Author Topic: Toilet Training Kids from Birth?  (Read 20309 times)

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Offline EofK

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Toilet Training Kids from Birth?
« on: August 27, 2007, 07:48:15 PM »
Here is an interesting article on potty training kids starting from birth.  Sounds like a great idea, but I'm wondering how effective this actually is?  Has anyone tried this?  Since I'm becoming a mother in about two months, does anyone have any advice on toilet training? 
Human beings, who are almost unique in having the ability to learn from the experience of others, are also remarkable for their apparent disinclination to do so. -- Douglas Adams

Offline Thomas

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Re: Toilet Training Kids from Birth?
« Reply #1 on: August 28, 2007, 08:42:49 AM »
I am not sure how my local health board in my area would look at that considering they will arrest any  person relieving themself in public (i.e. urinating under a tree).  I have heard ofparents in my area allowing children to go outside and being fined for it and referred to CPS.

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Offline TinaG

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Re: Toilet Training Kids from Birth?
« Reply #2 on: August 28, 2007, 09:28:00 AM »
Here is an interesting article on potty training kids starting from birth.  Sounds like a great idea, but I'm wondering how effective this actually is?  Has anyone tried this?  Since I'm becoming a mother in about two months, does anyone have any advice on toilet training? 

These are the same folks who try and push the rigid, structured feeding schedules, sleep scheduling, train them from day one or they'll be spoiled and out of control.   Some of its "biblically based" (train them up, spare the rod, etc...) and some of it's based on the idea of making babies fit your life, and not conforming to their biological needs - getting your life back to pre-baby normal. 

As a new mom you're going to see lots of books and information from these self-styled baby training experts like Gary Ezzo (Babywise, Growing Kids Gods Way) or Gina Ford (The Contented Baby). At best these programs are rigid and interfere with mother-baby attachment, at worst like some aspects of Ezzo, they are medically dangerous.  Babies aren't dogs and you can't enforce these kinds of practices if you want to succesfully breastfeed and bond with your baby.  Their motor skills, brain development and bowel/bladder control aren't geared to a pee on demand schedule.  Please, reconsider and if you want some good information, try the La Leche League website, Dr. Jim Sears, or find a good local La Leche League or attachment parenting moms group. 

Sorry to get up on my soapbox, but in my own parenting experiences and as a breastfeeding counselor, I haven't seen any good come from scheduling and training, whether its sleeping, feeding or toilet training.  I really understand your need for information as a new mom, just don't forget your own instincts.  Being a mom is about protecting and nurturing, so go with that.  Remember, there is big money in being a baby expert and having all the right answers, and inexperienced parents are often made to feel that they just can't make it on their own.   God bless you and your soon to be here baby. 

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Offline calligraphqueen

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Re: Toilet Training Kids from Birth?
« Reply #3 on: August 29, 2007, 10:33:48 AM »
Do listen to your instincts.  You will probably second guess them a thousand times with the first child, then years later wonder why you didn't "go with your gut' on some things.

We have several foster mothers for the adoption home here that use the Ezzo method for their own children.  The foster children obviously aren't breastfed, so scheduling them in this method provided for no attachment whatsoever.  When the same mother did this with her bf'ed child, the baby ended up in the hospital for malnutrition and severe dehydration.  She never thought about the simple facts of breastmilk not lasting as long in the system as derived formulas.  Simply listening to her God given mothering inclinations rather than following along with some rigid program for *basically* programming her child would have saved a lot of heartbreak. Motherhood is precious, and the time you are about to enter doesn't last that long. Don't schedule your child's life to fit your needs, that is rather arrogant-and one huge problem I had with the Ezzo method.

as you can see, I have several children.  Each one has potty trained at times when they were ready.  It is impossible for the child in infancy to hold their bladders, there isn't that kind of muscle control developed yet.  The child has to be ready. Please, whatever you do, stay away from these rigid programs, they will cost you and your child dearly in the long run. 

Offline EofK

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Re: Toilet Training Kids from Birth?
« Reply #4 on: August 29, 2007, 05:56:35 PM »
Thank you, all, for the advice.  I greatly appreciate it!  Luckily, my mother in law was a neonatal nurse and also a breastfeeding counselor so I have a great resource in her as well.  I am quite skeptical of trying to conform to a rigid schedule... it seems a bad idea to make the baby wait for the next feeding time if they didn't eat much last time.
Human beings, who are almost unique in having the ability to learn from the experience of others, are also remarkable for their apparent disinclination to do so. -- Douglas Adams

Offline Trudy

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Re: Toilet Training Kids from Birth?
« Reply #5 on: August 29, 2007, 10:35:19 PM »
Here is an interesting article on potty training kids starting from birth.  Sounds like a great idea, but I'm wondering how effective this actually is?  Has anyone tried this?  Since I'm becoming a mother in about two months, does anyone have any advice on toilet training? 

The child won't be toilet trained at this early age.  YOU will be the one toilet trained...meaning being able to read the child's signals well enough to "catch" the child and put her on the toidy.

Wait till they are 3.  It's easier and will happen much faster with little effort on your part.

And Congratulations on the new baby soon to be!

~Trudy~
(Mom to 2 adult children and survivor of toilet training her own plus a couple others she babysat ages ago!)
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Offline Thomas

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Re: Toilet Training Kids from Birth?
« Reply #6 on: August 30, 2007, 08:47:45 AM »
In our house my wife and shared toileting  duties.  I was responsible for the two boys and she for the three girls.  We both helped each other when one of us was at work.  I smile when I think of the potty converstations that I had with my two boys and have had and now am having with my 4 grandsons---we are potty training the youngest. He is doing so well! Everytime he goes potty he thinks it is the greatest occasion of his life---not one wet pull-up in three weeks.  Our only  concern is that when he says he is ready to go we better go with him then and there or we will pay the price in cleaning him up.
 Best wishes on yours.

Thomas
« Last Edit: August 30, 2007, 08:48:19 AM by Thomas »
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Offline Heorhij

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Re: Toilet Training Kids from Birth?
« Reply #7 on: August 30, 2007, 10:08:51 AM »
The child won't be toilet trained at this early age.  YOU will be the one toilet trained...meaning being able to read the child's signals well enough to "catch" the child and put her on the toidy.

Wait till they are 3.  It's easier and will happen much faster with little effort on your part.

And Congratulations on the new baby soon to be!

~Trudy~
(Mom to 2 adult children and survivor of toilet training her own plus a couple others she babysat ages ago!)

I have to say that this notion of "wait till they are three" might be influenced by the availability of disposable diapers. In the former USSR where I grew up, all the way till the 1990's disposable diapers were just not available, people had to wash and re-use them, and essentially ALL mothers worked outside of the house. So, early toilet training was a vital necessity. Our daughter was completely toilet-trained before she was one year old. When she was 10-11 months old, she could very clearly communicate to us her need to go to the "potty." And that was very common, almost all kids were like that.
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Offline ytterbiumanalyst

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Re: Toilet Training Kids from Birth?
« Reply #8 on: August 30, 2007, 02:46:39 PM »
Yeah, we're strongly considering cloth diapers. They're cheaper (teacher's salary--you are quite familiar with that) and more environmentally friendly too. So we'll probably toilet train her sooner rather than later.
"It is remarkable that what we call the world...in what professes to be true...will allow in one man no blemishes, and in another no virtue."--Charles Dickens

Offline Schultz

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Re: Toilet Training Kids from Birth?
« Reply #9 on: August 30, 2007, 03:24:10 PM »
We will most definitely go the cloth diaper route once we have children.  My wife already uses cloth menstrual pads and she loves them.  Once you know how to clean them and get used to the rhythm of having to do so, they're a breeze.
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Offline BasilCan

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Re: Toilet Training Kids from Birth?
« Reply #10 on: September 04, 2007, 10:25:54 PM »
...and this discussion affects our salvation in what way????

Offline Fr. George

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Re: Toilet Training Kids from Birth?
« Reply #11 on: September 04, 2007, 10:34:07 PM »
...and this discussion affects our salvation in what way????

Dude... the family forum is a place for people to discuss family issues, like how to raise children.  This doesn't have to be a theology board 24/7.

To directly answer your question, though: how we raise our children, down to when and how we toilet train them, has an effect on their temperament and personality until the end of their lives.  Each decision can have a monumental impact on the child.  Since how we raise our children effects our salvation directly, it stands to reason that we should take all care in making informed decisions about how to raise them - both from a spiritual POV, and a mundane one too.
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Offline Trudy

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Re: Toilet Training Kids from Birth?
« Reply #12 on: September 04, 2007, 10:36:46 PM »
...and this discussion affects our salvation in what way????

BasilCan, change one diaper containing #2 and you will understand in a new way the prayer, "Lord HAVE MERCY!!"  Trust me!

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Offline ytterbiumanalyst

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Re: Toilet Training Kids from Birth?
« Reply #13 on: September 04, 2007, 10:37:24 PM »
...and this discussion affects our salvation in what way????
Examine the fruits of the Spirit: love, joy, peace, patience, kindness, goodness, faithfulness, gentleness, self-control.

Which of these is not tested and strengthened by caring for a child?

Dude... the family forum is a place for people to discuss family issues, like how to raise children.  This doesn't have to be a theology board 24/7.

To directly answer your question, though: how we raise our children, down to when and how we toilet train them, has an effect on their temperament and personality until the end of their lives.  Each decision can have a monumental impact on the child.  Since how we raise our children effects our salvation directly, it stands to reason that we should take all care in making informed decisions about how to raise them - both from a spiritual POV, and a mundane one too.
Exactly.
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Offline GiC

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Re: Toilet Training Kids from Birth?
« Reply #14 on: September 04, 2007, 11:23:06 PM »
...and this discussion affects our salvation in what way????

Haven't you been listening? I've picked up on at least three or four parenting practices that will condemn your kid straight to hell within the first year of their life...and I also learned that if I were to read Gary Ezzo's books I'd probably find hundreds more. ;)
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Offline Nyssa The Hobbit

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Re: Toilet Training Kids from Birth?
« Reply #15 on: September 05, 2007, 03:53:36 PM »
BasilCan, change one diaper containing #2 and you will understand in a new way the prayer, "Lord HAVE MERCY!!"  Trust me!

Athanasia

Especially with a newborn's projectile #2!   ;D
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Offline Ebor

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Re: Toilet Training Kids from Birth?
« Reply #16 on: September 05, 2007, 05:52:41 PM »
Especially with a newborn's projectile #2!   ;D

Yikes!  We had that.  I thought that I had erased it from my memory banks... but noooooo. 

 ;D

Anyway, a newborn is too busy with the early growing and doesn't have the connections to figure out bodily sensations.  Trying to train a newborn sounds like a bad and frustrating idea for all concerned.  When they're that young, as a wise older Texas woman once said "Feed them when they're hungry.  Change them when they're wet.  Cuddle them when they cry."

Ebor
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Offline Heorhij

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Re: Toilet Training Kids from Birth?
« Reply #17 on: September 06, 2007, 09:56:20 AM »
I agree with Ebor and with that wise Texas woman. However, I don't think toilet training should be postponed to the time when they are three years old - that's way too late. I am saying it with all my sympathy and compassion to the parents - and especially to those who have several kids (I just had one). --G. :)
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Offline Sophie

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Re: Toilet Training Kids from Birth?
« Reply #18 on: September 06, 2007, 10:24:59 AM »
My sister who´s a year younger than me, stopped using diapers at around eleven months of age, imitating what she saw I was doing at the time. Thus, my mum  had two birds killed with a stone I guess. Obviously, it took me a bit longer, around one year and a half or a bit more. Every kid is different and a parent is different with every kid, more experience every time. :-\ ;D
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Offline Quinault

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Re: Toilet Training Kids from Birth?
« Reply #19 on: November 19, 2007, 02:24:59 AM »
We will most definitely go the cloth diaper route once we have children.  My wife already uses cloth menstrual pads and she loves them.  Once you know how to clean them and get used to the rhythm of having to do so, they're a breeze.

We have cloth diapered for about 6 years at this point with my own kids and about 3 years before that when I worked in childcare. I vastly prefer cloth diapers. And I recently picked up cloth menstral pads. They are great too. I LOVE cloth diapering, so if you want any info I am more than willing to share all I know. When you get into the swing of things it is much easier than you would think. In fact, at this point I find disposables more difficult in many ways.

Offline wynd

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Re: Toilet Training Kids from Birth?
« Reply #20 on: November 22, 2007, 10:13:46 PM »
In fact, at this point I find disposables more difficult in many ways.
Like what?

Offline Quinault

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Re: Toilet Training Kids from Birth?
« Reply #21 on: December 28, 2007, 01:13:48 AM »
There are a great deal of ruffles and such that have to be adjusted just right in order for a disp. diaper to work correctly. And then you need one size diaper for the day and the next larger size for night to have the best absorbtion. Also my kids are long and thin, so sizing is really challenging. Technically my 6mth old and my two year old wear the same size disp. diaper, so the sizing just doesn't work for my kids.

At this point I can pin a diaper faster on a newborn than I can put on a disposable diaper. And the expense alone would bankrupt us. It is SO EXPENSIVE to disp. diaper!!! We pay about $10 more a month for washing our dipes, wraps and wipes. We would pay at LEAST $100 to diaper our two youngest children. Over the course of a year that adds up! That is nearly $2,000 a year in savings.

My ONE gripe about cloth diapering is clothes. Childrens clothes are not designed for the bulk of a cloth dipe, so invariably nothing fits well. In fact, when we brought out eight and a half pound son home from the hospital he wouldn't fit in his carseat without a cloth diaper! That is how long and thin my kids are! So clothes have to be bought in a larger size to accomodate the cloth diaper. And then, if I use a disp. I end up with clothes that fall off my kids! ;D
« Last Edit: December 28, 2007, 01:17:48 AM by Quinault »

Offline EofK

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Re: Toilet Training Kids from Birth?
« Reply #22 on: December 28, 2007, 02:12:33 PM »
I would like to have done cloth, but with going back to work in a month, I'm afraid our babysitter would murder us.  :)  I work at a hospital that orders Pampers by the case and each case has 12 packages of 20-count diapers for $24 per case.  Much cheaper than buying them at the store.  I hate the thought of all those diapers going to the landfill, though.  My parents tell me they had the three of us kids potty trained by 8 months, so hopefully we can pull that off as well.  That would be *wonderful*!
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Offline Órëlaurëa

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Re: Toilet Training Kids from Birth?
« Reply #23 on: December 28, 2007, 05:44:12 PM »
Eight months? That would be fabulous! :D
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Offline EofK

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Re: Toilet Training Kids from Birth?
« Reply #24 on: December 28, 2007, 05:58:44 PM »
Wouldn't it?  Then we'd just have to deal with "gotta go now" syndrome.  :P
Human beings, who are almost unique in having the ability to learn from the experience of others, are also remarkable for their apparent disinclination to do so. -- Douglas Adams

Offline Quinault

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Re: Toilet Training Kids from Birth?
« Reply #25 on: December 28, 2007, 06:13:59 PM »
If you have a babysitter that is able to work with you it might be possible. Otherwise you will have a "potty trained" child at home and no where else.

Although I personally think that if you have to RUN a child to the bathroom when they show signs of needing to they aren't potty trained in the real practical sense. Working with kids for years, we didn't call those kids potty trained..WE were potty trained to see their signals. They merely gave us signals. In that sense all babies are potty trained from birth. There is no mistaking it when a baby has a bowel movement! ;D
« Last Edit: December 28, 2007, 06:14:59 PM by Quinault »

Offline Nyssa The Hobbit

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Re: Toilet Training Kids from Birth?
« Reply #26 on: December 28, 2007, 06:24:00 PM »
Yes, that sound of little balls hitting the diaper, or of a sudden gush of water (depending on the type of stinky), combined with the sudden smell of sour milk, is a dead giveaway.   :D
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Offline EofK

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Re: Toilet Training Kids from Birth?
« Reply #27 on: December 28, 2007, 07:41:06 PM »
All too true.   ;D  I'd much rather my daughter walk herself to the bathroom and take care of her own business than for me to constantly run her in there before she explodes everywhere.  Bad enough when that happens in the diaper!
Human beings, who are almost unique in having the ability to learn from the experience of others, are also remarkable for their apparent disinclination to do so. -- Douglas Adams

Offline kmm

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Re: Toilet Training Kids from Birth?
« Reply #28 on: December 30, 2007, 09:02:21 PM »
It is true that in most parts of the world that children are potty trained very young, compared to the norm amongst North American kids. But doing it is only possible if a) as someone mentioned, every caregiver involved is going to be willing to to participate in the early training, and most daycares won't go for it and b) if you are allowed/able to have your children mess anywhere. In China, infants wear pants that split in the crotch area and the parent just has the infant pee/poop anywhere  - no diapers (we'd never get away with that in North America!!!). Russian friends of ours who had children both in Russia and in NOrth America have found a big difference in the ability to toilet train early, mostly because many homes here have wall to wall carpeting, unlike in Russia. If you are renting, letting your kids do their thing on the carpet is an especially big no no. Just plain rude if it's not your own home. Many of the early toilet training fans recommend removing the carpet in your home and putting down tile, etc., but if you are on a budget, and or are renting, obviously this is not possible. Therefore you have to wait until the chances of accidents are going to be minimized.

I would recommend, however, trying to partially toilet train your kids before 3 if you can, just for the relief of your senses, if nothing else. Kids are better able to know and tell you if they have to have a bowel movement than if they have to urinate, and so they can do this a bit earlier. It's really great not to have to clean up a poopy toddler diaper. Really Really great. I can't emphasize that enough...