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Moderated Forums => Free-For-All => Religious Topics => Topic started by: Alexander_Kuzmin on July 01, 2014, 05:42:21 AM

Title: Marilyn Manson vs Orthodox activists
Post by: Alexander_Kuzmin on July 01, 2014, 05:42:21 AM
Here is a video of Orthodox activists attacking Marilyn Manson in Moscow.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=B7pVmAoVTFY

They threw eggs at him and poured holy water in his direction. You can see also a fan girl who attacked Orthodox activists back.
It was shown on TV many times, so they made a good advertisement for this singer before his concert.

But later right before the concert somebody called the police and said there the hall had been mined. So, the concert was cancelled. But it was a fake because the bomb was not found.
Title: Re: Marilyn Manson vs Orthodox activists
Post by: Maria on July 01, 2014, 08:07:32 AM
Is the video safe? I do not know who Marilyn Manson is.
Title: Re: Marilyn Manson vs Orthodox activists
Post by: Alexander_Kuzmin on July 01, 2014, 08:13:35 AM
Yes, it is safe. Marilyn Manson is a pseydo-satanic silly singer from the USA.
Title: Re: Marilyn Manson vs Orthodox activists
Post by: Maria on July 01, 2014, 08:15:32 AM
Yes, it is safe. Marilyn Manson is a pseydo-satanic silly singer from the USA.

I do not know about pseudo-satanic singers ... must of what I have heard sounds rock hard metal satanic.

I avoid such "music" like the plague.
Title: Re: Marilyn Manson vs Orthodox activists
Post by: Alexander_Kuzmin on July 01, 2014, 08:22:04 AM
There is no music in this video. This is a news-item from our TV.
But it looks as far from Christianity as the attacked person, although it was done by Christians.
Title: Re: Marilyn Manson vs Orthodox activists
Post by: Avdima on July 01, 2014, 09:03:32 AM
When so called Christians do these type of things it makes them look sick and hateful  :'(.
Title: Re: Marilyn Manson vs Orthodox activists
Post by: minasoliman on July 01, 2014, 09:05:22 AM
Really? They protest by throwing eggs (while making the sign of the cross no less) and hitting with icons?  I don't care who the singer is. The way the protest was done was unacceptable.
Title: Re: Marilyn Manson vs Orthodox activists
Post by: Alexander_Kuzmin on July 01, 2014, 09:07:41 AM
Yes, I agree.
Title: Re: Marilyn Manson vs Orthodox activists
Post by: Antonis on July 01, 2014, 09:51:56 AM
As a certain bishop from Cyprus was fond of saying, "God, save us from the religious!"
Title: Re: Marilyn Manson vs Orthodox activists
Post by: Geh on July 01, 2014, 10:05:20 AM
Pity they didn't go further.
Title: Re: Marilyn Manson vs Orthodox activists
Post by: Theophania on July 01, 2014, 10:10:59 AM
Yes, it is safe. Marilyn Manson is a pseydo-satanic silly singer from the USA.

I do not know about pseudo-satanic singers ... must of what I have heard sounds rock hard metal satanic.

I avoid such "music" like the plague.

Heavy metal music (which MM isn't) is satanic?
Title: Re: Marilyn Manson vs Orthodox activists
Post by: Asteriktos on July 01, 2014, 11:45:04 AM
I don't even...
Title: Re: Marilyn Manson vs Orthodox activists
Post by: yeshuaisiam on July 01, 2014, 11:46:00 AM
I completely disagree with these EO Christians for doing such a thing.  We are supposed to love our enemies.   He can use stuff like this to further exploit Christianity.  I do not believe for a second that most EO Christians would approve of this behavior.

Marilyn Manson is a satanist and an ordained priest in the Church of Satan.  

Much of the music industry promotes satanic teachings themed around "you can do what you want"/"do your own thing"/"do what thy wilt"/"going your own way"/ basically making yourself God.
Title: Re: Marilyn Manson vs Orthodox activists
Post by: DeniseDenise on July 01, 2014, 11:46:26 AM
Yes, it is safe. Marilyn Manson is a pseydo-satanic silly singer from the USA.

I do not know about pseudo-satanic singers ... must of what I have heard sounds rock hard metal satanic.

I avoid such "music" like the plague.


What -don't- you avoid like the plague?
Title: Re: Marilyn Manson vs Orthodox activists
Post by: Theophania on July 01, 2014, 11:47:43 AM
I completely disagree with these EO Christians for doing such a thing.  We are supposed to love our enemies.   He can use stuff like this to further exploit Christianity.  I do not believe for a second that most EO Christians would approve of this behavior.

Marilyn Manson is a satanist and an ordained priest in the Church of Satan.  

Much of the music industry promotes satanic teachings themed around "you can do what you want"/"do your own thing"/"do what thy wilt"/"going your own way"/ basically making yourself God.

You think everyone in show business is in the Illuminati..
Title: Re: Marilyn Manson vs Orthodox activists
Post by: yeshuaisiam on July 01, 2014, 12:08:57 PM
I completely disagree with these EO Christians for doing such a thing.  We are supposed to love our enemies.   He can use stuff like this to further exploit Christianity.  I do not believe for a second that most EO Christians would approve of this behavior.

Marilyn Manson is a satanist and an ordained priest in the Church of Satan.  

Much of the music industry promotes satanic teachings themed around "you can do what you want"/"do your own thing"/"do what thy wilt"/"going your own way"/ basically making yourself God.

You think everyone in show business is in the Illuminati..

You think that I think that everybody in show business is in the illuminati because I've pointed out several examples.
Keep the Ad Hominem attacks please.

There are a ton of EO warnings on much of the main stream music and movies.

Also read your saints on theaters, tragedies, and music.
Title: Re: Marilyn Manson vs Orthodox activists
Post by: yeshuaisiam on July 01, 2014, 12:10:02 PM
Yes, it is safe. Marilyn Manson is a pseydo-satanic silly singer from the USA.

I do not know about pseudo-satanic singers ... must of what I have heard sounds rock hard metal satanic.

I avoid such "music" like the plague.

Much of it promotes satanic ideals and teachings, whether knowing or unknowing.
Title: Re: Marilyn Manson vs Orthodox activists
Post by: Theophania on July 01, 2014, 12:10:56 PM
I completely disagree with these EO Christians for doing such a thing.  We are supposed to love our enemies.   He can use stuff like this to further exploit Christianity.  I do not believe for a second that most EO Christians would approve of this behavior.

Marilyn Manson is a satanist and an ordained priest in the Church of Satan.  

Much of the music industry promotes satanic teachings themed around "you can do what you want"/"do your own thing"/"do what thy wilt"/"going your own way"/ basically making yourself God.

You think everyone in show business is in the Illuminati..

You think that I think that everybody in show business is in the illuminati because I've pointed out several examples.
Keep the Ad Hominem attacks please.

There are a ton of EO warnings on much of the main stream music and movies.

Also read your saints on theaters, tragedies, and music.

No.
Title: Re: Marilyn Manson vs Orthodox activists
Post by: Alveus Lacuna on July 01, 2014, 12:15:20 PM
Really? They protest by throwing eggs (while making the sign of the cross no less) and hitting with icons?  I don't care who the singer is. The way the protest was done was unacceptable.

I think that it's hilarious and makes life worth living.
Title: Re: Marilyn Manson vs Orthodox activists
Post by: DeniseDenise on July 01, 2014, 12:16:29 PM
Yes, it is safe. Marilyn Manson is a pseydo-satanic silly singer from the USA.

I do not know about pseudo-satanic singers ... must of what I have heard sounds rock hard metal satanic.

I avoid such "music" like the plague.

Much of it promotes satanic ideals and teachings, whether knowing or unknowing.


as does the internet....yet you are here
Title: Re: Marilyn Manson vs Orthodox activists
Post by: minasoliman on July 01, 2014, 12:19:31 PM
I completely disagree with these EO Christians for doing such a thing.  We are supposed to love our enemies.   He can use stuff like this to further exploit Christianity.  I do not believe for a second that most EO Christians would approve of this behavior.

Marilyn Manson is a satanist and an ordained priest in the Church of Satan.  

Much of the music industry promotes satanic teachings themed around "you can do what you want"/"do your own thing"/"do what thy wilt"/"going your own way"/ basically making yourself God.

You think everyone in show business is in the Illuminati..

You think that I think that everybody in show business is in the illuminati because I've pointed out several examples.
Keep the Ad Hominem attacks please.

There are a ton of EO warnings on much of the main stream music and movies.

Also read your saints on theaters, tragedies, and music.

What ad hominem?
Title: Re: Marilyn Manson vs Orthodox activists
Post by: Alpo on July 01, 2014, 12:27:49 PM
I'm a bit suprised that some are still taking artists like that seriously and/or find it offending.
Title: Re: Marilyn Manson vs Orthodox activists
Post by: Asteriktos on July 01, 2014, 12:31:57 PM
I hope someone tells these guys about the thousand black metal bands probably within a stones throw of them. It'd probably be the best thing to happen to those bands.
Title: Re: Marilyn Manson vs Orthodox activists
Post by: biro on July 01, 2014, 12:33:23 PM
I hope someone tells these guys about the thousand black metal bands probably within a stones throw of them. It'd probably be the best thing to happen to those bands.

:)
Title: Re: Marilyn Manson vs Orthodox activists
Post by: PeterTheAleut on July 01, 2014, 01:07:41 PM
I completely disagree with these EO Christians for doing such a thing.  We are supposed to love our enemies.   He can use stuff like this to further exploit Christianity.  I do not believe for a second that most EO Christians would approve of this behavior.

Marilyn Manson is a satanist and an ordained priest in the Church of Satan.  

Much of the music industry promotes satanic teachings themed around "you can do what you want"/"do your own thing"/"do what thy wilt"/"going your own way"/ basically making yourself God.

You think everyone in show business is in the Illuminati..

You think that I think that everybody in show business is in the illuminati because I've pointed out several examples.
Keep the Ad Hominem attacks please.

There are a ton of EO warnings on much of the main stream music and movies.

Also read your saints on theaters, tragedies, and music.

What ad hominem?
Yesh thinks every criticism of his point of view is an ad hominem.
Title: Re: Marilyn Manson vs Orthodox activists
Post by: Adela on July 01, 2014, 01:13:16 PM
Yes, it is safe. Marilyn Manson is a pseydo-satanic silly singer from the USA.

I do not know about pseudo-satanic singers ... must of what I have heard sounds rock hard metal satanic.

I avoid such "music" like the plague.

Much of it promotes satanic ideals and teachings, whether knowing or unknowing.


as does the internet....yet you are here

Yesh might be right on this..... I saw a glimpse into the Goth world through my Goth neighbors about 4 years ago.  I ended up watching their dog quite a bit, and was invited over after their "gathering" for some gumbo.   On the surface it seems like silly kids dressed in black living out some fantasy in their heads.  Instead it was a rather formal, organized religion of sorts.  In this city, to get into the "group" you had to be sponsored by another Goth.  They had lots of kids wanting to get in, but they had to be sponsored to be admitted into the inner circle.     The weird thing, to me, was it wasn't just the kids dressed in black, it was other groups, such as some people pretending to be Vikings.  Really.  There was a subset that was into Viking paganism, and looked more like aging grunge rockers.  One couple had a wedding that was based on Viking paganism, and the guests all had to come dressed like Vikings.  Or, there were some rich women driving Mercedes and living in multimillion dollar homes living this secret life in the Goth world.   Many of them took 2nd names that were only used in their inner group.  Their "gatherings" were sort of like a religious thing, and they would talk about their spirituality.  They also had the concept of "elders". My neighbor was an elder, and if there were grievances in the group you had to go before the elders.    They also seemed to be really into sexually acting out whatever urges they had, there were these fetish parties.  I remember my neighbor going to one, telling me as she walked to her car, that she needed her sexual release.   She thought she was an expert on paganism.  Her boyfriend was into some black art,  he was always dressed in black and had weird symbols all over his car. My neighbor alluded to him practicing something dark, but I didn't ask further.   So, some of the kids you saw dressed in black wearing makeup to look like they were drained of blood might have been silly kids just rebelling, but there really is a more formal, underground group of connected yet diverse paganism that borders on dark arts.
Title: Re: Marilyn Manson vs Orthodox activists
Post by: DeniseDenise on July 01, 2014, 01:20:48 PM
First of all...


Paganism does NOT equal goth.

Considering I used to be a goth, I just might know a bit more about it than you would think.

Yes, there is overlap, just like there is overlap between many different groups.  But that does not make your neighbours the poster children for Goth. 



But honestly since I am wasting my breath....I will leave it at that.....




Title: Re: Marilyn Manson vs Orthodox activists
Post by: Theophania on July 01, 2014, 01:23:46 PM
First of all...


Paganism does NOT equal goth.

Considering I used to be a goth, I just might know a bit more about it than you would think.

Yes, there is overlap, just like there is overlap between many different groups.  But that does not make your neighbours the poster children for Goth. 



But honestly since I am wasting my breath....I will leave it at that.....






the fact that you used to be goth-- real goth, not Hot Topic goth --just makes me like you that much more, LOL.
Title: Re: Marilyn Manson vs Orthodox activists
Post by: Adela on July 01, 2014, 01:25:09 PM
First of all...


Paganism does NOT equal goth.

Considering I used to be a goth, I just might know a bit more about it than you would think.

Yes, there is overlap, just like there is overlap between many different groups.  But that does not make your neighbours the poster children for Goth.  



But honestly since I am wasting my breath....I will leave it at that.....






I can only share what I experienced in one city.  There really was strong pagan religion in all the many that came for their gatherings. Like I said, they only admitted some to their inner circle. So there were the teenagers dressed in black that you see at the mall, and then there were this rather large group of rather organized pagans that functioned as a secret religion.   Your experiences don't necessarily negate mine.
Title: Re: Marilyn Manson vs Orthodox activists
Post by: Alpo on July 01, 2014, 01:44:38 PM
Considering I used to be a goth

(http://www.metallized.it/public/articoli2/band1.jpg)

Sorry, couldn't resist. :angel:
Title: Re: Marilyn Manson vs Orthodox activists
Post by: TheTrisagion on July 01, 2014, 01:45:51 PM
First of all...


Paganism does NOT equal goth.

Considering I used to be a goth, I just might know a bit more about it than you would think.

Yes, there is overlap, just like there is overlap between many different groups.  But that does not make your neighbours the poster children for Goth. 



But honestly since I am wasting my breath....I will leave it at that.....

I did NOT see that one coming!
Title: Re: Marilyn Manson vs Orthodox activists
Post by: vamrat on July 01, 2014, 01:50:32 PM
First of all...


Paganism does NOT equal goth.

Considering I used to be a goth, I just might know a bit more about it than you would think.

Yes, there is overlap, just like there is overlap between many different groups.  But that does not make your neighbours the poster children for Goth. 



But honestly since I am wasting my breath....I will leave it at that.....






the fact that you used to be goth-- real goth, not Hot Topic goth --just makes me like you that much more, LOL.

Nah, she was just another poser.  The real Goths blended in with the peoples of Spain, Italy, and the Balkans ages ago.
Title: Re: Marilyn Manson vs Orthodox activists
Post by: DeniseDenise on July 01, 2014, 01:51:01 PM
First of all...


Paganism does NOT equal goth.

Considering I used to be a goth, I just might know a bit more about it than you would think.

Yes, there is overlap, just like there is overlap between many different groups.  But that does not make your neighbours the poster children for Goth. 



But honestly since I am wasting my breath....I will leave it at that.....

I did NOT see that one coming!

I have also been a protestant missionary in Brazil.....


expect the unexpected.
Title: Re: Marilyn Manson vs Orthodox activists
Post by: TheTrisagion on July 01, 2014, 01:51:45 PM
First of all...


Paganism does NOT equal goth.

Considering I used to be a goth, I just might know a bit more about it than you would think.

Yes, there is overlap, just like there is overlap between many different groups.  But that does not make your neighbours the poster children for Goth. 



But honestly since I am wasting my breath....I will leave it at that.....

I did NOT see that one coming!

I have also been a protestant missionary in Brazil.....


expect the unexpected.
At the same time that you were goth?
Title: Re: Marilyn Manson vs Orthodox activists
Post by: Arachne on July 01, 2014, 01:52:32 PM
First of all...


Paganism does NOT equal goth.

Considering I used to be a goth, I just might know a bit more about it than you would think.

Yes, there is overlap, just like there is overlap between many different groups.  But that does not make your neighbours the poster children for Goth. 



But honestly since I am wasting my breath....I will leave it at that.....

I'd have said the same, if we weren't at dinner at the time of posting. :P

We may have put aside the fashion sense, Denise (except for special occasions ;)), but gothery is more a matter of music and literature than how much black kohl we wear.

'Kids in black = satanism'. Are the 80s coming back? What has Tipper Gore to say about it?

Corpsepaint looks silly when fresh and ridiculous when mixed with sweat. Both Kiss and Alice Cooper abandoned it 30 years ago. Clue?

And Marilyn Manson? He may have had some shock value 15 years ago. Now he's just establishment.
Title: Re: Marilyn Manson vs Orthodox activists
Post by: vamrat on July 01, 2014, 01:52:48 PM
Considering I used to be a goth

(http://www.metallized.it/public/articoli2/band1.jpg)

Sorry, couldn't resist. :angel:

CRAB WALK!!!!!

(http://hugelolcdn.com/i/267522.gif)
Title: Re: Marilyn Manson vs Orthodox activists
Post by: Arachne on July 01, 2014, 01:54:35 PM
CRAB CRAPPED PANTS WALK!!!!!

(http://hugelolcdn.com/i/267522.gif)

Fixeded. :angel:
Title: Re: Marilyn Manson vs Orthodox activists
Post by: Adela on July 01, 2014, 01:59:08 PM
First of all...


Paganism does NOT equal goth.

Considering I used to be a goth, I just might know a bit more about it than you would think.

Yes, there is overlap, just like there is overlap between many different groups.  But that does not make your neighbours the poster children for Goth. 



But honestly since I am wasting my breath....I will leave it at that.....

I'd have said the same, if we weren't at dinner at the time of posting. :P

We may have put aside the fashion sense, Denise (except for special occasions ;)), but gothery is more a matter of music and literature than how much black kohl we wear.

'Kids in black = satanism'. Are the 80s coming back? What has Tipper Gore to say about it?

Corpsepaint looks silly when fresh and ridiculous when mixed with sweat. Both Kiss and Alice Cooper abandoned it 30 years ago. Clue?

And Marilyn Manson? He may have had some shock value 15 years ago. Now he's just establishment.

They didn't get the message in Tampa, FL,  this is where the Goths there all hang out:


(http://www.taboomasquerade.com/wp-images/2013/06/Taboo-April-19th-stroked-whiteweb-1.gif)
Title: Re: Marilyn Manson vs Orthodox activists
Post by: Arachne on July 01, 2014, 02:05:34 PM
First of all...


Paganism does NOT equal goth.

Considering I used to be a goth, I just might know a bit more about it than you would think.

Yes, there is overlap, just like there is overlap between many different groups.  But that does not make your neighbours the poster children for Goth. 



But honestly since I am wasting my breath....I will leave it at that.....

I'd have said the same, if we weren't at dinner at the time of posting. :P

We may have put aside the fashion sense, Denise (except for special occasions ;)), but gothery is more a matter of music and literature than how much black kohl we wear.

'Kids in black = satanism'. Are the 80s coming back? What has Tipper Gore to say about it?

Corpsepaint looks silly when fresh and ridiculous when mixed with sweat. Both Kiss and Alice Cooper abandoned it 30 years ago. Clue?

And Marilyn Manson? He may have had some shock value 15 years ago. Now he's just establishment.

They didn't get the message in Tampa, FL,  this is where the Goths there all hang out:


(http://www.taboomasquerade.com/wp-images/2013/06/Taboo-April-19th-stroked-whiteweb-1.gif)

Would they be allowed into more mainstream establishments?

I've had reactions to my own outfits (which ranged from Trinity to Vanessa Ives) range from indifference to 'point and laugh' to being cussed out in the street, as if it were any of their business.
Title: Re: Marilyn Manson vs Orthodox activists
Post by: Adela on July 01, 2014, 02:11:11 PM
http://www.sptimes.com/2006/08/17/Floridian/The_Castle_calls.shtml

Tampa Goths:

Quote
After 15 years, this still hasn’t gotten old: the black, the heavy makeup, the darkness, the sheer weight of being Goth.

(http://www.sptimes.com/2006/08/17/images/xlarge/Floridi_goths08_769577.jpg)


And they have poetry readings.....

(http://www.karmaradionetwork.com/picts/agg2012.JPG)
Title: Re: Marilyn Manson vs Orthodox activists
Post by: Arachne on July 01, 2014, 02:13:47 PM
Not every work environment out there is flexible enough for such styles. ;D 'Weekend goths' were ridiculed at first, but they keep gaining momentum as the scene ages and their ranks swell. :)
Title: Re: Marilyn Manson vs Orthodox activists
Post by: Asteriktos on July 01, 2014, 02:14:07 PM
(http://www.taboomasquerade.com/wp-images/2013/06/Taboo-April-19th-stroked-whiteweb-1.gif)

Those things are not as perverse as most people would assume.
Title: Re: Marilyn Manson vs Orthodox activists
Post by: DeniseDenise on July 01, 2014, 02:14:34 PM
Other than your dislike of your neighbors....I don't get why you are spending time digging up all this stuff?

I never said Goth's were angels....but nor are 100% of them like you have experienced.


You bring up flyers for events that say things like 'fetish ball'....big whoopie...so -some- people do stuff like that.  Just like I would be shocked right out of my shoes if -some- people here also didn't do stuff like that.

Appearance does not = your heart and your behavior.  Christ knew this....

Title: Re: Marilyn Manson vs Orthodox activists
Post by: Adela on July 01, 2014, 02:15:23 PM
First of all...


Paganism does NOT equal goth.

Considering I used to be a goth, I just might know a bit more about it than you would think.

Yes, there is overlap, just like there is overlap between many different groups.  But that does not make your neighbours the poster children for Goth. 



But honestly since I am wasting my breath....I will leave it at that.....

I'd have said the same, if we weren't at dinner at the time of posting. :P

We may have put aside the fashion sense, Denise (except for special occasions ;)), but gothery is more a matter of music and literature than how much black kohl we wear.

'Kids in black = satanism'. Are the 80s coming back? What has Tipper Gore to say about it?

Corpsepaint looks silly when fresh and ridiculous when mixed with sweat. Both Kiss and Alice Cooper abandoned it 30 years ago. Clue?

And Marilyn Manson? He may have had some shock value 15 years ago. Now he's just establishment.

They didn't get the message in Tampa, FL,  this is where the Goths there all hang out:


(http://www.taboomasquerade.com/wp-images/2013/06/Taboo-April-19th-stroked-whiteweb-1.gif)

Would they be allowed into more mainstream establishments?

I've had reactions to my own outfits (which ranged from Trinity to Vanessa Ives) range from indifference to 'point and laugh' to being cussed out in the street, as if it were any of their business.

I really don't know. I know what my neighbor shared, such as the monthly "spiritual"  gatherings they had that were hosted at different member's houses, the system of elders, and the fetish parties at the Castle.    Some in other cities might just be into play-acting and call themselves Goths.  In Tampa, they called themselves Goths and there was a lot more variety than just the old Marilyn Manson look-a-likes, such as the Viking pagans.
Title: Re: Marilyn Manson vs Orthodox activists
Post by: Asteriktos on July 01, 2014, 02:18:26 PM
Edited above post.
Title: Re: Marilyn Manson vs Orthodox activists
Post by: Arachne on July 01, 2014, 02:18:50 PM
I really don't know. I know what my neighbor shared, such as the monthly "spiritual"  gatherings they had that were hosted at different member's houses, the system of elders, and the fetish parties at the Castle.    Some in other cities might just be into play-acting and call themselves Goths.  In Tampa, they called themselves Goths and there was a lot more variety than just the old Marilyn Manson look-a-likes, such as the Viking pagans.

And this, the bolded part, is where it's at.

The goth subculture rose out of music and literature. Religiously/spiritually it is as diverse as any of the mainstream folks you see on the street.
Title: Re: Marilyn Manson vs Orthodox activists
Post by: Adela on July 01, 2014, 02:20:25 PM
Other than your dislike of your neighbors....I don't get why you are spending time digging up all this stuff?

I never said Goth's were angels....but nor are 100% of them like you have experienced.


You bring up flyers for events that say things like 'fetish ball'....big whoopie...so -some- people do stuff like that.  Just like I would be shocked right out of my shoes if -some- people here also didn't do stuff like that.

Appearance does not = your heart and your behavior.  Christ knew this....



 For one thing, you say have the final word of what is Goth because you say you used to be one.  So why are you so bothered by what I shared?  It's my experience after all, not yours.   

 I'm just sharing what I experienced.   Even if you find it not very interesting, so what?   I myself found it interesting that in this one city there was a group calling themselves Goths who had a rather formalized religious organization. 
Title: Re: Marilyn Manson vs Orthodox activists
Post by: DeniseDenise on July 01, 2014, 02:23:05 PM
First of all...


Paganism does NOT equal goth.

Considering I used to be a goth, I just might know a bit more about it than you would think.

Yes, there is overlap, just like there is overlap between many different groups.  But that does not make your neighbours the poster children for Goth. 



But honestly since I am wasting my breath....I will leave it at that.....

I'd have said the same, if we weren't at dinner at the time of posting. :P

We may have put aside the fashion sense, Denise (except for special occasions ;)), but gothery is more a matter of music and literature than how much black kohl we wear.

'Kids in black = satanism'. Are the 80s coming back? What has Tipper Gore to say about it?

Corpsepaint looks silly when fresh and ridiculous when mixed with sweat. Both Kiss and Alice Cooper abandoned it 30 years ago. Clue?

And Marilyn Manson? He may have had some shock value 15 years ago. Now he's just establishment.

They didn't get the message in Tampa, FL,  this is where the Goths there all hang out:


(http://www.taboomasquerade.com/wp-images/2013/06/Taboo-April-19th-stroked-whiteweb-1.gif)

Would they be allowed into more mainstream establishments?

I've had reactions to my own outfits (which ranged from Trinity to Vanessa Ives) range from indifference to 'point and laugh' to being cussed out in the street, as if it were any of their business.

I really don't know. I know what my neighbor shared, such as the monthly "spiritual"  gatherings they had that were hosted at different member's houses, the system of elders, and the fetish parties at the Castle.    Some in other cities might just be into play-acting and call themselves Goths.  In Tampa, they called themselves Goths and there was a lot more variety than just the old Marilyn Manson look-a-likes, such as the Viking pagans.


So you are making the assumption that the 'goths' of your acquaintance, representative of -one- city in the US are in essence so 'prototypical goth' that all goths should be measured by them?????

I hate to throw cold water on that.....but in the 10 plus years I was a Goth...I participated in events and music  festivals in multiple states, two continents...etc.    

Your neighbors are your neighbors...but do not extend how they act and behave to the rest of the Goth-ish world.....


It's rather like assuming that Christians are all crazy bible thumping lunatics who speak in tongues and handle snakes.


Title: Re: Marilyn Manson vs Orthodox activists
Post by: TheTrisagion on July 01, 2014, 02:28:36 PM
I was a goth once.  It was pretty cool. We ended up sacking Rome. Here is a photo of me back in the day. I'm the one on the left.


(http://3.bp.blogspot.com/-iBn1wjjdAMM/TlpRP57XQdI/AAAAAAAADBg/G8yx1ViP8is/s1600/DSCN7890%2B%2528Small%2529.JPG)
Title: Re: Marilyn Manson vs Orthodox activists
Post by: Adela on July 01, 2014, 02:29:04 PM
First of all...


Paganism does NOT equal goth.

Considering I used to be a goth, I just might know a bit more about it than you would think.

Yes, there is overlap, just like there is overlap between many different groups.  But that does not make your neighbours the poster children for Goth. 



But honestly since I am wasting my breath....I will leave it at that.....

I'd have said the same, if we weren't at dinner at the time of posting. :P

We may have put aside the fashion sense, Denise (except for special occasions ;)), but gothery is more a matter of music and literature than how much black kohl we wear.

'Kids in black = satanism'. Are the 80s coming back? What has Tipper Gore to say about it?

Corpsepaint looks silly when fresh and ridiculous when mixed with sweat. Both Kiss and Alice Cooper abandoned it 30 years ago. Clue?

And Marilyn Manson? He may have had some shock value 15 years ago. Now he's just establishment.

They didn't get the message in Tampa, FL,  this is where the Goths there all hang out:


(http://www.taboomasquerade.com/wp-images/2013/06/Taboo-April-19th-stroked-whiteweb-1.gif)

Would they be allowed into more mainstream establishments?

I've had reactions to my own outfits (which ranged from Trinity to Vanessa Ives) range from indifference to 'point and laugh' to being cussed out in the street, as if it were any of their business.

I really don't know. I know what my neighbor shared, such as the monthly "spiritual"  gatherings they had that were hosted at different member's houses, the system of elders, and the fetish parties at the Castle.    Some in other cities might just be into play-acting and call themselves Goths.  In Tampa, they called themselves Goths and there was a lot more variety than just the old Marilyn Manson look-a-likes, such as the Viking pagans.


So you are making the assumption that the 'goths' of your acquaintance, representative of -one- city in the US are in essence so 'prototypical goth' that all goths should be measured by them?????

I hate to throw cold water on that.....but in the 10 plus years I was a Goth...I participated in events and music  festivals in multiple states, two continents...etc.    

Your neighbors are your neighbors...but do not extend how they act and behave to the rest of the Goth-ish world.....


It's rather like assuming that Christians are all crazy bible thumping lunatics who speak in tongues and handle snakes.




But you also are saying that since you claim you were a goth you know 100% about it.   I only shared what I witnessed, and it did include much paganism.  I was careful to say that they only let people into their group by sponsorship, so perhaps you would not have been allowed to be a part of this group.  I have a right to share my views and experiences, even if you don't like it.

I'm not sure why I hit a nerve with you, but it seems to have happened. Let's just move on.    
Title: Re: Marilyn Manson vs Orthodox activists
Post by: Maria on July 01, 2014, 02:33:00 PM
I was a goth once.  It was pretty cool. We ended up sacking Rome. Here is a photo of me back in the day. I'm the one on the left.


(http://3.bp.blogspot.com/-iBn1wjjdAMM/TlpRP57XQdI/AAAAAAAADBg/G8yx1ViP8is/s1600/DSCN7890%2B%2528Small%2529.JPG)

Hey, were you an actor?

My son played a part in a movie dressed up like a goth.
Title: Re: Marilyn Manson vs Orthodox activists
Post by: ZealousZeal on July 01, 2014, 02:34:33 PM
All I have to add to this discussion is that I went to a MM concert 7 years ago, and it was a good show. Nothing crazy happened, and no one threw eggs.
Title: Re: Marilyn Manson vs Orthodox activists
Post by: Arachne on July 01, 2014, 02:36:29 PM
I was a goth once.  It was pretty cool. We ended up sacking Rome. Here is a photo of me back in the day. I'm the one on the left.

Ah, reenactments... The good old days of the SCA... I miss it. No Ren Faires around here, unfortunately. :-\
Title: Re: Marilyn Manson vs Orthodox activists
Post by: TheTrisagion on July 01, 2014, 02:37:56 PM
All I have to add to this discussion is that I went to a MM concert 7 years ago, and it was a good show. Nothing crazy happened, and no one threw eggs.
I think you forgot to mention that you sacrificed an infant and drank the blood of black goats.  It is usually toward the end of the show, right after the part where everyone slashes their wrists and pledges their souls to Satan.  You are right though, no one throws eggs.  That would just be disgusting.
Title: Re: Marilyn Manson vs Orthodox activists
Post by: TheTrisagion on July 01, 2014, 02:39:44 PM
I was a goth once.  It was pretty cool. We ended up sacking Rome. Here is a photo of me back in the day. I'm the one on the left.

Ah, reenactments... The good old days of the SCA... I miss it. No Ren Faires around here, unfortunately. :-\
Confession time. That isn't actually my picture.  :(

But I do know a guy who does SCA as a viking and goes around the world teaching swordplay and combat with axes.
Title: Re: Marilyn Manson vs Orthodox activists
Post by: Maria on July 01, 2014, 02:40:30 PM
I was a goth once.  It was pretty cool. We ended up sacking Rome. Here is a photo of me back in the day. I'm the one on the left.

Ah, reenactments... The good old days of the SCA... I miss it. No Ren Faires around here, unfortunately. :-\
Confession time. That isn't actually my picture.  :(

But I do know a guy who does SCA as a viking and goes around the world teaching swordplay and combat with axes.

I was going to say that you looked quite handsome.
Title: Re: Marilyn Manson vs Orthodox activists
Post by: Arachne on July 01, 2014, 02:42:19 PM
I was a goth once.  It was pretty cool. We ended up sacking Rome. Here is a photo of me back in the day. I'm the one on the left.

Ah, reenactments... The good old days of the SCA... I miss it. No Ren Faires around here, unfortunately. :-\
Confession time. That isn't actually my picture.  :(

But I do know a guy who does SCA as a viking and goes around the world teaching swordplay and combat with axes.

My friends' swords were what I envied most from our events. Although I considered myself lucky not to have to knit chainmail.
Title: Re: Marilyn Manson vs Orthodox activists
Post by: ZealousZeal on July 01, 2014, 02:42:32 PM
I was a goth once.  It was pretty cool. We ended up sacking Rome. Here is a photo of me back in the day. I'm the one on the left.

Ah, reenactments... The good old days of the SCA... I miss it. No Ren Faires around here, unfortunately. :-\
Confession time. That isn't actually my picture.  :(

But I do know a guy who does SCA as a viking and goes around the world teaching swordplay and combat with axes.

I was going to say that you looked quite handsome.

LOL! Too bad it's not you.
Title: Re: Marilyn Manson vs Orthodox activists
Post by: Maria on July 01, 2014, 02:43:55 PM
I was a goth once.  It was pretty cool. We ended up sacking Rome. Here is a photo of me back in the day. I'm the one on the left.

Ah, reenactments... The good old days of the SCA... I miss it. No Ren Faires around here, unfortunately. :-\
Confession time. That isn't actually my picture.  :(

But I do know a guy who does SCA as a viking and goes around the world teaching swordplay and combat with axes.

I was going to say that you looked quite handsome.

LOL! Too bad it's not you.

Yes, Trisagion, have you posted a picture of yourself here lately?
Title: Re: Marilyn Manson vs Orthodox activists
Post by: Mor Ephrem on July 01, 2014, 02:44:58 PM
I was a goth once.  It was pretty cool. We ended up sacking Rome. Here is a photo of me back in the day. I'm the one on the left.

Ah, reenactments... The good old days of the SCA... I miss it. No Ren Faires around here, unfortunately. :-\
Confession time. That isn't actually my picture.  :(

But I do know a guy who does SCA as a viking and goes around the world teaching swordplay and combat with axes.

I was going to say that you looked quite handsome.

LOL! Too bad it's not you.

Yes, Trisagion, have you posted a picture of yourself here lately?

Uh oh!  Play on, Trisagion!
Title: Re: Marilyn Manson vs Orthodox activists
Post by: TheTrisagion on July 01, 2014, 02:45:58 PM
I was a goth once.  It was pretty cool. We ended up sacking Rome. Here is a photo of me back in the day. I'm the one on the left.

Ah, reenactments... The good old days of the SCA... I miss it. No Ren Faires around here, unfortunately. :-\
Confession time. That isn't actually my picture.  :(

But I do know a guy who does SCA as a viking and goes around the world teaching swordplay and combat with axes.

I was going to say that you looked quite handsome.
That should have been your first clue that it was not me.   ;D
Title: Re: Marilyn Manson vs Orthodox activists
Post by: Agabus on July 01, 2014, 02:47:03 PM
The real story here is that people are still paying attention to Marilyn Manson.

That shtick wore out in 1998. Cut that, it wore out whenever he released Antichrist Superstar.

(http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/thumb/c/ce/Marilyn_Manson_-_Mechanical_Animals.jpg/220px-Marilyn_Manson_-_Mechanical_Animals.jpg)

I remember my friends talking about how his music wouldn't really make you kill yourself even though the nightly news said it would, but after everyone kept playing The Dope Show I wanted to throw something out of the window at minimum.
Title: Re: Marilyn Manson vs Orthodox activists
Post by: TheTrisagion on July 01, 2014, 02:48:20 PM
I was a goth once.  It was pretty cool. We ended up sacking Rome. Here is a photo of me back in the day. I'm the one on the left.

Ah, reenactments... The good old days of the SCA... I miss it. No Ren Faires around here, unfortunately. :-\
Confession time. That isn't actually my picture.  :(

But I do know a guy who does SCA as a viking and goes around the world teaching swordplay and combat with axes.

I was going to say that you looked quite handsome.

LOL! Too bad it's not you.

Yes, Trisagion, have you posted a picture of yourself here lately?
As a matter of fact, I have never posted a picture of myself.  It isn't really out of any concern for privacy so much as it is that people would run screaming from the forum never to return.  I would like of you all to just imagine me as the strapping Gothic fellow up above with my trusty dog that I ended up skinning and wearing across my shoulders.
Title: Re: Marilyn Manson vs Orthodox activists
Post by: Maria on July 01, 2014, 02:49:37 PM
I was a goth once.  It was pretty cool. We ended up sacking Rome. Here is a photo of me back in the day. I'm the one on the left.

Ah, reenactments... The good old days of the SCA... I miss it. No Ren Faires around here, unfortunately. :-\
Confession time. That isn't actually my picture.  :(

But I do know a guy who does SCA as a viking and goes around the world teaching swordplay and combat with axes.

I was going to say that you looked quite handsome.

LOL! Too bad it's not you.

Yes, Trisagion, have you posted a picture of yourself here lately?
As a matter of fact, I have never posted a picture of myself.  It isn't really out of any concern for privacy so much as it is that people would run screaming from the forum never to return.  I would like of you all to just imagine me as the strapping Gothic fellow up above with my trusty dog that I ended up skinning and wearing across my shoulders.

Aren't those grey fox pelts?
Title: Re: Marilyn Manson vs Orthodox activists
Post by: ZealousZeal on July 01, 2014, 02:50:37 PM
He (MM) was the most obnoxious guest ever to be on Talking Dead.
Title: Re: Marilyn Manson vs Orthodox activists
Post by: TheTrisagion on July 01, 2014, 02:51:27 PM
I was a goth once.  It was pretty cool. We ended up sacking Rome. Here is a photo of me back in the day. I'm the one on the left.

Ah, reenactments... The good old days of the SCA... I miss it. No Ren Faires around here, unfortunately. :-\
Confession time. That isn't actually my picture.  :(

But I do know a guy who does SCA as a viking and goes around the world teaching swordplay and combat with axes.

I was going to say that you looked quite handsome.

LOL! Too bad it's not you.

Yes, Trisagion, have you posted a picture of yourself here lately?
As a matter of fact, I have never posted a picture of myself.  It isn't really out of any concern for privacy so much as it is that people would run screaming from the forum never to return.  I would like of you all to just imagine me as the strapping Gothic fellow up above with my trusty dog that I ended up skinning and wearing across my shoulders.

Aren't those grey fox pelts?
We can call them that if it makes you feel better.  ;)
Title: Re: Marilyn Manson vs Orthodox activists
Post by: ZealousZeal on July 01, 2014, 02:53:22 PM
I remember my friends talking about how his music wouldn't really make you kill yourself even though the nightly news said it would, but after everyone kept playing The Dope Show I wanted to throw something out of the window at minimum.

We're all stars now...
Title: Re: Marilyn Manson vs Orthodox activists
Post by: Theophania on July 01, 2014, 02:58:14 PM
He (MM) was the most obnoxious guest ever to be on Talking Dead.

YES. For being such a huge fan of the show, he couldn't even remember Rick's useless wife's name. And then he said something about one of the women being emotional because she was on her period. He'd fit in here with that comment.
Title: Re: Marilyn Manson vs Orthodox activists
Post by: Maria on July 01, 2014, 03:02:02 PM
There are a lot of women with PMS and abortion issues.
Title: Re: Marilyn Manson vs Orthodox activists
Post by: Arachne on July 01, 2014, 03:05:07 PM
There are a lot of women with PMS and abortion issues.

A woman with PMS is definitely not on her period. ::)
Title: Re: Marilyn Manson vs Orthodox activists
Post by: Maria on July 01, 2014, 03:06:22 PM
There are a lot of women with PMS and abortion issues.

A woman with PMS is definitely not on her period. ::)

Oh, I know some women who have PMS all the time, or at least they would like you to think that!
Title: Re: Marilyn Manson vs Orthodox activists
Post by: Theophania on July 01, 2014, 03:08:39 PM
There are a lot of women with PMS and abortion issues.

what does that have to do with anything?
Title: Re: Marilyn Manson vs Orthodox activists
Post by: vamrat on July 01, 2014, 03:08:47 PM
I remember my friends talking about how his music wouldn't really make you kill yourself even though the nightly news said it would, but after everyone kept playing The Dope Show I wanted to throw something out of the window at minimum.

We're all stars now...

Ugh, now I am going to have that song stuck in my head for the rest of the day and then probably play it in my car on the way home.  I have his greatest hits cd, though I think I stuck it in the NWA case.
Title: Re: Marilyn Manson vs Orthodox activists
Post by: vamrat on July 01, 2014, 03:11:47 PM
I was a goth once.  It was pretty cool. We ended up sacking Rome. Here is a photo of me back in the day. I'm the one on the left.

Ah, reenactments... The good old days of the SCA... I miss it. No Ren Faires around here, unfortunately. :-\
Confession time. That isn't actually my picture.  :(

But I do know a guy who does SCA as a viking and goes around the world teaching swordplay and combat with axes.

My friends' swords were what I envied most from our events. Although I considered myself lucky not to have to knit chainmail.

(https://scontent-a-dfw.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-xpa1/t1.0-9/1545046_10100546668130113_8188253501955036324_n.jpg)

Don't get me started...
Title: Re: Marilyn Manson vs Orthodox activists
Post by: Maria on July 01, 2014, 03:13:38 PM
I was a goth once.  It was pretty cool. We ended up sacking Rome. Here is a photo of me back in the day. I'm the one on the left.

Ah, reenactments... The good old days of the SCA... I miss it. No Ren Faires around here, unfortunately. :-\
Confession time. That isn't actually my picture.  :(

But I do know a guy who does SCA as a viking and goes around the world teaching swordplay and combat with axes.

My friends' swords were what I envied most from our events. Although I considered myself lucky not to have to knit chainmail.

(https://scontent-a-dfw.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-xpa1/t1.0-9/1545046_10100546668130113_8188253501955036324_n.jpg)

Don't get me started...

You made your own chainmail?

Could you give us instructions? Could come in handy with zombie wars.
Title: Re: Marilyn Manson vs Orthodox activists
Post by: ZealousZeal on July 01, 2014, 03:14:54 PM
Wow that's really grown a lot, vamrat!
Title: Re: Marilyn Manson vs Orthodox activists
Post by: Theophania on July 01, 2014, 03:16:21 PM
I was a goth once.  It was pretty cool. We ended up sacking Rome. Here is a photo of me back in the day. I'm the one on the left.

Ah, reenactments... The good old days of the SCA... I miss it. No Ren Faires around here, unfortunately. :-\
Confession time. That isn't actually my picture.  :(

But I do know a guy who does SCA as a viking and goes around the world teaching swordplay and combat with axes.

My friends' swords were what I envied most from our events. Although I considered myself lucky not to have to knit chainmail.

(https://scontent-a-dfw.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-xpa1/t1.0-9/1545046_10100546668130113_8188253501955036324_n.jpg)

Don't get me started...

that's really impressive!
Title: Re: Marilyn Manson vs Orthodox activists
Post by: Maria on July 01, 2014, 03:50:06 PM
So, I did a google search for SCA, and this is what was displayed:

Quote
Society for Creative Anachronism, Inc.
Sexual Compulsives Anonymous: SCA

Refresh my memory, please. What does SCA stand for?
Title: Re: Marilyn Manson vs Orthodox activists
Post by: TheTrisagion on July 01, 2014, 03:57:24 PM
There is nothing that makes me more sexually compulsive than seeing this:

(http://4.bp.blogspot.com/_I8j7G62GmE0/SxXGOIAAJJI/AAAAAAAAAVQ/YzzHCz6_BCc/s1600/Battlelore0.jpg)
Title: Re: Marilyn Manson vs Orthodox activists
Post by: Maria on July 01, 2014, 04:01:18 PM
There is nothing that makes me more sexually compulsive than seeing this:

(http://4.bp.blogspot.com/_I8j7G62GmE0/SxXGOIAAJJI/AAAAAAAAAVQ/YzzHCz6_BCc/s1600/Battlelore0.jpg)

Not a pretty picture: lacking in sobriety and also very dissipative.
Title: Re: Marilyn Manson vs Orthodox activists
Post by: Asteriktos on July 01, 2014, 04:32:01 PM
There is nothing that makes me more sexually compulsive than seeing this:

(http://4.bp.blogspot.com/_I8j7G62GmE0/SxXGOIAAJJI/AAAAAAAAAVQ/YzzHCz6_BCc/s1600/Battlelore0.jpg)

Guy in the back row on the far left. He's less ugly than some of the comments on this board of late.
Title: Re: Marilyn Manson vs Orthodox activists
Post by: vamrat on July 01, 2014, 05:31:35 PM
I was a goth once.  It was pretty cool. We ended up sacking Rome. Here is a photo of me back in the day. I'm the one on the left.

Ah, reenactments... The good old days of the SCA... I miss it. No Ren Faires around here, unfortunately. :-\
Confession time. That isn't actually my picture.  :(

But I do know a guy who does SCA as a viking and goes around the world teaching swordplay and combat with axes.

My friends' swords were what I envied most from our events. Although I considered myself lucky not to have to knit chainmail.

(https://scontent-a-dfw.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-xpa1/t1.0-9/1545046_10100546668130113_8188253501955036324_n.jpg)

Don't get me started...

You made your own chainmail?

Could you give us instructions? Could come in handy with zombie wars.

Yeah, sure. First, make sure you have a boatload of patience, then get yourself a good helping of carpel tunnel...

In between patience and never using your hands again it's just European four-in-one pattern.  Here is the essence:

(http://s3.amazonaws.com/FusionBeads/a/european/step-5.gif)

I recommend 14ga wire and knippex cutters are a God-send.  Far better than dremmeling or using normal wire cutters. If I ever get around to taking pictures of an in-progress section I will post it somewhere.

As for making the shirt it has been a lot of trial and error.  If you've ever sewn clothes you are probably a step ahead of me.
Title: Re: Marilyn Manson vs Orthodox activists
Post by: The Fool on July 01, 2014, 05:43:58 PM
I was unaware that it was appropriate to abuse icons by using them as weapons.  ???

 ;)
Title: Re: Marilyn Manson vs Orthodox activists
Post by: Maria on July 01, 2014, 05:49:04 PM
I was a goth once.  It was pretty cool. We ended up sacking Rome. Here is a photo of me back in the day. I'm the one on the left.

Ah, reenactments... The good old days of the SCA... I miss it. No Ren Faires around here, unfortunately. :-\
Confession time. That isn't actually my picture.  :(

But I do know a guy who does SCA as a viking and goes around the world teaching swordplay and combat with axes.

My friends' swords were what I envied most from our events. Although I considered myself lucky not to have to knit chainmail.

(https://scontent-a-dfw.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-xpa1/t1.0-9/1545046_10100546668130113_8188253501955036324_n.jpg)

Don't get me started...

You made your own chainmail?

Could you give us instructions? Could come in handy with zombie wars.

Yeah, sure. First, make sure you have a boatload of patience, then get yourself a good helping of carpel tunnel...

In between patience and never using your hands again it's just European four-in-one pattern.  Here is the essence:

(http://s3.amazonaws.com/FusionBeads/a/european/step-5.gif)

I recommend 14ga wire and knippex cutters are a God-send.  Far better than dremmeling or using normal wire cutters. If I ever get around to taking pictures of an in-progress section I will post it somewhere.

As for making the shirt it has been a lot of trial and error.  If you've ever sewn clothes you are probably a step ahead of me.

I use Simplicity, McCalls, and other patterns to make my clothes (long and medium length skirts, long and short-sleeved shirts, PJs, shorts, jumpers, vests, slacks, underwear, aprons, and quilts).  However, I have found mistakes in most patterns because some cannot use the more tailored look of flat feld and French seams. I usually make a muslin trial before using any expensive fabric on a new design.

A pull over vest might be the pattern you might want.

Too bad you cannot use chainlink fencing.
Title: Re: Marilyn Manson vs Orthodox activists
Post by: Maria on July 01, 2014, 05:52:26 PM
I was a goth once.  It was pretty cool. We ended up sacking Rome. Here is a photo of me back in the day. I'm the one on the left.


(http://3.bp.blogspot.com/-iBn1wjjdAMM/TlpRP57XQdI/AAAAAAAADBg/G8yx1ViP8is/s1600/DSCN7890%2B%2528Small%2529.JPG)

What is the dude on the right wearing in place of chainmail?

The one on the left looks like he is wearing bands of metal.
Title: Re: Marilyn Manson vs Orthodox activists
Post by: The Fool on July 01, 2014, 06:02:05 PM
What is the dude on the right wearing in place of chainmail?

The one on the left looks like he is wearing bands of metal.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lorica_segmentata on the left.

Looks like leather on the right.
Title: Re: Marilyn Manson vs Orthodox activists
Post by: Alveus Lacuna on July 01, 2014, 11:22:27 PM
The real story here is that people are still paying attention to Marilyn Manson.

Thank you.

You could also add jokes about Eastern Europeans being a good 15 years behind on popular culture, some reference to them flooding still-open Tower music stores in Moscow to get this music on cassette tape, etc.
Title: Re: Marilyn Manson vs Orthodox activists
Post by: TheTrisagion on July 01, 2014, 11:30:20 PM
I was a goth once.  It was pretty cool. We ended up sacking Rome. Here is a photo of me back in the day. I'm the one on the left.


(http://3.bp.blogspot.com/-iBn1wjjdAMM/TlpRP57XQdI/AAAAAAAADBg/G8yx1ViP8is/s1600/DSCN7890%2B%2528Small%2529.JPG)

What is the dude on the right wearing in place of chainmail?

The one on the left looks like he is wearing bands of metal.
The guy on the right is wearing lamellar armor.
Title: Re: Marilyn Manson vs Orthodox activists
Post by: SolEX01 on July 01, 2014, 11:32:21 PM
How did this thread become LARP dominated?
Title: Re: Marilyn Manson vs Orthodox activists
Post by: Asteriktos on July 01, 2014, 11:44:35 PM
We started with a musician larping as a shock rocker, being assaulted by people larping as Christians. It really wasn't that much of a leap was it?

Oops... I was supposed to be watching Netflix so I couldn't make such posts... :angel:
Title: Re: Marilyn Manson vs Orthodox activists
Post by: Alexander_Kuzmin on July 02, 2014, 01:47:50 AM
 :) :) :) :)

(https://scontent-a-fra.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-xap1/t1.0-9/q85/s720x720/10482941_685310691550858_1936608282209560674_n.jpg)
Title: Re: Marilyn Manson vs Orthodox activists
Post by: Arachne on July 02, 2014, 03:09:08 AM
:) :) :) :)

(https://scontent-a-fra.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-xap1/t1.0-9/q85/s720x720/10482941_685310691550858_1936608282209560674_n.jpg)

QED. :)

The late Archbishop of Athens and All Greece Christodoulos gained a lot of popularity immediately after his election by urging young people to come to church as they were, tattoos, piercings, weird hairstyles and all. Supposedly, in one of his first appearances, a bunch of 'freak kids' approached him and said to him, 'Christodoule, we dig you', to which he replied, 'I dig you too'. That expression, and his habit of telling jokes as part of his homilies, are what most people remember from his tenure. ;)
Title: Re: Marilyn Manson vs Orthodox activists
Post by: The Fool on July 02, 2014, 03:11:35 AM
The late Archbishop of Athens and All Greece Christodoulos gained a lot of popularity immediately after his election by urging young people to come to church as they were, tattoos, piercings, weird hairstyles and all. Supposedly, in one of his first appearances, a bunch of 'freak kids' approached him and said to him, 'Christodoule, we dig you', to which he replied, 'I dig you too'.

D'aww.  ;D
Title: Re: Marilyn Manson vs Orthodox activists
Post by: Maria on July 02, 2014, 04:35:27 AM
:) :) :) :)

(https://scontent-a-fra.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-xap1/t1.0-9/q85/s720x720/10482941_685310691550858_1936608282209560674_n.jpg)

Wow! A Russian Mohawk!

I remember my brother really wanted a mohawk hair cut when he was little, and I obliged. My mother had a fit. I was almost four and he was 2 1/2 and man did I get creative with those scissors. So, Mom took him to the barber and he got all his hair cut off, so he looked like he had been scalped.
Title: Re: Marilyn Manson vs Orthodox activists
Post by: vamrat on July 02, 2014, 10:03:48 AM
I was a goth once.  It was pretty cool. We ended up sacking Rome. Here is a photo of me back in the day. I'm the one on the left.


(http://3.bp.blogspot.com/-iBn1wjjdAMM/TlpRP57XQdI/AAAAAAAADBg/G8yx1ViP8is/s1600/DSCN7890%2B%2528Small%2529.JPG)

What is the dude on the right wearing in place of chainmail?

The one on the left looks like he is wearing bands of metal.
The guy on the right is wearing lamellar armor.

I think the guy on the left is too, of some variety.
Title: Re: Marilyn Manson vs Orthodox activists
Post by: TheTrisagion on July 02, 2014, 10:16:19 AM
They guy on the left to me looks like he is wearing segmented (laminar) armor which is kind of odd, because I don't think that that is a typical Goth style.  Unless it is an attempt to portray repurposed lorica segmentata which is possible because of the number of Gothic troops that were used by the Romans. It doesn't seem to be a very faithful representation of that though.
Title: Re: Marilyn Manson vs Orthodox activists
Post by: vamrat on July 02, 2014, 10:44:50 AM
They guy on the left to me looks like he is wearing segmented (laminar) armor which is kind of odd, because I don't think that that is a typical Goth style.  Unless it is an attempt to portray repurposed lorica segmentata which is possible because of the number of Gothic troops that were used by the Romans. It doesn't seem to be a very faithful representation of that though.

By late antiquity I think Lorica Segmentata was getting somewhat rare, replaced by various scale types and chainmail.
Title: Re: Marilyn Manson vs Orthodox activists
Post by: JamesR on July 02, 2014, 12:58:02 PM
At first I thought this said "Marilyn Monroe" and I was disturbed to see that it wasn't about the blonde Hollywood starlet of my dreams but was about a lousy rock star from 16 years ago...
Title: Re: Marilyn Manson vs Orthodox activists
Post by: The Fool on July 02, 2014, 08:49:30 PM
At first I thought this said "Marilyn Monroe" and I was disturbed to see that it wasn't about the blonde Hollywood starlet of my dreams but was about a lousy rock star from 16 years ago...

What is it with you and blondes?
Title: Re: Marilyn Manson vs Orthodox activists
Post by: DeniseDenise on July 02, 2014, 08:50:55 PM
At first I thought this said "Marilyn Monroe" and I was disturbed to see that it wasn't about the blonde Hollywood starlet of my dreams but was about a lousy rock star from 16 years ago...

What is it with you and blondes?

18 and hormonal.

questions? ;)
Title: Re: Marilyn Manson vs Orthodox activists
Post by: The Fool on July 02, 2014, 08:55:51 PM
18 and hormonal.

questions? ;)

When I was 18 and hormonal I had the graciousness not to blather about it on internet forums about religion.  ;D
Title: Re: Marilyn Manson vs Orthodox activists
Post by: JamesR on July 03, 2014, 02:40:36 AM
At first I thought this said "Marilyn Monroe" and I was disturbed to see that it wasn't about the blonde Hollywood starlet of my dreams but was about a lousy rock star from 16 years ago...

What is it with you and blondes?

Dat social status and classic Hollywood starlet fantasy.
Title: Re: Marilyn Manson vs Orthodox activists
Post by: The Fool on July 03, 2014, 03:57:22 AM
At first I thought this said "Marilyn Monroe" and I was disturbed to see that it wasn't about the blonde Hollywood starlet of my dreams but was about a lousy rock star from 16 years ago...

What is it with you and blondes?

Dat social status and classic Hollywood starlet fantasy.

You were lusting after blondes in general in the smoking thread.
Title: Re: Marilyn Manson vs Orthodox activists
Post by: DeniseDenise on July 03, 2014, 11:01:38 AM
At first I thought this said "Marilyn Monroe" and I was disturbed to see that it wasn't about the blonde Hollywood starlet of my dreams but was about a lousy rock star from 16 years ago...

What is it with you and blondes?

Dat social status and classic Hollywood starlet fantasy.

You were lusting after blondes in general in the smoking thread.


Fixed this for you
Title: Re: Marilyn Manson vs Orthodox activists
Post by: IoanC on July 03, 2014, 11:51:53 AM
http://www.honeyandhemlock.com/2014/06/marilyn-manson-gigs-cancelled-in-russia.html
Title: Re: Marilyn Manson vs Orthodox activists
Post by: Cyrillic on July 03, 2014, 12:28:52 PM
They guy on the left to me looks like he is wearing segmented (laminar) armor which is kind of odd, because I don't think that that is a typical Goth style.  Unless it is an attempt to portray repurposed lorica segmentata which is possible because of the number of Gothic troops that were used by the Romans. It doesn't seem to be a very faithful representation of that though.

By late antiquity I think Lorica Segmentata was getting somewhat rare, replaced by various scale types and chainmail.

Lorica segmentata, contrary to Hollywood wisdom, was always rare. Lorica hamata was more practical, cheaper and offered more protection.
Title: Re: Marilyn Manson vs Orthodox activists
Post by: TheTrisagion on July 03, 2014, 12:32:08 PM
Not Roman and not practical, but the cuirass gets bonus points for the coolness factor.

(http://www.timetrips.co.uk/gw-bronzecuirass.jpg)
Title: Re: Marilyn Manson vs Orthodox activists
Post by: The Fool on July 03, 2014, 01:59:07 PM
You were lusting after blondes in general in the smoking thread.
Fixed this for you

Thanks.  ;)
Title: Re: Marilyn Manson vs Orthodox activists
Post by: yeshuaisiam on July 04, 2014, 12:24:20 PM
I completely disagree with these EO Christians for doing such a thing.  We are supposed to love our enemies.   He can use stuff like this to further exploit Christianity.  I do not believe for a second that most EO Christians would approve of this behavior.

Marilyn Manson is a satanist and an ordained priest in the Church of Satan.  

Much of the music industry promotes satanic teachings themed around "you can do what you want"/"do your own thing"/"do what thy wilt"/"going your own way"/ basically making yourself God.

You think everyone in show business is in the Illuminati..

You think that I think that everybody in show business is in the illuminati because I've pointed out several examples.
Keep the Ad Hominem attacks please.

There are a ton of EO warnings on much of the main stream music and movies.

Also read your saints on theaters, tragedies, and music.

What ad hominem?
Not you, Kelly.

She made an untrue statement based on posts I had in other threads, the illuminati I never brought up in this thread, and never stated that all musicians were involved in it (although I believe many are, but not even close to all).  It's an irrelevent "fact" to this musician or many musicians being satanic.  The illuminati is a fraternal organization, outside of the scope of this argument.

It was a fallicious ad hominem attack on my character in order to debase the statements I made.
Title: Re: Marilyn Manson vs Orthodox activists
Post by: yeshuaisiam on July 04, 2014, 12:25:46 PM
I completely disagree with these EO Christians for doing such a thing.  We are supposed to love our enemies.   He can use stuff like this to further exploit Christianity.  I do not believe for a second that most EO Christians would approve of this behavior.

Marilyn Manson is a satanist and an ordained priest in the Church of Satan.  

Much of the music industry promotes satanic teachings themed around "you can do what you want"/"do your own thing"/"do what thy wilt"/"going your own way"/ basically making yourself God.

You think everyone in show business is in the Illuminati..

You think that I think that everybody in show business is in the illuminati because I've pointed out several examples.
Keep the Ad Hominem attacks please.

There are a ton of EO warnings on much of the main stream music and movies.

Also read your saints on theaters, tragedies, and music.

No.

This is awkward.  Argue my points, ignore your own saints, wool over the eyes.... So you are here to argue, not learn.
Title: Re: Marilyn Manson vs Orthodox activists
Post by: yeshuaisiam on July 04, 2014, 12:29:27 PM
I completely disagree with these EO Christians for doing such a thing.  We are supposed to love our enemies.   He can use stuff like this to further exploit Christianity.  I do not believe for a second that most EO Christians would approve of this behavior.

Marilyn Manson is a satanist and an ordained priest in the Church of Satan.  

Much of the music industry promotes satanic teachings themed around "you can do what you want"/"do your own thing"/"do what thy wilt"/"going your own way"/ basically making yourself God.

You think everyone in show business is in the Illuminati..

You think that I think that everybody in show business is in the illuminati because I've pointed out several examples.
Keep the Ad Hominem attacks please.

There are a ton of EO warnings on much of the main stream music and movies.

Also read your saints on theaters, tragedies, and music.

What ad hominem?
Yesh thinks every criticism of his point of view is an ad hominem.

I do.  Funny, I've only accused of it once.   LOL, but I get the joke.
Title: Re: Marilyn Manson vs Orthodox activists
Post by: Theophania on July 04, 2014, 05:35:43 PM
I completely disagree with these EO Christians for doing such a thing.  We are supposed to love our enemies.   He can use stuff like this to further exploit Christianity.  I do not believe for a second that most EO Christians would approve of this behavior.

Marilyn Manson is a satanist and an ordained priest in the Church of Satan.  

Much of the music industry promotes satanic teachings themed around "you can do what you want"/"do your own thing"/"do what thy wilt"/"going your own way"/ basically making yourself God.

You think everyone in show business is in the Illuminati..

You think that I think that everybody in show business is in the illuminati because I've pointed out several examples.
Keep the Ad Hominem attacks please.

There are a ton of EO warnings on much of the main stream music and movies.

Also read your saints on theaters, tragedies, and music.

No.

This is awkward.  Argue my points, ignore your own saints, wool over the eyes.... So you are here to argue, not learn.

Funny you of all people should accuse another of that.
Title: Re: Marilyn Manson vs Orthodox activists
Post by: minasoliman on July 04, 2014, 07:39:17 PM
I completely disagree with these EO Christians for doing such a thing.  We are supposed to love our enemies.   He can use stuff like this to further exploit Christianity.  I do not believe for a second that most EO Christians would approve of this behavior.

Marilyn Manson is a satanist and an ordained priest in the Church of Satan.  

Much of the music industry promotes satanic teachings themed around "you can do what you want"/"do your own thing"/"do what thy wilt"/"going your own way"/ basically making yourself God.

You think everyone in show business is in the Illuminati..

You think that I think that everybody in show business is in the illuminati because I've pointed out several examples.
Keep the Ad Hominem attacks please.

There are a ton of EO warnings on much of the main stream music and movies.

Also read your saints on theaters, tragedies, and music.

What ad hominem?
Not you, Kelly.

She made an untrue statement based on posts I had in other threads, the illuminati I never brought up in this thread, and never stated that all musicians were involved in it (although I believe many are, but not even close to all).  It's an irrelevent "fact" to this musician or many musicians being satanic.  The illuminati is a fraternal organization, outside of the scope of this argument.

It was a fallicious ad hominem attack on my character in order to debase the statements I made.

She didn't ridicule your character, but your arguments.  There's a huge difference.  That's why it's not an ad hominem.

Look, you're not exactly of the mainstream thought here.  You have to expect your other views you have shared on this forum will impact pretty much anything else you say and you have to accept some of the criticisms people make of those arguments.