Author Topic: Book Question  (Read 1875 times)

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Offline John of the North

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Book Question
« on: February 21, 2007, 02:25:36 AM »
I couldn't think of a decent title....so if I have an editor out there. ;)

Father has me reading "Orthodox Worship: A Living Continuity With The Synagogue, The Temple, And The Early Church" by Benjamin Williams and Harold Anstall.

Page 117: "[the priest] is the icon of Christ; and for the Liturgy about to be celebrated becomes for us Christ Himself!"

Some clarification?? Is this just mere symbolism?? Is it possible for a layperson to become "the icon of Christ"??

Thanks,
Postolowka
“Find the door of your heart, and you will discover it is the door to the kingdom of God.” - St. John Chrysostom

Offline Justinian

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Re: Book Question
« Reply #1 on: February 21, 2007, 02:35:07 AM »
Is it possible for a layperson to become "the icon of Christ"??

Funny you should ask this question. I asked my priest a question not too long ago concerning the way he blessed us. I go through the normal routine but when I go down to kiss his hand, he kisses me on the top of the head or side of my face (depending on hair gel, etc). I asked why and he said that he looks at each one of us (his flock) as being a "potential icon of Christ."
"All this indignation have I hurled, At the pretending part of the proud world. Who, swollen with selfish vanity devise: false freedoms, holy cheats, and formal lies, Over their fellow slaves to tyrannize." - John Wilmot

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Re: Book Question
« Reply #2 on: February 21, 2007, 07:42:30 AM »
It's an echo of Ignatius of Antioch, though I think it's a mystery how exactly it'd be true.

Offline John of the North

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Re: Book Question
« Reply #3 on: February 21, 2007, 03:02:58 PM »
"In like manner let all men respect the deacons as Jesus Christ, even as they should respect the bishop as being a type of the Father and the presbyters as the council of God and as the college of Apostles. Apart from these there is not even the name of a church." - St. Ignatius of Antioch
“Find the door of your heart, and you will discover it is the door to the kingdom of God.” - St. John Chrysostom

Offline username!

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Re: Book Question
« Reply #4 on: February 28, 2007, 05:03:05 AM »
I couldn't think of a decent title....so if I have an editor out there. ;)

Father has me reading "Orthodox Worship: A Living Continuity With The Synagogue, The Temple, And The Early Church" by Benjamin Williams and Harold Anstall.

Page 117: "[the priest] is the icon of Christ; and for the Liturgy about to be celebrated becomes for us Christ Himself!"

Some clarification?? Is this just mere symbolism?? Is it possible for a layperson to become "the icon of Christ"??

Thanks,
Postolowka

Instead of the word symbolism the word sign should be used.  Symbolism is something we can't explain, a mystery, something that reaches into Heaven.  What we call a symbol in modern English is really a sign!  Take our language back!

Offline Fr. George

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Re: Book Question
« Reply #5 on: February 28, 2007, 09:17:28 AM »
I couldn't think of a decent title....so if I have an editor out there. ;)

Father has me reading "Orthodox Worship: A Living Continuity With The Synagogue, The Temple, And The Early Church" by Benjamin Williams and Harold Anstall.

Page 117: "[the priest] is the icon of Christ; and for the Liturgy about to be celebrated becomes for us Christ Himself!"

Some clarification?? Is this just mere symbolism?? Is it possible for a layperson to become "the icon of Christ"??

Thanks,
Postolowka

In the Greek Septuagent, Man is said to be created in the Ikon and Simiosin of God - what we call the image and likeness.  Theologians have used that observation for centuries to state that we are ikons of God who happen to tarnish ourselves - putting a layer of film and filth on top of the Ikon, which gets washed away by Christ's sacrifice, His body and blood, and His means of reconciliation for us all (Confession, Baptism, and Unction).

As for the word "symbol" - it seems to me (and a few of my professors) that the word "symbol" seemed to imply something different to the Fathers than what it does now: that something participated in the reality of what is symbolized.  A mere representation that does not participate in that reality would be a sign or some other synonym.... but symbol being used by the Orthodox implies that the object we claim to be a symbol (such as the Ikons/Icons) participates in the reality of what it symbolizes (hence, why we reverence icons).
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Offline Thomas

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Re: Book Question
« Reply #6 on: February 28, 2007, 09:33:56 AM »
Well put clarity, Cleaveland!

Thomas
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