truth to my heart.  Ironically, I believe that more people may consider Holy Orthodoxy after they witness the oppressive measures that were taken by the moderators.

I learned much from my years on that forum. I thank all of my Orthodox and Eastern Catholic brethren for the wonderful information they contributed. And I ask forgiveness for all I may have offended.

Special thanks to Arsenios and others who posted the information about the movie "Ostrov".  I weep every time I watch it. This movie truly conveys the essence of Holy Orthodoxy!

Peace and blessings to all!

Mickey
Amazing story Mickey, and very well balanced. Thanks.
Being "cradle" Orthodox, I personally love hearing about people's different journeys to Orthodoxy, and I've watched many of these journeys in the past few years on OCnet. To give you guys some idea of how insulated my life is: I never knew Catholic Answers Forum even existed before you guys started this thread!
I'm also learning a lot about being a moderator listening to you guys, and the responsibility it carries. I really feel for the moderator you guys mention, Joe Monahan, and you all obviously liked him.
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« Reply #224 on: November 13, 2007, 11:04:55 AM »

Hi Mickey,
Thanks for the beautiful testimonial. Your story seems so much like mine, I feel like we have known each other forever.
Perhaps we are long lost brothers!  Smiley
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