Author Topic: What form does the Coptic Holy Gifts take?  (Read 3026 times)

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Offline Loukas

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What form does the Coptic Holy Gifts take?
« on: October 03, 2002, 05:22:59 PM »
Our bishop allows some local Copts who don't have their own facilities (or priest) to use ours about once every six weeks. They use a large room upstairs to do their Liturgy, and they have a flying priest come in from San Antonio or elsewhere. I have also seen their bishop from Los Angeles there at one time. They come in on Saturday mornings. Anyhow, I was wondering what form of eucharistic elements they use. (homemade bread?, spoon?, wafers?, intinction?)

luke

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Re:What form does the Coptic Holy Gifts take?
« Reply #1 on: October 03, 2002, 05:33:00 PM »
Glory to Jesus Christ!

they have a flying priest come in

Luke, you've just GOT to take a picture of a flying priest for us!  Is it anything like the flying Nun? ;) :P God Bless!
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Offline Loukas

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Re:What form does the Coptic Holy Gifts take?
« Reply #2 on: October 03, 2002, 08:34:47 PM »
Glory to Jesus Christ!

they have a flying priest come in

Luke, you've just GOT to take a picture of a flying priest for us!  Is it anything like the flying Nun? ;) :P God Bless!

Hi Nik. Uhh, he takes off his wings before he gets to the church  ;)

Offline Fortunatus

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Re:What form does the Coptic Holy Gifts take?
« Reply #3 on: October 07, 2002, 11:51:41 AM »
I, too, would love to meet this flying priest of ours.  ;D I know of many of our monks that are "spirit-born", but flying ones I have yet to meet. :)
Anyway, we use leavened bread that we make ourselves.

Peace and grace.
Agape,
          Fortunatus
Amen, maranatha!
Agape,
         Fortunatus
Amen, maranatha!
"A man's life or death cometh from his neighbour; if we benefit our brother we benefit ourselves, and if we offend him we sin against God." - The Great Abba Antony

Offline Loukas

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Re:What form does the Coptic Holy Gifts take?
« Reply #4 on: October 22, 2002, 10:48:22 PM »
Anyway, we use leavened bread that we make ourselves.

Thanks, Fortunatus. Are you served by spoon as well?

Love, loukas

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Offline Fortunatus

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Re:What form does the Coptic Holy Gifts take?
« Reply #5 on: October 22, 2002, 10:51:10 PM »
Hey there! Yes, indeed we are. :) I generally love being spoon-fed, it's a weakness of mine. ;)
Agape,
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Amen, maranatha!
"A man's life or death cometh from his neighbour; if we benefit our brother we benefit ourselves, and if we offend him we sin against God." - The Great Abba Antony

Offline Raouf

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Re:What form does the Coptic Holy Gifts take?
« Reply #6 on: October 23, 2002, 11:43:01 AM »
Dear Loukas,

Unlike the Eastern Orthodox, the Copts take the Body and Blood separately. The Body is given by the priest directly from his right hand into the communicant's mouth, and the Blood is given by spoon.

In Christ,
Raouf
Flog your enemies with the Name of Jesus and let the remembrance of Jesus be present with each breath. - St. John Climacus

Offline Loukas

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Re:What form does the Coptic Holy Gifts take?
« Reply #7 on: October 23, 2002, 02:02:20 PM »
Unlike the Eastern Orthodox, the Copts take the Body and Blood separately. The Body is given by the priest directly from his right hand into the communicant's mouth, and the Blood is given by spoon.

Ahh, very interesting. Okay, thanks.

Hypo-Ortho

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Re:What form does the Coptic Holy Gifts take?
« Reply #8 on: October 23, 2002, 03:31:51 PM »
Dear Loukas,

Unlike the Eastern Orthodox, the Copts take the Body and Blood separately. The Body is given by the priest directly from his right hand into the communicant's mouth, and the Blood is given by spoon.

In Christ,
Raouf

Raouf, I'm trying to picture this--my imagination makes it appear a bit complicated.  How does the priest hold the Chalice and spoon to facilitate communing the faithful with the Precious Blood if the Body is given directly by the priest's right hand into the communicant's mouth?  Are both the Chalice and spoon meanwhile held in the priest's left hand?  It  appears to me that it would be quite a balancing act to administer the Precious Blood separately like this.  Or do the communicants *return* to the priest after all have received the Sacred Body and then all only receive the Precious Blood from the spoon the second time around?

Hypo-Ortho

Offline Fortunatus

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Re:What form does the Coptic Holy Gifts take?
« Reply #9 on: October 23, 2002, 05:53:24 PM »
lol - you are correct. If only one priest is serving, the Holy Body is first given (deacons, men, then women), then everyone returns for the blood (deacons, men women). In the case where more than one priest is serving, the priest of higher rank distributes the Body and the other priest distributes the Blood, and you take both right away (e.g. take the Body, and move up to take the Blood).

It is time consuming when there is one priest, but Communion *is* the best part of the Liturgy, no?
Agape,
         Fortunatus
Amen, maranatha!
"A man's life or death cometh from his neighbour; if we benefit our brother we benefit ourselves, and if we offend him we sin against God." - The Great Abba Antony

Hypo-Ortho

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Re:What form does the Coptic Holy Gifts take?
« Reply #10 on: October 23, 2002, 07:05:18 PM »
lol - you are correct. If only one priest is serving, the Holy Body is first given (deacons, men, then women), then everyone returns for the blood (deacons, men women). In the case where more than one priest is serving, the priest of higher rank distributes the Body and the other priest distributes the Blood, and you take both right away (e.g. take the Body, and move up to take the Blood).

It is time consuming when there is one priest, but Communion *is* the best part of the Liturgy, no?

True, Fortunatus, but what a waste of a deacon if one is present to assist the priest at the Liturgy and there is no second priest!  The deacon customarily administers the Chalice in many of the other Eastern (as well as in the Western) traditions.  Why doesn't this apply in the Coptic recension as well, do you know?

Another question: Is frequent and regular Communion the norm in the Coptic Church or do most parishioners receive perhaps only once or twice a year?

Hypo-Ortho

Offline Raouf

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Re:What form does the Coptic Holy Gifts take?
« Reply #11 on: October 23, 2002, 07:34:58 PM »
Dear Hypo-Ortho,

We Copts have a bad habit of calling everyone who serves as reader or chanter a "deacon". When Fortunatus says deacons go first, he is generally speaking of readers and chanters.

If there is a true Deacon or Arch-Deacon, he can distribute the Precious Blood only, not the Holy Body. Howeber, to be honest, we have very few Deacons in the US. I would say 99.9% of our parishes in the US do not have a true Deacon or Arch-Deacon. I think it is because according to our tradition, a Deacon, like a priest, must be dedicated 100% to the Church, not have a secular job, and wear the traditional cassock and such. So because of the shortage of priests here in the US, we tend to ordain capable and nominated men directly to the priesthood. We figure (I guess) they might as well be able to perform most of the Church's Mysteries as opposed to assisting the priest.

Regarding you second question, I would say that for the majority of Copts, frequent (weekly) communion is the norm. Of course, one must be prepared through confession but no as the Russians (some) practice (i.e. mandatory weekly confession).  The general rule one often hears among the Copts is that monthly confession is somewhat standard.

In Christ,
Raouf
Flog your enemies with the Name of Jesus and let the remembrance of Jesus be present with each breath. - St. John Climacus

Offline Fortunatus

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Re:What form does the Coptic Holy Gifts take?
« Reply #12 on: October 23, 2002, 09:04:13 PM »
Yeah, sorry about that! :(
Agape,
         Fortunatus
Amen, maranatha!
"A man's life or death cometh from his neighbour; if we benefit our brother we benefit ourselves, and if we offend him we sin against God." - The Great Abba Antony

Offline Orthodox11

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Re:What form does the Coptic Holy Gifts take?
« Reply #13 on: August 02, 2009, 06:26:52 PM »
Actually, if you go to an EO DL of St. James (usually celebrated only on St. James day in October, and in certain places like Jerusalem, a few monestaries, etc.), the Body and Blood is also given seperately.

And in some places the Body is even placed into the hand of the communicant.