Author Topic: Heavy Handed Censorship  (Read 2189 times)

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Offline Mo the Ethio

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Heavy Handed Censorship
« on: January 15, 2007, 12:00:26 AM »
What is the deal with the with the resent HEAVY HANDED censorship on this forum?
 Why are issues like the pedofile priest appointed by the AOC quickly locked ? Is a fear of turning possible converts away from the faith?  Are the Mods control freaks who think they are defending the faith by squashing issues that they find politically and morally offensive.  What gives?
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Offline Anastasios

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Re: Heavy Handed Censorship
« Reply #1 on: January 15, 2007, 12:17:53 AM »
I just stopped in during my travels.  I noticed this thread. While I don't moderate actively on the site anymore, I must say please, this is the least moderated Orthodox site of all time.

As far as personal accusations against priests, this is an internet forum, not a court of law.  I haven't read the thread in question but generally I have always wanted our forum to not discuss the specifics of individuals accused of crimes.  It is morally and legally irresponsible.

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Past posts reflect stages of my life before my baptism and may not be accurate expositions of Orthodox teaching. Also, I served as an Orthodox priest from 2008-2013, before resigning.

Offline Tamara

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Re: Heavy Handed Censorship
« Reply #2 on: January 15, 2007, 02:49:24 AM »
Mo,

It is not easy to be a forum moderator. It is a thankless job. If I post something that is unacceptable, they have a right to censor it because a forum is not a democracy. The moderators have a right to set the rules since they are the one's maintaining the site.

sincerely, Tamara


Offline ozgeorge

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Re: Heavy Handed Censorship
« Reply #3 on: January 15, 2007, 04:28:13 AM »
What is the deal with the with the resent HEAVY HANDED censorship on this forum?
I suppose that's a matter of opinion. I really don't think I'm heavy handed.

Why are issues like the pedofile priest appointed by the AOC quickly locked ?
As I explained in the post when I locked it, we don't know that he is a pedophile. In fact, if you read the link Tamara posted, there is no evidence, or even suggestion that he is a pedophile. If I had left his name posted on the thread, what you have just written would have smeared his name with the false accusation that he is a pedophile, and you would be up for libel. In other words, you have just proved that I was correct to remove his name.

Is a fear of turning possible converts away from the faith?
Not a consideration at all. In fact, as well as directing Tamara to her Bishop, I also posted a link to the independant pokrov.org website a link, so anyone who wants to can see the sexual abuse problems in the Orthodox Church in the USA.

Are the Mods control freaks who think they are defending the faith by squashing issues that they find politically and morally offensive.  What gives?
How about "legally dangerous"? You have just accused this man of being a pedophile- I hope you are prepared to defend yourself in a libel case, because you have no evidence that he is.
It's very important not to let our emotions run away with us. If you feel there is an issue with this priest, then there are proper channels- His Bishop, Pokrov.org, the Police etc. An internet forum is not the place to address this. What if it turns out this man is innocent and his name has been destroyed on this forum? How would you feel if someone suggested that you were a pedophile on this forum with absolutely no evidence? Well you have just done the same to this priest, and I have yet to see any evidence that he is a pedophile.

It's obvious to me that locking the thread and removing his name was more than justified.
« Last Edit: January 15, 2007, 08:38:19 AM by ozgeorge »
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Offline ozgeorge

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Re: Heavy Handed Censorship
« Reply #4 on: January 15, 2007, 05:01:19 AM »
a forum is not a democracy.
Nor is it a police state. But I would add, Tamara, that in a democracy, one is innocent until proven guilty. Or do we now live in the Age of "trial by internet"? If, like Mo, you think this man is a Pedophile, then please, I urge you to present your evidence to the proper authorities, as I have already suggested. Posting innuendo's here and discussing them is not going to protect children.
« Last Edit: January 15, 2007, 05:03:06 AM by ozgeorge »
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Offline GiC

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Re: Heavy Handed Censorship
« Reply #5 on: January 15, 2007, 08:14:07 AM »
Or do we now live in the Age of "trial by internet"?

Well, quite often in this day and age there are two courts, the court of law (which can be further divided into civil and criminal courts) and the court of public opinion...and you can be acquitted in one and convicted in the other ;)
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Offline Tamara

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Re: Heavy Handed Censorship
« Reply #6 on: January 15, 2007, 03:32:58 PM »
Nor is it a police state. But I would add, Tamara, that in a democracy, one is innocent until proven guilty. Or do we now live in the Age of "trial by internet"? If, like Mo, you think this man is a Pedophile, then please, I urge you to present your evidence to the proper authorities, as I have already suggested. Posting innuendo's here and discussing them is not going to protect children.

George,

First let me say I am not upset you locked the file. As a moderator of this forum I will respect your wishes.

Bishop Antoun is not my bishop so I doubt very much if he will hear my pleas because many have questioned him about his
decision to ordain this man.
I do not believe he is a pedophile but he has already been to court on numerous occasions and has had to pay $12 million dollars to settle various cases. If anyone reads the link, they will see what he has been accused of over the years before he was ordained a priest. He posed as a doctor without having the proper degrees and there seem to be quite of few adults who were harmed by him when they were teenagers.

If I have offended you anyway please forgive me. sincerely, Tamara

Offline Tamara

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Re: Heavy Handed Censorship
« Reply #7 on: January 15, 2007, 03:34:35 PM »
George,

I did check the pokrov site you mentioned. This priest is on their list of offenders.

Offline SmoT

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Re: Heavy Handed Censorship
« Reply #8 on: January 15, 2007, 03:54:53 PM »
Nor is it a police state. But I would add, Tamara, that in a democracy, one is innocent until proven guilty.

Unless, of course, you play lacrosse for Duke  >:(


Or do we now live in the Age of "trial by internet"?

Yes, we do.

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Offline Mo the Ethio

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Re: Heavy Handed Censorship
« Reply #9 on: January 15, 2007, 05:00:44 PM »
George:
  Forgive me for the offence . I am grateful for your fine efforts as a Mod on this forum.
I respect your opinion, though I disagree that it is inappropriate to discuss this matter on an internet forum.
 Perhaps moving it to politics ???
    ( I REALLY miss the spell check button!!!!)


                      Mo
« Last Edit: January 15, 2007, 05:07:27 PM by Mo the Ethio »
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Offline ozgeorge

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Re: Heavy Handed Censorship
« Reply #10 on: January 15, 2007, 05:52:02 PM »
George:
  Forgive me for the offence . I am grateful for your fine efforts as a Mod on this forum.
I respect your opinion, though I disagree that it is inappropriate to discuss this matter on an internet forum.
 Perhaps moving it to politics ???
    ( I REALLY miss the spell check button!!!!)


                      Mo

Really, I didn't take any offence, and I am more than happy that my moderation should be accountable.
You're right, and I agree that discussing this matter is not inappropriate for an internet forum, but I still think that discussing particular people and naming them (especially when the evidence is not clear or non-existent) is innappropriate for two reasons:
Firstly, it places the forum in a very precarious legal position. If you are prepared to pay the full legal costs of the board in a defamation case, then fine, but I doubt that you are.
Secondly, if you sincerely have concerns about a priest in the Orthodox Church (and are not merely engaging in gossip mongering) then you not only have a moral but also a legal responsibility to report it to the proper authorities. So if you feel strongly enough about this to drag this man's name through the mud on this forum, then surely you feel strongly enough about it to report your evidence/suspicions to the authorities who can actually do something about it, unlike this forum.
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Offline Mo the Ethio

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Re: Heavy Handed Censorship
« Reply #11 on: January 16, 2007, 02:26:50 AM »

 If you are prepared to pay the full legal costs of the board in a defamation case, then fine, but I doubt that you are.

With all due repect,you speculate. You have no knowledge of my financial disposition.
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Offline ozgeorge

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Re: Heavy Handed Censorship
« Reply #12 on: January 16, 2007, 04:20:55 AM »
With all due repect,you speculate. You have no knowledge of my financial disposition.
I actually didn't comment on your financial disposition. But if you mean that you will be happy to personally fund any and all legal costs incurred by the Admins of OCnet, as well as your own guaranty insurance for yourself should the worst happen and the costs leave you or your estate bankrupt, then I'll get SouthSerb & Veniamin to write up a contract for you to sign to that effect. As soon as I have the signed contract in my hand together with the certificate of currency for your guaranty insurance, I'll reopen the thread. ;)
« Last Edit: January 16, 2007, 05:03:01 AM by ozgeorge »
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Offline Mo the Ethio

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Re: Heavy Handed Censorship
« Reply #13 on: January 16, 2007, 10:35:37 PM »
I actually didn't comment on your financial disposition.
Ummm.... actually, you did.
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Offline ozgeorge

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Re: Heavy Handed Censorship
« Reply #14 on: January 16, 2007, 10:50:01 PM »
Ummm.... actually, you did.
Ummm...actually I didn't.
I commented (twice now) on your unwillingness to part with funds to pay for OCnet's legal costs, which I still maintain is a reality.
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Offline Mo the Ethio

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Re: Heavy Handed Censorship
« Reply #15 on: January 16, 2007, 11:21:14 PM »
Ummm...actually I didn't.
I commented (twice now) on your unwillingness to part with funds to pay for OCnet's legal costs, which I still maintain is a reality.
Point well taken. However you DID speculate by your comment " ...I doubt you can".
If your concern is of threads of a libelous nature, I summit there have been many,MANY other threads on this forum that invite the threat of litigation.
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Offline ozgeorge

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Re: Heavy Handed Censorship
« Reply #16 on: January 17, 2007, 07:15:25 AM »
Point well taken. However you DID speculate by your comment " ...I doubt you can".
Mo, this is getting frustrating! I didn't say that you can't, I said that you won't. And I still say that you wont! Go back and read it again for yourself. Here's what I said:
If you are prepared to pay the full legal costs of the board in a defamation case, then fine, but I doubt that you are.
So prove me wrong. Say right now that you are prepared pay the full legal costs of the board.

If your concern is of threads of a libelous nature, I summit there have been many,MANY other threads on this forum that invite the threat of litigation.
Perhaps, but not on my watch. ;)
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Offline Fr. George

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Re: Heavy Handed Censorship
« Reply #17 on: January 17, 2007, 07:45:59 PM »
Perhaps, but not on my watch. ;)   

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