OrthodoxChristianity.net
October 31, 2014, 06:09:39 AM *
Welcome, Guest. Please login or register.

Login with username, password and session length
News: Reminder: No political discussions in the public fora.  If you do not have access to the private Politics Forum, please send a PM to Fr. George.
 
   Home   Help Calendar Contact Treasury Tags Login Register  
Pages: 1   Go Down
  Print  
Author Topic: Men and Church  (Read 3820 times) Average Rating: 0
0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.
Tamara
Archon
********
Offline Offline

Faith: Orthodox Christian
Jurisdiction: Antiochian Orthodox Diocese of America
Posts: 2,208


+Pray for Orthodox Unity+


« on: October 08, 2007, 01:02:49 PM »

Men and Church
Frederica Mathewes-Greene | October 2, 2007

In a time when churches of every description are faced with Vanishing Male Syndrome, men are showing up at Eastern Orthodox churches in numbers that, if not numerically impressive, are proportionately intriguing. This may be the only church which attracts and holds men in numbers equal to women. As Leon Podles wrote in his 1999 book, The Church Impotent: The Feminization of Christianity, “The Orthodox are the only Christians who write basso profundo church music, or need to.”


Rather than guess why this is, I emailed a hundred Orthodox men, most of whom joined the Church as adults. What do they think makes this church particularly attractive to men? Their responses, below, may spark some ideas for leaders in other churches, who are looking for ways to keep guys in the pews.

you can read the rest of the article here:  http://www.frederica.com/writings/men-and-church.html
Logged
zebu
Mot à ta mère!
Elder
*****
Offline Offline

Faith: Orthodox Christian
Jurisdiction: ROCOR
Posts: 338

aimovoroi tourkoi!


« Reply #1 on: October 08, 2007, 01:34:47 PM »

This really is quite an interesting phenomenon.  Indeed, I myself have been to weekday Divine Liturgies where 100% of those present were men! Granted, in those instances, there were 10 or less people present, but still.  So much for those who think the church is composed of old ladies!
Logged

Жизнь прожить не поле перейти
Simayan
Site Supporter
High Elder
*****
Offline Offline

Faith: Orthodox Christian
Jurisdiction: Ecumenical Patriarchate - GOA
Posts: 816



« Reply #2 on: October 08, 2007, 01:35:26 PM »

I think it boils down to the fact men want something stable in something as large as a church. Orthodoxy isn't some fragile and superficial piece of china that will eventually shatter.
Logged

"He will wipe every tear from their eyes, and there will be no more death, nor mourning nor crying nor suffering, for the old order of things has passed away."
lubeltri
Latin Catholic layman
Protokentarchos
*********
Offline Offline

Faith: Catholic
Jurisdiction: Archdiocese of Boston
Posts: 3,795



« Reply #3 on: October 08, 2007, 01:38:35 PM »

I read this when it came out. LOL. This silly and triumphalist stuff, backed up by no real evidence, will do more to deter men in other communions from joining Eastern Orthodoxy than compel them. I'm sorry to disappoint you, Frederica, but I don't need to join your Church of Schwarzeneggar to feel all martial and masculine. I'm fine in my Girly-Man church, thank you. Smiley
Logged
lubeltri
Latin Catholic layman
Protokentarchos
*********
Offline Offline

Faith: Catholic
Jurisdiction: Archdiocese of Boston
Posts: 3,795



« Reply #4 on: October 08, 2007, 01:44:08 PM »

Rod Dreher posted this on his blog last week, and it engendered a great discussion. Read the comments:

http://blog.beliefnet.com/crunchycon/2007/10/frederica-on-orthodoxy-and-men-1.html.comments.html
Logged
Heorhij
Merarches
***********
Offline Offline

Faith: Orthodox
Jurisdiction: GOA, for now, but my heart belongs to the Ukrainian Orthodox Church
Posts: 8,576



WWW
« Reply #5 on: October 08, 2007, 01:58:29 PM »

Much as I loved Presbytera Mathewes-Green's book titled "The Illumined Heart," I just did not get this analysis on men and the Orthodox Church, at all. Sad
Logged

Love never fails.
Fr. George
formerly "Cleveland"
Administrator
Stratopedarches
*******
Offline Offline

Faith: Orthodox (Catholic) Christian
Jurisdiction: GOA - Metropolis of Pittsburgh
Posts: 20,095


May the Lord bless you and keep you always!


« Reply #6 on: October 08, 2007, 02:28:51 PM »

This silly and triumphalist stuff, backed up by no real evidence, will do more to deter men in other communions from joining Eastern Orthodoxy than compel them.

"backed up by no real evidence"
Which parts are you talking about?  ISTM that most of the article was quotes from the emails she got back.  So it's not claiming to be some sort of factual article, but rather a survey summary. 

I'm sorry to disappoint you, Frederica, but I don't need to join your Church of Schwarzeneggar to feel all martial and masculine. I'm fine in my Girly-Man church, thank you. Smiley

Unrelated to my disagreeing with you: since we do live in the Internet age and all, it would be best if one were to look up the spelling of a proper name before using it, especially one as recognizable as Schwarzenegger.
Logged

"The man who doesn't read good books has no advantage over the one who can't read them." Mark Twain
---------------------
Ordained on 17 & 18-Oct 2009. Please forgive me if earlier posts are poorly worded or incorrect in any way.
Maksim
Member
***
Offline Offline

Posts: 86


« Reply #7 on: October 08, 2007, 02:30:42 PM »

While some of her points confused me a little, I think there's definitely some truth to what she says.  There are plenty of people out there who think that the "real Jesus" is some sort of non-threatening hippie character, which is probably particularly repelling to men (which is not to say that it's compelling to most women, either).

As an example of just how startling Orthodoxy is to some, take the reading from Ephesians during the Orthodox marriage ceremony.  I have actually known some non-Orthodox to take offense to this reading, emphasizing as it does the self-denying obligations of husbands and wives to one another.  It's far out of step with the "religion of inoffensive self-affirmation" message that many expect to hear.  And for some people (both men and women), hearing the ancient faith openly proclaimed can be a refreshing jolt.
Logged
lubeltri
Latin Catholic layman
Protokentarchos
*********
Offline Offline

Faith: Catholic
Jurisdiction: Archdiocese of Boston
Posts: 3,795



« Reply #8 on: October 08, 2007, 02:37:42 PM »

"backed up by no real evidence"
Which parts are you talking about?  ISTM that most of the article was quotes from the emails she got back.  So it's not claiming to be some sort of factual article, but rather a survey summary. 

So it's just a fluff piece, eh? Then why does it begin with a clear argument? Are we supposed to accept these bold claims without evidence/data to back them up?

In a time when churches of every description are faced with Vanishing Male Syndrome, men are showing up at Eastern Orthodox churches in numbers that, if not numerically impressive, are proportionately intriguing. This may be the only church which attracts and holds men in numbers equal to women. As Leon Podles wrote in his 1999 book, The Church Impotent: The Feminization of Christianity, "The Orthodox are the only Christians who write basso profundo church music, or need to."

Rather than guess why this is . . . .


So she's not guessing.  Hmm. . .
Logged
Sophie
Sr. Member
****
Offline Offline

Posts: 217


« Reply #9 on: October 08, 2007, 02:44:40 PM »

Much as I loved Presbytera Mathewes-Green's book titled "The Illumined Heart," I just did not get this analysis on men and the Orthodox Church, at all. Sad

I had no idea who Presbytera Mathewes-Green is - still ignore much about her in fact - and do not get this analysis either.

I think it boils down to the fact men want something stable in something as large as a church. Orthodoxy isn't some fragile and superficial piece of china that will eventually shatter.

Right, this I guess is what it is about, we ALL do when it comes to look for a Church. The truth is large and stable when it is the Truth. It is not only about men and it is not about simple philosophy.

I read this when it came out. LOL. This silly and triumphalist stuff, backed up by no real evidence, will do more to deter men in other communions from joining Eastern Orthodoxy than compel them. I'm sorry to disappoint you, Frederica, but I don't need to join your Church of Schwarzeneggar to feel all martial and masculine. I'm fine in my Girly-Man church, thank you. Smiley

I comprehend your spirit. Maybe it would deter or maybe it would arise curiosity.Still, it is not a theological approach, it is rather a  social one. It is an observation. I am unsure whether this type of article would appeal to someone looking for a Church. Perhaps it would to someone investigating various ones.Not sure...
Logged

"Thoughts are like airplanes flying in the air. If you ignore them, there is no problem. If you pay attention to them, you create an airport inside your head and permit them to land!" (Priestmonk Christodoulos Aggeloglou, Elder Paisios of the Holy Mountain Mount Athos, Greece, 1998,pp. 29-30, 48)
Tamara
Archon
********
Offline Offline

Faith: Orthodox Christian
Jurisdiction: Antiochian Orthodox Diocese of America
Posts: 2,208


+Pray for Orthodox Unity+


« Reply #10 on: October 08, 2007, 02:55:09 PM »

Here is an interesting article from Touchstone by the author Frederica mentions. His numbers come from George Barna surveys.
http://touchstonemag.com/archives/article.php?id=14-01-026-f

Missing Fathers of the Church

The Feminization of the Church & the Need for Christian Fatherhood

by Leon J. Podles

You may have noticed that, in general, men are not as interested in religion as women are. There are usually more women than men at Sunday mass, and there are far more women than men at devotions, retreats, and prayer groups. The men who do come are often there because wives or girlfriends have put pressure on them to attend. In fact, if men speak honestly, they will tell you that men have a general feeling that the Church is for women. They may add that women are more emotional than men are, or that religion is a crutch that a man doesn’t need, as Jesse Ventura, the candidate of young white men, said in Playboy.

[further on he writes:]

Nor do women simply join churches more than men do. They also are more active and loyal. Of Americans in the mid-1990s, George Barna writes that “women are twice as likely to attend a church service during any given week. Women are also 50 percent more likely than men to say they are ‘religious’ and to state that they are ‘absolutely committed’ to the Christian faith.”4 The differences seem to be increasing rapidly. In 1992, 43 percent of men attended church; in 1996, only 28 percent.5 Patrick Arnold, a Jesuit of liberal theological leanings, claims that at churches he has visited, “it is not at all unusual to find a female-to-male ratio of 2:1 or 3:1. I have seen ratios in parish churches as high as 7:1.” Women are more active in all activities of the church, both in public and social activities, such as peace and justice committees, and in spiritual activities, such as prayer and Bible study.

Church attendance in the United States is about 60 percent female and 40 percent male. The more liberal the denomination, the higher the percentage of females. Fundamentalists are almost evenly divided, but the only religions that sometimes show a majority of men are Eastern Orthodoxy, Orthodox Judaism, Islam, and Eastern religions such as Buddhism. Men say they believe in God as much as women do, but the more Christian a practice or belief becomes, the fewer men will own up to it. Men go to church less than women do, they pray far less than women do, and they believe in the afterlife and heaven and hell far less than women do.

Logged
Ian Lazarus
The Main Man!
OC.net guru
*******
Offline Offline

Faith: Eastern Orthodox Christian
Jurisdiction: AOA
Posts: 1,545


yIjah, Qey' 'oH!


« Reply #11 on: October 08, 2007, 02:55:50 PM »

In my experience, the analysis is true.  I, along with most of the converts I know are men.  It's the challenge, the monasticism, the spirituality, and above all, the presence of Christ felt like nowhere else.  At least, that is the consensus where me and my buds are concerned.  
Logged

"For I am With thee, withersoever thou goest"

Joshua 1:9
lubeltri
Latin Catholic layman
Protokentarchos
*********
Offline Offline

Faith: Catholic
Jurisdiction: Archdiocese of Boston
Posts: 3,795



« Reply #12 on: October 08, 2007, 03:00:48 PM »

It's troubling, too, I think, the implied idea that the other churches are ladies' churches, where things are easy and not spritually rigorous. This stuff reminds me of Ann Coulter, who recently said that if only women had never gotten the right to vote, we wouldn't have all that "female" stuff like anti-poverty legislation and diplomacy instead of war.

I know if my Baptist father, big and burly and a former boxer, Marine and cop, ever walked into an Orthodox church, with all the kissing of pretty pictures and pretty vestments, perfumed incense, etc., he would think it a church for "queers," as he calls homosexuals. Of course, it is no such thing! But it shows how all this stuff about how "my church is more manly than yours" is silly and pointless.
Logged
Elisha
Warned
Protokentarchos
*********
Offline Offline

Faith: Orthodox
Jurisdiction: OCA
Posts: 4,452


« Reply #13 on: October 08, 2007, 03:01:32 PM »

As an example of just how startling Orthodoxy is to some, take the reading from Ephesians during the Orthodox marriage ceremony.  I have actually known some non-Orthodox to take offense to this reading, emphasizing as it does the self-denying obligations of husbands and wives to one another.  It's far out of step with the "religion of inoffensive self-affirmation" message that many expect to hear.  And for some people (both men and women), hearing the ancient faith openly proclaimed can be a refreshing jolt.

I sang at a wedding yesterday where the Epistle was in Slavonic and Gospel in English (the Wedding was about 50/50).  Now there's a way to bypass the potential "offense" - make it so those attending don't understand it!
Logged
Fr. George
formerly "Cleveland"
Administrator
Stratopedarches
*******
Offline Offline

Faith: Orthodox (Catholic) Christian
Jurisdiction: GOA - Metropolis of Pittsburgh
Posts: 20,095


May the Lord bless you and keep you always!


« Reply #14 on: October 08, 2007, 03:04:47 PM »

So it's just a fluff piece, eh? Then why does it begin with a clear argument? Are we supposed to accept these bold claims without evidence/data to back them up?

In a time when churches of every description are faced with Vanishing Male Syndrome, men are showing up at Eastern Orthodox churches in numbers that, if not numerically impressive, are proportionately intriguing. This may be the only church which attracts and holds men in numbers equal to women. As Leon Podles wrote in his 1999 book, The Church Impotent: The Feminization of Christianity, "The Orthodox are the only Christians who write basso profundo church music, or need to."

Rather than guess why this is . . . .


So she's not guessing.  Hmm. . .

Okay- so ask for the one piece of evidence.  90% of the article is email responses, and you've got an objection to the first 4 lines.  Does that mean that you dismiss the article out-of-hand?  Her emailed question doesn't begin with the false premise, or even include it in the question.  She asks a general question.

To a certain degree, yes, it is a "fluff" piece - one not designed to factually grab someone and convince them of Orthodoxy; rather, like many fluff pieces, it takes human observation and popular thought and engages the reader to either agree or disagree with the thought - and if they're not sure, to actually research it themselves.

She actually clearly shows the fact that it is not a research-based conclusion when she says "This may be the only Church" - leaving the possibility open that she is wrong because she doesn't know.  Her first claim could use some numerical backing: that the M-F ratio in Orthodoxy is significant and intriguing with regards to the "Vanishing Male Syndrome" comment.  Otherwise, she leaves the door wide open.
Logged

"The man who doesn't read good books has no advantage over the one who can't read them." Mark Twain
---------------------
Ordained on 17 & 18-Oct 2009. Please forgive me if earlier posts are poorly worded or incorrect in any way.
Fr. George
formerly "Cleveland"
Administrator
Stratopedarches
*******
Offline Offline

Faith: Orthodox (Catholic) Christian
Jurisdiction: GOA - Metropolis of Pittsburgh
Posts: 20,095


May the Lord bless you and keep you always!


« Reply #15 on: October 08, 2007, 03:07:12 PM »

So it's just a fluff piece, eh? Then why does it begin with a clear argument? Are we supposed to accept these bold claims without evidence/data to back them up? 

You don't have to accept it.  But if you want to stir up debate about it, take it to another forum.  To wit:

Beloved in the Lord,

The purpose of the Convert issues forum is to provide a a place on the OC.Net where inquirers, catechumen, and newly converted could ask their questions about the Orthodox Faith in a safe and supportive forum without retribution or recrimination. Many of those posting in this area are ignorant of Orthodox teachings and are using this forum to understand what are the basic teachings and practices of the Orthodox churches. Due to the simplicity of many of their requests and responses, direct and simple answers with sources if possible are most helpful.

If the moderators find that the discusions become faith or jurisdiction debates, the topic will be split and sent the appropriate OC.Net forum to continue the discussion or debate. As a poster,You may also ask that a topic be split so that a private discussion can be established to go into detail about the issues that you feel adamant about and wish to debate or discuss. The convert forum is not a place for combative debate or arguement. 

Thank you for your following these guidelines to the edification and spiritual growth of the forum inquirers, catechumen, and newly converted.

In Christ,
Thomas
Convert Forum Moderator
Logged

"The man who doesn't read good books has no advantage over the one who can't read them." Mark Twain
---------------------
Ordained on 17 & 18-Oct 2009. Please forgive me if earlier posts are poorly worded or incorrect in any way.
Schultz
Christian. Guitarist. Zymurgist. Librarian.
Taxiarches
**********
Offline Offline

Faith: Orthodox Christian
Jurisdiction: OCA
Posts: 6,482


Scion of the McKeesport Becks.


WWW
« Reply #16 on: October 08, 2007, 03:11:53 PM »

Anecdotally speaking, I see in actual practice at the Orthodox churches I've attended around Baltimore (Khouria Frederica's own stomping grounds) the opposite, especially for Vespers.  While I haven't actually counted, I would put the ratio at 3:2, women to men, on any given service in any given church (except, perhaps, Khouria's own church which I have yet to visit).  I recently attended Vespers at St. Mary AOC in Hunt Valley and, aside from some boys there with their mothers, I was one of three men in the assembled congregation of about 30.

At DL at St. Andrew's in Baltimore City last week, the ratio of men to women was somewhat higher, about 1 in 3.  It's still a far cry from the numbers Khouria is intimating.

But, as I wrote, these are my anecdotes.  That's the problem with anecdotes; they can unintentionally lie just as much as statistics can.
Logged

"Hearing a nun's confession is like being stoned to death with popcorn." --Abp. Fulton Sheen
Αριστοκλής
Merarches
***********
Offline Offline

Faith: Orthodox Catholic
Jurisdiction: American Carpatho-Russian Orthodox Diocese
Posts: 10,026


« Reply #17 on: October 08, 2007, 03:17:45 PM »

Well, if you're looking at Vespers you're probably looking at Slavic parishes; Antiochian (her church) may have other experiences.
Logged

"Religion is a neurobiological illness and Orthodoxy is its cure." - Fr. John S. Romanides
Schultz
Christian. Guitarist. Zymurgist. Librarian.
Taxiarches
**********
Offline Offline

Faith: Orthodox Christian
Jurisdiction: OCA
Posts: 6,482


Scion of the McKeesport Becks.


WWW
« Reply #18 on: October 08, 2007, 03:19:03 PM »

Well, if you're looking at Vespers you're probably looking at Slavic parishes; Antiochian (her church) may have other experiences.

The church I mentioned about where I attended Vespers was an Antiochan church. Smiley

Logged

"Hearing a nun's confession is like being stoned to death with popcorn." --Abp. Fulton Sheen
Veniamin
Fire for Effect!
Archon
********
Offline Offline

Faith: Orthodox Christian
Jurisdiction: OCA Diocese of the South
Posts: 3,372


St. Barbara, patroness of the Field Artillery


« Reply #19 on: October 08, 2007, 03:19:37 PM »

The ratio overall seems like there's a higher female to male ratio.  However, when looking at only converts, it seems the higher male to female ration FM-G discusses is more readily apparent.  It also seems, again from my anecdotal experiences, that men are more likely to find Orthodoxy on their own, while women are more likely to be brought to it by a significant other.  It seems like the male converts seem to come in on their own, while the female seem to come in with a male parishioner.
Logged

Artillery adds dignity to what would otherwise be a vulgar brawl. ~Frederick the Great
Αριστοκλής
Merarches
***********
Offline Offline

Faith: Orthodox Catholic
Jurisdiction: American Carpatho-Russian Orthodox Diocese
Posts: 10,026


« Reply #20 on: October 08, 2007, 03:33:33 PM »

The church I mentioned about where I attended Vespers was an Antiochan church. Smiley



I'm impressed! Both by you and the Antiochians!
Logged

"Religion is a neurobiological illness and Orthodoxy is its cure." - Fr. John S. Romanides
Schultz
Christian. Guitarist. Zymurgist. Librarian.
Taxiarches
**********
Offline Offline

Faith: Orthodox Christian
Jurisdiction: OCA
Posts: 6,482


Scion of the McKeesport Becks.


WWW
« Reply #21 on: October 08, 2007, 03:35:37 PM »

I'm impressed! Both by you and the Antiochians!

ha!  to be completely open, it was a reader's service, but it's my understanding that the priest is there usually.  had i known it was a reader's service that week, i would have just stayed home and do the same thing i do most every week: a reader's service!  Grin
Logged

"Hearing a nun's confession is like being stoned to death with popcorn." --Abp. Fulton Sheen
Ian Lazarus
The Main Man!
OC.net guru
*******
Offline Offline

Faith: Eastern Orthodox Christian
Jurisdiction: AOA
Posts: 1,545


yIjah, Qey' 'oH!


« Reply #22 on: October 08, 2007, 03:40:47 PM »

Oh yeah!  We have vespers rain or shine at my parish, and it's the same with all the other parishes here in H-town.  Chanters and all.

To all my Greek brothers out there, please don't take this as a snipe.  I have been to several churches in my area, and in my experience, none of the Greek churches hold vespers or confession on a regular basis.  In fact, the last time I was at a vespers in a Greek church I was chanting, and Metropolitan Isaiah was present, and he had to instruct the crowd how to go through it.  It seemed kind of embarrasing.

Not to say that the Antiochians have spades as far as that's concerned.  In my parish, some 650 families, we get a Vespers attendance of 20-30.  If we're lucky.  Sad  
« Last Edit: October 08, 2007, 03:43:17 PM by Ian Lazarus » Logged

"For I am With thee, withersoever thou goest"

Joshua 1:9
Tamara
Archon
********
Offline Offline

Faith: Orthodox Christian
Jurisdiction: Antiochian Orthodox Diocese of America
Posts: 2,208


+Pray for Orthodox Unity+


« Reply #23 on: October 08, 2007, 03:44:06 PM »

The ratio overall seems like there's a higher female to male ratio.  However, when looking at only converts, it seems the higher male to female ration FM-G discusses is more readily apparent.  It also seems, again from my anecdotal experiences, that men are more likely to find Orthodoxy on their own, while women are more likely to be brought to it by a significant other.  It seems like the male converts seem to come in on their own, while the female seem to come in with a male parishioner.

One young man convinced his whole family to join our parish. The family includes his father, mother, and their five teenage daughters. The father is ready to be chrismated but he is waiting for his daughters to join him.

Growing up in the church I noticed that both husbands and wives would attend Divine Liturgy (not Vespers...what can I say... we were cradle middle-easterners!  Cheesy).  The only time this wasn't the case was when a woman of middle-eastern extraction was married to someone who wasn't Orthodox. But if the man was married to a non-Orthodox woman she would attend Divine Liturgy with her husband.
Logged
Αριστοκλής
Merarches
***********
Offline Offline

Faith: Orthodox Catholic
Jurisdiction: American Carpatho-Russian Orthodox Diocese
Posts: 10,026


« Reply #24 on: October 08, 2007, 03:45:56 PM »

No offense taken. Our ACROD parish has weekly Vespers but no Orthros as our Greek parish does.
Logged

"Religion is a neurobiological illness and Orthodoxy is its cure." - Fr. John S. Romanides
Maksim
Member
***
Offline Offline

Posts: 86


« Reply #25 on: October 08, 2007, 04:08:30 PM »

Anecdotally speaking, I see in actual practice at the Orthodox churches I've attended around Baltimore (Khouria Frederica's own stomping grounds) the opposite, especially for Vespers.  While I haven't actually counted, I would put the ratio at 3:2, women to men, on any given service in any given church (except, perhaps, Khouria's own church which I have yet to visit).  I recently attended Vespers at St. Mary AOC in Hunt Valley and, aside from some boys there with their mothers, I was one of three men in the assembled congregation of about 30.

I think this can vary for a lot of reasons.  At the parish I usually attend, the Saturday vigil and Sunday liturgy are close to 50/50.  On the other hand, daytime services during the week tend to be primarily attended by women, mainly mothers with children or older women.  I think this is a function of work obligations (and the fact that women generally outlive their husbands anyway), more than anything else.

Either way though, many "mainline" churches would be happy to have a 3:2 female/male ratio.
Logged
scamandrius
Crusher of Secrets; House Lannister
Warned
Taxiarches
**********
Offline Offline

Faith: Greek Orthodox Christian
Jurisdiction: I'm Greek and proud of it, damn it!
Posts: 6,192



« Reply #26 on: October 08, 2007, 05:18:35 PM »

Anecdotally speaking, I see in actual practice at the Orthodox churches I've attended around Baltimore (Khouria Frederica's own stomping grounds) the opposite, especially for Vespers.  While I haven't actually counted, I would put the ratio at 3:2, women to men, on any given service in any given church (except, perhaps, Khouria's own church which I have yet to visit).  I recently attended Vespers at St. Mary AOC in Hunt Valley and, aside from some boys there with their mothers, I was one of three men in the assembled congregation of about 30.

At the Antiochian parish I attend, it is the women who come out for Vespers and Orthros.  The only men are usually the priest, myself and my fellow chanter.  The other 5-10 people in the congregation are almost entirely women. 
Logged

I seek the truth by which no man was ever harmed--Marcus Aurelius

Those who do not read  history are doomed to get their facts from Hollywood--Anonymous

What earthly joy remains untouched by grief?--St. John Damascene
pensateomnia
Bibliophylax
Archon
********
Offline Offline

Faith: Greek Orthodox Christian
Posts: 2,359


metron ariston


« Reply #27 on: October 08, 2007, 07:21:03 PM »

Just went to a fairly well attended Pan-Orthodox Vespers and lecture event. This time it was at an Antiochian parish. There were probably 60 people there. Not bad. I would guess the ratio was 2:1 in favor of women. Even more significantly, there were probably only 6 people there under the age of 45. However, four of those six younger people were male converts, including me. Not quite sure what that means.

Anecdotes aside, I know there were 23,823 converts who entered the Church through Holy Chrismation in the GOA from 1982 to 2006. I haven't seen any breakdown by gender. It would be interesting to see hard numbers broken down by gender in all jurisdictions.
Logged

But for I am a man not textueel I wol noght telle of textes neuer a deel. (Chaucer, The Manciple's Tale, 1.131)
Tags:
Pages: 1   Go Up
  Print  
 
Jump to:  

Powered by MySQL Powered by PHP Powered by SMF 1.1.18 | SMF © 2013, Simple Machines Valid XHTML 1.0! Valid CSS!
Page created in 0.101 seconds with 55 queries.