OrthodoxChristianity.net
October 01, 2014, 10:59:35 AM *
Welcome, Guest. Please login or register.

Login with username, password and session length
News: Reminder: No political discussions in the public fora.  If you do not have access to the private Politics Forum, please send a PM to Fr. George.
 
   Home   Help Calendar Contact Treasury Tags Login Register  
Pages: 1   Go Down
  Print  
Author Topic: Out of the mouths of babes.  (Read 3716 times) Average Rating: 0
0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.
ozgeorge
I'll take you for who you are if you take me for everything.
Hoplitarches
*************
Offline Offline

Faith: Orthodox Christian
Jurisdiction: Oecumenical Patriarchate of Constantinople, the New Rome, the Great Church of Christ.
Posts: 16,382


My plans for retirement.


WWW
« on: January 19, 2007, 06:36:11 PM »

A little girl was talking to her teacher about whales.
The teacher said it was physically impossible for a whale to swallow a human because even though it was a very large mammal its throat was  very small.

The little girl stated that Jonah was swallowed by a whale. Irritated, the teacher reiterated that a whale could not swallow a human; it was physically impossible.

The little girl said, "When I get to heaven I will ask Jonah". The teacher asked, "What if Jonah went to hell?" The little girl replied, "Then you ask
him"


Logged

If you're living a happy life as a Christian, you're doing something wrong.
Justin Kissel
Formerly Asteriktos
Protospatharios
****************
Online Online

Posts: 29,973


black metal cat


« Reply #1 on: January 19, 2007, 07:52:03 PM »

I'm not going to get all in a twist here George, but I don't think that joke is very funny.
Logged

"But science is an inferential exercise, not a catalog of facts. Numbers, by themselves, specify nothing. All depends upon what you do with them" - Stephen Jay Gould
GiC
Resident Atheist
Site Supporter
Merarches
*****
Offline Offline

Faith: Mathematician
Posts: 9,490



« Reply #2 on: January 19, 2007, 08:05:06 PM »

I'm not going to get all in a twist here George, but I don't think that joke is very funny.

Oh, it's funny. Sure it involves propaganda and twisting the minds of the youth...but, heck, we've been doing that for thousands of years...it's still funny.
Logged

"The liberties of people never were, nor ever will be, secure, when the transactions of their rulers may be concealed from them." -- Patrick Henry
Riddikulus
Protokentarchos
*********
Offline Offline

Posts: 4,788



« Reply #3 on: January 19, 2007, 08:37:01 PM »

Out of the mouths of babes, indeed; out of the attitudes of their elders.

I do appreciate that in the "snappy retort" sense the joke is amusing. But it's also rather chilling. That anyone would condition their child to consider it their place to condemn anyone to hell, an attitude I'm sure we have all witnessed, highlights a situation within Christianity that is all too familiar. Makes one wonder if this anecdote is taken from a real life situation.
Logged

I believe in One God, maker of heaven and earth and of all things visible and invisible.

Nothing in biology makes sense except in the light of evolution.
Theodosius Dobzhansky, Russian Orthodox Christian (1900-1975)
ozgeorge
I'll take you for who you are if you take me for everything.
Hoplitarches
*************
Offline Offline

Faith: Orthodox Christian
Jurisdiction: Oecumenical Patriarchate of Constantinople, the New Rome, the Great Church of Christ.
Posts: 16,382


My plans for retirement.


WWW
« Reply #4 on: January 19, 2007, 09:16:08 PM »

I'm not going to get all in a twist here George, but I don't think that joke is very funny.
Logged

If you're living a happy life as a Christian, you're doing something wrong.
Zoe
Elder
*****
Offline Offline

Faith: Eastern Orthodox
Jurisdiction: GOA
Posts: 450



« Reply #5 on: January 19, 2007, 09:29:11 PM »

Hahahah I found the joke funny but I think I found the button funnier!
Logged

NI!!!!!!
Justin Kissel
Formerly Asteriktos
Protospatharios
****************
Online Online

Posts: 29,973


black metal cat


« Reply #6 on: January 19, 2007, 09:31:25 PM »

I think I get it now! George is trying to be a walking advertisment for why people should homeschool  Tongue
Logged

"But science is an inferential exercise, not a catalog of facts. Numbers, by themselves, specify nothing. All depends upon what you do with them" - Stephen Jay Gould
jlerms
High Elder
******
Offline Offline

Faith: Eastern Orthodox
Jurisdiction: GOA
Posts: 826


O sweet Jesus, cleanse my soul.


« Reply #7 on: January 19, 2007, 09:32:27 PM »

I also concur with Riddikulus that it was quite chilling.  Funny but sad.  Interestingly I just read an article for Road to Emmaus (winter 2005):  Eternal Questions:  On Heaven and Hell.   In the article a Russian reader asked a question about how a loving God could let some of his creation go to Hell forever.  The reply was authored by Fr. Artemy Vladimorov and he started off by saying:

"From the Bible, especially from the Book of Revelation, we know that our Lord Jesus Christ has given the keys of paradise to His disciples-St. Peter is often depicted with them-but the keys to hell He holds in His own hand.  What does this mean?  It means that our gracious Lord, Who is Light and Love, does not delegate the right to send a soul to hell to any creature, neither saint nor angel.  As the Merciful Creator, He keeps this key for Himself.....It is a great danger to allow doubt to penetrate our hearts because our Lord is loving and just and there is not the slightest shadow of darkness on the spiritual Sun.  Even His disciples couldn't understand everything that Jesus Christ said, vut they did not doubt or insistently question their Teacher.  They were humble before His mystery.  God lives in unapproachable Light; how can a creature measure his Creator?"

blessings,  Juliana
Logged
GiC
Resident Atheist
Site Supporter
Merarches
*****
Offline Offline

Faith: Mathematician
Posts: 9,490



« Reply #8 on: January 19, 2007, 09:57:11 PM »

"From the Bible, especially from the Book of Revelation, we know that our Lord Jesus Christ has given the keys of paradise to His disciples-St. Peter is often depicted with them-but the keys to hell He holds in His own hand.  What does this mean?  It means that our gracious Lord, Who is Light and Love, does not delegate the right to send a soul to hell to any creature, neither saint nor angel.  As the Merciful Creator, He keeps this key for Himself.....

And you would worship such a God? One who does not give to others the right to send souls to hell, but reserves the pleasure as his own?
Logged

"The liberties of people never were, nor ever will be, secure, when the transactions of their rulers may be concealed from them." -- Patrick Henry
ozgeorge
I'll take you for who you are if you take me for everything.
Hoplitarches
*************
Offline Offline

Faith: Orthodox Christian
Jurisdiction: Oecumenical Patriarchate of Constantinople, the New Rome, the Great Church of Christ.
Posts: 16,382


My plans for retirement.


WWW
« Reply #9 on: January 19, 2007, 10:14:56 PM »

I think I get it now! George is trying to be a walking advertisment for why people should homeschool  Tongue
I'm certainly not looking forward to the great Apostasy if all Atheists are as humourless as you. Tongue
Logged

If you're living a happy life as a Christian, you're doing something wrong.
Justin Kissel
Formerly Asteriktos
Protospatharios
****************
Online Online

Posts: 29,973


black metal cat


« Reply #10 on: January 19, 2007, 10:19:49 PM »

I was only half joking, maybe that's why it was only half funny? Wink
Logged

"But science is an inferential exercise, not a catalog of facts. Numbers, by themselves, specify nothing. All depends upon what you do with them" - Stephen Jay Gould
Riddikulus
Protokentarchos
*********
Offline Offline

Posts: 4,788



« Reply #11 on: January 19, 2007, 10:25:11 PM »

"From the Bible, especially from the Book of Revelation, we know that our Lord Jesus Christ has given the keys of paradise to His disciples-St. Peter is often depicted with them-but the keys to hell He holds in His own hand.  What does this mean?  It means that our gracious Lord, Who is Light and Love, does not delegate the right to send a soul to hell to any creature, neither saint nor angel.  As the Merciful Creator, He keeps this key for Himself.....It is a great danger to allow doubt to penetrate our hearts because our Lord is loving and just and there is not the slightest shadow of darkness on the spiritual Sun.  Even His disciples couldn't understand everything that Jesus Christ said, vut they did not doubt or insistently question their Teacher.  They were humble before His mystery.  God lives in unapproachable Light; how can a creature measure his Creator?"

Quote from greekischristian,

Quote
And you would worship such a God? One who does not give to others the right to send souls to hell, but reserves the pleasure as his own?

greekischristian,

Do you really read that passage as saying that God reserves the "pleasure" of sending souls to hell for himself?  I read it in anyother way; that man is limited in mercy and, all too often, unjust. The only possible Judge of where a soul belongs is God, who is Merciful and Just. Who else could look into the heart and see what lies there?

The question as to whether hell is eternal, (which I honestly doubt, considering I believe God to be all-merciful and completely just), is probably off topic.  Smiley
Logged

I believe in One God, maker of heaven and earth and of all things visible and invisible.

Nothing in biology makes sense except in the light of evolution.
Theodosius Dobzhansky, Russian Orthodox Christian (1900-1975)
aurelia
High Elder
******
Offline Offline

Posts: 588


« Reply #12 on: January 24, 2007, 12:59:31 PM »

Well, I certainly would not allow my child to speak to a teacher like that, and I see the humor, though I find it only mildly amusing.  The button was cute, though nothing I would ever wear.

Logged
Justin Kissel
Formerly Asteriktos
Protospatharios
****************
Online Online

Posts: 29,973


black metal cat


« Reply #13 on: January 24, 2007, 05:15:59 PM »

Ok, this is beginning to make me sick. Are you people really that desensitized to hell? You know, eternal suffering? Torment? Imagine if the punchline was that the person would be brutally raped. Hahahahahaha! Rape is so funny, isn't it? But you people are talking about suffereing FOREVER. And hey, you can sorta see the humor in a joke about that. Whatever.
« Last Edit: January 24, 2007, 05:16:24 PM by Asteriktos » Logged

"But science is an inferential exercise, not a catalog of facts. Numbers, by themselves, specify nothing. All depends upon what you do with them" - Stephen Jay Gould
ozgeorge
I'll take you for who you are if you take me for everything.
Hoplitarches
*************
Offline Offline

Faith: Orthodox Christian
Jurisdiction: Oecumenical Patriarchate of Constantinople, the New Rome, the Great Church of Christ.
Posts: 16,382


My plans for retirement.


WWW
« Reply #14 on: January 24, 2007, 05:26:58 PM »

The button was cute, though nothing I would ever wear.
I want one with a Bible verse on it, specifically Malachi 2:3:
"I shall turn away from you and scatter dung upon your faces"
Logged

If you're living a happy life as a Christian, you're doing something wrong.
Schultz
Christian. Guitarist. Zymurgist. Librarian.
Taxiarches
**********
Offline Offline

Faith: Orthodox Christian
Jurisdiction: OCA
Posts: 6,477


Scion of the McKeesport Becks.


WWW
« Reply #15 on: January 24, 2007, 05:34:10 PM »

I do see Asteriktos' point.  It is a rather chilling retort, even more so coming from a child.  I did giggle, but I know I'm unfortunately desensitized, as he says.

I would merely point out to the teacher that if a sperm whale can swallow giant squid whole (in 1955, a recently swallowed 405 lb squid was found in the belly of a sperm whale), a whale can definitely eat a human being.
Logged

"Hearing a nun's confession is like being stoned to death with popcorn." --Abp. Fulton Sheen
GiC
Resident Atheist
Site Supporter
Merarches
*****
Offline Offline

Faith: Mathematician
Posts: 9,490



« Reply #16 on: January 24, 2007, 06:24:00 PM »

Ok, this is beginning to make me sick. Are you people really that desensitized to hell? You know, eternal suffering? Torment? Imagine if the punchline was that the person would be brutally raped. Hahahahahaha! Rape is so funny, isn't it? But you people are talking about suffereing FOREVER. And hey, you can sorta see the humor in a joke about that. Whatever.

Wow, you take things far too seriously and, hey, we all have our trials and tribulations to go through, no reason not to make light of them.
Logged

"The liberties of people never were, nor ever will be, secure, when the transactions of their rulers may be concealed from them." -- Patrick Henry
ozgeorge
I'll take you for who you are if you take me for everything.
Hoplitarches
*************
Offline Offline

Faith: Orthodox Christian
Jurisdiction: Oecumenical Patriarchate of Constantinople, the New Rome, the Great Church of Christ.
Posts: 16,382


My plans for retirement.


WWW
« Reply #17 on: January 24, 2007, 06:39:37 PM »

we all have our trials and tribulations to go through, no reason not to make light of them.
I agree. Humour is a very adult way of dealing with things. When we mock something we fear, we diminish it's power to frighten us. Just like the sugar candy skulls the Mexicans make for Dia de Muertos ("Day of the Dead").



Just like how we blow and spit at the devil as part of our initiation rite into Orthodox Christianity, and how we place a skull at the base of our Crosses to signify the triumph of the Holy Cross over death.
« Last Edit: January 24, 2007, 07:52:53 PM by ozgeorge » Logged

If you're living a happy life as a Christian, you're doing something wrong.
Riddikulus
Protokentarchos
*********
Offline Offline

Posts: 4,788



« Reply #18 on: January 24, 2007, 08:06:22 PM »

Ok, this is beginning to make me sick. Are you people really that desensitized to hell? You know, eternal suffering? Torment? Imagine if the punchline was that the person would be brutally raped. Hahahahahaha! Rape is so funny, isn't it? But you people are talking about suffereing FOREVER. And hey, you can sorta see the humor in a joke about that. Whatever.

I have to agree.

As I said, I appreciate that there is humour in the "snappy retort" sense; looking at it from that perspective. But I have to admit, I don't think it's at all funny. In fact, as I said earlier; it's chilling. Hard to laugh when one is going "brrrrrrr".

Sorry, George. Maybe I have no sense of humour about the whole "eternal torment" scene... But I don't think that's likely to change.
Logged

I believe in One God, maker of heaven and earth and of all things visible and invisible.

Nothing in biology makes sense except in the light of evolution.
Theodosius Dobzhansky, Russian Orthodox Christian (1900-1975)
ozgeorge
I'll take you for who you are if you take me for everything.
Hoplitarches
*************
Offline Offline

Faith: Orthodox Christian
Jurisdiction: Oecumenical Patriarchate of Constantinople, the New Rome, the Great Church of Christ.
Posts: 16,382


My plans for retirement.


WWW
« Reply #19 on: January 24, 2007, 08:13:26 PM »

Sorry, George. Maybe I have no sense of humour about the whole "eternal torment" scene... But I don't think that's likely to change.
That's fine, I can respect your beliefs. I hope that you can respect that I disagree with them though, and think they are unhealthy.
Logged

If you're living a happy life as a Christian, you're doing something wrong.
Riddikulus
Protokentarchos
*********
Offline Offline

Posts: 4,788



« Reply #20 on: January 24, 2007, 09:04:01 PM »

That's fine, I can respect your beliefs. I hope that you can respect that I disagree with them though, and think they are unhealthy.

Actually, I have a most robust sense of humour, just not when it comes to laughing at the "eternal hell" thing. I must be one of those hyper-sensitive types! This unfortunate trait doesn't spill over into other areas of a good laugh so, quite naturally, I have no objections to various Black Adder/Monty Python punch-lines regarding subjects like the Bubonic Plague, the Spanish Inquistion, etc. I might, therefore, be only slightly unhealthy. Tongue

Some of the best laughs I've ever had have been at myself, and in that regard I have managed to provide myself with many years of hilarity.

And I most certainly respect your right - your absolute right - to disagree with me in that I consider hell to be no laughing matter. 
Logged

I believe in One God, maker of heaven and earth and of all things visible and invisible.

Nothing in biology makes sense except in the light of evolution.
Theodosius Dobzhansky, Russian Orthodox Christian (1900-1975)
ozgeorge
I'll take you for who you are if you take me for everything.
Hoplitarches
*************
Offline Offline

Faith: Orthodox Christian
Jurisdiction: Oecumenical Patriarchate of Constantinople, the New Rome, the Great Church of Christ.
Posts: 16,382


My plans for retirement.


WWW
« Reply #21 on: January 24, 2007, 09:10:09 PM »

I consider hell to be no laughing matter. 
Well I've got the whole of eternity to be miserable about it, so I may as well laugh at it now. Wink
Logged

If you're living a happy life as a Christian, you're doing something wrong.
Riddikulus
Protokentarchos
*********
Offline Offline

Posts: 4,788



« Reply #22 on: January 24, 2007, 09:26:30 PM »

Well I've got the whole of eternity to be miserable about it, so I may as well laugh at it now. Wink

Ah yes, but the joke wasn't focused on one's own prospect's of hell, was it? Shocked If it had been, it would have fallen into the category of self-mockery which, as we all know, can provide a worthwhile chortle.  Smiley
 
Logged

I believe in One God, maker of heaven and earth and of all things visible and invisible.

Nothing in biology makes sense except in the light of evolution.
Theodosius Dobzhansky, Russian Orthodox Christian (1900-1975)
minasoliman
Mr., Sir, Dude, Guy, Male, tr. Minas in Greek, Menes in white people Egyptologists :-P
Section Moderator
Toumarches
*****
Offline Offline

Faith: Oriental Orthodox
Jurisdiction: Coptic Orthodox Archdiocese of North America
Posts: 11,650


Strengthen O Lord the work of Your hands(Is 19:25)


WWW
« Reply #23 on: January 25, 2007, 02:12:03 AM »

I do see Asteriktos' point.  It is a rather chilling retort, even more so coming from a child.  I did giggle, but I know I'm unfortunately desensitized, as he says.

I would merely point out to the teacher that if a sperm whale can swallow giant squid whole (in 1955, a recently swallowed 405 lb squid was found in the belly of a sperm whale), a whale can definitely eat a human being.

Well, technically, a squid is like jello.  It can be squeezed down the whale's throat.  An octopus can squeeze its way out of a lot of things that are impossible for vertebrates to do (or may have even seemed impossible for an octopus or squid to do).
Logged

Vain existence can never exist, for \\\"unless the LORD builds the house, the builders labor in vain.\\\" (Psalm 127)

If the faith is unchanged and rock solid, then the gates of Hades never prevailed in the end.
Schultz
Christian. Guitarist. Zymurgist. Librarian.
Taxiarches
**********
Offline Offline

Faith: Orthodox Christian
Jurisdiction: OCA
Posts: 6,477


Scion of the McKeesport Becks.


WWW
« Reply #24 on: January 29, 2007, 12:46:29 PM »

Hm, good point, also.  But the article I read regarding the 450# squid implied that it was discovered "undamaged" within the stomach of the whale.  While squid are invertebrates, I would assume that squeezing one through an esophagus that would not admit a human being would make the squid unrecognizable.
Logged

"Hearing a nun's confession is like being stoned to death with popcorn." --Abp. Fulton Sheen
Aristibule
Your Weaker Brother
High Elder
******
Offline Offline

Faith: Orthodox Christian
Jurisdiction: ROCOR
Posts: 515


Xeno


« Reply #25 on: January 29, 2007, 04:29:52 PM »

Well, in the joke the 'teacher' questions both the veracity of Scripture and the sanctity of the prophet Jonah. The joke doesn't make  sense without those premises. As to hell - if we go, it is definitely of our own volition. The joke takes on a darker cast if one dogmatically holds to the post-Dante revisioning of hell as well as a Calvinist/Jansenist sort of God. Fear God, not hell.
Logged

"We must begin at once to "build again the tabernacle which is fallen down, and to build again the ruins thereof, and to set it up;" for HE WHO GAVE THE THOUGHT IN OUR HEART HE LAID ALSO THE RESPONSIBILITY ON US THAT THIS THOUGHT SHOULD NOT REMAIN BARREN." - J.J. Overbeck, 1866
aurelia
High Elder
******
Offline Offline

Posts: 588


« Reply #26 on: February 21, 2007, 09:15:43 AM »

Well, in the joke the 'teacher' questions both the veracity of Scripture and the sanctity of the prophet Jonah. The joke doesn't make  sense without those premises. As to hell - if we go, it is definitely of our own volition. The joke takes on a darker cast if one dogmatically holds to the post-Dante revisioning of hell as well as a Calvinist/Jansenist sort of God. Fear God, not hell.

I think one can assume the child was not attending parochial school. 

I like the squid thing, though, it s the sort of thing my daughter would come up with.

Also, just because I get a mild chuckle out of a smart alek remark in a joke doesn't mean that I allow that behavior from my own kids or approve of it from others....TV shows in fact, take the "smartypants" kid thing too far quite often, in my opinion. 

Logged
Augustine
High Elder
******
Offline Offline

Posts: 565

pray for me, please


WWW
« Reply #27 on: February 22, 2007, 05:17:26 PM »

I don't know what anyone is getting all upset about, subjective to their claimed perspectives.

Christian: What Christians are told is not precisely "not to judge", but to not judge with an uneven measure.  That is to say, the standards we hold others to sure better be exactingly met by ourselves, or there may very well be "hell to pay."  The idea that we're not to appraise anything is just absurd.  And while it's true that it is presumptuous of anyone to pretend to know what any given person's final end will be, it is equally stupid to pretend anyone dying without faith will be saved in that condition.  "Without faith it is impossible to please God."  Further, the Scriptures reflect what at first may seem to be an unsettling idea - that the Saints will rejoice when God issues His sentence, both giving reward to the elect and casting those "not in the book of life" out of the Heavenly City.  The meaning?  That those who will end up in the "lake of fire" deserve to be there - and if we have a hard time seeing this now, it is only because our priorities are confused and we are not seeing things for what they are in relation to God.

Atheist: Hell apparently doesn't exist anyway.  So other than lamenting over the mental illness of people who believe in such places, you really shouldn't care either way.  After all, couldn't someone else just say "those who are not Odin's sons aren't going to Vahalla" or what have you?  I mean, it's all the same gibberish when it comes down right to it, as are all beliefs.  In the end, you should care about your implied exclusion from God's friendship about as much as I would my implied exclusion from the fold of Rabbinical Judaism or it's version of "the world to come", or Islam's "Janna", for being the filthy wine swilling, bacon eating, cross worshipping kaffir that I am.
Logged
Tags:
Pages: 1   Go Up
  Print  
 
Jump to:  

Powered by MySQL Powered by PHP Powered by SMF 1.1.18 | SMF © 2013, Simple Machines Valid XHTML 1.0! Valid CSS!
Page created in 0.089 seconds with 54 queries.