Latina

[augustin717]

O Roma nobilis, orbis et domina,
Cunctarum urbium excellentissima,
Roseo martyrum sanguine rubea,
Albis et virginum liliis candida,
Salutem dicimus tibi per omnia
Te benedicimus: salve per saecula

Petre tu praepotens caelorum claviger,
vota precantium exaudi iugiter
cum bis sex tribuum sederis arbiter
factus placabilis judica leniter
teque petentibus nunc temporaliter
ferto suffragia misericorditer.

O Paule suscipe nostra precamina
Cujus philosophos vicit industria
Factus oeconomus in domo regia
Divini muneris appone fercula
Ut quae repleverit te sapientia
Ipsa nos repleat tua per dogmata.

[augustin717]

Nativitas tua, Dei Genitrix Virgo, gaudium annuntiavit universo mundo ex te enim ortus est Sol justitiae, Christus Deus noster qui solvens maledictionem dedit benedictionem et confundens mortem donavit nobis vitam sempiternam.
Ant. ad "Magnificat" in festo Nativitatis BV Mariae

[scamandrius]

In sequentia, hoc carmen consumite sicut beatus Ambrosius beatusque Augustinus!

Te Deum laudamus

[Cyrillic]

I am translating the Odes of Horace (into Dutch, not into English, btw) but I need some help:

quae nunc oppositis debilitat pumicibus mare         
Tyrrhenum: sapias, vina liques et spatio brevi
spem longam reseces. dum loquimur, fugerit invida
aetas: carpe diem quam minimum credula postero.

Quae refers to the ultimam [hiemes], I think. So it would be: "Which now weakens upon opposing pumice rocks [...]" Where does Mare Tyrrhenum fit in. Does it mean "Which now weakens upon opposing pumice rocks of the Tyrrhenian Sea "?

[Cyrillic]

Horace is depressing, especially the second stanza  

Ode I.5:

Quis multa gracilis te puer in rosa
perfusus liquidis urget odoribus
grato, Pyrrha, sub antro?
Cui flavam religas comam

simplex munditiis? Heu quotiens fidem
mutatosque deos flebit et aspera
nigris aequora ventis
emirabitur insolens,

qui nunc te fruitur credulus aurea,
qui semper vacuam, semper amabilem
sperat nescius aurae
fallacis. Miseri, quibus

intemptata nites. Me tabula sacer
votiva paries indicat uvida
suspendisse potenti
vestimenta maris deo.    

[augustin717]

I am translating the Odes of Horace (into Dutch, not into English, btw) but I need some help:

quae nunc oppositis debilitat pumicibus mare         
Tyrrhenum: sapias, vina liques et spatio brevi
spem longam reseces. dum loquimur, fugerit invida
aetas: carpe diem quam minimum credula postero.

Quae refers to the ultimam [hiemes], I think. So it would be: "Which now weakens upon opposing pumice rocks [...]" Where does Mare Tyrrhenum fit in. Does it mean "Which now weakens upon opposing pumice rocks of the Tyrrhenian Sea "?

Isn't "mare tyrrhenum" the subject (have no time to look for the preceeding lines): "Those that now, on opposing pumice cliffs, the Tyrrhenian sea weakens."

[Cyrillic]

The whole ode is:

Tu ne quaesieris - scire nefas - quem mihi, quem tibi
finem di dederint, Leuconoë, nec Babylonios
temptaris numeros. Ut melius, quicquid erit, pati!
seu plures hiemes, seu tribuit Iuppiter ultimam,

quae nunc oppositis debilitat pumicibus mare
Tyrhenum. Sapias, vina liques, et spatio brevi
spem longam reseces. Dum loquimur, fugerit invida
aetas: carpe diem, quam minimum credula postero.

From Ut melius I had:

"It's better to, whatever it may be, to suffer it! Whether Jupiter gives many winters or the last [ultimam], which [quae] now weakens on the opposing rocks of the Tyrrhenian Sea, etc"

[augustin717]

Just give debilitat a freer translation and it's gonna make sense. Mare Tyrrhenian is the direct object so you ave "the winter that's now tossing the Tyrrenian sea between pumice cliffs"

[Cyrillic]

Just give debilitat a freer translation and it's gonna make sense. Mare Tyrrhenian is the direct object so you ave "the winter that's now tossing the Tyrrenian sea between pumice cliffs"

This makes sense indeed. Thanks!

I changed it to "which now weakens the Tyrrhenian sea on opposing rocks". Not making it too free but not making it overly literal either.

[augustin717]

Is Latin taught in most Dutch high-schools? and how many years?

[Cyrillic]

Is Latin taught in most Dutch high-schools? and how many years?

We have segregated levels in high school. Only the highest level of high school has Latin and Greek. <5% of high school students do that level and only a few remain in the final classes. Around 15 students in the last three classes combined follow Greek courses in my school with 1500 students. Not that many schools offer the level which has Greek and Latin.

Latin is taught for 6 years, Greek for 5 years (not done the first year). I'm in my 6th year.

[augustin717]

When i was in school, in Romania, we started Latin in the 8th grade and went on throughout the 12th. Greek was only taught in few high-schools. But Latin was mandatory for everyone, although, of course, only a small number actually learned it.

[Cyrillic]

When i was in school, in Romania, we started Latin in the 8th grade and went on throughout the 12th. Greek was only taught in few high-schools. But Latin was mandatory for everyone, although, of course, only a small number actually learned it.

I pity the Romanian children being forced to learn Latin. Only a few really like it, all of my friends couldn't stand it. Did you learn Greek as well?

[augustin717]

When i was in school, in Romania, we started Latin in the 8th grade and went on throughout the 12th. Greek was only taught in few high-schools. But Latin was mandatory for everyone, although, of course, only a small number actually learned it.

I pity the Romanian children being forced to learn Latin. Only a few really like it, all of my friends couldn't stand it. Did you learn Greek as well?

Yes, but in college.

[Cyrillic]

Eheu fugaces, Postume, Postume, labuntur anni.

[WeldeMikael]

I had Latin classes from 7th grade to 9th grade. A shame I was too young, Latin classes now would be very interesting. 

I barely remember Rosa.  Rosa -rosa - rosam -rosae - rosae- rosa 

[Cyrillic]

The latest addition to my book collection. A diglot of Horace (Latin-Dutch):

[Alpo]

I know next to nothing about Latin but you might be interested in Nuntii Latini. It's a Latin news service provided by Finnish public broadcasting company.

[Cyrillic]

I know Nuntii Latini. It's awesome.

[ialmisry]

When i was in school, in Romania, we started Latin in the 8th grade and went on throughout the 12th. Greek was only taught in few high-schools. But Latin was mandatory for everyone, although, of course, only a small number actually learned it.

I pity the Romanian children being forced to learn Latin.

Why?  They love it: it affirms that they are not Slavs.

It's also not that different, sort of like Italian (except Romanian still has declension).

[ialmisry]

O Roma nobilis, orbis et domina,
Cunctarum urbium excellentissima,
Roseo martyrum sanguine rubea,
Albis et virginum liliis candida,
Salutem dicimus tibi per omnia
Te benedicimus: salve per saecula

Petre tu praepotens caelorum claviger,
vota precantium exaudi iugiter
cum bis sex tribuum sederis arbiter
factus placabilis judica leniter
teque petentibus nunc temporaliter
ferto suffragia misericorditer.

O Paule suscipe nostra precamina
Cujus philosophos vicit industria
Factus oeconomus in domo regia
Divini muneris appone fercula
Ut quae repleverit te sapientia
Ipsa nos repleat tua per dogmata.

Scribis "Cujus" in Romania/Dacia?

[Cyrillic]

"Cujus" in tempora post casum Imperii Romani Occidentalis et ante Renatum (in saeculis XIV-XVI) ab omnibus usus est.

[Cyrillic]

Jejunuium Nativitatis mane oritur et huius anni cursus ad finem  accedit.
Tam rapidum tempus, ut cum Horatio velim clamare:

"Eheu fugaces, Postume, Postume,   
  labuntur anni nec pietas moram   
rugis et instanti senectae   
  adferet indomitaeque morti;"

'Nec pietas moram rugis et instanti senectae adferet indormitaeque morti'?  "Quae enim commuicatio luci ad tenebras? Qui consensus Christo et Belial?  Quid facit cum Psalterio Horatius?" (Sanctus Hieronymus: Epistula 22:29)

Horatium Flaccum, vatem optimum maximumque, multo diligo.

AMEN!

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