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Convert Issues / Re: What is a good book on the origins of Monasticism?
« Last post by mcarmichael on Yesterday at 11:45:07 PM »
I'm surprised nobody mentioned Elijah, and his disciples.
93
That is a good question.  Why are Melkites, whose theology does not agree with Rome, in communion with them?  Maybe to the Melkite Bishop of Antioch, communion doesn't necessarily mean in theological agreement.  Maybe it means "hey we may theological and traditional differences but we can still be friends"?
They may answer that way.

And de facto you are left with a radically different understanding of communion, basically Open Communion - just one that you have selectively given to some and not others. Why not give communion to every single schismatic "Orthodox" group so long as they have basic teachings close to yours? Why not give communion to Lutherans and to Anglo-Catholics? I think you should if you are going to give communion to RCs and EOs alike. Lutheran/Anglican theology is in some ways closer to Orthodoxy and in other ways closer to the RCs, so if you are just going to give communion based on theology and think RC and EO theology are close enough, you might as well give communion to everyone else whose theology matches either the RCs' or EOs'.
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Hostility to metaphysics among scientists goes back a long way. If I recall correctly, Lavoisier says that his work on chemistry will not be metaphysical, i.e., it will be rigorous. Even Einstein, who was pretty well educated in philosophy, made jokes about metaphysics from time to time. It is no wonder that the Oatmeal lifted the text from 1920s Europe, where dislike of theology and metaphysics were pretty high and science was strongly admired.
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Please see these short statements by the Melkite and Ant. Orth. Churches here:
http://www.byzcath.org/index.php/resources-mainmenu-63/document-library-mainmenu-97/33-document-library/documents-of-the-byzantine-catholic-churches/2770-the-melkite-initiative-with-the-antiochian-orthodox-church

The Antiochians church says that fot the Melkite to have the same faith as the EOS it would need to stop accepting post schism RC councils as ecumenical for the whole church. Recognized ecumenical councils are seen by nature by the RCS and by many EOS as infallible. But the Non EO councils teach things EOS disagree with.
The Ant. Church does not accept intercommunion with Melkites at this point it says and it does not agree with having communion with Rome until the faith is lined up.

So to answer your question, the Ant. Orthodox and Orthodox do not agree with intercommunion with the RC communion at this point, because we do not agree all the teachings of councils you and the RCS call ecumenical after the Schism.

The Roman pope's follow up was diplomatic bc it said that you need the same beliefs to be in communion and the RCS and EOS do not have the same teachings. The Pope did not lay out in a raw form all that this entails. But it basically raises the question of what the melkites are doing in communion in Rome if they disagree with Rome's teachings of faith not just what you call politics.

That is a good question.  Why are Melkites, whose theology does not agree with Rome, in communion with them?  Maybe to the Melkite Bishop of Antioch, communion doesn't necessarily mean in theological agreement.  Maybe it means "hey we may theological and traditional differences but we can still be friends"?  I will find out the answer to this and I will ask Melkite clergy about this and see what they say about this.

About a year ago I asked a young ordained Melkite priest: "why did you decide to join the Melkites and not the Orthodox Church?". He said that it was a tough decision to make but that he felt that being a Melkite allowed his to follow the Orthodox faith yet be able to bridge the gap the west.

This is a very interesting topic to me as I continue to learn about early church history.  The divine liturgy at a RCC does nothing for me.  However, there is something about a St John Chrysostum divine liturgy, either at a Melkite or AEO church, that is really gravitating.
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Please see these short statements by the Melkite and Ant. Orth. Churches here:
http://www.byzcath.org/index.php/resources-mainmenu-63/document-library-mainmenu-97/33-document-library/documents-of-the-byzantine-catholic-churches/2770-the-melkite-initiative-with-the-antiochian-orthodox-church

The Antiochians church says that fot the Melkite to have the same faith as the EOS it would need to stop accepting post schism RC councils as ecumenical for the whole church. Recognized ecumenical councils are seen by nature by the RCS and by many EOS as infallible. But the Non EO councils teach things EOS disagree with.
The Ant. Church does not accept intercommunion with Melkites at this point it says and it does not agree with having communion with Rome until the faith is lined up.

So to answer your question, the Ant. Orthodox and Orthodox do not agree with intercommunion with the RC communion at this point, because we do not agree all the teachings of councils you and the RCS call ecumenical after the Schism.

The Roman pope's follow up was diplomatic bc it said that you need the same beliefs to be in communion and the RCS and EOS do not have the same teachings. The Pope did not lay out in a raw form all that this entails. But it basically raises the question of what the melkites are doing in communion in Rome if they disagree with Rome's teachings of faith not just what you call politics.
97
Non-Religious Topics / Re: Reason And Rationalism
« Last post by Onesimus on Yesterday at 09:47:01 PM »
The Fathers (esp. The desert Fathers) define reason as something quite different than what they call "bare knowledge" or intellect.

The Scriptures differentiate between the two with the word gnosis and epignosis. 

Reason is the mind illumined by the healed and illumined heart and noetic faculty.   

Your definition seems to fit this well.   Intellectual thought is not reason.   True reason is a gift from God received as grace in sanctification.

It is important, I think in modernity, to say that reason is not simply an aspect of intellectual faculty.   The intellect must be directed, as you indicate, by the "renewal of our mind" be faith and grace.
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Prayer Forum / Re: Friend tried to kill himself
« Last post by JTLoganville on Yesterday at 09:43:49 PM »
God, the author and giver of all life,
Who has created us in Your pure image:
We pray for your creature John,
who may not yet recognize that he is Your child,
and the bearer of Your likeness,
but who has despaired and thus despised Your gift of life.
Convert his heart,
and ours,
that we may more and more recognize that we bear the image and likeness
of Your only-Begotten Son with Whom You are blessed,
together with Your all-Holy and life giving Spirit,
now and always and urto Ages of Ages.
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Non-Religious Topics / Re: Reason And Rationalism
« Last post by lbrody on Yesterday at 09:37:04 PM »
Has the original question been addessed at all?

Actually I never got the one liner. So here is my best attempt:

"The rational man, through the use of reason, when receptive to faith is able to battle against the powerful forces of imagination, resulting in a search for authentic truth; however, if not receptive to faith is helpless to the powerful forces of imagination, resulting in the irrational man--the sub-human man--who is controlled by various and innumerable, subtle lies."

-lbrody
100
Prayer Forum / Re: Friend tried to kill himself
« Last post by IXOYE on Yesterday at 09:35:06 PM »
Lord, have mercy!
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