Is it OK for Orthodox Christians to celebrate Halloween?

[Αριστοκλής]

^

[Schultz]

This is probably going to sound harsh, but without any kind of back-up or support, I wouldn't trust Jack Chick to interpret a greeting card, let alone any kind of scholarly work.  There was one tract of his on D&D, "Dark Dungeons" is the title that listed Tolkien and C. S. Lewis as authors whose works were "satanic".  He'd been told this by someone and accepted it without question.  In a later edition of this work that note was taken out.

Ebor

"Dark Dungeons" is my favorite one, by far.  The fact that there are not one but TWO female players in the game as presented in the story is bad enough, but one of them is actually the Dungeon Master! (FYI: for those non-RPG types, the DM is the person who creates/narrates/presents the storyline/gameworld in which the players play)  Such displays of horrid scholarship turned me against Chick Tracts forevermore

[GabrieltheCelt]

Well, it looks like I got my answer; but you're all wrong and will pay dearly! 

[TinaG]

I hope you'll go ahead and write a little something about how you view Halloween.

Write a little something!  You knew that was going to happen.  Opinions are as freely given out as Halloween candy (at least by 48.6% of us).

[GabrieltheCelt]

Write a little something!  You knew that was going to happen. 

Yes, but most of them wrote the wrong answer...  Juuust kidding.

[minasoliman]

Indeed...a friend of mine gave me the website on Jack Chick and I read the first thing which was anti-RC concerning a son who watched his mom die while suffering some sort of possession.  It was the strangest thing, and it was a great turn-off.  It's sad that our sources in rejecting Halloween comes from irrational and mentally deranged sources like Chick.

In any case, I'm a sucker for Hershey's Cookies and Creme.  In fact, any white chocolate will win me over.  Not a big fan of milk chocolate (and dark chocolate..yuk!).  Does anyone know anybody who can bake a white chocolate ice cream cake?

God bless.

[Ian Lazarus]

Does anyone know anybody who can bake a white chocolate ice cream cake?

I can.  I also do something that I have dubbed (thanks to Homestarrunner.com) "This Brownie Might Kill You", which is hommade brownie filled with Tin Roof ice cream, coverd in ganache, and topped with almonds and chocolate sprinkles.  And whpiied cream, when the mood suits.

[minasoliman]

I can.  I also do something that I have dubbed (thanks to Homestarrunner.com) "This Brownie Might Kill You", which is hommade brownie filled with Tin Roof ice cream, coverd in ganache, and topped with almonds and chocolate sprinkles.  And whpiied cream, when the mood suits.

DUDE...where do you live!!!??? lol

[Ian Lazarus]

Texas, where else!

But if you want the recepie, I can probably write it up and post it.

I usually do it by memory, though.  The main ingredient is alot of...butterfat!

HA!  Thought I was gonna say love, didn't ya!

Nah, Just foolin. 

[EofK]

BTW,  the movie EVENT HORIZON gave me the jibbluies more than the above listed movies.  It's just that scary.

Oh man... I made the mistake of watching that in college when I was home alone.  I shut it off halfway through and slept with the lights on... when my roommate came back the next day, we finished it together and I still had to sleep with lights on for a week.  Interesting concept for a film, but very disturbing.

[Ian Lazarus]

Oh man... I made the mistake of watching that in college when I was home alone.  I shut it off halfway through and slept with the lights on... when my roommate came back the next day, we finished it together and I still had to sleep with lights on for a week.  Interesting concept for a film, but very disturbing.

Tell me about it.  the most disturbing part for me is when I fugured out the message in Latin "Liberate tutte lei ex inferis" with all that blood and gore spilling out.  "Save yourselves from Hell".  AndI saw it in the theatre with only three other people inthe actual room with me.  Complete strangers.  I think we all slept with the lights on that night. 

[EofK]

Tell me about it.  the most disturbing part for me is when I fugured out the message in Latin "Liberate tutte lei ex inferis" with all that blood and gore spilling out.  "Save yourselves from Hell".  AndI saw it in the theatre with only three other people inthe actual room with me.  Complete strangers.  I think we all slept with the lights on that night. 

Ah, I didn't even catch that.  Yeah, the blood and gore was enough to do me in.

[Ian Lazarus]

Well, the whole dang concept was freaky as stink.  I'd buy the movie, if I relly wanted to freak every on of my friends out before halloween.  But I don't think when I have kids I'll let them watch it until they are older.   

[EofK]

My astronomy professor mentioned it when we were talking about black holes and such, so I thought I'd watch it and maybe they'd have something I could apply to astronomy class.  The only thing I learned is how to gouge out eyes and vomit blood.  Valuable lessons, yeah?

[Ian Lazarus]

I could have taught you that!  Just watch "Kill Bill II" while eating gone off blood sausage!  Mission accomplished.

[Nyssa The Hobbit]

"Dark Dungeons" is my favorite one, by far.  The fact that there are not one but TWO female players in the game as presented in the story is bad enough, but one of them is actually the Dungeon Master! (FYI: for those non-RPG types, the DM is the person who creates/narrates/presents the storyline/gameworld in which the players play)  Such displays of horrid scholarship turned me against Chick Tracts forevermore

Actually, I used to play in a D&D group with TWO other female players. 

[Ian Lazarus]

I used to VTM.

[minasoliman]

holla at me with the recipe 

[Ian Lazarus]

Okay.  Gimmie a minute.

[Ian Lazarus]

For the cake:
3 large eggs
1 1/2 cups milk
3/4 cup vegetable oil
2 teaspoons vanilla extract
3 cups granulated sugar
2 3/4 cups all-purpose flour
1 1/8 cups cocoa powder
2 1/4 teaspoons baking powder
2 1/4 teaspoons baking soda
1 1/2 teaspoons salt
1 1/2 cups very hot water

Ice cream center:
1 pint your favorite ice cream, slightly softened (I prefer dark chocolate for contrast)
 
Chocolate Topping:
1 cup heavy cream
8 ounces white chocolate, chopped (or use chips)
 
White Chocolate Trim: (optional)
1/2 cup heavy cream
4 ounces white chocolate, chopped

Preheat oven to 350*F (175*C). Grease a 13 x 9 x 2-inch baking pan and line the bottom and sides with parchment or waxed paper.
In a medium bowl, whisk together the eggs, milk, oil, and vanilla extract; set aside.
In a large mixing bowl, combine the 3 cups sugar, flour, cocoa, baking powder, baking soda, and salt. Add the wet mixture to the flour mixture and mix at low speed of an electric mixer for 5 minutes. Gradually add the hot water while mixing at low speed just until combined. Batter will be thin. Pour the batter into the prepared baking pan.
Bake for 25 to 30 minutes or until wooden pick inserted in center comes out clean. Cool cake in pan on wire rack, then refrigerate, covered, for 1 hour or until ready to assemble cake.
To assemble cake: Place a piece of parchment over the entire cake and then carefully turn it out onto a large work surface. Peel off the original parchment and carefully cut the cake in half lengthwise into 2 layers using a large serrated knife. Place one layer of cake on a rectangular serving platter (or line an upside-down 13 x 17 x 1-inch baking pan with foil). Spread the softened ice cream evenly to the cake edges. Freeze for 15 to 20 minutes.
Once chilled, carefully place the second layer of the cake onto the ice cream layer, cover with parchment paper and gently press down with another baking sheet pan gently to adhere the top layer. Return cake to the freezer.
For the Chocolate Topping: In a small saucepan, heat the 1 cup of cream just to a boil; remove from heat and add the chopped semisweet chocolate and whisk until smooth. Set aside and prepare the White Chocolate Trim.
For the White Chocolate Trim: Repeat the same procedure as for the Chocolate Topping and place it in small pastry bag with a small plain tip.
Remove the cake from the freezer and working quickly, spread the Chocolate Topping evenly over the top of the cake only.
Drizzle straight lines of the White Chocolate Trim across the entire surface of the cake diagonally. Draw a wooden pick back and forth in the opposite direction of the lines to make decorative pattern.
Return finished cake to the freezer until ready to serve

Eat until bursting.

Peace!

[minasoliman]

sweet...i'm saving this...thanks Ian   

[Ian Lazarus]

No prob.  If you want a killer pasta bake or pizza, lemmiekno.

[Ian Lazarus]

Post 450!  YAY!

[Fr. George]

Post 450!  YAY!

*yawn*

Oh, I should be more helpful...

"The journey of 4000 posts begins with 450..."

[Ian Lazarus]

Shees.  Thanks for the sour persimmons, cousin.

[Bono Vox]

Before becoming Orthodox, i came out of the Anglo Catholic tradition. We were always taught Halloween could be used to glorify God. Sure it had pagan origins like the Christmas tree, but it can be turned around and sanctified. As St. Paul said imitate me, we were taught to imitate the saints of God. I think it is not a good idea to dress disgusting or evil, but to imitate something positive and praise worthy. Halloween was the hallowed evening before all saints day. We don't celebrate witches, devils, etc.. We honor Christ in His saints.

We usually put some icons with candles outside the doors during Halloween (We then hand out tracks and ask people if they want to say the sinners prayer ...just kidding). I usually put my old alter server vestments on, or priest costumes on to pass out candy.

[Nigula Qian Zishi]

Turn your monitor upside down while you type?   

Ebor

¡ɐ1oıʌ puɐ 'buıdʎʇ ǝɹɐ noʎ uǝɥʍ pɐǝɥ ɹnoʎ uo puɐʇs oʇ pǝǝu ʇsnظ noʎ 'ʎ11ɐnʇɔɐ

[PeterTheAleut]

Indeed...a friend of mine gave me the website on Jack Chick and I read the first thing which was anti-RC concerning a son who watched his mom die while suffering some sort of possession.  It was the strangest thing, and it was a great turn-off.  It's sad that our sources in rejecting Halloween comes from irrational and mentally deranged sources like Chick.

Volume I of a series on the life and work of Alberto Rivera, I believe.  I read it and believed it when I was a gullible kid.  Now I recognize it as the stuff one would wipe out with toilet paper.

[minasoliman]

Volume I of a series on the life and work of Alberto Rivera, I believe.  I read it and believed it when I was a gullible kid.  Now I recognize it as the stuff one would wipe out with toilet paper.

Ya, that's the one...disgusting and revolting.  I see the worst Muslims as much more righteous than these idiotic wannabe "Christians."

[Didymus]

Deacon Nikolai, how did you do that please?

Volume I of a series on the life and work of Alberto Rivera, I believe.  I read it and believed it when I was a gullible kid.

Are there many of us here who used to be involved with JTC?

I haven't read all of this thread but would you please be able to let me know your view on this issue PeterTheAleut as I'm against Halloween celebrations (which aren't traditionally part of the Australian way anyway) due to association with witches and the like yet I wonder whether my bias is too greatly tilted by JTC or not?

Thank you and pray for me please.

[yes halloween is evil]

Of course, halloween is NOT okay to observe and celebrate. This is so upsetting to see fellow Christians observing it and acting like it's okay. I know all about halloween. I used to love it and it was my favorite day of the year - before I got saved! Then I woke up to the truth. It is evil. It is a pagan observance. Celebrating it at all in any fashion is sin because it is a pagan observance with pagan roots and it completely contradicts the WORD OF GOD. We already have our own fall festival and it's called the Feast Of Tabernacles aka Sukkot which is the fall feast that God set up Himself for us to celebrate (which I just finished observing from 9/26/07 - 10/04/07 as it last eight days). Most Christians don't observe the feasts instituted by God because I believe they are being deceived by satan to not even think about those observances and because they are so caught up in their own "holidays" with pagan roots such as halloween, easter and even Christmas (which I would be happy to tell you about). But, God Himself said to observe the Feast Of Tabernacles:

Leviticus 23:2, 4, 37, 44, . . . the feasts of the LORD, which ye shall proclaim to be holy convocations, even these are My feasts . . . . These are the feasts of the LORD, even holy convocations, which ye shall proclaim in their seasons . . . . These are the feasts of the LORD, which ye shall proclaim to be holy convocations . . . the feasts of the LORD. (God instituted the holiday and requires us to observe it)

Zechariah 14:16-19, "And it shall come to pass, that every one that is left . . . shall even go up from year to year to worship the King, the Lord of hosts, and to keep the Feast of Tabernacles. And it shall be, that whoso will not come up of all the families of the earth unto Jerusalem to worship the King, the Lord of hosts, even upon them shall be no rain. . . . This shall be the punishment of Egypt, and the punishment of all nations that come not up to keep the Feast of Tabernacles." (God requires us to observe it. And this is a prophecy talking about our future when Jesus rules the earth.)

This is a history of halloween from MS Encarta Encyclopedia:

"Many of the ancient peoples of Europe marked the end of the harvest season and the beginning of winter by celebrating a holiday in late autumn. The most important of these holidays to influence later halloween customs was samhain, a holiday observed by the ancient Celts, a tribal people who inhabited most of Western and Central Europe in the first millennium bc. Among the Celts, samhain marked the end of one year and the beginning of the next. It was one of four Celtic holidays linked to important transitions in the annual cycle of seasons.
samhain began at sundown on October 31 and extended into the following day. According to the Celtic pagan religion, known as druidism, the spirits of those who had died in the preceding year roamed the earth on samhain evening. The Celts sought to ward off these spirits with offerings of food and drink. The Celts also built bonfires at sacred hilltop sites and performed rituals, often involving human and animal sacrifices, to honor druid deities.
By the end of the 1st century ad, the Roman Empire had conquered most of the Celtic lands (see Rome, History of). In the process of incorporating the Celts into their empire, the Romans adapted and absorbed some Celtic traditions as part of their own pagan and Catholic religious observances. In Britain, Romans blended local samhain customs with their own pagan harvest festival honoring pomona, goddess of fruit trees. Some scholars have suggested that the game of bobbing for apples derives from this Roman association of the holiday with fruit.
Pure Celtic influences lingered longer on the western fringes of Europe, especially in areas that were never brought firmly under Roman control, such as Ireland, Scotland, and the Brittany region of northwestern France. In these areas, samhain was abandoned only when the local people converted to Christianity during the early Middle Ages, a period that lasted from the 5th to the 15th century. The Roman Catholic Church often incorporated modified versions of older religious traditions in order to win converts. For example, Pope Gregory IV sought to replace samhain with All Saints’ Day in 835. All Souls’ Day, closer in spirit to samhain and modern halloween, was first instituted at a French monastery in 998 and quickly spread throughout Europe. Folk observances linked to these [Christian holidays], including halloween, thus preserved many of the ancient Celtic customs associated with samhain.
halloween traditions thought to be incompatible with Christianity often became linked with Christian folk beliefs about evil spirits. Although such superstitions varied a great deal from place to place, many of the supernatural beings now associated with halloween became fixed in the popular imagination during the late Middle Ages and the Renaissance (14th to 17th century). The jack-o’-lantern, originally carved from a large turnip rather than a pumpkin, originated in medieval Scotland. Various methods of predicting the future, especially concerning matters of romance and marriage, were also prominent features of halloween throughout the British Isles.
Between the 15th and 17th centuries, Europe was seized by a hysterical fear of witches, leading to the persecution of thousands of innocent women. witches were thought to ride flying brooms and to assume the form of black cats. These images of witches soon joined other European superstitions as symbols of halloween."

There are many different resources on the Internet that you can find in order to know the origin of halloween. If you research the history of halloween, as I have, you will find that there is something very wrong about it and it's not only about decorating your house with witches and goblins. It goes even deeper than that. These are only a few Bible quotes that forbid and warn against such practices:

Colossians 2:8: "Beware lest anyone cheat you through philosophy and empty deceit, according to the tradition of men, according to the basic principles of the world, and not according to Christ." (NKJV)

Proverbs 14:12: "There is a way that seems right to a man, But its end is the way of death." (NKJV)

Exodus 23:24: "You shall not bow down to their gods, nor serve them, nor do according to their works; but you shall utterly overthrow them and completely break down their sacred pillars." (NKJV)

Leviticus 18: "...According to the doings of the land of Egypt, where you dwelt, you shall not do; and according to the doings of the land of Canaan, where I am bringing you, you shall not do; nor shall you walk in their ordinances. You shall observe My judgments and keep My ordinances, to walk in them: I am the LORD your God. You shall therefore keep My statutes and My judgments, which if a man does, he shall live by them: I am the LORD." (speaks of some of the abominations that they do) ..."Do not defile yourselves with any of these things; for by all these the nations are defiled, which I am casting out before you. For the land is defiled; therefore I visit the punishment of its iniquity upon it, and the land vomits out its inhabitants. You shall therefore keep My statutes and My judgments, and shall not commit any of these abominations, either any of your own nation or any stranger who dwells among you for all these abominations the men of the land have done, who were before you, and thus the land is defiled, lest the land vomit you out also when you defile it, as it vomited out the nations that were before you. For whoever commits any of these abominations, the persons who commit them shall be cut off from among their people. Therefore you shall keep My ordinance, so that you do not commit any of these abominable customs which were committed before you, and that you do not defile yourselves by them: I am the LORD your God." (NKJV)

Deuteronomy 12:29-32: "When the LORD your God cuts off from before you the nations which you go to dispossess, and you displace them and dwell in their land, take heed to yourself that you are not ensnared to follow them, after they are destroyed from before you, and that you do not inquire after their gods, saying, 'How did these nations serve their gods? I also will do likewise.' You shall not worship the LORD your God in that way; for every abomination to the LORD which He hates they have done to their gods; for they burn even their sons and daughters in the fire to their gods. "Whatever I command you, be careful to observe it; you shall not add to it nor take away from it."' (NKJV)

Mark 7: 6-9: He answered and said to them, "Well did Isaiah prophesy of you hypocrites, as it is written:
'This people honors Me with their lips, But their heart is far from Me. And in vain they worship Me, Teaching as doctrines the commandments of men.' For laying aside the commandment of God, you hold the tradition of men - the washing of pitchers and cups, and many other such things you do." He said to them, "All too well you reject the commandment of God, that you may keep your tradition." (NKJV)

1 Corinthians 3:18-21: "Let no one deceive himself. If anyone among you seems to be wise in this age, let him become a fool that he may become wise. For the wisdom of this world is foolishness with God. For it is written, 'He catches the wise in their own craftiness;' and again, 'The LORD knows the thoughts of the wise, that they are futile.'"

BUT

2 Chronicles 7:14: "If My people who are called by My name will humble themselves, and pray and seek My face, and turn from their wicked ways, then I will hear from heaven, and will forgive their sin and heal their land."

1 John 1:8-9: "If we say that we have no sin, we deceive ourselves, and the truth is not in us. If we confess our sins, He is faithful and just to forgive us our sins and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness."

[ozgeorge]

Why don't they call them "Boredementalists"- They're hardly "fun".

[yes halloween is evil]

Isaiah 5:20-21: "And woe to those who call evil good and good evil, who regard light as darkness and darkness as light, who regard bitterness as sweet and sweetness as bitter. Woe to those who are wise in their own sight, but those standing before them they regard as fools." (Ancient Aramaic Scriptures)

Isaiah 5:20-21: "Woe to those who call evil good, and good evil; Who put darkness for light, and light for darkness; Who put bitter for sweet, and sweet for bitter! Woe to those who are wise in their own eyes, And prudent in their own sight!" (New King James Version)

[ozgeorge]

What does it say about those who are sure they are saved?

[scamandrius]

I sure hope you're not setting up a Christmas tree this year, because that comes from pagan ritual and, therefore, evil.  I hope you don't dare dye easter eggs because that also comes from pagan ritual and, therefore, evil.  Come to think of it--the name Easter is a pagan Anglo-Saxon word and, therefore, evil.

Why don't they call them "Boredementalists"- They're hardly "fun".

Nice.  Perhaps you should forward that to the "What's your favorite Evangelical bumper sticker" thread. 

[Αριστοκλής]

Two concurrent threads, identical in purpose, have been merged here.

Αριστοκλής, Section Moderator

[yes halloween is evil]

I sure hope you're not setting up a Christmas tree this year, because that comes from pagan ritual and, therefore, evil.  I hope you don't dare dye easter eggs because that also comes from pagan ritual and, therefore, evil.  Come to think of it--the name Easter is a pagan Anglo-Saxon word and, therefore, evil.

Nice.  Perhaps you should forward that to the "What's your favorite Evangelical bumper sticker" thread. 

I don't observe christmas anymore nor easter. That is one of the reasons why I went through the process of writing what I wrote.

[Fr. George]

I don't observe christmas anymore nor easter. That is one of the reasons why I went through the process of writing what I wrote.

You don't observe them?  I would understand if you kept all the pagan-influenced elements out, but to say you don't observe Christmas and Pascha is to say you don't observe the biggest two feastdays on the Church calendar and don't respect the Incarnation and Death and Resurrection.

[yes halloween is evil]

I am not an Orthodox Christian, I am simply Christian who tries to live by the Bible and not a particular church's way of doing things. I don't know very much about Orthodox Christianity, so I don't really know much about what Orthodox Christians observe. I just came onto this thread because I was looking up something on the Internet and noticed this thread on Google Search.

Mark 6:9 "He said to them, 'All too well you reject the commandment of God, that you may keep your tradition.'" (NKJV)

[ozgeorge]

I am not an Orthodox Christian, I am simply Christian who tries to live by the Bible and not a particular church's way of doing things.

Complete contradiction in terms. You cannot "live by the Bible" and not be "within the Church", since the Epistles are addressed to the Church. Therefore, you cannot even be Christian. There is no such thing as a Christian outside of the Church.

[Didymus]

yes halloween is evil, peace be with you my friend.

Though we do not know one another, yet have I known your spirit. You my friend, are a Protestant who believes that faith which you have been taught. However this is an Orthodox forum whereon matters run much deeper than you are now able to comprehend.

Please click on "My Messages" in the bar near the top of the screen to see the message which I have sent you in private; for I would not that this conversation be diverted onto another topic when all your questions could be answered by discussions between us.

I am near Brisbane, Australia. Please let me know where you are from that we may figure out whether we might be able to speak via ICQ/Y!/AIM/MSN rather than solely via messages.

Thank you and please pray for me.

For those of Protestant backgrounds, please remember from whence we came.

For those of Orthodox backgrounds, please be patient with us as children in the Faith.

Thank you.

[lubeltri]

Complete contradiction in terms. You cannot "live by the Bible" and not be "within the Church", since the Epistles are addressed to the Church. Therefore, you cannot even be Christian. There is no such thing as a Christian outside of the Church.

Just to be sure . . . you aren't saying Christians outside your church are not Christians, are you?

[Didymus]

I don't observe christmas anymore nor easter. That is one of the reasons why I went through the process of writing what I wrote.

May the grace of God enlighten your heart and eyes my friend.

There was a time when I observed neither Christmas nor Easter but kept the Passover and the Feast of Unleavened Bread, the Day of Atonement and the Feast of Tabernacles similarly to how Armstrong's movement once observed these relics of the Faith of ancient Israel. All these things I did in zealous ignorance whilst a Seventh Day Baptist. Yet the Lord, by His grace, has seen fit to show me the error of my ways and grant me forgiveness by the Blood of Christ.

Now (and I realise this may cause some debate even on these forums), I affirm that history strongly suggest that Jesus Christ our Lord and King was indeed born on Christmas Day (ie the 25th of December- according to the Julian calendar). I know this may astonish you and had somebody told me the same not too many years ago I would have marvelled at him; yet I would have been bound for the Truth's sake to seek out why he would say such a thing.

I have read The Two Babylons by Hislop and know the arguments presented therein yet they are often incorrect or misleading. (For more on this you may like to begin by reading The Babylon Connection? available here: http://www.ralphwoodrow.org/books/pages/babylon-connection.html or on amazon.)

My friend, I have sent you a personal message so please reply as there are too many issues to discuss in so short a time as now for it is late here.

May the love of God be with you as you pray for me.

Thank you.

[Didymus]

Heorhij, you seem right there

yes halloween is evil, we don't believe that MS Encarta Encyclopedia is infallible so quoting from it won't win you any particular support around here. Just look up the history of man and read about evolution and you may not think its version of history is so reliable either.
By the way, I'm against Halloween but seems it's not celebrated much in Australia anyway.

[lubeltri]

I guess what OzGeorge is saying is that there is no such thig as "your" Church and "my" Church - there is only one Church, visible, tangible, hierarchical, with one Bread and one Cup.

That is true.

I was just confused by the wording---that one cannot be a Christian if he is outside the Church. There are two interpretations of that statement. There's the boredamentalist one, everyone who is not a formal member of the Eastern Orthodox Church is not a Christian, and then there's the alternative, every Christian outside the visible boundaries of the Eastern Orthodox Church is only a Christian by the grace given to the Eastern Orthodox Church. The more common interpretation of that statement would be the former, but I didn't think George subscribed to that view.

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OrthodoxChristianity.net > Moderated Forums > Free-For-All > Religious Topics (Moderator: minasoliman) > Topic: Is it OK for Orthodox Christians to celebrate Halloween?