Author Topic: This is not an Orthodox Christian forum  (Read 15701 times)

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Offline Matthew777

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This is not an Orthodox Christian forum
« on: January 16, 2007, 05:35:21 PM »
In what way does this forum exemplify right belief and right praxis? Orthodoxy is not practiced on the internet; the true God is not worshipped via keyboard. This may be a forum comprised of Orthodox members, but since I know none of you personally, I cannot know the sincerity of your Orthodoxy. You may be St. John Chrysostom, but then again, you may be Rasputin. Therefore, if this cannot be considered an Orthodox Christian forum and neither are we certain that this is a forum comprised of Orthodox Christians; can we at least discern whether or not this qualifies as a "good" forum? I'll leave that up to you. If, on the other hand, this forum, or any internet forum for that matter, can be considered "Orthodox," then one might as well believe that a tacky blinking neon "icon" is also "Orthodox."
 
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Offline Anastasios

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Re: This is not an Orthodox Christian forum
« Reply #1 on: January 16, 2007, 05:40:04 PM »
Yeah you're right Matt, I think I will talk to Fr Chris and Robert about throwing in the towel. Cuz nothing good comes from this unOrthodox pseudo forum.
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Offline Matthew777

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Re: This is not an Orthodox Christian forum
« Reply #2 on: January 16, 2007, 05:45:08 PM »
Yeah you're right Matt, I think I will talk to Fr Chris and Robert about throwing in the towel. Cuz nothing good comes from this unOrthodox pseudo forum.

My point is that "Orthodox Christian" and "internet forum" are a contradiction of terms. If this forum is not Orthodox, then neither is any forum for that matter.
« Last Edit: January 16, 2007, 05:46:07 PM by Matthew777 »
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Offline EkhristosAnesti

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Re: This is not an Orthodox Christian forum
« Reply #3 on: January 16, 2007, 05:45:21 PM »
Matthew,

Is there any hope that you will ever make any sense, ever?
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Offline EkhristosAnesti

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Re: This is not an Orthodox Christian forum
« Reply #4 on: January 16, 2007, 05:47:23 PM »
Quote
My point is that "Orthodox Christian" and "internet forum" are a contradiction of terms.


Because one refers to a type of personal being, and the other a type of impersonal thing? Fair enough.
No longer an active member of this forum. Sincerest apologies to anyone who has taken offence to anything posted in youthful ignorance or negligence prior to my leaving this forum - October, 2012.

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Offline Matthew777

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Re: This is not an Orthodox Christian forum
« Reply #5 on: January 16, 2007, 05:49:37 PM »
Because one refers to a type of personal being, and the other a type of impersonal thing? Fair enough.

Because Orthodoxy is not practiced via the internet, but in how we relate to the real world in real life.
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Offline Justin Kissel

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Re: This is not an Orthodox Christian forum
« Reply #6 on: January 16, 2007, 05:51:47 PM »
I think the issues you bring up are very good ones, though I think you are dealing with them rather rashly. I have been on various forums for over 9 years now, and on this particular one for 4 1/2 years (if you  were a member before they changed the name to OC.net, you've been around here for a while ;) ). So, I might, possibly have picked up a thing or two along the way.

Quote
In what way does this forum exemplify right belief and right praxis?

It is exceedingly good at allowing freedom. It gives a very high place to tolerance, respect and civility (central elements of Christian love). If you listen sometimes, you might even pick up some orthodox information. I know I've learned more (and found out that I was wrong more) from this forum than any other. Truth is Orthodox, no?

Quote
Orthodoxy is not practiced on the internet; the true God is not worshipped via keyboard.

The same might be said of books, but that doesn't mean all books should be thrown out.

Quote
This may be a forum comprised of Orthodox members, but since I know none of you personally, I cannot know the sincerity of your Orthodoxy. You may be St. John Chrysostom, but then again, you may be Rasputin. Therefore, if this cannot be considered an Orthodox Christian forum and neither are we certain that this is a forum comprised of Orthodox Christians; can we at least discern whether or not this qualifies as a "good" forum?

Lol. Well maybe I'm just somewhat cynical, but I think the same could be said of real life, Matthew. People are fake. Period. True, peoplemay be slightly more fake on the internet, because it provides anonymity and a better place for people to be who they want to be rather than who they are. For example, when you see me in real life, you see the ugly truth; when you see a picture I post on myspace, you see the least ugly one. That's a deception. I am on the internet deceiving you. But people are deceptive in real life as well. Some people might even be more deceptive in real life, because the very anonymity which makes some people deceptive while online might make another person bolder and more forthright while online. It's a mixed bag.

Quote
I'll leave that up to you. If, on the other hand, this forum, or any internet forum for that matter, can be considered "Orthodox," then one might as well believe that a tacky blinking neon "icon" is also "Orthodox."

I dunno, I can't see anyone bowing down to a neon icon. Then again, some people can't imagine bending down before a paper icon, but John of Shanghai and San Francisco didn't have a problem doing that. Praxis is sometimes a matter of opinion.

Offline scamandrius

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Re: This is not an Orthodox Christian forum
« Reply #7 on: January 16, 2007, 05:53:06 PM »
Because Orthodoxy is not practiced via the internet, but in how we relate to the real world in real life.

You're kidding, right?  ;D
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Offline Matthew777

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Re: This is not an Orthodox Christian forum
« Reply #8 on: January 16, 2007, 05:56:15 PM »
Is there any hope that you will ever make any sense, ever?

In an irrational world, the most sensible man is a "fool."  

For example, when you see me in real life, you see the ugly truth; when you see a picture I post on myspace, you see the least ugly one.

But at least you have a wife and children who love you... or at least you've allowed us to believe that you have a wife and children who love you. Your family's opinion of you should be what really matters to you, not what the people on internet forums think.
« Last Edit: January 16, 2007, 05:59:14 PM by Matthew777 »
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Offline Landon77

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Re: This is not an Orthodox Christian forum
« Reply #9 on: January 16, 2007, 06:42:58 PM »
Well, even if we were members of your parish and you hung around with us during coffee hour every Sunday, you still wouldn't know if we were the same person out side of the building or if we were just putting on a good show.

And before I moved close to an Orthodox church, a forum was my only contact with real Orthodox people.  It is also a place where a person can ask questions they might be ashamed to ask in person.
So a forum has some good points.
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Offline Pravoslavbob

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Re: Ceci n'est pas un forum orthodoxe
« Reply #10 on: January 16, 2007, 06:46:00 PM »
This is not me winking at you either.   ;)
« Last Edit: January 16, 2007, 06:50:48 PM by Pravoslavbob »
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Offline Matthew777

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Re: This is not an Orthodox Christian forum
« Reply #11 on: January 16, 2007, 06:47:06 PM »
So a forum has some good points.

That might be correct, but "Orthodox Christian forum" would still be a contradiction. One might as well have an "Orthodox Christian mailbox" or "Orthodox Christian beach towel." Both would serve a purpose, but that wouldn't make them "Orthodox."
« Last Edit: January 16, 2007, 06:50:19 PM by Matthew777 »
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Offline Landon77

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Re: This is not an Orthodox Christian forum
« Reply #12 on: January 16, 2007, 07:02:31 PM »
They would be if they were used for Orthodoxy.
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Offline Justin Kissel

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Re: This is not an Orthodox Christian forum
« Reply #13 on: January 16, 2007, 07:03:20 PM »
Orthodox Forum means "a forum where Orthodox Christians can discuss various issues". Deal with it.

Offline dantxny

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Re: This is not an Orthodox Christian forum
« Reply #14 on: January 16, 2007, 07:03:57 PM »
Quote
That might be correct, but "Orthodox Christian forum" would still be a contradiction. One might as well have an "Orthodox Christian mailbox" or "Orthodox Christian beach towel." Both would serve a purpose, but that wouldn't make them "Orthodox."

What the Sam Hill are you talking about?  You're comparing apples and oranges.  In modern parlance, a forum is an internet site where you discuss issues.  This forum deals primarily with Orthodox Christian issues, therefore it is an Orthodox Christian Forum.  I am on another forum that deals with issues from the Civil War.  It, therefore is a Civil War Forum.

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I think the French may be on to something here.

Offline dantxny

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Re: This is not an Orthodox Christian forum
« Reply #15 on: January 16, 2007, 07:05:33 PM »
Also, now that I think about it, I have a white towel that I used to dry myself after my baptism into the Orthodox Church.  I keep it next to my baptismal robe and do not use it due to its signifigance.  Therefore, that's an Orthodox Christian Bathtowel.  ;D
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Offline Matthew777

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Re: This is not an Orthodox Christian forum
« Reply #16 on: January 16, 2007, 07:08:26 PM »
What the Sam Hill are you talking about?  You're comparing apples and oranges.  In modern parlance, a forum is an internet site where you discuss issues.  This forum deals primarily with Orthodox Christian issues, therefore it is an Orthodox Christian Forum.  I am on another forum that deals with issues from the Civil War.  It, therefore is a Civil War Forum.

Do you not see a difference between the words "Civil War" and "Orthodox Christian"? I don't believe we should be so arbitrary with the terms "Orthodox," "Christian," and "Orthodox Christian." Again, Orthodoxy is practiced in real life in the real world, not over an internet forum. Otherwise, the term "Orthodox Christian" has little weight or value. One might as well make "Jesus Christ" the brand name for a candy bar.
« Last Edit: January 16, 2007, 07:12:04 PM by Matthew777 »
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Offline Veniamin

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Re: This is not an Orthodox Christian forum
« Reply #17 on: January 16, 2007, 07:11:52 PM »
You know, one of my law professors always talks about The Monkey when giving us test advice.  An infinite number of them, as we all know, will eventually produce the works of Shakespeare, but The Monkey as an individual can only get a C- on a test because he produces nothing but gibberish.  We've always assumed The Monkey was merely hypothetical, but we have now located him.

Matthew is The Monkey.
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Offline Veniamin

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Re: This is not an Orthodox Christian forum
« Reply #18 on: January 16, 2007, 07:13:28 PM »
One might as well make "Jesus Christ" the brand name for a candy bar.

You already made him some sort of sex symbol with one of your avatars a while back.  I was wondering when you'd take it to this level.
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Offline Matthew777

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Re: This is not an Orthodox Christian forum
« Reply #19 on: January 16, 2007, 07:14:29 PM »
Matthew is The Monkey.

Again, in an irrational world, the most sensible man is a "fool." If you don't see the arbitrary nature of "Orthodox Christian forum," that is not my fault.

I was wondering when you'd take it to this level.

I'm not the one who devalued the name of Orthodoxy by making an "Orthodox Christian forum."
« Last Edit: January 16, 2007, 07:15:58 PM by Matthew777 »
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Offline dantxny

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Re: This is not an Orthodox Christian forum
« Reply #20 on: January 16, 2007, 07:17:13 PM »
You know, one of my law professors always talks about The Monkey when giving us test advice.  An infinite number of them, as we all know, will eventually produce the works of Shakespeare, but The Monkey as an individual can only get a C- on a test because he produces nothing but gibberish.  We've always assumed The Monkey was merely hypothetical, but we have now located him.

Matthew is The Monkey.

ROFL! :D

Quote
Again, Orthodoxy is practiced in real life in the real world, not over an internet forum.
Well, my apologies that you do not practice the tenets of Orthodox in all aspects of your life and you feel that the internet is fake enought to be non-Orthodox there.
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Offline dantxny

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Re: This is not an Orthodox Christian forum
« Reply #21 on: January 16, 2007, 07:18:57 PM »
Quote
Again, in an irrational world, the most sensible man is a "fool." If you don't see the arbitrary nature of "Orthodox Christian forum," that is not my fault.

Well, I am glad that in your foolishness you have decided to enlighten the rest of us.

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I think the French may be on to something here.

Offline ozgeorge

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Re: This is not an Orthodox Christian forum
« Reply #22 on: January 16, 2007, 07:20:55 PM »
I am on another forum that deals with issues from the Civil War.  It, therefore is a Civil War Forum.
No it doesn't. You just think it does. There cannot be any such thing as a civil war forum any more than there can be a civil war mailbox or a civil war beach towel. "Civil War' and "internet forum" are contradictions in terms, and the Civil war cannot be practiced on the internet. Why anyone else can't see this is difficult for me to understand. Purple monkey dishwasher, lucy in the sky with diamonds.
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Offline Matthew777

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Re: This is not an Orthodox Christian forum
« Reply #23 on: January 16, 2007, 07:22:10 PM »
Well, my apologies that you do not practice the tenets of Orthodox in all aspects of your life and you feel that the internet is fake enought to be non-Orthodox there.

Again, there is no way of knowing for certain whether the members of the forum are Orthodox, given that I do not know your conduct in the real world, or whether you even attend an Orthodox church, and there's nothing that would make an internet forum more Orthodox than a candy bar, a beach towel, a roast beef sandwich, etc.

Quote
The Meaning of Orthodox.
The term Orthodox combines the adjective orthos, which means right, correct or true, and the noun doxa, which comes from the verb doxazo, "I hold an opinion," or "I believe." Hence "right belief," or "true doctrine." But in a deeper sense it also means "right worship," since doxazo can also mean "I glorify." It could be said that the term Orthodox was forged as a defense against heretical, or heterodox, teaching which persisted during the formative centuries. As then, so now, it signifies a framework of theological propositions worked into precise doctrinal formulations, a body of faith and a tradition, that has retained its absolute integrity in the face of the changes and innovations that have occurred within Christianity.
http://www.goarch.org/en/ourfaith/articles/article7051.asp

Orthodoxy is found in Scripture, the liturgical and theological Tradition of the Church, and in how we relate to others, even those who are our enemies. Orthodoxy is not practiced over an internet forum, Orthodoxy is real life.
« Last Edit: January 16, 2007, 07:30:34 PM by Matthew777 »
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Offline Veniamin

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Re: This is not an Orthodox Christian forum
« Reply #24 on: January 16, 2007, 07:23:25 PM »
No it doesn't. You just think it does. There cannot be any such thing as a civil war forum any more than there can be a civil war mailbox or a civil war beach towel. "Civil War' and "internet forum" are contradictions in terms, and the Civil war cannot be practiced on the internet. Why anyone else can't see this is difficult for me to understand. Purple monkey dishwasher, lucy in the sky with diamonds.

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Offline John of the North

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Re: This is not an Orthodox Christian forum
« Reply #25 on: January 16, 2007, 07:26:41 PM »
Instead of putting my head through a wall over this whole thread, I shall restrain myself to ask a question....Why are you here then??
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Offline Matthew777

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Re: This is not an Orthodox Christian forum
« Reply #26 on: January 16, 2007, 07:29:35 PM »
Instead of putting my head through a wall over this whole thread, I shall restrain myself to ask a question....Why are you here then??

That is a good question. As an Orthodox Christian, I should devote myself to activities that can reasonably be referred to as "Orthodox," such as prayer, fasting, reading Scripture, and loving my neighbor. 
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Offline ozgeorge

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Re: This is not an Orthodox Christian forum
« Reply #27 on: January 16, 2007, 07:32:40 PM »
Igly boo is farkle?
Clearly I can trust you. Think about it man, just think about it! An apple is not a pie, yet there is this huge government conspiracy to make us believe that there is such a thing as "apple pie". Can't you see? Am I the only one who recognises this?
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Offline Matthew777

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Re: This is not an Orthodox Christian forum
« Reply #28 on: January 16, 2007, 07:35:49 PM »
Clearly I can trust you. Think about it man, just think about it! An apple is not a pie, yet there is this huge government conspiracy to make us believe that there is such a thing as "apple pie". Can't you see? Am I the only one who recognises this?

I'm sorry if you'd devalue the term "Orthodox Christian" to compare it to the term "apple." I thought there was more meaning in Orthodoxy than that.   
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Offline Veniamin

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Re: This is not an Orthodox Christian forum
« Reply #29 on: January 16, 2007, 07:37:45 PM »
Clearly I can trust you. Think about it man, just think about it! An apple is not a pie, yet there is this huge government conspiracy to make us believe that there is such a thing as "apple pie". Can't you see? Am I the only one who recognises this?

Preach it, brother!  Elvis is on a UFO!!!!
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Offline Justin Kissel

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Re: This is not an Orthodox Christian forum
« Reply #30 on: January 16, 2007, 07:44:04 PM »
This thread has some funny stuff! Monkeys and apples, that's what OC.net is all about Matthew.  :P

Offline Matthew777

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Re: This is not an Orthodox Christian forum
« Reply #31 on: January 16, 2007, 07:45:16 PM »
This is a serious issue as to how loosely we should use the term "Orthodox Christian" and what it really means to us. It's sad that anyone would be foolhardy about it.

Orthodox Christianity is found in a life well lived, not on an internet forum. Orthodox Christianity is found in a life well lived, not on an internet forum. Orthodox Christianity is found in a life well lived, not on an internet forum.
« Last Edit: January 16, 2007, 07:46:16 PM by Matthew777 »
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Offline ozgeorge

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Re: This is not an Orthodox Christian forum
« Reply #32 on: January 16, 2007, 07:47:02 PM »
This is a serious issue as to how loosely we should use the term "Orthodox Christian"
Or the terms "apple" or "monkey" or "civil war".....
If you're living a happy life as a Christian, you're doing something wrong.

Offline Veniamin

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Re: This is not an Orthodox Christian forum
« Reply #33 on: January 16, 2007, 07:52:36 PM »
Orthodox Christianity is found in a life well lived, not on an internet forum. Orthodox Christianity is found in a life well lived, not on an internet forum. Orthodox Christianity is found in a life well lived, not on an internet forum.

Now click the heels of your ruby slippers together three times and you'll be teleported out of the magical land of Oz and far away from a keyboard.

And George will be ever so grateful...

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Offline Anastasios

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Re: This is not an Orthodox Christian forum
« Reply #34 on: January 16, 2007, 07:53:58 PM »
This is a serious issue as to how loosely we should use the term "Orthodox Christian" and what it really means to us. It's sad that anyone would be foolhardy about it.

Orthodox Christianity is found in a life well lived, not on an internet forum. Orthodox Christianity is found in a life well lived, not on an internet forum. Orthodox Christianity is found in a life well lived, not on an internet forum.

Internet forums are real life--not real life in its totality, but certainly a part of real life. Many of us meet in person as a result of having met on this forum.  it is clearly a part of true sharing of being.

Anastasios
« Last Edit: January 16, 2007, 07:54:16 PM by Anastasios »
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Offline Justin Kissel

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Re: This is not an Orthodox Christian forum
« Reply #35 on: January 16, 2007, 07:56:29 PM »
Quote
Orthodox Christianity is found in a life well lived, not on an internet forum. Orthodox Christianity is found in a life well lived, not on an internet forum. Orthodox Christianity is found in a life well lived, not on an internet forum.

This reminded me of that seen in The Burbs, where Tom Hanks is in his basement and starts repeating himself in an attempt to ignore his friend.  :)

Offline John of the North

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Re: This is not an Orthodox Christian forum
« Reply #36 on: January 16, 2007, 07:59:30 PM »
For the purpose of semantics....by labelling the forum as "Orthodox Christian" it is shown the majority of the users may indeed belong to said faith group.

Has anyone actually claimed that being on this site makes one a "true" Orthodox Christian??  Whatever happened to the imperfection of the church and its adherents??

I mean, is someone on here claiming that by having a set number of posts, they are a better exemplar of the Faith than anyone else??  This is a medium to facilitate communication where barriers to physical fellowship exist. Period.

Even if it was possible for this site to make someone better as a follower of the Faith, to do so one would have to turn into one of those crazy computer nerds who die from sitting at the computer for days on end depriving themselves the neccessities of life.  Not to mention said persons would be skipping services....
"Christianity is not a philosophy, not a doctrine, but life." - Elder Sophrony (Sakharov)

Offline Carpatho Russian

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Re: This is not an Orthodox Christian forum
« Reply #37 on: January 16, 2007, 08:03:35 PM »
In the Orthodox Church, we have a phenomenon known as "Fools for Christ".  Since we have been informed that this is not an Orthodox Christian forum, I guess we just have fools!
Zastupnice christianov nepostydnaja, chodatajice ko Tvorcu nepreložnaja, ne prezri hr’išnych molenij hlasy, popredvari jako blahaja na pomošč nas, virno vopijuščich ti: Uskori na molitvu, i potščisja na umolenije, zastupajušči prisno Bohorodice, čtuščich t’a.

Offline ozgeorge

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Re: This is not an Orthodox Christian forum
« Reply #38 on: January 16, 2007, 08:04:01 PM »
And George will be ever so grateful...
No he won't. He actually has grown to love Matthew.
I like having him around. He amuses me.
And I would rather have a board full of Matthews than one full of racist nutjobs using it as a soapbox for their thinly disguised irrational hatred.
Matthew reminds me of the Hitch Hikers Guide to the Galaxy's description of the planet Earth: "Mostly harmless".
« Last Edit: January 16, 2007, 08:04:29 PM by ozgeorge »
If you're living a happy life as a Christian, you're doing something wrong.

Offline Veniamin

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Re: This is not an Orthodox Christian forum
« Reply #39 on: January 16, 2007, 08:07:59 PM »
And I would rather have a board full of Matthews than one full of racist nutjobs using it as a soapbox for their thinly disguised irrational hatred.

And we'd be guaranteed Shakespeare at some point.  ;)
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Offline dantxny

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Re: This is not an Orthodox Christian forum
« Reply #40 on: January 16, 2007, 08:11:36 PM »
In the Orthodox Church, we have a phenomenon known as "Fools for Christ".  Since we have been informed that this is not an Orthodox Christian forum, I guess we just have fools!

Well, at least one of them. ;)
"If you give the average Frenchman a choice between a reforming president who would plug the country's huge deficit and a good cheese, he would probably opt for the cheese." - Stephen Clarke
I think the French may be on to something here.

Offline Riddikulus

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Re: This is not an Orthodox Christian forum
« Reply #41 on: January 16, 2007, 08:16:19 PM »
Orthodox Christianity is found in a life well lived, not on an internet forum. Orthodox Christianity is found in a life well lived, not on an internet forum. Orthodox Christianity is found in a life well lived, not on an internet forum.

When I read this, I thought I needed new reading glasses. ::)

Matthew,

I have noticed, as I've read through other threads, that you have some very interesting things to say and often contribute some very good thoughts. This time, however, it seems that you have merely been contentious. Likely you didn't mean to be.

If I might be so bold as to offer a few words of advice. Sometimes, it's a good idea not to voice what is, when it is  articulated to others, bound to be perceived as a random and unconnected thought.  Sometimes, for whatever reason, issues that we have been contemplating are difficult to share. What might seem a brilliant concept when it remains inside our own head, is not helpful when shared with others who have not spent time considering similar issues.

Pick your battles and remember loose lips sink ships.  ;D


I believe in One God, maker of heaven and earth and of all things visible and invisible.

Nothing in biology makes sense except in the light of evolution.
Theodosius Dobzhansky, Russian Orthodox Christian (1900-1975)

Offline Carpatho Russian

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Re: This is not an Orthodox Christian forum
« Reply #42 on: January 16, 2007, 08:24:33 PM »
Hey,
I just noticed it's Matthew's Birthday.
Matthew - Happy Birthday!
May God grant you many happy, healthy, holy, and blessed years!
Mnohaja i blahaja lita!
Zastupnice christianov nepostydnaja, chodatajice ko Tvorcu nepreložnaja, ne prezri hr’išnych molenij hlasy, popredvari jako blahaja na pomošč nas, virno vopijuščich ti: Uskori na molitvu, i potščisja na umolenije, zastupajušči prisno Bohorodice, čtuščich t’a.

Offline Riddikulus

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Re: This is not an Orthodox Christian forum
« Reply #43 on: January 16, 2007, 08:28:26 PM »
Happy Birthday, Matthew! ;D
I believe in One God, maker of heaven and earth and of all things visible and invisible.

Nothing in biology makes sense except in the light of evolution.
Theodosius Dobzhansky, Russian Orthodox Christian (1900-1975)

Offline Landon77

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Re: This is not an Orthodox Christian forum
« Reply #44 on: January 16, 2007, 08:41:54 PM »
The Internet Forum Formerly Known as Orthodox Christianity dot Net, or IFFKOC.net.  Hey, it looks Greek to me!

"How stands your mighty god? My God is stronger than he."  -St. Boniface